Biggest plot holes in games

[J Tyran]

Again you're misunderstanding the questions.

You have shown that your observation is pretty poor, do you really want to have to go through me proving you wrong every step of the way yet again? My understanding of the questions has been spot on every time.

No it hasn't. Your answers have predominately been smartassery that doesn't actually address what i'm asking. Yes I understand the kid can walk, no shit. how did he walk from from his building all the way into the other building, climbing up through vents to the top level in the same amount of time it took Shepard to get there? The only way he could have feasibly gotten there is if he started well before the reapers came. You might -think- you're addressing my questions, but you're really not.

Edit: Regardless I think we're done here, you are either incapable or refuse to actually address the question i'm asking so we're not going to get anywhere with further arguing.

Well have you seen a map of the base? How do we know the building he was in wasn't the same one he was on the roof of when Shepard watched him from the window for starters, neither do we know how easy it was to move around the complex. It was ten minutes or more from when Shepard saw him on the roof to when he was in the vent, it was more than five minutes from when Shepard saw him on the roof until the first Reaper hit the base. Neither do you know he used the vents to get to where he was, he could have moved around and then entered the vent close to where Shepard found him. Again you are making assumptions about things you have no way of knowing about.

The kid had plenty of time to move around, and that's assuming the building he was found in is a different one entirely. I admit my answers are slightly snarky but that's because your questions are silly and all ready have obvious answers. "How did the kid get to where he was" well of course he used his legs, what did you expect him to use a fugging jetpack? It wasn't a question that really needed asking let alone answering.

 

[bug_of_war]

I probably should have been more specific. I never meant to imply that I thought the Reapers were VI's, my belief was that the Reapers were AI's, however were restricted by some base programming measures that guided them. I agree with you that he was arrogant and quite well developed, however cleverbot can be arrogant and have some depth, and that program is just a VI. Again, HUUUUUUGE stretch there, but it's just my opinion and it worked for me and caused me to see no problem with the ending.

Okay. Now I'm having an idea. One that might, if you stretch a little, actually close the plotholes in the ME3 ending. This might take a while, so (extensive text)
The Reapers aren't the villain here, they're another victim of a race of tyrants long dead.[/spoiler]
It's stretching and there isn't much to support it over any other theory, but it seems to fit all the evidence I can think of.
Okay, now somebody help me find the holes in this.

Well yeah, I never thought that far into detail, but around ME3's ending I saw the Starchild as the safety net that the original creators would have placed within the programming of the Reapers. It's my understanding that the Leviathan DLC reveals that the creators of the Reapers initially created the Starchild to come up with a way to solve the problem of synthetics fighting organics, and they then built the Reapers. Assuming that the Starchild was simply put there to process probability calculations, it is likely that the Starchild is a VI, especially the way it talks to Shepard. So, to then link the Reapers, an AI powerhouse race of synthetic, to a VI that has the sole purpose of solving 1 particular problem, you can kind of see how the VI would come to the conclusion of preserving organic races in synthetic bodies and the overwriting a majority of the Reapers' intelligence and using them as pawns.

Again, loose fan theory, but it makes more sense then the Shepard indoctrination theory and has very few holes if any.

I was initially against Vega, because all I saw was that he was a latino jersey shore looking dude. But after playing the first 2 hours of the games, I really, REALLY liked his character. I loved that he wasn't a Jersey Shore DB, I loved that he was a soldier through and through, but knew how to chill out after missions. I feel as though he was a nice addition to the series as he was the only human on your team who was somewhat freaked out about the Reapers' raw power.

My first impression of him was that he was a boring grunt, when my ship was full of deep, unique, wonderful people. Though I'll admit that because of the bad first impression I didn't talk to him much later in the game my first time through, and I haven't gotten around to a second playthough yet, so if he has awesome hidden depths I'd have missed them. Like how I didn't like Garrus at all in the first game but started to love him in the second maybe?

He was totally there to fill the Krogan role, and I can see where other players saw him to be shallow or unlikeable. But I saw the charm of a young marine in a war like no other, whom had a hard time in the past, reacting and living through such horrors. He was a difficult character to really like and understand I guess, kind of like Connor from Assassins Creed 3. I really liked him because I understood why he was the man he was. Most people hated his attitude and naive nature, but I totally understood it, and for that I really loved the character. I'm not saying you have to understand a character to like them, far from it, what I'm saying is sometimes understanding a character can give you a new appreciation for them. Not all the time, but there are a lot of characters who go un-noticed due to not acting like Nathan Drake or Master Chief.

but sill, I miss my psychotic biotic.

Same here. But as strong as those kids were, they weren't ready for the horrors of the front line without her there as an unstoppable force of destruction and/or team mom.

I know but...come on, don't tell me you didn't wish the students told her to go with you, even though they were screwed without her. I just...Damn it she was such a cool character and all we got to see of her was one mission, and then two side conversations.

 

[otakon17]

Fallout 3 original ending is the worst one that I have ever encountered.

Spoiler: The ending

You are faced with a decision to go into a room full of lethal radiation in order to enter a code and prevent disaster. You are told it has to be you, and nobody else, and doing so will kill you.

You have the potential to have a super mutant and a ghoul with you at the end of the game. Both of them are not only immune to the negative effects of radiation, but are healed by it.

They will refuse to go into the room and enter the code because "It's your destiny" to do so.

It makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

Pretty much that. That ending seriously was just bad. "It's your destiny" Fawkes says, but you when I'm thinking with my head that the day can be saved and I'd be able to live sounds like a good prospect. But no the developers decided to make so that you couldn't until Broken Steel.

Indeed, the "whoever goes in there dies due to radiation poisoning" line made everyone who had Cheron/RL-something/Fawkes to do it, yet they didn't for asinine reasons and even when they agree in Broken Steel, they act pissed about it, why are they pissed?

Spoiler: Another Fallout 3 Example!

In Fallout 3 once you retrieve the G.E.C.K. in Vault 87, you are ambushed and captured by Enclave troops before you get out. Problem is, the main door of Vault 87 is broken and surrounded by deadly radiation, so the only way in is the back door through Little Lamplight. But the residents of Little Lamplight wouldn't have let the Enclave troops in, and there's nothing to suggest the Enclave forced their way through, considering there is no damage to Little Lamplight itself.

And for that matter, if the vault door is busted, how do the mutants get out?

The Vault door isn't busted, you can get into Vault 87 without using the back entrance. It's just the radiation is so high it literally takes over a hundred RadAway doses to even make it to the entrance let alone enter it and get into 87 proper.

Another Fallout 3 one:

Spoiler

So, your Dad gets killed by the massive dose of radiation the first time the device goes off along with Col. Autumn, except SOMEHOW Autumn survives and it's never ever explained. He's not wearing armor of any kind, we don't see him jam a needle of RadAway into his arm or pop a couple of Rad-X even. Yet he's fine and dandy just a while later while good old Dad is a corpse

 

[Mikeyfell]

Granted, many of these things have outcomes that seem roughly equivalent on the face, since it's just not feasible to make an entirely different game for every possible combination of factors

Really? Because After I finished Mass Effect 3 I sat down in a fit of rage and wrote one.
I'm not programing gameplay or designing levels or anything but I wrote a script that takes into account every combination of choices you can make in the first 2 games.

Yeah, a script is easy. But just as a simple example, if the Ravagers were removed from the game by killing the Rachni queen in the first game? Every single level that included them needs to be reworked and rebalanced. The quest in the tunnels no longer exists for half of the pcs, so suddenly you have to allow for a wide range of levels of Shepard in every mission after that because of lost exp, and half your your players are going to be bitching about the game being too long or too short unless you make some equivalent mission that only happens if there aren't rachni around for some reason. Which would increase production costs by a significant amount and make the story even more nonsensical.

Wait. How is compensating for a very important player choice that was completely ignored by the writers of the game going to make anything more nonsensical?
Because to my mind.
I killed the last Rachnai. Oh shoot they're all back is more nonsensical than
I killed the last Rachnai, anything that doesn't involve Rachnai happens.

And I fully agree that redoing the levels to compensate for player choices would take work.
You know what? Good things take work.
If Bioware seriously thought that they could half ass and cut every corner and end up with a good game that means they should stop making products because they obviously don't know what they're supposed to be doing.

When it comes right down to it there aren't that many factors you have to take into account... there are only 50 possible outcomes you have to consider.

And if you make the basic structure of the game different for each one, that's 50 different full length AAA games you need to make. With all the rage over day 1 DLC, do you really think anyone would be willing to pay the several hundreds of dollars per copy required to recoup those costs?

There are really only 3 or 4 choices that would drastically effect the gameplay.
There would only be 1 or 2 levels they'd have to build from scratch, and just recycle the enemy AI they already used.
The vast majority would only effect the writing process and since that's the easy part just nut up and pay your vice actors to read more lines.
Like I said the script is only about 5 times the length, the amount of new architecture you have to program is negligible. and they'd really only have to make one, maybe two more enemy factions. And considering how boring and samey all the Mass Effect firefights are all they'd have to do is re-skin Cerberus and call it a day.


But this is Bioware we're talking about, if the writing is good people would play Mass Effect 3 the text adventure, that's the kind of fan base Bioware had, and they're fucking us over with these poorly written worse constructed action games. Go back to RPG's, go back to the Hero's Journey, and if you need to cut cost cut cut graphics.
What does this have to do with Day 1 DLC?

That would be the case if any of the scenes you mentioned existed. You save the queen, your numbers go up.
You save the clone, your numbers go down and you get a strongly worded letter from Hackett.

Did you actually read any of the text in the game? Because everything in the game is a part of the story, and if you don't pay attention to anything without a big shiny cutscene you're missing much of the plot and can't really contribute to a story discussion.

Yes I read every word of it.
Especially the Emails from people who refuse to talk to you when you're standing 3 feet from them insistently clicking on them.
The problem is that it was mostly exposition, There were a few times when you got a legitimately good Email (Kai Leng's post coup message, Morinth's message to Rila and what's her name. A lot of the messages that had nothing to do with anything like the interrogation records and such)
You never got any real insightful character information that made me think differently about any of the stuff I think. Wrapping up an entire story arc in a brief impersonal email is very bad form. It's like they outsourced all the email messages to interns. (Except the ones I mentioned up there. But hey, some interns are talented. Maybe interns wrote all of 'em. I don't know.)

If Shepard knew that TIM and by extension Cerberus is was and forever will be evil, why in the hell did s/he give TIM the Collector base?

That base was full of tech which could be used against the Reapers. For all you knew, it was the only way to catch up the crippling technological disadvantage in time to save the galaxy. That wasn't a question of whether or not you liked Cerberus, it was a question of whether you were willing to take the risk of giving that resource to someone you knew was evil but currently working on the right side, or if you would destroy that threat at the cost of being less prepared for the real invasion.

According to you. YOU. Shepard knew the Illusive Man was evil and going to stab him/her in the back the second s/he showed it to him. That's you talking (That's me paraphrasing you)

And willing to work with people who are clearly evil because he can't accomplish what he needs alone

That's you taking.
Would you trust someone who is "clearly evil" with that level of technology?

It's all rendered moot anyway because TIM attacks you first thing in ME3 regardless of what you did with the base.
Regardless of how much you wanted to work with him.
Regardless of how much you thought his Idea about reverse engineering indoctrination to use it against the Reapers was a better plan than putting all your eggs in the Dues Ex Machnia basket.

Basically Shepard died in the 6 months between ME 2 and 3 and was replaced by a personality deficient dipshit who was unwilling and unable to think for him/her self.

 

[Mortamus]

Diablo III.

Pretty much the only character that actually acted to all their hype and description that made them the feared Lesser Evils was...oh wait. None of them. Belial the Lord of Lies put himself directly in your face constantly, and even the NPCs commented on how horribly obvious he was. Azmodan was even worse. For being the revered tactician, he was constantly telling you his plans like some poorly written cartoon villian. I half expected him to say "I would have gotten away with it, too, if it weren't for you meddling kids!" Diablo was the only one that accomplished anything or truly lived up to his legend.

 

[darlarosa]

Dragon Age 2.

All the way through it you get drummed with "Mages are good .... Templars are bad".

Yet all the way through it the Templars are helpful and polite and the Mages are trying to eat my face.....

Kind of hard to follow a plot and take it seriously when it doesn't know what the fuck it's doing itself. In fact, the Templars don't turn "bad" until the very end and even then it's only 1 person .... who turns bad because of a corrupt sword .... made from metal Hawke found.

WHO WRITES THIS SHIT.

Well...its pretty much implied throughout the game that a lot of rape and sexual assault is happening in the Gallows. If you walk around the gallows and click on people a few times or overhear them they'll hint at it repeatedly. The reason that crazy Templar was making mages Trainquil was so he could use them without complaining. Alain, one of the mages from Starkhaven, if he is captured he will tell you that he has been forced to do things under threat of being made Trainquil

It's not done well at all. Every other mage uses blood magic, and
I have a theory it was all in an attempt to make people want to play a templar in DA3....

So reapers attack earth and Shepard and Anderson start climbing around on the rooftops. Why? Why didn't they just take the stairs, how is this in any way faster or safer than the sensible thing?

Because the doors are blocked and the interior of the building is chaos. Thats pretty damn clear. Not to mention you don't know what is stable and what isn't....remember the Reaper tore through that building.
...a lot og your questions are answered if you go look up the wiki or...pay attention to the game

Actually if you look closely, the desk breaks apart as it hits the wall, so there goes that. And that's exactly my point, we don't know if the door works because nobody in the room even bothers to check, they just look at the blown out window and go "Yep this is the best way to go about this." without even thinking things through. So yeah, maybe you'd like to try paying attention.

Edit: Also, are you suggesting to me that Shepard and Anderson( trained military proffessionals) can't...hop over a desk when we see them hoping over chest high walls within the next few minutes? As Shepard once said to a reporter: I'm tired of your disingenuous assertions!

If you actually look, some of the beams of the room are in the debris, then if you look at the direction where they came from which is the only apparent interest to the room their are large beams and other steel debris blocking the way. Also consider that the goal is to get out of there, and get to a ship of some kind. There is a better chance of that if you are outside then in a building. Considering that the reapers could once again fire on the building and bring the whole damn thing down it might be a good idea to go outside. Do you run through a burning building trying to get out or use the fire escape?

Now onto the artistic licence. Consider this is the first time the player sees Earth and Reaper destruction first hand. By putting Anderson and Shep outside you give the player that defining image of burning Earth. It doesn't disrupt the game,

 

[Spiritmaster]

Baldur's Gate 2, don't know if this is explained in game, but why after draining your "bhaal-hood" does Jon decide to send you through a laughably easy (but long) dungeon rather than kill you with his instant-kill death magic while you are weakened? Seeing as though he is still at the asylum when you get back from the dungeon (and resting in 8 hour intervals) he clearly wasn't pressed for time.

 

[Suncatcher]

That base was full of tech which could be used against the Reapers...

According to you. YOU. Shepard knew the Illusive Man was evil and going to stab him/her in the back the second s/he showed it to him. That's you talking (That's me paraphrasing you)

And willing to work with people who are clearly evil because he can't accomplish what he needs alone

That's you taking.
Would you trust someone who is "clearly evil" with that level of technology?

Personally? Yes. Under those circumstances, I'd power up the evil xenophobic bastards behind Akuze and Admiral Kahoku and Subject Zero and Overlord and all those other horrors. I'd cure the genophage and revive the rachni even if I was sure that they were going to rampage across the galaxy the instant the Reapers were gone. Hell, I'd uplift the bloody Yahg if they gave me a chance, because compared to the extinction of all sapient organics everything else is a lesser evil. If it makes the forces resisting extinction stronger, and the problems it creates in the future are smaller than the Reapers themselves, it's the right choice. That's what the Renegade path means: recognizing that you can't save everyone, accepting the collateral damage from your actions, finding a route that does more good than harm because you can't remove all the harm, and getting the job done however you can because failure is simply not an option.

 

[Mikeyfell]

That base was full of tech which could be used against the Reapers...

According to you. YOU. Shepard knew the Illusive Man was evil and going to stab him/her in the back the second s/he showed it to him. That's you talking (That's me paraphrasing you)

And willing to work with people who are clearly evil because he can't accomplish what he needs alone

That's you taking.
Would you trust someone who is "clearly evil" with that level of technology?

Personally? Yes. Under those circumstances, I'd power up the evil xenophobic bastards behind Akuze and Admiral Kahoku and Subject Zero and Overlord and all those other horrors. I'd cure the genophage and revive the rachni even if I was sure that they were going to rampage across the galaxy the instant the Reapers were gone. Hell, I'd uplift the bloody Yahg if they gave me a chance, because compared to the extinction of all sapient organics everything else is a lesser evil. If it makes the forces resisting extinction stronger, and the problems it creates in the future are smaller than the Reapers themselves, it's the right choice. That's what the Renegade path means: recognizing that you can't save everyone, accepting the collateral damage from your actions, finding a route that does more good than harm because you can't remove all the harm, and getting the job done however you can because failure is simply not an option.

Saving the Rachnai queen is Renegade now? Anyway...

That's how I'd play it too. Except that there was no inclination given that that was the decision you were making at the end of ME 2. The decision you were making was presented as: do you want to stay on the Illusive Man's good side or not?
There was no threat of betrayal foreshadowed if you handed over the collector base. In fact the foreshadowing was much closer to your crew turning on you than the Illusive man.


Unfortuantly that's not how Bioware played it either because Cerberus had the exact same amount of resources and did the exact same amount of damage whether you gave them the base or not.

Back in the day when I thought Bioware could write worth a damn I thought if you handed TIM the Collector Base the Alliance would refuse to work with you and you'd enter Mass Effect 3 with a Cerberus crew. And that the council Races would be less inclined to work with you if you killed the Council, or would outright refuse to work with you if you let Udina form the new council with all humans.

Even back then I knew it was a pipe dream, but I could never have foreseen the horror story that was what we actually got.

 

[Suncatcher]

Saving the Rachnai queen is Renegade now? Anyway...

Well, at the time you probably didn't know anything about the Reapers, so it was a choice between giving the innocent queen a chance or committing genocide to keep the rest of the galaxy safe from the potential for another rachni war, so sparing her was the Paragon thing (idealistic, merciful, soft) while ending her was the Renegade thing (greater good over personal kindness, taking no chances). In a hypothetical situation in which you knew that freeing the Rachni would lead to bloody, genocidal war in the future, but would assist against the Reapers in the short term, the sides switch as the Paragon tries to prevent all that bloodshed before it starts and the Renegade accepts the future price for better odds of immediate survival.

Anyway, I agree that ME3 was not all it could (and maybe should) have been. There were many choices which didn't have as much of an effect on events as I had hoped. The whole war seems to have been delegated to the background, the multiplayer, and a tally of numbers instead of an active conflict Shepard could participate in, and in accordance with that the primary villain shifted from someone to fight against to a silent feature of the terrain. These are flaws, but not plot holes and none of them are unreasonable. And even with them, if we were to discount the ending I would easily consider this game the best of the trilogy. The problem is that we expected a perfect game, and instead got 90% of an awesome one.

 

[Mikeyfell]

choice between giving the innocent queen a chance or committing genocide

Allegedly innocent.

Anyway, I agree that ME3 was not all it could (and maybe should) have been. There were many choices which didn't have as much of an effect on events as I had hoped. The whole war seems to have been delegated to the background, the multiplayer, and a tally of numbers instead of an active conflict Shepard could participate in, and in accordance with that the primary villain shifted from someone to fight against to a silent feature of the terrain. These are flaws, but not plot holes and none of them are unreasonable. And even with them, if we were to discount the ending I would easily consider this game the best of the trilogy. The problem is that we expected a perfect game, and instead got 90% of an awesome one.

You actually think a game who's entire series was based on a narrative driven by player choice can be "90$ awesome" when it outright ignored all but 2 choices you made?


We're way off topic at this point but what did Mass Effect do "90% awesomely"

 

[Enverex]

Not so much a plot hole, but in FarCry3

Spoiler

during the hallucinogenic sequence where you have to kill Hoyt,

what the hell happened to all the guards?

It just irked me a little. Not enough to be an "oh my god this game sucks because it missed a few details" moment (not like I have those, anyway), but still, what the hell?

I found the Vaas bit even more annoying.

Spoiler

He stabs YOU, but because you kill him in a dream, you're fine and he's dead. What?! What the hell happened? Then you wake up back in the temple! How did you get there?!

 

[Lord Kloo]

First off, after the mission "No Russian", wouldn't the Russian authorities have launched a massive investigation, which would involve identifying the three other gunmen? Which would, in turn, reveal that the leader was a known terrorist and madman.

Two, since when is it considered sane to declare war on a country for the actions of one crazy-person (who wasn't actually crazy)? Some may cite the assassination of Archduke Ferdinand and WWI, but I (preemptively) counter that there were already factors and men/idiots who were pushing for war and the assassination was just the straw that broke the camel's back. As far as we (and the game) know, war is declared for the sole reason of an American being involved in the slaughter.

Three, the entire invasion force is shown to be attacking from the Pacific and the Atlantic. The Pacific? Yeah, I can buy that, since Russia has direct access to the Pacific Ocean. But the Atlantic? No way. That would mean that Russian forces had to either a)launch from the Barents Sea and make a long sea trip, b)take a massive road trip through Europe, or c)fly massive armadas over Europe, all of which involve (illegally) passing through the borders/airspace of almost every major European power.

Four, how do you launch a massive, full scale invasion force in the digital age, which has almost-instantaneous-communication and satellite surveillance, without anyone noticing until the last minute?

And finally, the coup-de-grace, the most glaring hole the Russian invasion in MW2 has. The entire invasion force: all the men, the equipment, the armor, the aircraft, the supplies and ammunition. All of that was gathered, prepped, organized, and mobilized, within the span of three days.

No sense at all.

Don't get me wrong. I don't hate MW2. It's a solid and enjoyable shooter. It just didn't think things through.

My own personal remedy to the whole of MW2 was that Makarov had enough power over the Russian government with his blackmail terrorist operations to start a war with Shepard's backing that the US would be weak and powerless (due the the satellite already being stolen but I also think Shepard had helped to shut down the US defenses, somehow..). The Ultra-nationalist and presumably anti-US government of Russia after the civil war probably leapt at the idea of invading a powerless USA and so invaded so on Makarov's promises (partially explains why the Russians were ready in 3 days in that they already planned to invade the USA) meanwhile Shepard was still running all the shit but actually had no plan what-so-ever for getting the Russians out of the USA (apparently only Price's nuke EMP saved the US bacon).

However it never seems to be explained if Makarov is in with the Russian govt. or not, I think he dupes them like Shepard dupes Makarov into giving the US 'a new patriotic generation'... I guess thats why the Russians want a peace treaty in MW3 because they've just realised they're complete tools

Although it doesn't explain why the US president didn't just ring up the Kremlin and threaten nuclear war unless the Russian troops got off his lawn right now... would have been a hell of a lot simpler than almost going scorched earth on your capital city just because its under enemy occupation for a few hours

Also I'm not sure if Shepard wants Price to launch the Russia nuke to help the US soldiers in Washington, Price won't know the situation and it seems the US would have been pretty screwed if the nuke had not launched and downed all the pretty Russian equipment (despite the fact that the US Army and Airforce probably could have mobilized to defeat the invasion in days, though i guess there is more Shepard magic going on here in his making the uS a prime target for the Russians

All seems a bit extreme just because the general lost the 30,000 men of his Marine force to a Russian rebel and terrorist, would have made more sense to aid the Russian loyalists by sending US forces in to fight the rebels

 

[imagremlin]

Super Mario 64.

Princess Peach invites Mario for cake, Mario toils for endless hours to save her, and at the end she says: "Let's bake a cake, for Mario".

YOU MEAN YOU HAVEN'T BAKED IT YET?

 

[Beautiful End]

Super Mario 64.

Princess Peach invites Mario for cake, Mario toils for endless hours to save her, and at the end she says: "Let's bake a cake, for Mario".

YOU MEAN YOU HAVEN'T BAKED IT YET?

Well, that's not much of a plot hole. A plot hole would be if she never even mentioned the cake. That just means she lies/she's lazy/she lost it/ etc.
However, your post did make me laugh cause that would be my reaction.

 

[Erttheking]

It's probably been said before, but it bears repeating.

http://jmstevenson.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/ai.png?w=500&h=290

 

[Cyrus Hanley]

In Heavy Rain, they never explain Ethan's blackouts, which is a pretty big deal because they are the reason he is the main suspect. What is more, they contain information about victims Ethan wouldn't have even met...

they came out in a video and explained that one but it had a supernatural like explanation so the scenes that explained that were cut out of the game. shame really

You dont need a supernatural explanation. He was in a car accident and had a concussion which causes blackouts. Simple.

You don't understand, he's not proposing a supernatural explanation, he's saying that the explanation was supernatural.


They cut all that content explaining it and left plot holes.

EDIT: I dont remember him miraculously learning new information via blackouts but they do cause memory loss, maby he forgot how he learned said information. It's a stretch I know but it makes some sort of sense.

When Ethan comes to from the blackouts he has origami. That's a plot hole.

 

[Auron225]

I was replaying it recently, noticed it and remembered this thread;

In Final Fantasy IV;

When you go back to Baron castle with Palom, Porom, Tellah and Yang - there is that scene where the walls are closing together and Palom & Porom turn themselves to stone to hold them apart. Why couldn't Tellah just teleport them out? o.o

 

[Narfo]

Snip

Snip

Interesting theory.
My only real problem here's that Twilight_guy didn't say that. I did.
Not sure what happened there.

 

[Cheesus Crust]

Dragon Age 2.

All the way through it you get drummed with "Mages are good .... Templars are bad".

Yet all the way through it the Templars are helpful and polite and the Mages are trying to eat my face.....

Kind of hard to follow a plot and take it seriously when it doesn't know what the fuck it's doing itself. In fact, the Templars don't turn "bad" until the very end and even then it's only 1 person .... who turns bad because of a corrupt sword .... made from metal Hawke found.

WHO WRITES THIS SHIT.

While I wouldn't agree to everything you said, I do agree that overall the plot made no sense as it had no direction. I think Yahtzee said it best, each chapter of the game felt like it was just build up that ended within the same chapter, which is why at the end it felt like Hawke didn't really achieve anything because there was no overarching plot like in DAO. I also felt that there was no sense of closure to the game's story.

I had the suspicion that EA planned to actually end Hawke's real story through DLC which they bailed out of at the last moment feeling that it would infuriate a lot of fans.