BioWare Did Right By Us

[Mr Companion]

Hey everyone, I frequent this site but until now I have been on the sidelines but I thought I'd chime in here with my own opinion.

I just beat Mass Effect 3 with Extended Cut DLC. What I mean to say is, I've never played Mass Effect 3 before the EC DLC version and I didn't spoil anything though it was impossible to avoid all the hubris over the ending in the past few months.

I thought the story was perfect, and the endings were very good. I have viewed the non-extended DLC versions on youtube and while I understand they have some plotholes I think this entire issue is ridiculously exaggerated. The main complaints are

1) No closure, plot holes that don't explain what happened to our crew members.

-Does not apply to me because my first play through was with extended cut! lol. That being said, I could understand the frustration over this but it was fixed with this DLC and I don't think it was big enough an issue for people to rise in arms like they did. The real issue was.

I never played ME 3 (did play the others) but here is the thing, rewind time and imagine you played it without the extended cut first. You've just had a massive adventure spanning three long games growing to love the characters and the world around them. Then at the very end no matter what you do all the mass relays explode and kill every living thing, assuming that didn't happen all the relays are gone anyway so all the trade lines and communication are scuppered leading to terrible strife, the whole fleet that fought desperately and heroically to save the galaxy are now stranded floating above a ravaged earth. And even assuming the ending somehow didn't indicate any of these things the worst thing is not being able to know. No closure at all. A tiny dialogue tree leading to three non-choices full of plotholes. Then the developers explain its "artistic" or "open to interpretation" or "bittersweet" although I struggle to see whats so sweet amongst all the bitter but kay. The old endings seem fine to you because you know what they all mean and how it's supposed to end, but when left in the dark a player is understandably frustrated (time money and care investment not paid back).

Anyway all that aside these new fully fleshed out endings are good. The endings never needed to be happy snugglefun where everything is fine forever but they needed what they got, an explanation.

 

[Mr Companion]

I know it's extremely long but it is well worth a read and I sincerely hope this persons message is heard by BioWare.

That was fantastic, its astonishing how even now we learn more and more reasons why the standard endings (and even the extended endings) are fail to deliver. Its like the awfulness is so prevalent in every aspect of its design it becomes a multifaceted gem where every time you turn to look at it from a different angle you discover more flaws, new depths of wrongness to research and examine in full. Light catches it from another angle here or we see something in a facet there and suddenly we locate another thing wrong with it so deeply stupid we feel compelled to write a massive report about it. In a way the Mass Effect ending debacle has caused such dedicated study/rampant fury from every fan even remotely related to it that it has sparked interest and passion from the community in ways that go about halfway to refunding the misplaced emotional investment it trashed in the first place. Actually pretty cool when you think about it!

 

[I.Muir]

The amusing thing to me is that is still worth talking about
The root of their problem was the star child and vague attempts to be meaningful but managing to leave plot holes caused by this character unaddressed and giving unknowable vaguely cthulian horrors a purpose at all was a mistake - everybody should know this by now
The extended cut DLC did not fix this massive problem it only made the endings less sad overall which is a major miscommunication or just bioware being deluded. They did this even though just removing the star child makes the whole thing into an above average ending and they could have handed the whole plot into a primary school English teacher and have been told much the same.
I just don't understand how anybody could not see these things as a problem bioware fans or not

Of course if the star child was gone we wouldn't be able to choose what color the ending was but without the stupid little speech beforehand how much of a difference would this have made. I think this is kind of stupid in itself that you didn't spend the entire game building up to the choice rather than being informed by bastard mcplothole in the last twenty minutes. Just goes to show the ending was some last minute shite thrown together because who would purposefully miss out on building that kind of suspense.

 

[putowtin]

Of course Shepard shot first,

and with "lot's of big guns!"

 

[-Dragmire-]

Out of curiosity, does the Catalyst explain why he's showing himself in the form of Shepard's nightmare kid now? Maybe that info was already there and I missed it but I'm pretty sure that doesn't come in conversation, which is odd.

 

[Neonsilver]

Oh, and one minor nitpick about the EC... I see that in addition to Multi-Core Shielding, we have added some serious Plot Armor to the Normandy. Or did Harbinger just decide that the ship that carries the people that have been screwing with the Reapers' plans at every turn just wasn't worth shooting at? Maybe Joker had a Red Cross painted on the hull?

I actually attributed that to the Normandy's stealth systems - they've said many times that the only way you could detect the ship would be if you were looking at it, and Reapers don't have "eyes"...

The problem with that assumption is that the Reaper-created Collector ship could detect the Normandy just fine, even in stealth mode.

And that the shuttles that were used to bring sheppard and the rest of the ground forces were shot down. If I remember it right at some point in the game it's said that since me2 those shuttles got the same stealth system the normandy has.

 

[TastyCarcass]

The extended cut DLC did not fix this massive problem it only made the endings less sad overall which is a major miscommunication or just bioware being deluded.

THIS

For the love of god Bioware needs to understand this. It was not a bad ending because it was a sad or unhappy ending in the sense that The Godfather had a bad ending, it was a bad ending because it was a terrible ending that contradicted the themes of all three games up to that point and made absolutely no sense.

They could have handed the whole plot into a primary school English teacher and have been told much the same.

More like primary school student.

Out of curiosity, does the Catalyst explain why he's showing himself in the form of Shepard's nightmare kid now? Maybe that info was already there and I missed it but I'm pretty sure that doesn't come in conversation, which is odd.

The Indoctrination theory was confirmed as being the original idea, which would have made sense. It still wouldn't have worked with the themes of the games story, as the long post on this page pointed out, but it would have made sense. Apparently it was cut, although I'm not sure why. I also read that the Prothean had much more to do with the story originally, as the Illusive Man was supposed to kidnap him, but because they made the decision to use him as DLC, they could no longer make him directly related to the game's plot.

 

[Neonsilver]

The Indoctrination theory was confirmed as being the original idea, which would have made sense. It still wouldn't have worked with the themes of the games story, as the long post on this page pointed out, but it would have made sense. Apparently it was cut, although I'm not sure why. I also read that the Prothean had much more to do with the story originally, as the Illusive Man was supposed to kidnap him, but because they made the decision to use him as DLC, they could no longer make him directly related to the game's plot.

Where did you get that information?

 

[TastyCarcass]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBETU-uOGh8&feature=plcp

 

[TwistednMean]

You can go to great lengths about why Bioware did a great job with extended cut, I'm sure. Only it doesn't make the story any more gratifying for those people why didn't like the idea of an ass-pulled character coming along at the very end of the series coercing the player character into arbitrary and extremely morally ambiguous decisions. All the while saying that synthetic and organic lifeforms will be ultimately at odds with each other even though Geth throughout the series are a very convincing example of how this is not the case.

This totally destroys the Reapers motivation, which as dark and scary as long as it has been unknown and now they look like complete morons, who can't even make out what's wrong with wiping all organics out, who could produce synthetics, who could wipe them out. And the most disturbing thing is Shepard swallowing this load of crap and going along with what Catalyst suggests.

Yeah, I almost forgot to mention the new endings with "the cycle continues". That one almost made me feel like Bioware needed to justify their stupid original ending by stating that either you agree or you die. Would have been all right if it was a book. But since it's an freaking role-play game they just totally spoil the fun of a person grinding through the whole series just to get to a point where everyone dies. Seriously, it would have been a lot better if they never implemented this ending at all, because it does have the sort of spit-in-the-face feel to it.

 

[TotalerKrieger]

After watching the extended cut endings, it really struck me just how amateurish and incomplete the original endings actually were. The new endings were a big improvement but certainly had a "band-aid" feel to them at times. The epilouge sequences to synthesis and destroy made me cringe a bit due to all the unwavering bullshit. Control, previously my least favorite ending, was awesome, the space-guardian angle was the right way to go.

In the end, I still felt compelled to uninstall ME1, ME2 & ME3 from my hard drive. Another playthrough of the trilogy just isn't worth my time at this point. My original disappointment with the endings has permanently marred the series, and no attempt to fix them, even if fairly competent, will change this.

 

[Atmos Duality]

Catalyst-Starchild still exists so...really, this is just damage control.
Good effort, but I think the damage is irreparable simply because it betrayed the series' original ambition ("Your decisions matter"...well, maybe TWO decisions matter now).

ME3 will eventually go down as something for hipsters and business geeks to argue over; an obvious case of business and greed overtaking the creative ambitions of its creators.

(the huge sudden emphasis placed on multiplayer in what was a personal story; the DLC money-packs associated with the multiplayer, the rushed hugely contrived "twist" ending.)

Priorities changed between ME2 and ME3, and it shows.

As for why they do not shoot at the normandy...*snip*

Just looking at all the explanations, I'm calling it a plot hole.

Why? If every explanation requires personal interpretation and blind assumption in order to work, then the outcome is ambiguous.

Which is fine for regular plot points and twists (even unintended ones *cough*Blade Runner*cough*); but not potential plot holes.

 

[KrabbiPatty]

I'm gonna' say this right now, as someone who was as deep in the Retake trenches as anyone and who is still bitter at BioWare, I have to admit that they DID do right by the fans.

The ending is still stupid and ignorant and fucked up and the Baby Jesus bullshit is still insulting and forced...BUUUUT at least now it's a stupid, ignorant, fucked up, insulting, forced ending that MAKES SENSE.

And really that's all I personally wanted.

I said it before, if they at least explain why the Mass Relays blowing up didn't destroy the galaxy (here, they don't blow up, so the point is moot) why Joker left the battle (he was ordered) and if everyone starved to death or not (no, they didn't) then I'd be happy.

That doesn't make this a GOOD ending. I've read the original idea for the ending, it's better...the Indoc ending is better, and it's just "Loose Change: The Game of the Movie"...but that being said Bioware did the right thing.

And why shouldn't they: if they ACTUALLY cared about artistic integrity then they'd try and fix the plot holes...which they did. So they do. So at least I know Bioware didn't actively screw people over for money, to sell DLC as I had feared, they just did it because they genuinely, by no fault of their own, wrote a shitty ending due to ignorance and complacency (and due to politicking between Casey Hudson and his peers too) so I can forgive that, since God only knows I've made tremendous fuck ups in the past. I'm not one to talk.

So as far as I'm concerned, Bioware did the right thing, I'm not happy about it--I'd prefer if it had never been necessary in the first place--but I'm happy they owned up. It shows me they care about their fans and that matters to me, as a consumer.

So good on you Bioware, you did the capital letters Right Thing and that's what counts.