Black Thor Actor Talks About Racist Comic Book Fans

[remulean]

the guy is pretty good in the movie and he portrays heimdall well. as a casting decision it was a good job and i have no problem with him being black. that said, i'm from iceland and in iceland the old sagas and the ancient mythology is a pretty improtant part of the curriculum, this stuff is a big part of our cultural heritage. the guy is described as literally the "witest of the gods". so it burns me a little, but hey this is a comic book movie,and a damn good one.that said, i wonder what black people would say if anansi was portrayed by a white person.

 

[Poofs]

It is a sad day when wanting something to stay true to it's source material is considered 'racist'

Considering that no waves were made when the news of an Asian was cast in a similar role, it raises a big red flag about what the true motivation is. Not to mention all the dozens of other inaccuracies between the movie and comics (or actual Norse mythology).

This may be true, however you must admit that an Asian person was much more likely to be found in Viking Civilization, for all we know Vikings could have been in contact with nations in China. They both possessed the technology, you also have to admit that White, and Asian skin tones are not all that different. However a Black Guy, would stand out, and does stand out, like, well, like a Black Guy in a Society of White Gods.
I just feel that people making movies, or any other form of media, should not be labeled as 'racist' for trying to create a more authentic experience.

 

[KirbyKrackle]

That comparison makes no sense. de Niro being cast in Thor would bring complaints that would have nothing to do with skin color. People don't want Elba as Heimdall merely because he's black.

No, people have a problem with Elba because he doesn't look the part.

Why/How doesn't he look the part?

I think people have more of a problem with race on the side DEFENDING the decision, than people who are actually denouncing it.

If they had cast frigging Mickey Abbot for the role, I don't care how great a performance, everyone would have complained, and no one would be defending the decision.

But because the difference in appearance is race instead, so everyone rushes to defend it...

It's kind of odd. I really hate being put on the same side as the racist lunatics who complain about this... But I think it's hillarious that everyone is up at arms at fans complaining about an appearance change in a casting decision...

Huh? Sorry, could you answer my question? I guess I'm kind of dumb, because I don't really feel you answered it. I don't quite get your comments like "I think people have more of a problem with race on the side DEFENDING the decision, than people who are actually denouncing it." Elba's defending it, so he has a problem with black people? Also, since many of the people denouncing the casting choice are out-right racists, your reasoning seems a bit unfounded. I'm really curious as to what your basis is for this line of argument, in fact.

Also, I think it's hilarious that the "fans" are up in arms and complaining about an appearance change in a casting decision. Obsessive comic nerds are an eternal font of entertainment, are they not? And so far as that goes, we're all forgetting the most important thing here: Does Loki have his ridiculous hat in the movie or not?

 

[The Deadpool]

Huh? Sorry, could you answer my question? I guess I'm kind of dumb, because I don't really feel you answered it. I don't quite get your comments like "I think people have more of a problem with race on the side DEFENDING the decision, than people who are actually denouncing it." Elba's defending it, so he has a problem with black people? Also, since many of the people denouncing the casting choice are out-right racists, your reasoning seems a bit unfounded. I'm really curious as to what your basis is for this line of argument, in fact.

The difference is indeed race. But I postulate that were the difference anything else other than race, the fans would STILL complain (although the racists likely wouldn't), BUT there would not be this large influx of people DEFENDING this decision.

Does Loki have his ridiculous hat in the movie or not?

Yup...

Hogun is Japanese, while the character in the comics has always looked more like a Mongolian Charles Bronson. And Volstagg should reall be in a fat suit.

All three complaints have been brought up by fans, but only one gets defended...

 

[ReiverCorrupter]

Let me just put this as clearly as possible: Norse Mythology did not have any moral values to enforce. It had no messages to preach, it had nothing to teach. It is one of the most pointless religions ever to have existed.

So my point still stands: Nobody from Scandinavia has no reason to proclaim their national heritage.

LOL at bolded. If it had no value it wouldn't have existed in the first place. Norse mythology reflected the war-like attitude of the vikings, and like it or not, the vikings were one of the most influential forces in medieval history, not only as conquers but as world class merchants. In fact, despite depictions of them being mindless barbarians they were incredibly skilled craftsmen and actually worked to spread the advances of civilization, especially to Ireland. Britain would be unrecognizable without the vikings (I'm not sure if you're aware of this but the Normans were of viking decent as well).

Are you perchance a Christian, and if so, would I be out of line to assume that you think that Christianity is the only religion that has a worthwhile value system? I hate to break it to you, but it was exactly when Scandinavians became Christians that they stopped having much of an effect on European history.

The idea that the ethics of the norse religion was one of barbarity and bloodshed is quite a commom misconception. The idea that they had no moral values is just plain wrong. Even though the Norse were infamous for raiding and whatnot, they weren't mindless barbarians. The Eddas are full of ethical rules and guidelines, and most of the stories are highly allegorical for the Norse mindset, which actually weren't so far from the christian way of thinking in some ways.

For example, the Hávamál (the central poem regarding Norse morals) starts out by saying that a good man is a generous host to every guest who visits him. The Grimnirsmál tells the story of Odin who suffers at the hand of an evil king, until he is saved by the young prince, who is rewarded with divine knowledge. Replace "Odin" with "Jesus" and it wouldn't seem too out of place in the Bible.

Not to say that the norse religion is really just christianity in disguise, there are plenty of differences - the biggest of them being (in my mind) the fact that the norse heathen's relationship with the gods had roots in his own personal honor and renown, a personal religious view, if you will, whereas the christian values are defined from a collective, over-arching idea of sin and absolution, under which each man's qualities are assimilated. What the best form of religion is, I don't know, but it sure is a difference.

Now, I'm not trying to play clever here, don't get me wrong. ReiverCorrupter, I am sure you know most, if not all, of this already, it was more the blatant ignorance of Cherry Cola that called for a little education : )

...

That said, I agree that we scandinavians aren't any more "viking" than anyone else, as the traces of both blood and culture have been long since wiped and warped beyond reckognition. Not that that's necesarilly a bad thing, it's unavoidable, but the link between the modern scandinavian and the ancient viking is very thin indeed these days.

Yes, I agree. I would by no means credit hospitality to Christians though, it is an extremely old Indoeuropean value, even Homer speaks of it in the Iliad and Odyssey.

Honestly the Vikings were more advanced in a lot of ways than the rest of Europe. They were probably the greatest explorers in human history, discovering the Americas several hundred years before Columbus. Not to mention they founded Russia, and had an incredibly complex network of trade that extended on to the middle east. Not only that, but the Althing is one of the oldest judicial systems still in existence. When they conquered a land they generally improved it.

And when they did raid people, they were not just a bunch of disorganized looters, but rather well organized and extremely clever tacticians. They were known for their triangular shield wall which was part of what gave them their military advantage as well as the vastly superior design of their longships which allowed them to not only travel at amazing speeds, but to do so within only a few feet of water, thus allowing them to quickly strike well inland behind enemy defenses by following rivers. Far from being mindless raiders they were a military force so formidable as to hold the entire kingdom of France, (which had an entire army at its disposal), for ransom.

So yeah, I think Scandinavians have a lot to be proud of, and if I were them I wouldn't try to distance myself from my amazing ancestors just because they had some war-like tendencies. Hell, the phrase 'war-like' in the context of history is more or less synonymous with 'winner'. Just adding to your point, I'm sure you know all of this as well.

 

[KirbyKrackle]

Huh? Sorry, could you answer my question? I guess I'm kind of dumb, because I don't really feel you answered it. I don't quite get your comments like "I think people have more of a problem with race on the side DEFENDING the decision, than people who are actually denouncing it." Elba's defending it, so he has a problem with black people? Also, since many of the people denouncing the casting choice are out-right racists, your reasoning seems a bit unfounded. I'm really curious as to what your basis is for this line of argument, in fact.

The difference is indeed race. But I postulate that were the difference anything else other than race, the fans would STILL complain (although the racists likely wouldn't), BUT there would not be this large influx of people DEFENDING this decision.

Does Loki have his ridiculous hat in the movie or not?

Yup...

Hogun is Japanese, while the character in the comics has always looked more like a Mongolian Charles Bronson. And Volstagg should reall be in a fat suit.

All three complaints have been brought up by fans, but only one gets defended...

I'm sorry, he kept the hat, yet people are complaining about the movie not being faithful? What more could anyone ask for?

Also, one gets defended more than the other because one decision gets attacked more than the others, and, as has been pointed out, is attacked by far nastier than your usual comic book guy (hard to imagine, I know), which means it gets more attention. I'm sure most normal people have long since learned to ignore the petulant whining of obsessive "fans" in favour of dealing with actual societal problems (e.g., racism), which is why, other than as a source of derisive laughter, no, no one would care about some comic nerd's hand-wringing over an appearance change being "wrong".

 

[Clankenbeard]

I'm pretty sure that Nick Fury was originally white. I know that he was black in comics before the movies but he was definitely white first. It's not exactly a new thing, is all I'm saying. Also, Elba was awesome in Thor and I wouldn't change him just to fit in a little bit better with the traditional canon. Things don't always have to change for the worse.

I never liked Nick Fury in the comics as an eyepatched non-stretchy Reed Richards clone. I did wonder "Why is Samuel Jackson playing Nick Fury?" out of preservation of my precious comic book satiated upbringing. But I have to say, I like him in the role.

My kids saw the trailer with Hal Jordan as the Green Lantern and went all "WTF?!? Why isn't Green Lantern black, like on Justice League? That's not John Stewart!" It's weird. Where I live (Houston), young people mostly don't give a rat's ass about color. (There are the exceptions.) Adults are all still twisted up about equality and racism. Kids don't care about skin color or heritage. They just care if their friends are cool.

Marvel should just recast Roadie (War Machine) or Storm with white people for any impending sequels. I don't think anyone would have a problem with that. Atoned!

(Maybe recast the White Queen as a black person as well, just to shake things up? Beta Ray Bill should be played by an eskimo in Thor II! These are all fee ideas for anybody.)

 

[JediMB]

Hell, the phrase 'war-like' in the context of history is more or less synonymous with 'winner'.

We were banging seven gram rocks. That's how we rolled.

<_<

 

[ReiverCorrupter]

-snip-

Alright. I could have sworn this went without needing to be said, but I guess meanie-pants words need to actually have their definition detailed.

Definition of prick: A man regarded as stupid, unpleasant, or contemptible.

...

Did that clear it up for you?

I don't care about the word. I never did. It was never my point in the first place.

So, if someone is ignoring all of the much larger issues with calling these Norse Gods the same as the Norse Gods of mythology because one of them was black in the comic book movie loosely based on the comic book that is very loosely based on the mythology, it's because they are being stupid. They are being unpleasant for arguing about it, and they're being contemptible for continuing to carry around the racism card.

You have, however, now given an argument so I'm satisfied.

 

[L-J-F]

"whitewashing [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/91423-Avatar-Protest-Shut-Down-By-Viacom-Copyright-Claim]" in The Last Airbender movie - which is the casting of white actors as characters of color

That was stupid too :|

 

[Hat Man]

A black Norse god....

I find that to be just a silly notion. But it's just as silly as a notion as a women (or Valkyrie) fighting when in historical context.

However I do find the notion of being against "whitewashing" to be just as racist as having a black guy in a movie just so you can say your movie has a black guy in it.

 

[L-J-F]

Although Elba doesn't look like a typical viking, it's not as if he's playing a historical figure, and it's hardly the only liberty that Marvel has taken with the Norse pantheon. As insults go, saying that the Norse gods were actually aliens with some really advanced technology - which is actually true in the Marvel canon - would seem to be much worse than casting a black actor as Heimdall, but strangely, no one seems to be bothered about that fact.

I also find it a bit ludicrous that people can do that, change the race of a god, make them actually aliens (which IS more ridiculous) and get away with it, if you had an Asian playing Jesus or a white woman as Mohammad you'd be dead before you finished speaking the proposal.

Not to mention it would be socially acceptable to be against either of those two (more so with the latter though).

 

[Vrex360]

I honestly never understood why it was such a big deal. I mean the character's just a gate keeper and spends most of his time just standing around, save for the occassional moment of awesomeness that he pulls off.
It's just a skin color, it shouldn't matter what skin color it is and, like Movie Bob once said, it's not 'caving in to evil left wing politically correct agendas'... it's just being fair and acknowledging that we are living in the 21st century.

Besides, isn't the rest of the cast pretty white apart from him? I mean the only other person in the whole movie who I can think of who wasn't inherently white was Natalie Portman and that's because she has Isreli origins.

Other than those two, pretty much everyone is white. White as a snowman's clean teeth at Christmas. With that in mind, does it really matter if just one character who spends nine tenths of the entire movie just standing in one spot happens to be black?

I admit I never read any of the comics and this movie was kind of my first experience with Thor as a franchise but still, I honestly didn't think there was anything wrong with a few minor tweaks.

 

[KAPTAINmORGANnWo4life]

If all of the other Gods are White, wouldn't it make sense for one of the Norse Gods who likes to stand out to represent himself as different from the rest?

 

[Gladiateher]

Comic book fans aren't racist! we love our black Nick Fury!

 

[kickyourass]

Wow I must be way behind on movie news cause this is the first I've ever heard about this. Well since I'm here I might as well throw in my two cents.

I'll say to this what I said about a black guy playing Frair Tuck in the recent BBC Robin Hood series, he was probably the best guy they could find for the part. Besides, he's a god, he can look how ever he wants to look, I'm pretty sure that's one of the perks of godhood.

 

[Mechalemmiwinks]

Eh......depending on what continuity you like, Norse Gods can look however they want. This isn't anywhere near as bad as black Kingpin.

 

[Logan Westbrook]

Although Elba doesn't look like a typical viking, it's not as if he's playing a historical figure, and it's hardly the only liberty that Marvel has taken with the Norse pantheon. As insults go, saying that the Norse gods were actually aliens with some really advanced technology - which is actually true in the Marvel canon - would seem to be much worse than casting a black actor as Heimdall, but strangely, no one seems to be bothered about that fact.

I also find it a bit ludicrous that people can do that, change the race of a god, make them actually aliens (which IS more ridiculous) and get away with it, if you had an Asian playing Jesus or a white woman as Mohammad you'd be dead before you finished speaking the proposal.

Not to mention it would be socially acceptable to be against either of those two (more so with the latter though).

You have to remember though, that there's a difference between changing elements of Norse mythology - which is for all intents and purposes, a dead religion - and changing elements of a living, breathing religion followed by millions of people all over the world.

 

[A Distant Star]

I've yet to see the movie, so I cant comment on the content of the roll, and given how fantastic and ultimately dismissive Thor the comic can be of Norse Mythology, a black Norse god hardly seems like the biggest liberty Thor the movie is going to be taking with the mythological subject mater its using. http://satwcomic.com/nordic-halloween

But at the same time, lets play a little game of hypothetical that may get me into a little bit of trouble.

Lets take the same basis plot of Thor, only switch it up with a different mythology. For the purposes of this example lets use Haitian Voodoo.

So our new comic follows the Loa (Loa are basically the caretakers of the world, something between and angel and a god, they are often analogous to Catholic Saints) Papa Legba, the intermediary between humans and the loa, as he is cast into the human world for some slight by Baron Samedi lord of the cross roads. He becomes something of a hero as he battles against the Voodoo Satan figure Kalfu. There's some romantic tension between him and Erzulie the loa of love, beauty, jewelry and peculiarly gay men. Now say for all this, there was a minor character, an important figure in voodoo mythology, Loko the Loa patron of healing. Say in the film adaptation of this comic a white actor was cast to play the roll.

Would people still complain about his ethnicity? Would it be considered racist of they did? Would it actually be racist?

 

[Valdus]

Heres an question to everyone who thinks he should have gotten the part despite being black...

Would you have cast a female actor to play Thor if she was genuinely the best actress for the part? If not, why not? Saying someone doesn't fit a role due to skin colour is the same as saying someone doesn't fit a role due to gender - on the big screen their only difference is how they look.