BTJunkie "Voluntarily" Shuts Down

[SenseOfTumour]

I still maintain that if every pirate stopped both pirating AND purchasing any form of content, just leaving those who never pirate to continue, we'd see quite a few companies go to the wall in just a few months.

There's levels of piracy, and I for one don't like being labelled a criminal, tho lawfully I am, because I have shrinkwrapped dvds, unopened on my shelf, because I prefer the convenience of torrented files over the discs I own.

Morally, I've done nothing wrong, and I'm supporting those who created the content, legally, I owe EMI or whoever a million bucks.

 

[BehattedWanderer]

Well...damn. I did not see that coming. Good on them, getting out ahead of the pain, but still. They were what, the fifth most used torrent site? Well, crap. Two down, I suppose. The more people start flocking to the other sites, the easier it'll be to target them. I guess we should be a bit careful of it.

 

[Robomega]

How about the consumers? Do they get what they want? Or is this purely between the EVIL EVIL PIRATES and the EVIL EVIL CORPORATIONS?

Or do we have to blindly accept that either artists have no money, or artists have some money after it's been taxed to the hilt?

But I'm guessing you've done some research on this: What exactly are YouTube and BTJunkie's differing objectives, and what part do you specifically criticize?

Does BTJunkie remove a copyright-infringing torrent from their listings if its legal owner files a complaint? Because if they don't, well, there's a big difference right there.

There's also the fact that corporations use YouTube as a legitimate method of advertising and many companies even stream their stuff for free on there anyways, making money off ads that play before the videos start. A few companies have made use of torrent technology for their own legitimate ends, but they're almost always done internally (ie. World of Warcraft patcher) and not through torrent search engines. And with legitimate, paid methods of digital distribution rapidly becoming available for all forms of media (iTunes, Netflix, Steam, and many more), how long can torrent trackers really maintain their legal grey area?

When you provide a service, you have a responsibility to at least ATTEMPT to police it, ensure that your clients are following the rules and not breaking the law. In some cases it's nearly impossible, yes, but attempts are still made. YouTube deletes videos and bans accounts daily. Blizzard and Valve ban cheaters and hackers. Forums like this one have moderators that scan for offending content.

The internet has been around for over two decades now, and so far attempts to police it have been hampered at every turn. Lawmakers are stymied because the internet is a land without borders; it's impossible to police something where they have no jurisdiction, and that's why we get things like SOPA and ACTA. They're desperate attempts to levy some form of control over a beast that's been running wild for far too long. I'm not saying those bills are correct or that they should be passed the way they are now (god forbid), but something does need to be done.

So what do we do? Do we hope and pray that all the millions and millions of people using the internet will wake up one day and understand that theft is wrong? All the people who justify piracy to themselves are enough evidence that that will never happen. Or do we recognize that freedom of information and freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom to steal.

People are free to hate and despise corporations and the government, but if you hate a company, you should refuse to use their products. When you download something with the justification, "I'd never have bought it anyways," it's called having your cake and eating it too. And the world doesn't work that way. Or at least it shouldn't. Right now it does, and that's the problem.

 

[Rad Party God]

For those of us not in the know and don't torrent, what is BTJunkie?

Same as Pirate Bay, different name. And for the ones that are a bit more clean than some of us, it's a torrent search page. As for how does a torrent file works, well, Google is your friend.

OT: Well, I can't say I'm glad it got shut, but I'm also a bit indifferent on the matter.

 

[AstylahAthrys]

I respect them for their decision to go down on their own terms. Still won't mean a damn thing, though. Pirates just go somewhere else. They always find somewhere new to go.

 

[viranimus]

How about the consumers? Do they get what they want? Or is this purely between the EVIL EVIL PIRATES and the EVIL EVIL CORPORATIONS?

Or do we have to blindly accept that either artists have no money, or artists have some money after it's been taxed to the hilt?

But I'm guessing you've done some research on this: What exactly are YouTube and BTJunkie's differing objectives, and what part do you specifically criticize?

Does BTJunkie remove a copyright-infringing torrent from their listings if its legal owner files a complaint? Because if they don't, well, there's a big difference right there.

Well I have to ask, did that save megaupload? Considering megaupload also blocked copywritten content upon request. Did the action against megaupload ever consider that the primary usage of megavideo had not been legitimately relevant for streaming/downloading use of copywritten material for at least the last year and a half to two years specifically because the mega staff was blocking the content of shows just as fast as they could, literally in many cases less than 24 hours after being posted for the most notable instances?

Isnt that the exact same defense that people justifying youtube give? What is the difference? Youtube is popular enough that corporations accept it not because they have control over their content (actually youtube increases illegal downloads of copywritten material because anyone with a simple youtube fvl file ripper and a file conversion program can get unlimited free music files via youtube, that the copywrite holders PUT on youtube) but because they think they can make money from it. Thats what this comes down to. Not that file sharing is wrong, or copywrite infringement is wrong because these people dont think it is or else they would not willingly host their own copywritten content on it. Its because someone else was profiting from it and they werent. That is all.

 

[Dogstile]

Oh joy, another service taken down.

On a related note, does anyone know if the US is going to give people the money back that they paid for the megaupload pro service?

 

[Awexsome]

What part of "differences between a site like Youtube or Twitter and it's objectives and something like Megaupload or BTJunkie or Pirate Bay and their objectives." didn't you get?

And ACTA got through.

Exactly. See? Good things can come when fighting piracy. Oh? You think an international treaty (not a law. Fun fact.) made to attempt to encourage the more problematic countries like China is bad while doing NOTHING to further crack down in most countries? Ok.

How about the consumers? Do they get what they want? Or is this purely between the EVIL EVIL PIRATES and the EVIL EVIL CORPORATIONS?

Or do we have to blindly accept that either artists have no money, or artists have some money after it's been taxed to the hilt?

Y'know constantly spewing strawmans and extremes isn't exactly the best option to make you seem reasonable. Little protip there.

 

[Awexsome]

How about the consumers? Do they get what they want? Or is this purely between the EVIL EVIL PIRATES and the EVIL EVIL CORPORATIONS?

Or do we have to blindly accept that either artists have no money, or artists have some money after it's been taxed to the hilt?

But I'm guessing you've done some research on this: What exactly are YouTube and BTJunkie's differing objectives, and what part do you specifically criticize?

Does BTJunkie remove a copyright-infringing torrent from their listings if its legal owner files a complaint? Because if they don't, well, there's a big difference right there.

Well I have to ask, did that save megaupload? Considering megaupload also blocked copywritten content upon request. Did the action against megaupload ever consider that the primary usage of megavideo had not been legitimately relevant for streaming/downloading use of copywritten material for at least the last year and a half to two years specifically because the mega staff was blocking the content of shows just as fast as they could, literally in many cases less than 24 hours after being posted for the most notable instances?

Did you even read the indictment? Because that's the exact opposite of what they did. Here: http://www.scribd.com/doc/78786408/Mega-Indictment

They sure as hell weren't blocking shows as fast as they could. They were ignoring orders of takedown, and even still paying their members for uploading popular pirated content while being fully aware that it was illegaly uploaded.

 

[gyroscopeboy]

Google also censors "btjunkie" as a search term because of its deep connections to piracy.

*scratches head* I could always get about 2,650,000 results - the top ten leading directly to the site?

Google only censors AutoComplete and Instant results...the sites are still indexed.

 

[viranimus]

How about the consumers? Do they get what they want? Or is this purely between the EVIL EVIL PIRATES and the EVIL EVIL CORPORATIONS?

Or do we have to blindly accept that either artists have no money, or artists have some money after it's been taxed to the hilt?

But I'm guessing you've done some research on this: What exactly are YouTube and BTJunkie's differing objectives, and what part do you specifically criticize?

Does BTJunkie remove a copyright-infringing torrent from their listings if its legal owner files a complaint? Because if they don't, well, there's a big difference right there.

Well I have to ask, did that save megaupload? Considering megaupload also blocked copywritten content upon request. Did the action against megaupload ever consider that the primary usage of megavideo had not been legitimately relevant for streaming/downloading use of copywritten material for at least the last year and a half to two years specifically because the mega staff was blocking the content of shows just as fast as they could, literally in many cases less than 24 hours after being posted for the most notable instances?

Did you even read the indictment? Because that's the exact opposite of what they did. Here: http://www.scribd.com/doc/78786408/Mega-Indictment

They sure as hell weren't blocking shows as fast as they could. They were ignoring orders of takedown, and even still paying their members for uploading popular pirated content while being fully aware that it was illegaly uploaded.

And do I trust what a government agency tells me is true? Or do I belive what people who deal in that scene would show you as well as what anyone was free to verify at any given time on their own.

The scene had long since moved to other lockers like putlocker, VideoBB, VideoZer and others, because megavideo was trashing links to content too quickly, when it comes to streamed content, and for direct downloads thats not how torrent sites like TPB and mininova even work.

In short do you believe what your told, or what you could have seen with your own eyes had you ever looked?

Yes, I had read the indictment the day it came out. Because I was vested in a megaupload account, and lost my migration files right in the middle of reformatting my main PC and now things like my scanned art proofs, work documents, tons of personal recorded tracks I use for my own recordings, minecraft save file, and about 50gb worth of stuff I hosted on megaupload that was password protected and not accessible to the general public is essentially being held hostage in what amounts to a terroristic activity. So yes I do have a vested interest in this, and I would like my access to my 100% completely legal files back. So too would thousands of others. Yet these people cannot because the US has in effect selectively imposed its legal will by enforcing one set of its laws while completely ignoring another set not on its own people, but citizens around the world.

But this is WHY this sort of thing happens. When people form supportive opinions not based on fact, but based on supposition, heresy, fabrications and propaganda without ever knowing or even looking at the actual facts you have people supporting this sort of thing. And now... because we see the US forcing its legal will without even following its own laws on the internet like it has dominion over it, we see the results like this of companies bowing out of the game because they know that they lack the power to fight against it. Its also why you see the illegal organizations who were legitimately doing wrong in all this and had no shame about it, moving their registry off US controlled DNS and now will work to create a new work around that will stay one step ahead. In essence, all this did was punish legitimate customers, while making those who were perpetrating the crimes dig in deeper and thus harder to combat.

 

[Screamarie]

I honestly find it funny when people start shouting "coward!" Yeah, because everyone wants to go up against the U.S. government when they're on the warpath and be called terrorists and get fined millions of dollars and probably go to jail.

They may be hypocrites because they're saying they've fought for freedom but when shit hit the fan they just gave up because they didn't want to get into trouble, but I wouldn't call them cowards. It took a mere few days to get rid of Megaupload, which I think is a much large site with more money and probably lawyers than BTjunkie (though I could be wrong, I don't use them).

And anyone that says it's better to fight and lose than to have never fought at all...you go and open up bittorrent site and go fight before you start calling others cowards.

 

[Sylveria]

Otherwise if we continue to defend the sites who want to encourage piracy it'll only encourage the higher ups that the internet really is the criminal, unlawful haven that corporations tried throwing millions of dollars at to make them believe.

And if we leave them to die then the corporations can make sure that the internet is a safe haven for them to make money off exactly the same things we're doing at the moment.

Just as they've done with public music broadcasting.

$5000 to have someone sing you "Happy Birthday" in a film you know? Payable direct to Time Warner.

Have a nice day, Citizen.

What part of "differences between a site like Youtube or Twitter and it's objectives and something like Megaupload or BTJunkie or Pirate Bay and their objectives." didn't you get?

SOPA got turned down if you recall. There is a middle ground between pirates getting all they want and corporations getting all they want. Letting sites like this stay up would be leaning towards the former.

The copyright holders don't distinguish between Pirate Bay and Youtube. To them, clearly, anyone who has even a tangential relationship to what they see as infringement, is a threat to be removed. That's the reason SOPA came to exist in the first place.

 

[Sylveria]

I honestly find it funny when people start shouting "coward!" Yeah, because everyone wants to go up against the U.S. government when they're on the warpath and be called terrorists and get fined millions of dollars and probably go to jail.

They may be hypocrites because they're saying they've fought for freedom but when shit hit the fan they just gave up because they didn't want to get into trouble, but I wouldn't call them cowards. It took a mere few days to get rid of Megaupload, which I think is a much large site with more money and probably lawyers than BTjunkie (though I could be wrong, I don't use them).

And anyone that says it's better to fight and lose than to have never fought at all...you go and open up bittorrent site and go fight before you start calling others cowards.

There's a pretty big difference between running a torrent site and claiming to be fighting for freedom on the internet. They claimed the latter. Then when the fight actually came to their doorstep, they dropped their sword and ran for the hills.

If you're fighting for something, you fight. If you're not, don't pretend that you are. Yes, they are cowards, cause they claimed to be fighting for something then fled when they realized the fight had come. It's all in the language they used.

If they claimed they were simply offering a service or running a business but they had to give it up, that would be different, and I would agree that calling them cowards is unfair, but, as we've established, that was not their stated reasoning.

 

[Awexsome]

How about the consumers? Do they get what they want? Or is this purely between the EVIL EVIL PIRATES and the EVIL EVIL CORPORATIONS?

Or do we have to blindly accept that either artists have no money, or artists have some money after it's been taxed to the hilt?

But I'm guessing you've done some research on this: What exactly are YouTube and BTJunkie's differing objectives, and what part do you specifically criticize?

Does BTJunkie remove a copyright-infringing torrent from their listings if its legal owner files a complaint? Because if they don't, well, there's a big difference right there.

Well I have to ask, did that save megaupload? Considering megaupload also blocked copywritten content upon request. Did the action against megaupload ever consider that the primary usage of megavideo had not been legitimately relevant for streaming/downloading use of copywritten material for at least the last year and a half to two years specifically because the mega staff was blocking the content of shows just as fast as they could, literally in many cases less than 24 hours after being posted for the most notable instances?

Did you even read the indictment? Because that's the exact opposite of what they did. Here: http://www.scribd.com/doc/78786408/Mega-Indictment

They sure as hell weren't blocking shows as fast as they could. They were ignoring orders of takedown, and even still paying their members for uploading popular pirated content while being fully aware that it was illegaly uploaded.

And do I trust what a government agency tells me is true? Or do I belive what people who deal in that scene would show you as well as what anyone was free to verify at any given time on their own.

The scene had long since moved to other lockers like putlocker, VideoBB, VideoZer and others, because megavideo was trashing links to content too quickly, when it comes to streamed content, and for direct downloads thats not how torrent sites like TPB and mininova even work.

In short do you believe what your told, or what you could have seen with your own eyes had you ever looked?

So you honestly believe that the government forged tens upon tens of e-mails? The only way anyone rational could see Megaupload as the good guy is if, quite plainly, you're a conspiracy theorist. Tin foil hat and all.

You should be more pissed at Megaupload for committing the crimes that got them shutdown and effected the services they provided than the government for punishing them. I see your reason to be angry and want your legitimate content back but blame who's to blame here.

 

[Awexsome]

Otherwise if we continue to defend the sites who want to encourage piracy it'll only encourage the higher ups that the internet really is the criminal, unlawful haven that corporations tried throwing millions of dollars at to make them believe.

And if we leave them to die then the corporations can make sure that the internet is a safe haven for them to make money off exactly the same things we're doing at the moment.

Just as they've done with public music broadcasting.

$5000 to have someone sing you "Happy Birthday" in a film you know? Payable direct to Time Warner.

Have a nice day, Citizen.

What part of "differences between a site like Youtube or Twitter and it's objectives and something like Megaupload or BTJunkie or Pirate Bay and their objectives." didn't you get?

SOPA got turned down if you recall. There is a middle ground between pirates getting all they want and corporations getting all they want. Letting sites like this stay up would be leaning towards the former.

The copyright holders don't distinguish between Pirate Bay and Youtube. To them, clearly, anyone who has even a tangential relationship to what they see as infringement, is a threat to be removed. That's the reason SOPA came to exist in the first place.

And that's why if they try to pull off something like SOPA again we'll do all we can to stop it again.

If all they try to do is push for legislation like SOPA then it'll end up being their fault that piracy continues. If the government though comes up with something in the middle ground and start to accept the valid differences between sites out to promote or do nothing about piracy and those who are willing to cooperate to stifle it then we need to show support for such a idea. Else something like SOPA will get more support as the government will be willing to believe the corporations when they say that all internet file-sharing is out to wrong them.

 

[BoogieManFL]

Since the law is all about being able to *prove* stuff, how can they say they lost $500m because of a torrent site? They can't really prove that each illegal download resulted in a lost sale. The majority of the people would probably never have purchased it in any event. I'm not defending it, but how can such a claim hold up in court, I wonder?