Can men and women be just friends? - proof within

[Catrixa]

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Look, I've been trying to hold off with this because I know that you will probably find it hard to believe, plenty of women will find it hard to believe and plenty of guys will deny (and those are the ones you should keep an eye on) it. We manipulate you. Given some of us are better and some of us are worse at it, but we're in the game just as much as you are, we just have different tactics. So, when I say that your friend could cause problems, I'm not thinking about him simply lying to you, because if he's any good at this, thats not what he's going to do.

What he will do is take the little things that I inevitably will do wrong. Even if it's something as minor as being late or missing a date with you because something came up. Chances are, you being a women and all, you probably will be annoyed by it, but you're not going to psycho about it. See, what your ''friend'', by which I mean the guy who is pretending he's your friend, will do is, he won't come out and immediantly start making shit up. He isn't going to tell you something that could easibly be proven wrong and make his motives obvious. The entire idea is that you don't notice, therefore, what he'll do is, with little things he'll try to make you see any little mistake by me as a far more dramatic thing and will do alot to try and create a kind of contrast where he appears better. Basically, because he is your friend, you confind in him, this tells him exactly what he would have to do to screw with your emotions.

It doesn't have to do with trust...if anything it has to do with plenty of women being blissfully ignorant to this and therefore too trusting. It comes from the sexual tactics that men and women employ. To keep it short, for the most part women are like sniper rifles, precise, they can cherry pick. Men take more of a shotgun approach, who gives a fuck in which direction we shot, only important thing is that we hit something.

Now, I assume you aren't going to believe me and also that this post will probably get me quoted about another 10 billion times. The deal, not everyone is going to do this, some guys might be legit friends, but how am I supposed to know that? Should I take your word for it? Why would I do that? I may hypothetically love you, but that doesn't absolve you of ignorance that I probably used myself to get closer to you.

The point I'm trying to make is not "No woman could ever be manipulated by a man!". We can. We have. We've manipulated men. Everyone manipulates everyone. The point I'm trying to make is: don't underestimate your girlfriend's abilities to choose who she's friends with. Assuming any unknown male is a malicious entity trying to steal your woman from you isn't exactly healthy for you and can be insulting for her. Whether or not you think so, you're saying that you don't believe she is smart enough to tell when she's being manipulated. Maybe she isn't, but let her even think for a minute that you don't consider her smart enough to make her own decisions and that'll be all the evidence she'll need (unless she has other mental issues and thinks she deserves abuse, which is an entirely different topic). And if you used the same manipulation just to get her to be with you, honestly, wouldn't you prefer someone who you didn't have to think of like some flighty treasure who is always at risk of flying off to some other random man? That you can trust to find friends who won't manipulate them? That possibly just like you because you're you, despite any faults you have, and not because of the tactics you've used to woo them?

I'm not saying women are perfect. But please keep in mind: you are not perfect either. This new male friend might be just that: a friend who is male. Assume the half the world is your enemy and you'll be fighting for the rest of your life. And if I ever thought for a moment of our hypothetical relationship that you didn't think I was mentally capable of picking good friends--regardless of how much I trust my own decisions--I'd be pretty damn pissed off. You obviously don't hold my intelligence in high regard. And if you don't think I'm smart enough to pick my own friends, why should I think you'll consider me intelligent enough to handle finances? Or raise future children? Or buy a house or a car? I mean, a good salesman/financial adviser/babysitter could be manipulating me (and they all could, some of them are pretty damn good at it, too). And if you can't trust me with big decisions, why do you want me? Why would I want to be with you? I mean, I'd want to be in a relationship where I was thought of as an equal partner, not as some sort of adorable pet who is just so darned cute, but has to wait for permission to go outside to pee.

 

[zama174]

Snippy

Pretty much this.. Seriously I have well over a dozen good friends who are women and I don't have the slightest attraction to any of them, and many of them are good looking. Men and women can be just friends.

 

[robot slipper]

I think it's possible. If you both respect each other and know you don't want it to go any further, then there shouldn't be any issues. Unfortunately, for girls like me who aren't very attractive, the furthest you ever get with males is friendship, so if you do fancy one of your friends then it's tough.

 

[Karhukonna]

Well, I personally have a few female friends I can honestly say I have no intention of dating, ever. I'm cool with just enjoying their company. That doesn't mean that I've never had sexual thoughts about them, though. It's just that I find this thought process to be a completely natural part of a larger process, which is me structuring my opinion on them. Whether they're sexy or not is just a small part of my personal view of them, and obviously carries no immediate effects on my opinion on them as people.
There's also the issue of sexual tension. This can be very one-sided on occasion, and sometimes make a friendship seem rather electric, but all it does for me (I can't speak for the ladies) is bolster our relationship as two adults spending time together.

I will proceed with my personal favorite in presenting an argument, a personal example.

So get this, when I was serving in the military my dare I say best mate was in fact a woman. We were both NCO's, and had been together since the first day. She was one of only two people to have served in the same unit with me throughout my service. Needless to say, we grew pretty close.

I always sensed a bit of a spark between us. We'd always fool with the younger recruits by making it seem as though we were together or something. The amount of times we were seen marching back from the cantina or having spent some time hanging out after hours at the NCO corner, it confused people. And we had a blast. ;D Now, I sometimes thought about it, sure. "I wonder what would happen if we really got it on?" I'm in a very happy relationship, mind you, so I never had any honest intention of doing it, but I just wondered, out of curiosity. It's not like she was ugly or anything, when she let her hair flow she was very attractive.

Well, having spent a year together, crawling through mud and snow, learning all about soldiering together, I can honestly consider her a true friend. We can both rely on each other, and I'd trust my life with her. And yet, the sexual tension has become more of a... I dunno, like a pedestal on top of which our friendship has been built. It's still there, but neither of us think nothing of it. It's just a natural piece of the puzzle that is our relationship.

I don't obviously have quite as powerful ties to my other female friends, but I nonetheless appreciate them as friends. There are people who I may occasionally consider friends, but I have not known them long enough for this kind of sexual presence to have disappeared. This is why I separate friends and acquaintances. My friends are always there for me, and there's no need to feel awkward in their company, but acquaintances are still completely date-worthy if I was single.


TL;DR I think that true friends are never viewed sexually, but people you've only known for a while are fresh game. At least for me.

 

[Deef]

On that video, two words: Confirmatory bias.

How many people do you think he cut out to make his point?

 

[Blow_Pop]

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In all honesty, I do have a few male friends who have never once thought of that. One of them being my best friend who I've known since we were 3. As I said we're close enough that we're like brother and sister....He also came out a few years ago that he was gay(which we all suspected even though he kept dating girls)......

Ok, homosexuals do not count. that's like cheating.

still counts......i have straight male friends that I'm not their type of girl and therefore they aren't attracted to me. Granted its all stuff plastic surgery could fix if I really wanted to be with them but since I like my body how it is......

 

[Vault101]

I'd I agree with this video. Also this video really made me miss college. It was like a buffet of babes. A babe buffet. "I want to me a chick today... Oh there's 12 right here!"

from what Ive heard this "college" thing seems awful...then again Im not american so Its probably different

and dont get me started on this truly hideous concept called the "frat boy"

 

[Angie7F]

SNIP!

Totally agree with you.

The friend i mentioned earlier is very similar to the situation you described in the military.
I met my friend working at a restaurant, so its probably no where close to what you experienced with your friend, but still, we ran the busy dinner times, covered each others asses, and really went through hell and back (in a restaurant setting, but what the hell).

Many people used to suspect that we were in fact dating, but after going through so much together as a team, you no longer see each other sexually, but more as a brother.

I understand that many people are in settings where the slightest comment can be seen as sexual harassment etc, but its sad that they miss out on this kind of gender defying experience.

 

[Emurlahn]

I just love the denial of the women in the video and the people in this Thread.

NO, we can't be ''just'' friends, it's always going to be in that wierd place where it generally shouldn't be, those feelings will be too strong and rather inappropriate for a ''friendship'' between men and women. That is precisely the reason why, as a Boyfriend, you have to make those male ''friends'' fuck right off

But honestly, if your girlfriend wants male friends then you apparently aren't giving her something and she's looking for it somewhere else.

The funniest part about this thread however is, and I would be willing to bet that I'm spot on about this, that most of the people denying this are guys that are trying to downplay feelings they have for one of their ''friends'' and to generally appeal more to the female forum users.

I would like to say that I agree with fagotto, this sounds like the start of an abusive relationship, going by the definition that an abusive relationship is a relationship where one of the parts limits the others freedom of choice in a crucial social or economic way, or is mentally/physically hurting the other part.
Telling your girlfriend that she can't be friends with guys is highly limiting her social life.

And to follow the argument about cross-gender friendship: Are you attracted to every female you've known ever? I would not believe so. Thus rendering the argument that there will always be contesting attraction invalid.
If not, how would you handle hanging out with with a friend and his girlfriend more than a few times a week. Your argument is simply a logic fallacy.

I will say that Fagotto did not say his/her meaning in a good way though.

At least that's my opinion.

 

[the Dept of Science]

I've got lots of female friends who I would knock boots with if given the chance.
What I don't understand is why that disqualifies them from the friends category.

Consider this analogy: I have a friend that is a good cook. If he offered to cook me a meal, then I would go for it without hesitation. If I made friends with him for the sole reason that someday he might cook me a meal, then I wouldn't really call myself his friend. But this isn't the case, maybe we have similar interests or compatible personalities, we get along really well. There isn't much significance attached to his cooking ability, I wouldn't feel hurt if he turned around to me and said that he never had any intention of cooking me a meal. I can go to a restaurant or cook for myself, I don't need that one guy to fill that particular need.

The problem is that I think a lot of guys treat attractive women the way lottery winners get treated. They find lots of people pretending to be their friend in order to get something from them. They would try and be friends with the lottery winner no matter what their personality was like and if they got told that they would never get any money, then they would feel hurt and either look elsewhere or double their efforts to pal up to whomever.

Whether or not a guy can really be friends depends on what mindset the guy is coming from... a lot of guys are going into friendship under false pretences in order to get some, but some guys will genuinely enjoy your company

 

[Vault101]

I just love the denial of the women in the video and the people in this Thread.

NO, we can't be ''just'' friends, it's always going to be in that wierd place where it generally shouldn't be, those feelings will be too strong and rather inappropriate for a ''friendship'' between men and women. That is precisely the reason why, as a Boyfriend, you have to make those male ''friends'' fuck right off

But honestly, if your girlfriend wants male friends then you apparently aren't giving her something and she's looking for it somewhere else.

The funniest part about this thread however is, and I would be willing to bet that I'm spot on about this, that most of the people denying this are guys that are trying to downplay feelings they have for one of their ''friends'' and to generally appeal more to the female forum users.

are you f***ing serious?

ok hypotheticallly

1.boyfreind or not youve got no right to tell me who I can and cant be freinds with

2.the "you dont agree with my veiw?..DENIAL!" argument is stupid,and not only in this thread but there are alot of people out their who would disagree...I mean come on

3. going back to 1. Im not allowed to be freinds with guys? well fuck, mabye I dont have any female freinds I can discuss videogame/other nerdy stuff with...ever consider that?...ohh my freind whom I have know since childhood...cant see him anymore? because you *think* he wants to get with me? (of coarse it doesnt matter what I think...obviously)

4.and obviously YOU can speak on behalf of everyone out there with a y chromozone, because..you know right?



right sorry, Ill make sure I only makes freind with girls in the future...chase off ANY guys with pepper spray and stay in the kitchen where I belong

 

[Vault101]

I just love the denial of the women in the video and the people in this Thread.

NO, we can't be ''just'' friends, it's always going to be in that wierd place where it generally shouldn't be, those feelings will be too strong and rather inappropriate for a ''friendship'' between men and women. That is precisely the reason why, as a Boyfriend, you have to make those male ''friends'' fuck right off

But honestly, if your girlfriend wants male friends then you apparently aren't giving her something and she's looking for it somewhere else.

The funniest part about this thread however is, and I would be willing to bet that I'm spot on about this, that most of the people denying this are guys that are trying to downplay feelings they have for one of their ''friends'' and to generally appeal more to the female forum users.

are you f***ing serious?

.

yeah, (hypothetically) youre threataning one of my freinds...thats controlling


psychologists?....while Im on the fence about the whole psychology thing..and even if a guy freind would fuck me at the drop of a hat (thats debatable VERY debatable)...so? that doesnt stop me from enjoying his company or hanging out/talking, (ok then your getting intot he "nice guy" thing....WHOLE other issue which I dont have the stength to even think about)


all Im saying is your giving the impression that becuase your a guy you know how ALL guys think and act

no one "explicity wants" male freinds...you just end up freind with people regardles of that, you dont have pre-requisites

what does the fact that your in a relationship have to do with ANYTHING?, this thread isnt about relationships, its about freinds

so I take you dont have any female freinds? did you ever?

 

[Emurlahn]

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It's funny, because not only did she laugh at the prospect of me of all people being abusive in any way, but it's also our 4th anniversary today, so this isn't the beginning of anything either.

I'd say you and Fagotto should probably leave psychology to the psychologists.

As I said, that's my opinion, and it was based on the definition of abuse, your relationship might work perfectly, and I'm glad that it does. I can just say that I would never be able to stay in a relationship where my girlfriend said I couldn't have female friends.

And about the psychology, there you are quite off target, at least on my account, can't talk for fagotto there. I might not be an A-grade student, but I'm major-ing in psychology, and I'm in the top 5 (maybe 7) of my class, so I must be doing something right there, and as a matter of fact, this, and my former argument has nothing to do with psychology, so that is not valid in any way at all.

And I would like you to answer my argument about male/female friendship from the former post, because that is the topic, not your relationship, as it is only one example, which render it useless in the big picture, neither is about my expertise in psychology, so please answer the argument, or don't answer at all.

Have a nice day. (And no, I'm not saying this to be condescending, I'm only trying to be polite.)