"Classics" that you were underwhelmed by.

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Fetzenfisch

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Games: The Anno series, Pokemon both bored me to death after half an hour and i threw them in the garbage

Books: Everything called Thriller or Crime story. Boooooring.

Movies: 90% of Horror classics. Halloween, Nightmare on Elmstreet, Friday the 13th. Not a single good movie in that bunch. Wishmaster is great though
 

MadCapMunchkin

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Apr 23, 2010
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eggsovereasy said:
Nightmare on Elm Street (the original). Highly disappointed.
BLASPHEMY! I HAVE NEVER BEEN SO ENRAGED!!! *beats up inner Wes Craven fanboy and stuffs him back into the box* Sorry.

OT: I'd have to say Titanic. Incredibly drawn out and overrated.

Also, I'm sorry. Scarface wasn't that good...
 

Verlander

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TSED said:
Verlander said:
TSED said:
I wonder how many of these opinions come from academically minded individuals. There is a huge difference in how, say, a Bachelor of English will dissect a narrative and how a layman will.

"Blade Runner," I must confess, is a movie I have never seen. "Do Androids Dream Of Electric Sheep?", the novel by Dick on which it is based, I have read and quite enjoyed. The point of the novel is how it's a postcolonial piece. It's a critique on specific paradigms found at the time it was written. Many of the points it makes - particularly the anti-war sentiments coupled with a frustration and acknowledgement of the necessity of the police - ARE still culturally relevant. Once again, I know the movie has been altered substantially from the novel but I have not seen it.

Anyway, education is important to appreciate things. Some people complain that this exposure "ruins" literature for them; others find the exact opposite. The latter finds a way to vocalize their dislike of a work, and can now not only explain why they liked something, but they can find new interpretations to further their enjoyment.

This is not to dismiss pacing (I can't stand anything written between Pope and the Modernists, for example), but there's no nice way to say this. You don't like it because you don't get it.
Surely anything that requires education to enjoy would automatically be discounted, as it's appealing to a niche audience, and the majority of people cannot enjoy it? For example, I enjoy well written books on the history of art, as well as advanced documents on computer science, BUT I cannot expect others to enjoy the same things as they won't have the foundations to even approach the material.

What I'm saying, I guess, is that if something demands from the audience, it cannot complain when the section of the audience that cannot give treats it with disdain...

You recognize that these books are "well written" but you "cannot expect others to enjoy the same things." That's fine. I don't think any one's ever said something along the lines of "all classics are good and if you don't like them you are a BAD PERSON" (actually, ok, a few decades ago they were pretty strict on how lit theory worked...). There's a difference between proclaiming a personal dislike of something and proclaiming a failing of the work itself.

Notice the comments so far. A good deal of them have been "I didn't like it," and then a good deal of them have been "it sucked because of ______." Now, both of these opinion styles have merit, but they amusing work on opposite ends of the education spectrum. As anecdotal evidence, I don't know much swing jazz. When I hear swing jazz I like or dislike, I preface it with how it is merely my opinion. On the other hand, something I have a deep understanding and mastery of I will not describe with opinions. I will use concrete terms and support them with arguments whichever way it lies.

The problem is when this is reversed. If I walked into a debate on, let's say Image Comics (note that I have never read any of their works) and start saying that they suck objectively, my opinion will be worthless. If I started talking about how I think that maybe Neuromancer could possibly mean this one thing... Well, it'd sound like I didn't know what I was talking about. My analysis would be taken as an opinion instead of an educated and nuanced view point.

This being said, I'm still a hypocrite. I have very little knowledge over certain things (Twilight, most famous mallcore / metalcore bands, WoW - as examples) but I still speak as if I have deep insights and do not lace my sentences with the aforementioned weakening modifiers. I still have some knowledge, but in truth most of my knowledge comes from contrasting it with other comparable works. Hey - it's not my fault it sucks too much for me to bother with it.
Ha! I like that... but, being heavily opinionated, I would have to disagree. You see, in your theory, every single persons opinion would have a different amount of worth (as well all have different levels of experience, education and general intelligence). This cannot apply when the media in question is universally aimed. The best anyone can give is a personal opinion (which education is, in the long run). I can give reasons for the selections I made (I didn't because I can't be bothered), and there will be people who disagree. Sadly, some of those people may be smarter or more motivated then I am, and then tackle each of my reasons successfully. It doesn't invalidate my opinion though, and there will be many people who agree with me.

Either way, the question asked for personal opinions, and I daresay there will be people more interested in seeing certain films, like the Godfather or similar, simply because they appeared on an overrated list, because they want their own opinion on the subject. So everyone wins! What a contrary bunch we are...
 

Puzzlenaut

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Dear OP, if you don't like the philosophical bits of Bladerunner, then for the love of god don't read the novel.

In other news: Citizen Kane is, in my opinion, pretty poor -- it just isn't interesting or engaging.

Oh, and Raging Bull. That was straight up shit.

And Psycho (but that was ok; not the incredible masterpiece some people think it is though)
 

i7omahawki

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y1fella said:
I walked in expecting a slow burn but talk about no burn. Instead of you know investigating and stuff he just roams around getting in arguments about philosophy with the replicant girl before very suddenly everyone starts very suddenly getting in gun fights. and then at the end it just ends. I mean the bad guy dies suddenly no kind of personal goal is achieved and the movies over.
What version did you watch, just out of interest? There are a few, and it really seems like a few different films.

Your opinion is yours, obviously, so I'm not gonna say you should've enjoyed the film, but there are some definite goals achieved by the 'bad guy' Roy Batty. When he saves Deckard, he shows empathy, the human characteristic that separates (only slightly) the humans from the replicants. In doing this, the character essentially becomes human, there is no definition of human given in the film that he doesn't now fulfill. And it's tough to think of one outside of the film too.

It does get very philosophical, perhaps why I like it so much, and maybe without an insight or care for that sort of thing, the movie may just pass you by.

OT:

Books: Not sure I've ever been let down on this front...nope can't think of anything.

Games: Deus-Ex, definately. Hadn't played it before, and recently bought it on steam, can't really see much good about it, and I've yet to get anywhere in it haha. Perhaps it hasn't aged well, or I don't have the patience to figure out what I'm doing.

Films: The Omega man. Not sure where I got the impression that it was a classic, but the book it's based on is good. The film though, is unbearably cheesy and at times ridiculous...kind of ruins the apocalyptic feel that it was going for.
 

loodmoney

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TSED said:
I wonder how many of these opinions come from academically minded individuals. There is a huge difference in how, say, a Bachelor of English will dissect a narrative and how a layman will.
...
[E]ducation is important to appreciate things.
This interests me: How does a work become considered a classic?

What if a work is classic because an educated elite has deemed it so? Perhaps there has been lenghy analyses of the themes within, or it was written with a certain artistic intention (perhaps, e.g., Joyce's Ulysses). The burden would be on the reader to understand it, which they may not be able to do without a knowledge of the critical literature surrounding it.

What if a work is considered a classic because of some other aspect of its history? Perhaps it sold well, was a controversial work, or is an important source of knowledge about the history of the world (e.g. the Homer's epics (though I think the Iliad is as good as Gears of War for juicy violence)). Without knowledge of its context, much of its significance is lost.

In these sorts of cases, you are right that education plays an important role. But there is another way in which a work may be considered a classic, possibly a more important one. Works are often taken to be classics because they form a sort of canon, e.g. the canon of Western Literature. These works should be considered important because of their educational value--what they teach the common reader about, say, the human condition, or other things central to a good life. In many cases, of course, what is a classic in one of the first two senses will be a classic in the third.

Not sure if this is a refutation of your post, but anyway: education and literature are inter-related. To say that people need to be educated to enjoy a work ignores the fact that works are of great relevance to peoples' education.
 

Levethian

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Nov 22, 2009
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Games: Baldurs Gate, Deus Ex, Final Fantasy VII


Found a bad review of Blade Runner in which the reviewer asks "How could anyone actually like this film?", in comments the reviewer then says "Rewatch it after you've distanced yourself a bit. I did, and my tune has changed entirely."

Makes sense. Didn't leave me with a good first impression either.
 
Jun 16, 2010
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y1fella said:
Subject is in the title but I got to say I watched blade runner and........
It was either really boring or I'm really stupid. And I don't think I'm particularly stupid because I have read the entire wheel of time series thus far and you need allot of patience to keep reading book 10.
that aside I don't understand the whole stigma around the movie. I walked in expecting a slow burn but talk about no burn. Instead of you know investigating and stuff he just roams around getting in arguments about philosophy with the replicant girl before very suddenly everyone starts very suddenly getting in gun fights. and then at the end it just ends. I mean the bad guy dies suddenly no kind of personal goal is achieved and the movies over. I walked in with the highest expectations yeah but I still never once enjoyed, was intrigued, liked the characters or anything that would typically constitutes a good movie
Warty Bliggens said:
Someone already touched on The Lord of the Rings, but I'd like to go back to it. Tolkien, as creative as he was, could not write to save his fucking life. The books are preachy, monotonous drivel that spend one page on critical plot development for every twenty used to describe a piece of furniture. The man was so in love with this world he created that he forgot to pace them as a story rather than present them as a historical text for what is, admittedly, probably the best medieval-fantasy setting ever crafted. The problem is that as expansive as it's always been, Middle-Earth is just fucking boring.
I totally agree with you two. You both hit the nail right on the head.

As for the worst classic game I've played, it'd be Half-Life 2. I don't understand what was great about it at all. The pacing was terrible. There was ten minutes of actual plot at the beginning and end, and then eight long hours of linear vehicle sections, unsatisfying shootouts (even something as simple as tense combat music or the ability to AIM rather than shoot from the hip all the time would've improved it) and incredibly simple physics puzzles.
The plot itself was confusing, and a whole lot was left completely unexplained (alien overlords, zombies, underground monsters, peaceful aliens, interdimensional businessmen, etc. => maybe it would make sense if I'd played all the way through HL1, but that came out like a decade before. They could at least try to bring you up to speed).
The characters were largely uninteresting and underdeveloped. The only memorable one is that drunken Russian priest in Ravenholm, and he's only in it for about ten minutes.

The only good thing about HL2 was the variety of levels and gameplay, but that was ruined by how long and drawn-out each level and gameplay mechanic is. Every interesting new weapon or place or enemy or puzzle gets boring and tedious well before the game is done throwing them at you.
 

KafkaOffTheBeach

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Nov 17, 2010
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Verlander said:
Ha! I like that... but, being heavily opinionated, I would have to disagree. You see, in your theory, every single persons opinion would have a different amount of worth (as well all have different levels of experience, education and general intelligence). This cannot apply when the media in question is universally aimed. The best anyone can give is a personal opinion (which education is, in the long run). I can give reasons for the selections I made (I didn't because I can't be bothered), and there will be people who disagree. Sadly, some of those people may be smarter or more motivated then I am, and then tackle each of my reasons successfully. It doesn't invalidate my opinion though, and there will be many people who agree with me.

Either way, the question asked for personal opinions, and I daresay there will be people more interested in seeing certain films, like the Godfather or similar, simply because they appeared on an overrated list, because they want their own opinion on the subject. So everyone wins! What a contrary bunch we are...
Wait, what.
Fuck it.
You know what?
I was going to answer, but, to be honest, I'm too tired.
Basically I was going to say that what the previous dude said was not a theory, there is no such thing as universally aimed media, or, if you want to be optimistic, there is no such thing as not universally aimed media, opinions can actually be wrong, and they can indeed be invalidated if you are unable to defend them because that shows that you went into the text without the necessary tools, and I was going to use the idea of romance in Twilight/Fiesta: And the Sun Also Rises as an example.
 

Verlander

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Apr 22, 2010
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KafkaOffTheBeach said:
Verlander said:
Ha! I like that... but, being heavily opinionated, I would have to disagree. You see, in your theory, every single persons opinion would have a different amount of worth (as well all have different levels of experience, education and general intelligence). This cannot apply when the media in question is universally aimed. The best anyone can give is a personal opinion (which education is, in the long run). I can give reasons for the selections I made (I didn't because I can't be bothered), and there will be people who disagree. Sadly, some of those people may be smarter or more motivated then I am, and then tackle each of my reasons successfully. It doesn't invalidate my opinion though, and there will be many people who agree with me.

Either way, the question asked for personal opinions, and I daresay there will be people more interested in seeing certain films, like the Godfather or similar, simply because they appeared on an overrated list, because they want their own opinion on the subject. So everyone wins! What a contrary bunch we are...
Wait, what.
Fuck it.
You know what?
I was going to answer, but, to be honest, I'm too tired.
Basically I was going to say that what the previous dude said was not a theory, there is no such thing as universally aimed media, or, if you want to be optimistic, there is no such thing as not universally aimed media, opinions can actually be wrong, and they can indeed be invalidated if you are unable to defend them because that shows that you went into the text without the necessary tools, and I was going to use the idea of romance in Twilight/Fiesta: And the Sun Also Rises as an example.
Ok, change the term "universally aimed media", and replace it with "universally accessible media". An opinion cannot be wrong, it can be merely "badly informed". Which isn't the same thing. Every opinion is valid, if not useful.

Anyway, the question asked for opinions.
 

VaudevillianVeteran

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Sep 19, 2009
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Game: Bulletstorm. It was a fairly average shooter that wasn't really that bad in spite of all the hype about it being pure evil.
Book:Jaws. Just...what?
Film: Halloween. The series has always been insanely underwhelming. The same goes for Friday the 13th.
 

Nihilism_Is_Bliss

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Oct 27, 2009
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Oh dear...I fear I may be the only one who says this, but the classic anime movie 'Akira' did nothing for me at all.

Edit: And what's with all the Twain hate? Is it because you studied his work in school?
I can imagine him being present on the American high school booklist :p
Nothing wrong with a little Twain!
 

NinjaDeathSlap

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Feb 20, 2011
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Novs said:
NinjaDeathSlap said:
Game: (heavy duty flame shield at the ready) The Elder Scrolls games. I just don't like melee based combat from a first person viewpoint, it just looks and plays so much better from the third. Also the story to me seems like pretty much formula fantasy RPG, not bad in the slightest but nothing I haven't seen before.
You missed the point. Those games arent about fighting. There more about exploring and lore.


But Oblivion sucks massive dick, its one of the worst games i have ever played, a bland experience, its exporation was a bore, its art direction sucked, it was just never interesting.
Well like I said It's not just the fighting that bothers me. There's nothing particularly 'wrong' with the story, it's just that it's nothing more than LOTR clone no. 1 million and 1 IMO.
 

XandNobody

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Aug 4, 2010
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Alright, this should be fun.

Movie: Have to go with Blade Runner myself. It wasn't bad by any means, it was just, slower, than I'd expected.

Game: The original Sonic. So gonna hear about that one, but running sideways never really appealed to me I suppose.

Book: Dante's Inferno. Part of that is my own fault, as half way through I had the realization that I was reading Pokemon Snap for the damned. Kinda colored my opinion after that.
 

Ashadow700

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Jun 28, 2010
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I think it has been mentiond a few times by now, but my pick goes without a doubt to Zelda: Ocarina of Time. Yeah, it was probably awsome back when 3D was still considerd something new, but all I could see when I tried it in 2008 was just Twilight Princess with worse level design and horrible grafics.

I don't really have a good one for film and book though.

Oh, and one more thing: flameshild up.
 

Yellowbeard

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Nov 2, 2010
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Owlslayer said:
I never understood why Deus Ex was so awesome as people said. Maybe i was really young at the time (my brother started playing it, and i tried it out, too. Didn't like it much).
Haven't tried playing it again, though. Maybe i ought to give it one more chance.
Deus Ex is weird in that almost every aspect of it is technically poor. Combat, graphics, animation, dodgy voice-acting, countless ways to break the game, etc. Somehow it still turns into a masterpiece if it finally hooks you.

I got sick of it around the Hell's Kitchen point and quit the first time. Gave it a second chance and with only ONE complete play through it's been in my top five ever since. Granted it was never going to age well.