Collaborative Thought Experiment: what would a game targeted at Anita Sarkeesian look like?

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FieryTrainwreck

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Despite my invocation of Anita Sarkeesian, I really don't want this to turn into one of those threads. Please read this entire first post and respond in the same spirit. If you want the short version, skip to the numbered bits!

I think a lot of the outrage directed at Anita Sarkeesian and her criticism of video games has to do with the fact that it is, well, criticism. It's not typically constructive or instructive; for the most part, she establishes a framework for tearing down video games with little apparent interest in building them up or pushing them forward. The perception, deserved or not, is that she doesn't want to grow the industry in truth (with new concepts and IP) so much as she wants to shame existing devs and customers into changing their ideas and preferences.

She's free to do this, of course, and people are free to love, hate, or not care about her ideas all they want. This thread isn't about any of that. This thread is about brainstorming ideas for a video game, or series of games, that would actually appeal to Anita Sarkeesian. She makes it very clear that she isn't interested in what the AAA industry is currently peddling. So what would peak her interest? Are there any existing games that might appeal to her "demographic"? If we were to create new games from scratch, what would they look like? And are there perhaps some actual good reasons why such games don't or can't exist?

A few thoughts to get the ball rolling...

1. What existing games would attract the attention of Anita Sarkeesian, and why?

The first game that comes to my mind is Gone Home. It tells a story that focuses on female characters who aren't validated by male counterparts. It doesn't rely on the most common video game mechanics (violence, action, etc.). It's not high-pressure, anxiety-producing, or competitive in any way. It's grounded and real and restrained and mature. It was also written and developed by a team comprised of at least 50% women.

2. What would a brand new game designed to appeal to Anita Sarkeesian look like?

I'm not well-suited to answer this question because I don't think she and I have much in common, but I suppose a story-heavy game with an intense focus on character development and minimal violence would fit the bill? Again, Gone Home springs to mind.

3. Are there any good reasons why such games don't exist or aren't more viable?

To be honest, I think a lot of this industry's "obsession" with violence is really nothing more than an evolutionary manifestation of input limitations. Violence is largely binary and easily grafted onto our most common control mechanisms; you pull a trigger on an input device and pull a trigger in your virtual game world. More complicated interactions with characters and environments simply don't translate very well. In fact, such interactions are usually stilted and off-putting - and subsequently financially ruinous for publishers. Maybe some of the more nuanced and (apologies in advance...) "feminine" behaviors Anita might want from video games are beyond the scope of our current input models rather than the imaginations of our creators.

Regarding the lack of female-focused (or Anita-focused) AAA titles: if Gone Home is what I picture Anita playing, aren't we dangerously close to emulating other media? I mean it's a walk-around simulator, right? There's very little that might be strictly defined as "gameplay" in Gone Home, and what's there might be easily removed or skipped over in similar offerings. At what point does it cross over into simply being an actual movie or graphic novel?

Also, how important is being tethered to a desktop or a television to someone like Anita? Do her desired gameplay experiences require the fidelity of a high-end PC/console? If not, wouldn't those experiences be better suited for mobile and web devices? Might those experiences, in fact, already be available on those more fitting platforms? Most stats point towards a lot of female gamers focusing on mobile/web gaming. Are these women playing games on these platforms because they have to or because they want to?

Anyways, my overriding purpose in creating this thread is to maybe generate something productive and positive in the gender equality discussions here. I don't like how people are constantly tearing down what's here and demonizing people for enjoying it. The far better path is to support and nurture other ideas and ways of doing things. Think outside the box, generate something Anita would be proud to play, and then explain why it would (or wouldn't) be feasible given the constraints of the hardware.
 

T_ConX

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I had a little chuckle over that 'The Last Princess' video. OH! A game where a Princess rescues herself and liberates her kingdom from tyranny! Why hasn't anyone made a game like that?

Oh wait, they have! I can immediately think of a few, and two of them are Final Fantasy's!

Anita isn't the only one who suffers from a game industry that isn't making the games she wants. She wants fewer distressed damsels and other sexist tropes, and more strong female characters. That's nice. I want fewer corridor cover shooters and more Card-based TRPGs (like Metal Gear Acid). Doesn't mean I'm going to get it, especially since myself, and folks with tastes similar to mine, are so few in number compared to the corridor cover shooter market.

But that just means that when a game I like comes out, I have to buy it to encourage future development of that game.

Anita wants triple AAA devs to alter their formulas to appeal to her tastes, but when they do, well, it doesn't work out so smoothly. She can sing all the praise about Mirror's Edge she wants, but when it gets outsold by every Battlefield title (including the Bad Company games), it's kind of obvious which franchise EA is going to make DICE focus on. Maybe if Mirror's Edge 2 sells well...

Oh who are we kidding. Anita is not a gamer, she just plays one on Youtube. She steals game footage from other people and even confessed to not liking video games.
 

gyrobot_v1legacy

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So where do games like Neptunia and Senran Kagura stand for her? There are a lot of strong independant girls there.
 

BreakfastMan

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Well, looks like this thread has descended into crazy awfulness with the very first reply. Hurray? :\

OT:

1. What, do you mean in a good way? Then... I dunno, Hydrophobia, maybe? Or perhaps The Longest Journey? Trying to avoid the obvious answers like Metroid Prime or Beyond Good and Evil here, but I am not coming up with a whole lot... Oh wait, the new Tomb Raider could probably work here too!

2. Probably a game where you have a cool, non-sexualized female main character kicking all sorts of ass, but not in a hollow, "look at me, aren't I so like the boys?" kind of way. Like the best bits of the new Tomb Raider game, or something similar.

3. Two reasons. A: Insidious gender roles and sexism that remain rampant through culture at large, and B: the (false) perception by marketers and business people in the industry that games aren't "for" women. Polygon actually had a pretty good article on how point B came about, everyone should go check it out.
 

FieryTrainwreck

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BreakfastMan said:
2. Probably a game where you have a cool, non-sexualized female main character kicking all sorts of ass, but not in a hollow, "look at me, aren't I so like the boys?" kind of way. Like the best bits of the new Tomb Raider game, or something similar.
Well which is it? How does she kick ass without doing it "like the boys"? Does she remain vulnerable/feminine/nurturing and generate extreme ludonarrative dissonance (why is this caring woman destroying everyone?)? Would this offend someone who doesn't mind a female character taking on "male" characteristics if it empowers her? Is her non-sexualized design so plain as to offend those who believe there is nothing wrong with female sexualization so long as she owns? I guess I'm looking for the actual line we're supposed to follow in pleasing someone like Anita. If it's a "get 'em as they're coming or going..." situation, why should anyone try to please that demographic?

3. Two reasons. A: Insidious gender roles and sexism that remain rampant through culture at large, and B: the (false) perception by marketers and business people in the industry that games aren't "for" women. Polygon actually had a pretty good article on how point B came about, everyone should go check it out.
I sorta specifically asked for "good" reasons, but I should have been more specific. Are there design/technical limitations reducing gameplay possibilities in a sensible, objectively reasonable fashion? Are there perhaps legitimate, non-offensive, non-gender-related reasons why things might be the way they are?

I did read that article on Polygon. It had some good points, some obvious points, and a LOT of marketing suits power-tripping on their own godliness. If the purpose of the piece was to illustrate the fact that advertising can sell anything to anyone, I think that's pretty well established at this point. If they're trying to criticize the industry for targeting specific demographics, that's a spotlight we can shine on every industry and most of human behavior.

Honestly, the Candy Crushes, Bejeweleds, and Farmvilles of the world account for a significant portion of female gamers. There's nothing wrong with that in the slightest. I'm just not sure how that translates into AAA devs dropping the ball on female demographics. Almost without exception, those instances where devs do dip a toe in the other side of the pool... those instances end in financial failure. The genres that seem to appeal most to female gamers (generalization!) also tend not to require the visual fidelity or all-around development cost of AAA games.

I'm not saying it all feels like "blame", but what exactly are the publishers supposed to do? Take a bunch of shots on the chin, possibly at the expense of their continued existence, just to establish presence in a market that *might* exist? Whenever they step out of line on a AAA game, they eat millions of dollars in losses. This is definitely an indictment of the AAA development strategy, but it's purely economic. It's not an agenda.
 

BreakfastMan

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FieryTrainwreck said:
BreakfastMan said:
2. Probably a game where you have a cool, non-sexualized female main character kicking all sorts of ass, but not in a hollow, "look at me, aren't I so like the boys?" kind of way. Like the best bits of the new Tomb Raider game, or something similar.
Well which is it? How does she kick ass without doing it "like the boys"? Does she remain vulnerable/feminine/nurturing and generate extreme ludonarrative dissonance (why is this caring woman destroying everyone?)? Would this offend someone who doesn't mind a female character taking on "male" characteristics if it empowers her? Is her non-sexualized design so plain as to offend those who believe there is nothing wrong with female sexualization so long as she owns? I guess I'm looking for the actual line we're supposed to follow in pleasing someone like Anita. If it's a "get 'em as they're coming or going..." situation, why should anyone try to please that demographic?
You miss what I was trying to say. Anita would want such a character to have actual character. That such a character's status as "kicking ass/being like the boys" doesn't define everything about her. I mean, I am fairly sure Anita would not want to just replace one stupid trope with another. I think she would want an a-typical female character that is actually a good character.
3. Two reasons. A: Insidious gender roles and sexism that remain rampant through culture at large, and B: the (false) perception by marketers and business people in the industry that games aren't "for" women. Polygon actually had a pretty good article on how point B came about, everyone should go check it out.
I sorta specifically asked for "good" reasons, but I should have been more specific. Are there design/technical limitations reducing gameplay possibilities in a sensible, objectively reasonable fashion? Are there perhaps legitimate, non-offensive, non-gender-related reasons why things might be the way they are?
Well... There aren't really any good reasons I can think of. Pretty much just because of misconceptions on part of business men and sexism in culture. It is a bit like DRM-less or single-player only games.
 

MrHide-Patten

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Just going off what my sisters would find interesting a game that is/has:

A) A compelling narrative. My sisters were watching me play the Last of Us and was actually interested in where the story was going and were slightly disappointed to 'not know what was happening' when I continued playing without them.

B) Minimalist controls. My sisters have both played (and liked playing) LittleBigPlanet and Limbo, because there weren't many control inputs for them to remember; move left and right, jump, and the R button grabs onto things. My sisters start panicking and flipping out when they are forced to try and navigate a third person camera.

Not saying these apply to women in general but the second point (especially about the camera) could easily explain why so many women get into mobile games. It's very easy to overlook at how easily it is for gamers (male or female) to "control" games, compared to people that barley/have never touched them.
 

FieryTrainwreck

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BreakfastMan said:
You miss what I was trying to say. Anita would want such a character to have actual character. That such a character's status as "kicking ass/being like the boys" doesn't define everything about her. I mean, I am fairly sure Anita would not want to just replace one stupid trope with another. I think she would want an a-typical female character that is actually a good character.
So is her beef specifically with female characterization or characterization in general? Whatever, that's straying off topic. I think story and character are probably key in attracting someone like Anita to the table. She clearly enjoys the narrative aspects of most media. But what sort of gameplay would reel her in? If the defining aspect of a video game is its interactivity, what sort of interactivity would sell the medium to Anita?

Well... There aren't really any good reasons I can think of. Pretty much just because of misconceptions on part of business men and sexism in culture. It is a bit like DRM-less or single-player only games.
I think the limitations imposed on us by current input devices and AI really do play a big part in how games are designed right now. So much of the industry is simplistic violence and action, which might not speak to the female gamer (nor a good chunk of male gamers, for that matter). But how do they represent other, more nuanced behavior given input devices and the AI? Can you have a convincing, satisfying conversation in a single player game given our AI? Can you do something constructive and visceral and almost tangible using the same old controller inputs? I think games, as a whole, might be "dumb" because a lot of the attempts to make them more intelligent fall hopelessly flat. I mean look at Two Souls. Cage tries to do new and different things with his video games, but they end up being essentially movies with QTEs. The AI and input devices aren't up to the challenge, and that's not a misconception or sexism.

MrHide-Patten said:
That makes a lot of sense. I've noticed that navigation of 3D environments is extremely difficult for newer players, and the majority of AAA games tend to feature such navigation. At the same time, if the appeal of a game for a certain demographic can be directly linked to how much "game" they manage to take out of it, are we then talking about barely-interactive movies/books? Now I'm thinking maybe industry standard terrible "tutorials" are to blame for at least a portion of the barrier to entry. I mean how many tutorials take the time to slowly introduce the player to the very concept of 3D navigation? Yet they all hold your hand to an embarrassing degree when explaining the most self-evident mechanics...
 

The_Echo

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Since Anita seems to be displeased with any and all current depictions of women in games, I assume a game tailored to her tastes would have a target demo of very, very few people.

I imagine the script would lean towards the "hamfisted grrlpower overtones" end of the spectrum.
gyrobot said:
So where do games like Neptunia and Senran Kagura stand for her? There are a lot of strong independant girls there.
See, it doesn't count if they have boobs.
 

BreakfastMan

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FieryTrainwreck said:
But what sort of gameplay would reel her in? If the defining aspect of a video game is its interactivity, what sort of interactivity would sell the medium to Anita?
I am not so certain, I don't know her tastes in games. That isn't really something that ever comes up in her series, as she is taking a look at narrative tropes used in games. But if I had to guess, I would say... Pretty much anything, so long as it is well executed and enjoyable? You know, just like the most of the rest of us?
I think games, as a whole, might be "dumb" because a lot of the attempts to make them more intelligent fall hopelessly flat. I mean look at Two Souls. Cage tries to do new and different things with his video games, but they end up being essentially movies with QTEs. The AI and input devices aren't up to the challenge, and that's not a misconception or sexism.
Sorry, I just can't agree with that. Games have been successfully working towards being smarter ever since the Atari 2600. One can find interesting and nuanced narratives and gameplay in games as far back as the mid to early 80's (see text-based adventure games, Chris Crawford, Ultima IV, and many others), and such games have only been increasing in number over the years. I don't accept that games are currently somehow inherently limited to perpetuating sexist stereotypes and ideas simply because David Cage became shitty after Indigo Prophecy.
 

T_ConX

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undeadsuitor said:
saying no female led game will ever succeed because one game didn't, is like saying macho bravado games featuring white guys with guns wont work because Duke Nukem Forever failed
Except Duke Nukem Forever didn't fail It actually made a profit.

Oh, yeah, sure... It was a bad game, got bad reviews, and there nothing new I can say development cycle...

Still made money.

Think about that. A bad game with a misogynist main character made money while a better game (not good, but better than DNF) with a good female character failed.

Imagine you're an executive at a major AAA publisher, and you're looking at this data, seeing how even terrible, cliched, half-assed shooters with male leads still do better than well developed, original games with female leads. What kinds of projects do you green-light? Who do you bet on?

You bet on Duke! Always bet on Duke!
 

Signa

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I'm sure it's just the asshole in me, but I picture Anita liking a game like Mary-Kate and Ashley Olson's Mall Adventure or something like that. A game about shopping with all that kickstarter funds and being independent and empowered to do whatever she feels like with no consequences. And most of all, no boys allowed!

In that same vein, Animal Crossing could fit the same criteria without being so cynical about it.
 

Therumancer

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T_ConX said:
I had a little chuckle over that 'The Last Princess' video. OH! A game where a Princess rescues herself and liberates her kingdom from tyranny! Why hasn't anyone made a game like that?

Oh wait, they have! I can immediately think of a few, and two of them are Final Fantasy's!

Anita isn't the only one who suffers from a game industry that isn't making the games she wants. She wants fewer distressed damsels and other sexist tropes, and more strong female characters. That's nice. I want fewer corridor cover shooters and more Card-based TRPGs (like Metal Gear Acid). Doesn't mean I'm going to get it, especially since myself, and folks with tastes similar to mine, are so few in number compared to the corridor cover shooter market.

But that just means that when a game I like comes out, I have to buy it to encourage future development of that game.

Anita wants triple AAA devs to alter their formulas to appeal to her tastes, but when they do, well, it doesn't work out so smoothly. She can sing all the praise about Mirror's Edge she wants, but when it gets outsold by every Battlefield title (including the Bad Company games), it's kind of obvious which franchise EA is going to make DICE focus on. Maybe if Mirror's Edge 2 sells well...

Oh who are we kidding. Anita is not a gamer, she just plays one on Youtube. She steals game footage from other people and even confessed to not liking video games.
Pretty much what I've been saying about her for a long time now, and exactly why she got so vehemently attacked and threatened when she started her campaign.

As I've said many times before, Anita is pretty much just a trouble maker. She's pretty much trying to attack games for perpetuating non-existent attacks on women and their role in society, because it gets her attention. The general role of women in games right now is pretty much what the vast majority of women want it to be, with the female characters and protaganists being virtually identical to the ones that women create on their own, especially when creating for a female audience. Even the so called "negative" trope of the damsel needing to be rescued or whatever is one that actually sppeals to most women, as shown by the huge amounts of money made producing romance novels involving such premises. When it comes to the way the characters look, and what they wear, again you turn right around and look at fantasy created for women by women, and we're not talking stuff that is necessarily romance oriented, it's pretty much identical to what is being described.

If Anita genuinely represents any group, it's one so small, that it might as well not even exist, and you can't be surprised that there aren't even many fringe producers catering to it. But at the end of the day she doesn't, she takes some general arguments that gets attention, exaggerates things, makes a video, and then wallows in the attention and notoriety.

To answer the OP, you really can't make a game to appeal to Anita Sarkeesian because at the end of the day her entire schtick is about the noise she's making rather than being satisfied. It's safe for her to pull out something like "Mirror's Edge" largely because it was a failure, or at least not the success that was hoped for. Truthfully had Mirror's Edge done more with the protagonist, or become a big success, I kind of suspect it would be on Anita's hit list, right now it's pretty much something that can be pulled out to present the illusion of there being real reason.

Strictly speaking from what I've seen of Anita and her videos (and yes, I have seen some of them) something like "Gone Home" would be dismissed in all likelihood specifically because it strays from the common video game staples of action, violence, etc. As a result it could be considered pandering and more or less creating a sort of "girl space" that isn't tantamount to acceptance on the same general playground as everyone else. I'm pretty sure she's gone off on adventure games in the past for that reason, with adventure games you frequently have female protaganists who are strong and well characterized, rescue people, and do all kinds of things, but by being a non-mainstream genere we're not supposed to count that. The same can apparently be applied to say "light novels" and the like. Simply put it seems like they still manage to put out a few Nancy Drew games every year, Nancy Drew pretty much fitting everything one would think Anita is complaining about, but see by giving her what she says she wants on one hand, it by definition violates other requirements as far as gaming goes, effectively creating a no win scenario. One of the reasons why I do not take Anita seriously is in how she weaves a web to discount anything that would meet her requirements and force her to concede there really isn't an issue. Understand adventure and adventure-puzzle game hybrids and such have been out there for a long time, and are actually making something of a comeback, slowly but surely, especially with the indie scene and the realization that they are fairly easy to port over to tablets/notebooks/etc... Aside from Nancy Drew, there are entire series of these games about lady psychics, detectives, etc... along with men.
 

JayElleBee

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Trilligan said:
FieryTrainwreck said:
Here's a concept, off the top of my head.

Post-apocalyptic survival shooter, action/adventure oriented, sort of in the vein of Fallout 3/NV, only in a more serious setting. Main protagonist is a mother of two boys, one 13 and one 10. The 10 year old has been blinded by events in the crapsack world they inhabit.

Mother is trying to find her husband, who disappeared pre-game for plot-related reasons we get to at the end of the second act or so. Family had been trying to reach safe haven somewhere before Dad ghosted. Plot follows Mother as she searches the road for clues, trying to keep her boys safe from the myriad dangers of the world. She has a gun but ammunition is scarce, violence can be effective but is extremely risky. 13 year old can get himself in trouble trying to help, 10 year old will panic and freak out in any exceptionally hairy situations. Many groups are simply too large for Mother to handle with her rifle. Best bet is usually for Mother to outsmart opponents or try to convince them to see reason, though there are myriad ways to approach any particular problem.

Part of the game mechanics include the emotional states of Mother and the boys - they draw strength from each other, but their nerves can fray from all the stresses of the world. Fear, anger, depression can each have different effects on the characters, causing them to react to different encounters in different ways. The 13 year old, in particular, has a bit of a chip on his shoulder, trying to be 'the man of the house' so to speak - he will try to influence Mother's decisions, and can be difficult if he isn't managed properly.

Edit: Additional afterthought. Potential mechanics for building bonds between Mother and boys - ability to choose to sing to them, ability to tell them bedtime stories, etc. Boys can bring Mother random gifts - flowers, found jewelry, etc. Maybe collectible storybooks litter the world as sort of a scavenger hunt mechanic, unlocking new tales for Mother to tell.
As a woman, I'd play the hell out of this and then some. I always wondered what a game like TLoU would look like with the genders switched.
 

Catfood220

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Just make her play Thomas Was Alone, both male and female characters are just squares of differing sizes. I don't see how anyone could complain about that.
 

EternallyBored

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T_ConX said:
undeadsuitor said:
saying no female led game will ever succeed because one game didn't, is like saying macho bravado games featuring white guys with guns wont work because Duke Nukem Forever failed
Except Duke Nukem Forever didn't fail It actually made a profit.

Oh, yeah, sure... It was a bad game, got bad reviews, and there nothing new I can say development cycle...

Still made money.

Think about that. A bad game with a misogynist main character made money while a better game (not good, but better than DNF) with a good female character failed.

Imagine you're an executive at a major AAA publisher, and you're looking at this data, seeing how even terrible, cliched, half-assed shooters with male leads still do better than well developed, original games with female leads. What kinds of projects do you green-light? Who do you bet on?

You bet on Duke! Always bet on Duke!
Except your wrong, the only thing your links show is that DNF beat the sales expectations of a single marketing firm, after they cut their expectations in half post launch, the expectations weren't even posted by Take 2. This also conveniently forgets the tens of millions of dollars that was sunk into the project before Take 2 sued the rights away from 3D Realms, due to breach of contract, and 3D realms going bankrupt, and pushed it off on to Gearbox to cobble together 10 years of code in less than a year. Whatever profit Take 2 made was because they basically got the license for almost nothing and the game still had to have its sales expectations cut in half to make a profit. Of course, this also ignores the wonky way companies report profit and expectations, DNF was profitable with less than 2 million sales, but Dead Space gets put on ice for selling 3 times what DNF did.

All of this is irrelevant anyway, people bought DNF to be part of the spectacle of a game that reached a sort of unique development hell nirvana. They wanted to see the monster of a game that had been in development for 10+ years, that's why people were posting pictures of their preorder tickets from 2002 on places like Reddit. You can't make any reliable statements, negative or positive, about male or female protagonists in games from DNF, it is an anomaly. People weren't buying DNF because of anything to do with his gender, they bought it to witness one of gaming's most sublime trainwrecks since Daikatana.

If you want to use relevant examples, male protagonists fail all the time. The medal of Honor series has pretty much been frozen by EA in favor of Battlefield. There are Male protagonist shooters that die every year due to shitty sales: Haze, Dark Void, Saboteur, Singularity, I can do this all day for pretty much every genre.

The catch 22 with this is that we really don't have enough data to make statements about the success of female protagonists in games. On one hand, we've got metrics for games like Mass Effect, where only 20% of players used female Shepard, but that doesn't actually make any concrete statements about how willing gamers are to play a female protagonist. On the other hand, we've seen a few female protagonists succeed in the AAA space. Lara Croft managed to perform as well as Nathan Drake with the last tomb raider (actually selling better than Uncharted 3, but Tomb Raider was a multi-platform, so that's not nearly as impressive). The only reason anyone questioned its financial success was because it got saddled with the unfair expectations of being lumped in with all of Square-Enix's other properties of the year. These same fucked up sales expectations also kill many male protagonists as well (RIP Isaac Clarke, maybe EA will unfreeze your corpse sometime in the future).

What females do we actually have in the AAA arena to pull our data from? Mirror's Edge? that's a first person parkour game, not even close to a mainstream title, the gameplay was pretty much untested by any other popular title, male or female protagonist, the game didn't even have an A game budget, much less a AAA budget, EA only marketed it as part of their effort at the time to change their image, the only real success they had with that entire initiative, male or female protagonist, was Dead Space. Remember Me? please, that game was hardly AAA, it got attention for some of its mechanics, and eventually their statements about how hard it was to get a publisher behind them, but again, it was a niche playstyle that wasn't high paced action, and mixed some half-assed RPG and combo mechanics in. Tomb Raider? Actually, the Tomb Raider reboot is getting another sequel, while Dead Space is currently in limbo, so yeah, there seems to be at least one female protagonist that guys seem to be willing to play.

Now, to be fair, I can understand why companies aren't toppling over themselves to create female protagonists in AAA games, the AAA arena is so god damn expensive, that I can't really blame them for not taking a risk that might put them out several hundred million dollars. Still, I'm all for playing games that actually do take some risks; any risks really, so a part of me wants to see them do it just to play something different that isn't an indie game that looks like it was made 10+ years ago.

EDIT: also, your comparison of DNF to Mirror's Edge says less about male and female protagonists, and more about how certain genres fare in the mainstream. So it's less "bet on Duke", and more "bet on a shooter to sell more than a quirky untested playstyle that involves platforming in a point of view people have traditionally hated platforming in". Mirror's Edge probably would have still been outsold by DNF with a male protagonist.
 

The Madman

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I haven't been following the whole Anita thing because frankly I think it's being blown way out of proportions, but I do vaguely recall seeing a picture ages ago of her next to the stack of games she bought from Kickstater or something and noticing Dreamfall: The Longest Journey was in that pile. Has she ever commented on it? I'll admit I haven't watched her videos and I certainly haven't been paying any attention to the media surrounding them, but if she really is for strong empowered female protagonists in gaming then The Longest Journey and its sequel Dreamfall seem like they'd be her ideal games.

Y'know, story-wise at least. Gameplay wise neither are exactly anything worth writing home about.
 

blackrave

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The Madman said:
I haven't been following the whole Anita thing because frankly I think it's being blown way out of proportions, but I do vaguely recall seeing a picture ages ago of her next to the stack of games she bought from Kickstater or something and noticing Dreamfall: The Longest Journey was in that pile. Has she ever commented on it? I'll admit I haven't watched her videos and I certainly haven't been paying any attention to the media surrounding them, but if she really is for strong empowered female protagonists in gaming then The Longest Journey and its sequel Dreamfall seem like they'd be her ideal games.

Y'know, story-wise at least. Gameplay wise neither are exactly anything worth writing home about.
Pfft! Are you for real?
Zoe is drawn in all of the mess by a man
Not to mention that April and Zoe are both sexualized to pander to male demographics.
C'mon there are plenty of sequences when they are running around in underwear
Context? That all "context" thingy is just an excuse to objectify females.
And in the end April and Zoe both fail.
That perfectly fits patriarchal beliefs that women are inferior and incapable to achieve anything on their own.
How dare you suggest that this degrading shit would be good enough for Anita?

P.S. I've learned to dismiss games from Anita. How well I'm doing?