Convince Me That I'm Wrong About RPGs

[Shymer]

Most people have a blend of four behaviours that they exhibit; the need to win, the need to be right, the need for harmony and the need for recognition. People differ in the intensity with which these things are important to them.

In my experience, which is not exhaustive, people who enjoy computer games have a natural inclination to be more intense about the need to be right. I am one of these people. These people are more task-orientated (like people who need to win more than anything) than people-orientated (those that crave recognition, need harmony). As a consequence, their 'people skills' may need honing.

You might understand how these people (myself included) would spend their time (or researching on the 'net) optimising a 'build', thus proving themselves right. They may try and share this with you - perhaps not recognising that you don't need 'help', or that they are not necessarily expert at communicating it without flashing their 'correctness' to prove to you how right they are.

All they are doing is exposing where game balance has not been balanced by the game developers and using that to their advantage. I like these people for their creativity, their attention to detail, and the lengths to which they will go to prove a point. However, sometimes their (my) manners leave a lot to be desired.

That you may approach games in a different angle, or with different intensity is brilliant. Do it your own way. Games are about fun. Fun is about a game appealing to your particular hot buttons, which may not be winning/being right.

Perhaps one of the limitations of mainstream RPG design is that they are often developed by people who exhibit these task-orientated behaviours. That is good because they would not necessarily finish the game without being that way - but it does lend itself to games where recognition (social gaming) and harmony (building/management) are not explored to their fullest.

I don't think your story is a reason to steer clear of your friends. I would advocate appreciating them for their focus and drive to be right all the time. Gently humour them about their lack of social graces, and consider whether you need to take their advice to enjoy the game you're playing. Sometimes optimising the build breaks the challenge. If you finds that's the case - put it to one side and leave it for another day.

Good luck!

 

[captainwolfos]

I personally LOVE playing MMOs. But I play them MY way. I've been told only once that I needed to restart my character because it sucked, and that was way back in the day I had absolutely no idea what I was doing, but still miraculously managing to stay alive XD

My advice: ignore everyone else and do it your way. It's your game and your character(s), after all. I play RPGs for the chance to be a stalwart hero (or a complete lunatic) most of the time, and I can do that perfectly well without paying much heed to any numbers, aside from how many dudes I have to kill.

 

[kingcom]

Most people have a blend of four behaviours that they exhibit; the need to win, the need to be right, the need for harmony and the need for recognition. People differ in the intensity with which these things are important to them.

In my experience, which is not exhaustive, people who enjoy computer games have a natural inclination to be more intense about the need to be right. I am one of these people. These people are more task-orientated (like people who need to win more than anything) than people-orientated (those that crave recognition, need harmony). As a consequence, their 'people skills' may need honing.

You might understand how these people (myself included) would spend their time (or researching on the 'net) optimising a 'build', thus proving themselves right. They may try and share this with you - perhaps not recognising that you don't need 'help', or that they are not necessarily expert at communicating it without flashing their 'correctness' to prove to you how right they are.

All they are doing is exposing where game balance has not been balanced by the game developers and using that to their advantage. I like these people for their creativity, their attention to detail, and the lengths to which they will go to prove a point. However, sometimes their (my) manners leave a lot to be desired.

That you may approach games in a different angle, or with different intensity is brilliant. Do it your own way. Games are about fun. Fun is about a game appealing to your particular hot buttons, which may not be winning/being right.

Perhaps one of the limitations of mainstream RPG design is that they are often developed by people who exhibit these task-orientated behaviours. That is good because they would not necessarily finish the game without being that way - but it does lend itself to games where recognition (social gaming) and harmony (building/management) are not explored to their fullest.

I don't think your story is a reason to steer clear of your friends. I would advocate appreciating them for their focus and drive to be right all the time. Gently humour them about their lack of social graces, and consider whether you need to take their advice to enjoy the game you're playing. Sometimes optimising the build breaks the challenge. If you finds that's the case - put it to one side and leave it for another day.

Good luck!

One of the most insightful looks into people I've seen a while.

 

[Snowalker]

Its not a matter of "How to do it perfect," its a matter of, "what makes sense." If you're wanting to be a warrior, boost strength and pick skill that either boost your health or deal dmg, and if the game provides, a couple that do both. Wanting to be a mage? Wisdom and intelligence, then spells in your magic school of choice. I think thats what people are talking about. If you can't grasp that, then don't try making something complicated, like a mage-warrior, or a magic-assassin... Because that require expertise in balancing skill with attributes.

There are choice, and their are fuckups, because a mage with maxed out strength but little wisdom is fucked beyond belief. So, yeah, if you don't like the fact you can screw up, then don't play RPG. Maybe you're talking about master builds, ones in which nothing is beatable. Those exist in any game, not just RPG's. Simply put, don't worry about them in Single-player, and they'll be nerfed in mmos eventually.

 

[StormShaun]

RPG = FUN
MMORPG = WASTE OF TIME

 

[GavmatexD]

YOUR WRONG ABOUT RPG'S convinced ?

 

[Dastardly]

I know a LOT of you are going to abhor me for saying this, but I feel I need to say it.

Well, for one, there are always bad examples of good types of games. There are bad shooters, bad RPGs, bad puzzle games... but it doesn't mean the genre is inherently bad.

Now, math being what it is, there's always going to be some set of builds that are "optimal" for a particular thing--there's a "take lots of damage" build or two, a few "fast criticals" builds... But being able to say, "Wow, I seemed to play the game fine with a build these people called 'awful'?"

Isn't that a good thing about the game? The fact that you could play it your way, despite detractors getting on you because it's not mathematically the "best?"

 

[TheRightToArmBears]

It doesn't make vast amounts of difference usually. For instance, in Oblivion my latest character is a lightly armoured, sword weilding High Elf with no magical abilities whatsoever. You can overcome the setbacks just by playing more so the stats you use get better, and I've solved the weakness to magic by wearing a load of reflect spell items. Of course, there's always a 'perfect' build, but it kills your roleplaying, so just ignore it.

Besides, even when you are going to play by numbers, there should really be a race or class or whatever that caters pretty well to a jack-of-all-trades type character, so you shouldn't have to have a poor character just because you're not set ino one style of playing.

 

[Veldt Falsetto]

I know a LOT of you are going to abhor me for saying this, but I feel I need to say it.

So, I was talking to some people about Dungeon Fighter Online, an MMORPG, and we were on the subject of Skill builds. Now, I'm not an expert at this game, and I simply asked what skills were good to get for one of the game's classes. I was directed to a "Skill build simulator", that crunches exact numbers for every level of every skill in the game! Using this, I discovered that my build was "terrible", yet I've been getting by pretty well with it.

Apparently, you're NOT supposed to base your stats and skills on what you use often and what you don't! No, every single aspect of customization this game comes down to whether the simulator likes it or not. This got me thinking about other RPGs I've played. In every single one of them, somebody's complained that I was doing things completely wrong. I've been forced by others to start over, no matter how well I play, even if it's a single-player game! I then began to ask myself questions: Why is it that, if I don't do everything PERFECT, I've screwed up? How can so many people (every RPG fan I've ever met) care so much about what a computer or walkthrough says? Why does everybody else get all of this Skill and Stat and Equipment stuff, yet I always "ruin" my characters completely? And most importantly: How many RPGs have REAL customization? Do RPGs really have billions of customization options? Or do they have three or four "options", and a billion fuckups?

This has turned me off from the entire RPG genre. And, in case you haven't noticed, a LOT of games these days have Stats and Skills and all that jazz. I don't want to go the rest of my life unable to enjoy these games. So please, Escapist. Convince me that I'm horribly, horribly wrong.

EDIT: It's not just people I play with that are unimpressed with me. I've found "Easy" games seriously hard, and I'm positive some of it is actually because of my decisions. Maybe I just think differently from everyone else, but a stat build in a game that I thought was pretty solid has, more than once, made it a LOT harder. It can't be ALL others' fault. I'm seriously bad when it comes to RPG elements, even in simple games like Pokemon.

How about you forget what everyone else says and just have fun with it? In Oblivion, take what skills you fancy and which you think you'd like to use. In Pokemon why not just take which mons you like as long as you have a decent range of types and levels you can have fun and beat the game. If you're playing for fun then there is no wrong way to play, you just do it however you want

 

[Chibz]

That really requires likeminded people in my experience, getting the wrong person to play a TT game in general can go very wrong (though a good GM REALLY helps).

It's surprisingly easy to get a functional group together. And like I said to the OP, once you stop trying to "roleplay" in electronic games you'll realize how little freedom they allowed you.

 

[singlcuteguy]

@WildSeraph Exclaimed:
This got me thinking about other RPGs I've played. In every single one of them, somebody's complained that I was doing things completely wrong. I've been forced by others to start over, no matter how well I play, even if it's a single-player game! I then began to ask myself questions: Why is it that, if I don't do everything PERFECT, I've screwed up?

First off, as a long time RPGer, I do NOT abhor you. Secondly, if other people are FORCING YOU to start your game over again... perhaps you should tell them to back off - to stop HARASSING YOU. Thirdly, and this is perhaps most important, think about what genre you're playing: AnRPG: A ROLE PLAYING GAME. Unfortunately, many CRPGs & MMORPGs are ill-designed and focus more on the GAME part than the ROLE part. Every choice you make for your character should grant some kind of bonus/reward to your stats/skills/abilities so your character can grow THE WAY YOU WANT. For example - if I wanted to have a Knight character who has some thieving skills because I view him as having grown up as a street urchin, than why should anyone other than myself be concerned about my refusal to min/max? Why should any twink/munchkin/min-max-er be so concerned with what I CHOOSE TO DO? If a game requires me to munchkin-ize every character I make, and there are some which DO do this, than I refuse to play such a game with a lazy design like that.

Therefore, my advice to you is: Choose your RPGs more wisely and have fun being your character. Isn't that what PLAYING A ROLE is? Remember: Haters are gonna hate no matter what you do. Be your own person, create a character you like, and have fun with it!

 

[Mr Gilkes]

To the OP:

Your game, your playthrough, do what you want and enjoy.