Cyberpunk 2077 Review thread - Umm....

CriticalGaming

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I may make Cyberpunk my Christmas present to myself. Though since I run but a humble GTX1080 :p it may not be quite up to the standards of the glorious pc gaming master race but I’ll muddle through I’m sure.
You should be fine on medium settings. No ray tracing for you, but that is whatever imo.
 

Dreiko

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I know for a fact that they aren't. Growing up a gaming girl/woman in the 00's and early-10's was a great way to experience boys/men who simply could not wrap their head around the idea that a woman might be a hardcore gamer. Gaming culture has, for whatever reason, attracted a kind of men that are deeply misogynistic, easily slighted and have massive entitlement issues. These people are assholes in real life too, the kind of assholes that will grope a woman, get mad when she doesn't "take the compliment" and then demand that she, in great detail, explains how to get the Red Armor in Link's Awakening or she's a Fake Gamer Girl and thus not worthy of their time.

Gaming, roleplaying and miniature games have traditionally drawn this kind of utter scum into their ranks. Roleplaying and miniature games have worked hard to either purge them or ensure that they stick to their little shitty cliques and don't bother decent folk looking for a good time. Gaming? In gaming there are broad circles that actively embrace these assholes and encourage them.

I think you are coming into it not considering their perspective in a glaringly obvious way. As someone who was gaming in the mid 90s on, I legit, legit, had no female gaming friend or even knew any girls who didn't think gaming was weird or dumb or later in life around high school would make fun of you for playing with a child's toys. It was not until I moved to the US and went to college that I would meet any normal gaming girls, and by then I was online enough to not be surprised by that. Now, my disposition generally is to just be above petty interpersonal grievances, so instead of taking it out on them or growing bitter, I just pitied them for being ignorant of the awesomeness of gaming, it wasn't just girls mind you, boys also had this facade of "growing out of gaming" thing going at that age, though they secretly would play em and just lie about it which I actually took way bigger issue with.

But yes, if at that age group with that background you came over in the early 00s and claimed you played games, and not only that, but you played in the same way I did, I would look at you like I was seeing an alien riding on a unicorn. Not because I hate anything about it, but just out of sheer incredulity borne out of a lifetime of counterexamples.


Now, some people are less magnanimous and let these lifetime worth of experiences get to them, they grow bitter and hateful, and they approach this issue with "well, if you're gonna call me weird and immature, screw you and everyone like you". I don't think it's odd. This is legit a lifetime of bullying manifesting here. I think expecting kids to be as mature as an adult is an unreasonable standard.


You need to stop thinking about you and think about what experiences drove that person to be the way they are. If you think they're just automatically evil and sociopaths then you are doing the same thing they do when they treat girls like the enemy because they were being met with scorn for just having a hobby just like you were.
 

CriticalGaming

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I think you are coming into it not considering their perspective in a glaringly obvious way. As someone who was gaming in the mid 90s on, I legit, legit, had no female gaming friend or even knew any girls who didn't think gaming was weird or dumb or later in life around high school would make fun of you for playing with a child's toys. It was not until I moved to the US and went to college that I would meet any normal gaming girls, and by then I was online enough to not be surprised by that. Now, my disposition generally is to just be above petty interpersonal grievances, so instead of taking it out on them or growing bitter, I just pitied them for being ignorant of the awesomeness of gaming, it wasn't just girls mind you, boys also had this facade of "growing out of gaming" thing going at that age, though they secretly would play em and just lie about it which I actually took way bigger issue with.

But yes, if at that age group with that background you came over in the early 00s and claimed you played games, and not only that, but you played in the same way I did, I would look at you like I was seeing an alien riding on a unicorn. Not because I hate anything about it, but just out of sheer incredulity borne out of a lifetime of counterexamples.


Now, some people are less magnanimous and let these lifetime worth of experiences get to them, they grow bitter and hateful, and they approach this issue with "well, if you're gonna call me weird and immature, screw you and everyone like you". I don't think it's odd. This is legit a lifetime of bullying manifesting here. I think expecting kids to be as mature as an adult is an unreasonable standard.


You need to stop thinking about you and think about what experiences drove that person to be the way they are. If you think they're just automatically evil and sociopaths then you are doing the same thing they do when they treat girls like the enemy because they were being met with scorn for just having a hobby just like you were.
This speaks to the core of my being.
 

Baffle

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I think you are coming into it not considering their perspective in a glaringly obvious way. As someone who was gaming in the mid 90s on, I legit, legit, had no female gaming friend or even knew any girls who didn't think gaming was weird or dumb or later in life around high school would make fun of you for playing with a child's toys. It was not until I moved to the US and went to college that I would meet any normal gaming girls, and by then I was online enough to not be surprised by that. Now, my disposition generally is to just be above petty interpersonal grievances, so instead of taking it out on them or growing bitter, I just pitied them for being ignorant of the awesomeness of gaming, it wasn't just girls mind you, boys also had this facade of "growing out of gaming" thing going at that age, though they secretly would play em and just lie about it which I actually took way bigger issue with.

But yes, if at that age group with that background you came over in the early 00s and claimed you played games, and not only that, but you played in the same way I did, I would look at you like I was seeing an alien riding on a unicorn. Not because I hate anything about it, but just out of sheer incredulity borne out of a lifetime of counterexamples.


Now, some people are less magnanimous and let these lifetime worth of experiences get to them, they grow bitter and hateful, and they approach this issue with "well, if you're gonna call me weird and immature, screw you and everyone like you". I don't think it's odd. This is legit a lifetime of bullying manifesting here. I think expecting kids to be as mature as an adult is an unreasonable standard.


You need to stop thinking about you and think about what experiences drove that person to be the way they are. If you think they're just automatically evil and sociopaths then you are doing the same thing they do when they treat girls like the enemy because they were being met with scorn for just having a hobby just like you were.
Sorry, but I don't think we should be apologists for shitheads. I'm almost 40, I've been through the supposed bad years of gaming. I don't feel the need to be an awful person to people.

We all carry baggage from our early years. I've got loads, and sometimes I still go out to get some more now. But it doesn't make me treat people like shit on the internet or in real life (nor would it ever justify doing so).
 

CriticalGaming

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Sorry, but I don't think we should be apologists for shitheads. I'm almost 40, I've been through the supposed bad years of gaming. I don't feel the need to be an awful person to people.

We all carry baggage from our early years. I've got loads, and sometimes I still go out to get some more now. But it doesn't make me treat people like shit on the internet or in real life (nor would it ever justify doing so).
I feel like there is a difference between being social inept and awkward and being a shitbag. Like the people who are unironically impressed that girls know things are more socially awkward, versus shitheads who sent voice actors death threats because they didn't like a character that someone else wrote.

Because as someone who was very awkward in middle/high school there have been many times when 've just said dumbshit because my mouth acted faster than my brain.
 

Baffle

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I feel like there is a difference between being social inept and awkward and being a shitbag. Like the people who are unironically impressed that girls know things are more socially awkward, versus shitheads who sent voice actors death threats because they didn't like a character that someone else wrote.

Because as someone who was very awkward in middle/high school there have been many times when 've just said dumbshit because my mouth acted faster than my brain.
Oh, I agree. I was a very shy and awkward child (and teen), and would blurt out dumb stuff. But that sort of behaviour is quite normal and not what I'm talking about. There's just too much maliciousness (that is, active hatred and a desire to hurt) that is just awful. Haven't got time for it, would place in an airlock and get rid.
 

Gethsemani

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I think you are coming into it not considering their perspective in a glaringly obvious way.
I find it incredibly ironic that you lead with this and then go on to absolutely erase my (and many other women who gamed in those years) experience in order to explain to us why the people who harassed us and bullied us are actually the victims.

Now, some people are less magnanimous and let these lifetime worth of experiences get to them, they grow bitter and hateful, and they approach this issue with "well, if you're gonna call me weird and immature, screw you and everyone like you". I don't think it's odd. This is legit a lifetime of bullying manifesting here. I think expecting kids to be as mature as an adult is an unreasonable standard.
And yet you don't see women in gaming form large asshole cliques were they find 12 year old kids to vent their frustration with the bullying they've had to endure from male gamers. You don't see LGBTQ persons form harassment mobs to drive out other minority gamers, despite being the group that has it absolutely worst in gaming circles. Why the fuck should I pity the people who target me because I share their hobby but have a different gender?

You need to stop thinking about you and think about what experiences drove that person to be the way they are. If you think they're just automatically evil and sociopaths then you are doing the same thing they do when they treat girls like the enemy because they were being met with scorn for just having a hobby just like you were.
Why should I? Why is the onus on me to consider the delicate fee-fees of the people that harass me? Why should any of us give even a modicum of respect or sympathy to the utter dickwads that go apeshit, doxx and start sustained harassment and death threat campaigns against streamers or pro-players that come out as trans?

Baffle said it best:
We all carry baggage from our early years. I've got loads, and sometimes I still go out to get some more now. But it doesn't make me treat people like shit on the internet or in real life (nor would it ever justify doing so).
Most of us suck it up, deal with it in a constructive way and move on. We don't turn it on someone weaker.

Because as someone who was very awkward in middle/high school there have been many times when 've just said dumbshit because my mouth acted faster than my brain.
This is not the behavior I was referring to. A lot of us who got into gaming in the 90's were awkward in some way, but the vast majority of us didn't become raging assholes, not online and not in real life.
 
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CriticalGaming

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This is not the behavior I was referring to. A lot of us who got into gaming in the 90's were awkward in some way, but the vast majority of us didn't become raging assholes, not online and not in real life.
I dunno, I've been called a raging asshole on this and the last forum before.

Maybe i'm the baddie.....
 

Dreiko

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I find it incredibly ironic that you lead with this and then go on to absolutely erase my (and many other women who gamed in those years) experience in order to explain to us why the people who harassed us and bullied us are actually the victims.



And yet you don't see women in gaming form large asshole cliques were they find 12 year old kids to vent their frustration with the bullying they've had to endure from male gamers. You don't see LGBTQ persons form harassment mobs to drive out other minority gamers, despite being the group that has it absolutely worst in gaming circles. Why the fuck should I pity the people who target me because I share their hobby but have a different gender?



Why should I? Why is the onus on me to consider the delicate fee-fees of the people that harass me? Why should any of us give even a modicum of respect or sympathy to the utter dickwads that go apeshit, doxx and start sustained harassment and death threat campaigns against streamers or pro-players that come out as trans?

Baffle said it best:


Most of us suck it up, deal with it in a constructive way and move on. We don't turn it on someone weaker.



This is not the behavior I was referring to. A lot of us who got into gaming in the 90's were awkward in some way, but the vast majority of us didn't become raging assholes, not online and not in real life.

Which is it, did most of us not become raging assholes, which is the point I made originally that you were refuting, or are gamers evil like you said in your refutation?



I did not erase your experience, I clarified what set it in motion. If you don't care about that stuff, then they are justified to not care about your stuff either. I say we care about both things.


If you think girls don't form cliques in highschool and use that group power to harass people, you live on a different planet. If you think gamers didn't have it especially bad, much, much worse than whatever happened to the gamer girls in a gaming community, again, different planet.


And no there's no need to pity them, you just need to interpret the way they are towards you through the prism of the understanding I layed out if you care to be accurate about your estimation of them. If you don't care about what girls did to them, they are not gonna care about what gamers did to you or to gay folks. And the thing that was done to someone first HAS to take precedence in the sequence of caring. You can't just be like "why did you punch me in the face" right after you got done punching someone in the face first. You gotta include what lead up to you being counterpunched.


Sorry, but I don't think we should be apologists for shitheads. I'm almost 40, I've been through the supposed bad years of gaming. I don't feel the need to be an awful person to people.

We all carry baggage from our early years. I've got loads, and sometimes I still go out to get some more now. But it doesn't make me treat people like shit on the internet or in real life (nor would it ever justify doing so).
I didn't apologize for anything. I clarified why it happened, and that it's understandable, if unfortunate.
 

Houseman

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If you think women don't form cliques in highschool then use that group power to harass people, you live on a different planet.
Case in point, people are still attacking others for being socially inept virgins. They call them incels now.
This is the same "haha, you're a NERD and you don't have a GIRLFRIEND because you just play videogames instead of sports!" from the 90's dressed in different clothes.
And every time that taunt is uttered, it just further insults and reinforces the belief that "you don't matter if you aren't having sex like the cool people"

So the bullying has never stopped.
 

Dreiko

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Case in point, people are still attacking others for being socially inept virgins. They call them incels now.
This is the same "haha, you're a NERD and you don't have a GIRLFRIEND because you just play videogames instead of sports!" from the 90's dressed in different clothes.
And every time that taunt is uttered, it just further insults and reinforces the belief that "you don't matter if you aren't having sex like the cool people"

So the bullying has never stopped.

Incel is imo even dumber because you have people identifying with it which is baffling to me. Being called a nerd at least means you like something and also that you're a creepy weirdo virgin. You at least have star trek or anime or something to sustain you while you suffer the indignities, or you like it so much that it doesn't even matter what ridicule you face.

Incels are just an identity about being weird ugly virgins. I don't know why they'd allow themselves to give women and their relations relative to them so much power to define their beings.
 

Houseman

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Incel is imo even dumber because you have people identifying with it which is baffling to me. Being called a nerd at least means you like something and also that you're a creepy weirdo virgin. You at least have star trek or anime or something to sustain you while you suffer the indignities, or you like it so much that it doesn't even matter what ridicule you face.

Incels are just an identity about being weird ugly virgins. I don't know why they'd allow themselves to give women and their relations relative to them so much power to define their beings.
I think that, taking the word at face value, incel is something you DON'T want to be, but are. "Involuntarily".
So claiming the name is a way of saying "I've been treated unfairly! There's something wrong! The system doesn't work!"
It's not a mark of pride, it's a cry of oppression. Kind of like BLM
 

Dreiko

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I think that, taking the word at face value, incel is something you DON'T want to be, but are. "Involuntarily".
So claiming the name is a way of saying "I've been treated unfairly! There's something wrong! The system doesn't work!"
It's not a mark of pride, it's a cry of oppression. Kind of like BLM

I gueeeeeess I can see that, but like, I can't draw for shit, I don't really focus on that, and trust me, I'd love to be able to draw. I think there's something pathological in caring so much about this one thing you suck at. I think it's putting it on a pedestal, giving it too much emphasis, too much power to control your life, power it doesn't deserve to have over you. I don't think being an incel is something so grave where you'd wanna form a group about it. Just...do other stuff instead. Focus elsewhere.
 

CriticalGaming

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Incel is imo even dumber because you have people identifying with it which is baffling to me. Being called a nerd at least means you like something and also that you're a creepy weirdo virgin. You at least have star trek or anime or something to sustain you while you suffer the indignities, or you like it so much that it doesn't even matter what ridicule you face.

Incels are just an identity about being weird ugly virgins. I don't know why they'd allow themselves to give women and their relations relative to them so much power to define their beings.
I'm an incel sadly. On top of being a fat ugly nerd, I'm also just unbelievably shy in person. Like it's kind of a real big problem, and it takes special circumstances to get me to be any kind of outgoing. I also have that phobia where I really hate going outside or into crowds, so my mind has dead set stuck my into a corner in which I'll never meet anyone ever. Top that off with not having any "cool" hobbies and yeah, just kind of incelled out.

In other news here is a video I shot the other day of me being a nerd on a guitar
 
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Baffle

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I didn't apologize for anything. I clarified why it happened, and that it's understandable, if unfortunate.
That isn't what apologist means. It's someone who defends or makes excuses for something.
 

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I think it's putting it on a pedestal, giving it too much emphasis, too much power to control your life, power it doesn't deserve to have over you.
Well, there's no biological imperative to draw. People don't regularly have the urge to draw from a young age, but with no genuine outlets. People don't socially view being able to draw as part of a necessary part of being a complete person.

Society is what puts sex on a pedestal. I agree, an individual shouldn't, but it would be naive to think that a great deal of people wouldn't be negatively affected by not being able to attain something that society thinks everybody should attain.

Top that off with not having any "cool" hobbies and yeah, just kind of incelled out.
I think playing the guitar is a cool hobby.
 
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Baffle

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I'm an incel sadly. On top of being a fat ugly nerd, I'm also just unbelievably shy in person. Like it's kind of a real big problem, and it takes special circumstances to get me to be any kind of outgoing. I also have that phobia where I really hate going outside or into crowds, so my mind has dead set stuck my into a corner in which I'll never meet anyone ever. Top that off with not having any "cool" hobbies and yeah, just kind of incelled out.
Can't comment on the guitar playing because for some reason there isn't any sound. You are, inevitably, a better musician than me.

But if you're unhappy with how things are, work to change them. I know it's not as easy as saying that, not even close. But things don't change themselves either. Get therapy if that's what it takes (never had it, probably should). I know I'm not telling you anything you haven't heard before, but, you know, you gotta do something if you're unhappy right. (Sorry, this is a terrible pep talk). And if you wanna lose weight, don't eat bread. That shit is a nightmare, white bread especially.
 

Houseman

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And if you wanna lose weight, don't eat bread. That shit is a nightmare, white bread especially.
On that subject, I noticed myself getting fat in quarantine, so I switched to only eating two smaller meals a day. Maybe some eggs in the morning, and then something else at night. It's been working well so far. I don't have a scale, but I noticed my pants don't hurt to put on now.

My real fear is having to buy more clothes. Anything but that.
 

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From this thread, I have learned there is a cyberpunk and a post-cyberpunk, and the difference is whether everybody in the setting is miserable and have bad haircuts.
 
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