Dark Souls 2: Dragons Not Included

[michael87cn]

I think it's more a case of if they pitted new players (the dragon rider is a new player boss) against two opponents simultaneously right off the bat, nobody would like the game. People commonly hate O&S because they find it 'cheap' that you have to fight two bosses at once.

Pitting the player against a dragon AND a dragonrider at the same time would be kind of ridiculous right at the beginning of the game. Some will disagree, but of course some are never satisfied and in their opinion, souls games can never be too hard. In fact, in their opinion nothing is hard. They play with their pinky toe and still beat the game with the Ladle. Without getting hit once. While in the champions covenant new game +99. They're waiting for the DLC that makes you have to WILL your character to move with telepathy. But, sadly, even that will be too easy.

Anyway, it probably also had Lore connotations. I mean, this comic is kind of bad. Its not funny, and it doesn't even poke fun at something that makes sense.

 

[Ferisar]

I think it's more a case of if they pitted new players (the dragon rider is a new player boss) against two opponents simultaneously right off the bat, nobody would like the game. People commonly hate O&S because they find it 'cheap' that you have to fight two bosses at once.

Pitting the player against a dragon AND a dragonrider at the same time would be kind of ridiculous right at the beginning of the game. Some will disagree, but of course some are never satisfied and in their opinion, souls games can never be too hard. In fact, in their opinion nothing is hard. They play with their pinky toe and still beat the game with the Ladle. Without getting hit once. While in the champions covenant new game +99. They're waiting for the DLC that makes you have to WILL your character to move with telepathy. But, sadly, even that will be too easy.

Anyway, it probably also had Lore connotations. I mean, this comic is kind of bad. Its not funny, and it doesn't even poke fun at something that makes sense.

See, you had me right until that last bit. That's just rude and untrue. It -doesn't- make any sense, that's why it's being poked at. You never face a dragonrider with a dragon, the both times you meet them.

 

[talker]

These guys are nitwits! How can you have a tophat without a monocle and moustache?

Don't forget the pipe, slippers and upper-class British accent.

 

[Mahorfeus]

There is actually a picture in the artbook that shows one of these dudes riding a dragon... thing. It's not one of the ones you see later in the game - it looks more like some kind of dinosaur or something. I figure that they ended up taking it out or just not implementing it at some point in development. It would have been kind of cool, though.

 

[Zendariel]

I think it's more a case of if they pitted new players (the dragon rider is a new player boss) against two opponents simultaneously right off the bat, nobody would like the game. People commonly hate O&S because they find it 'cheap' that you have to fight two bosses at once.

Pitting the player against a dragon AND a dragonrider at the same time would be kind of ridiculous right at the beginning of the game. Some will disagree, but of course some are never satisfied and in their opinion, souls games can never be too hard. In fact, in their opinion nothing is hard. They play with their pinky toe and still beat the game with the Ladle. Without getting hit once. While in the champions covenant new game +99. They're waiting for the DLC that makes you have to WILL your character to move with telepathy. But, sadly, even that will be too easy.

Anyway, it probably also had Lore connotations. I mean, this comic is kind of bad. Its not funny, and it doesn't even poke fun at something that makes sense.

See, you had me right until that last bit. That's just rude and untrue. It -doesn't- make any sense, that's why it's being poked at. You never face a dragonrider with a dragon, the both times you meet them.

Few quotes from the game,
"The Dragonrider faithfully served King Vendrick. Long ago, the dragonriders mounted wyrms, and were feared on the battlefield for their unparallelled strength." -Dragon rider soul

"Halberd of the Dragonriders, King Vendrick's royal guard. A highly versatile weapon that can slash, sweep, and thrust when wielded numbly, and is also imbued with magic.
Demands great skill of its wielder, and thus served to test the worthiness of those who aspire to join the Dragonriders." -Dragonrider halberd

So basically, the dragonriders are/were an order of knights that used to mount wyrms, and wyrms are probably not the dragons that are later in the game, though this is just an assumption. It's based on the assumption of the area being shut off from rest of drangleic before Aldia managed to create the dragons.

There is actually a picture in the artbook that shows one of these dudes riding a dragon... thing. It's not one of the ones you see later in the game - it looks more like some kind of dinosaur or something. I figure that they ended up taking it out or just not implementing it at some point in development. It would have been kind of cool, though.

thanks, i haven't seen the artbook yet, but you confirmed my suspicions on that part.

 

[Ishal]

*ahem*
*Wipes snot from nose with hand*
*adjusts glasses*

Technically they aren't even "dragon" riders. They ride wyrms, which are basically lizard-things.

Spoiler

Anyway, they're more just special warriors who helped found Drangleic. Part of a special group of knights. I love their armor.

Good comic. Got a few good laughs out of me. Are you guys enjoying the game?

 

[00slash00]

My favorite part is that you fight a dragon rider later in the game too and rather than give him, say, a dragon, they just throw in a second, weaker dragon rider to provide backup. Maybe there's a lore thing I'm just not getting, but why not just call them something else. Kinda seems like calling an enemy who exclusively casts fire spells, a lightning mage

 

[00slash00]

it is kinda disappointing that most bosses seem to be filler. the corridor leading to the looking glass knight is much more dangerous than the boss himself, by that time even people who never touched a souls game before should be able to beat him easily(his shield thing is kinda cool but he did it once for me before melting)
and the bosses that hold the great souls are a little underwhelming, the only one that gave me trouble was the sinner and that was mostly because it's one of the places where the old lighting system rears its head and you can't lock onto enemies until you can poke them with your toe.

I actually didn't notice The Old Sinner was harder to target because of the lighting, until I heard people talking about it. Most of the bosses just seemed to be the same strategy of, block, strafe around, attacked the back. The Iron Keep boss gave me some trouble but only because I kept accidentally rolling in to lava, haha. The chariot boss was probably my favorite in the game. It was one of the only bosses that felt different and among the very few that you couldn't just tortoise shell your way through.

But as I understand it, ng is mostly a tutorial (more so than other Souls games) and ng+ is a much greater difficulty jump than it was in previous games

 

[CelestDaer]

I like how people keep harping on this, but the guy lives just across the way from the DragonSLAYER... I mean, duh?

 

[Objectable]

It's that the Dragonrider boss has no dragon.

Ultima IX, anyone?

Hey, at least in the cutscenes to Not Ultima IX they rode dragons.

 

[Denamic]

This being Dark Souls, it'd be really, REALLY weird if someone were to actually use dragons as mounts. Dragons are a pretty big deal in Dark Souls. Drakes and wyrms are NOT dragons. Dragons are god-like beings that were ancient since before mankind even existed. You don't ride them.

 

[Robyrt]

it is kinda disappointing that most bosses seem to be filler. the corridor leading to the looking glass knight is much more dangerous than the boss himself, by that time even people who never touched a souls game before should be able to beat him easily(his shield thing is kinda cool but he did it once for me before melting)
and the bosses that hold the great souls are a little underwhelming, the only one that gave me trouble was the sinner and that was mostly because it's one of the places where the old lighting system rears its head and you can't lock onto enemies until you can poke them with your toe.

I actually didn't notice The Old Sinner was harder to target because of the lighting, until I heard people talking about it. Most of the bosses just seemed to be the same strategy of, block, strafe around, attacked the back. The Iron Keep boss gave me some trouble but only because I kept accidentally rolling in to lava, haha. The chariot boss was probably my favorite in the game. It was one of the only bosses that felt different and among the very few that you couldn't just tortoise shell your way through.

But as I understand it, ng is mostly a tutorial (more so than other Souls games) and ng+ is a much greater difficulty jump than it was in previous games

Blocking has always been a safe and reliable, albeit slow, strategy for Souls games. There are a lot of people who are no good at most action games but still want to get the Souls experience, so they turtle up behind a greatshield with 70+ stability and poke every enemy to death. More power to them! Meanwhile I'm doing exciting things like dodging, parrying and attacking.

Basically, if you are a Souls veteran, you'll want to be on NG+ as fast as possible. All those mysterious blank spots in the world fill up with enemies, the one-note boss fights like Lost Sinner and Flexile Sentry start getting interesting, and the drop rates go back up to the generous numbers they were in DS1.

 

[sXeth]

Yeah, thats one silly named boss(es, there's like 5? of them). I would've even taken a guy in dragon-themed armor or whatever on a horse or something, but they don't even go that far with it.

I mean, the "normal" elite Drangleic knights are guys in giant mastodon helmets, they couldn't at least do that for the Boss elite knight-guards of Drangleic.

 

[Ferisar]

I mean, the "normal" elite Drangleic knights are guys in giant mastodon helmets, they couldn't at least do that for the Boss elite knight-guards of Drangleic.

I... uh... I don't think those are helmets.

Dun
dun
... dun...

 

[irishda]

There is one "dragon" you can fight (not the drake). There appears to be a good reason a dragon wasn't included with the rider.

 

[Kungfu_Teddybear]

What the hell has the player been doing? WHY IS HE USING INFANTRY SET versus The Dragonrider?!

Well the Dragonrider was the first boss I killed/ran into in DS2 on my first run, so maybe the same is true for them?

Highly doubtful, the Infantry/Hollow Infantry set is by far worse than even the starting gear unless you're Deprived. Besides it was a joke, also Dragonrider that early? The Old Knights would have been enough of a deterrent I think since you go from fighting enemies with around 250~HP to 900HP.

As a knight starter who used 2h broadsword for a long time (900hp in 8-9 swings), I also went to Heide's tower first and killed The Dragon Rider, then The Old Dragonslayer with the help of some phantoms. The Old Knights are OK except for the hammer wielding one who disappears forever on his first death. Him aside, you can clear the zone without taking a hit just by circling-- not even dodging-- just circling.

I thought The Last Giant was harder than anything in Heide's zone. He took my first life from me!!

OT: This strip isn't moe enough. Needs more Erin. Also, everybody- literally everyone- who's fought that boss has beaten you to the joke. We all said it to ourselves or our viewers before the fight was even over...

Yeah, The Dragonrider isn't even hard. My weapon broke during fighting him and I still beat him on my first attempt. In fact, Heide's tower was the first area I went to after getting to Majula because I didn't notice the path leading to the Forest of Fallen Giants. I never fought the Dragonrider or the The Old Dragonslayer when I first went there, but I killed most of the knights in the starting gear. Then headed back to Majula for something which is when I noticed the path to the forest and went there instead.

 

[AdagioBoognish]

I like how people keep harping on this, but the guy lives just across the way from the DragonSLAYER... I mean, duh?

Oh snap, that makes a lot of sense. This is my first time playing a souls game and I do get the feeling that my character showed up late, with all the epic battles having already been fought years ago.

 

[Ferisar]

I like how people keep harping on this, but the guy lives just across the way from the DragonSLAYER... I mean, duh?

Oh snap, that makes a lot of sense. This is my first time playing a souls game and I do get the feeling that my character showed up late, with all the epic battles having already been fought years ago.

This is the unfortunate truth of Dark Souls. The first one had the same feeling, which is fine since it's what it was going for. (Hell, the last boss of the first game is a very literal exemplification of this). All the events of the world have seemingly gone on and have become either legend or half-forgotten stories, ever crumbling at the stairs of a looming abyss. You're just here to pick up bits and pieces and hope you don't fall along with it.

 

[AdagioBoognish]

I like how people keep harping on this, but the guy lives just across the way from the DragonSLAYER... I mean, duh?

Oh snap, that makes a lot of sense. This is my first time playing a souls game and I do get the feeling that my character showed up late, with all the epic battles having already been fought years ago.

This is the unfortunate truth of Dark Souls. The first one had the same feeling, which is fine since it's what it was going for. (Hell, the last boss of the first game is a very literal exemplification of this). All the events of the world have seemingly gone on and have become either legend or half-forgotten stories, ever crumbling at the stairs of a looming abyss. You're just here to pick up bits and pieces and hope you don't fall along with it.

Do you think the first dark souls did a better job at conveying that feeling? I just feel like a hero from any other game, but I do get the impression I should feel much smaller and insignificant than a hero. Maybe it's the warping around at bonfires and how easy it is to become human again. I could see removing some check points and making it more punishing to be undead would make me feel a bigger sense of urgency and futility.

 

[Zendariel]

I like how people keep harping on this, but the guy lives just across the way from the DragonSLAYER... I mean, duh?

Oh snap, that makes a lot of sense. This is my first time playing a souls game and I do get the feeling that my character showed up late, with all the epic battles having already been fought years ago.

This is the unfortunate truth of Dark Souls. The first one had the same feeling, which is fine since it's what it was going for. (Hell, the last boss of the first game is a very literal exemplification of this). All the events of the world have seemingly gone on and have become either legend or half-forgotten stories, ever crumbling at the stairs of a looming abyss. You're just here to pick up bits and pieces and hope you don't fall along with it.

Do you think the first dark souls did a better job at conveying that feeling? I just feel like a hero from any other game, but I do get the impression I should feel much smaller and insignificant than a hero. Maybe it's the warping around at bonfires and how easy it is to become human again. I could see removing some check points and making it more punishing to be undead would make me feel a bigger sense of urgency and futility.

Personally i did, mostly because of blightown and the swamp following it. I heard that part of the game broke many players and not just because of the frame rate drops. Well not the urgency part, but a feeling of dread and futility when i was lost, cursed and had to traverse poisonous swamp and could not find a way out because i was scared there. It was a great experience back then . But yeah i feel that the safer traversal and there being somehow less places to explore and get lost to, the second game is much easier to navigate. And i feel that alone takes some of the feeling of danger and dread away.If you happen to get to a point that is clearly too dangerous, you can just warp away, or if you feel you don't know how to get back to previous bonfire and you don't know if you can survive the area where you'd lit a new bonfire, you can just warp away.

Compare that to first time in anor londo. If i wanted to get back, i had to survive sen's fortress, without the shortcut because i did not find the key, once i got to the castle proper, i had to find a way out of there because the way that I got in from could not be traversed back, enemies killed me with two hits on average(On average i never start with vitality build, or rarely even putting a single point there. not the best way to start souls games but that is just my usual starting playstyle). The area itself had a huge impact because it was beautiful and the first actually bright place in the game. Or the painted world that got me even more lost and could only be escaped by going through the whole area.

The places i mentioned can't really say anything to you because you haven't played the game but the sen's fortress part is for example way more difficult area than anything before it, it has huge amount of deathtraps and enemies that both hit harder than anything before, take more damage, and you fight them in a more dangerous environment, then to get back after you make it through the area, you would need to go through the same traps and enemies backwards, there are other ways that you probably won't think of when you get there the first time and it is easier to do it backwards, but once you have gone up, going down is a new and possibly quite frightening experience, coupled with the fact that if you go there, you have to be able to come back again the proper way. Again, you could find a shortcut, but there is a good change that you would not.

I could nitpick about some other things that make the game feel slightly inferior to it's predecessor, most of them to have to do with setting and how the world feels compared to the first one. But it is still a great game that i hope to sink countless hours into once i get my hands on the pc version.