Dark Souls 2 invasion system

[TaintedSaint]

I'm on NG++ and still have never been invaded not once.

 

[gigastar]

Your chances of being summoned vary wildly depending on where you leave your sign. Also having 15m+ soul memory raises your chances significantly.

For example, leaving your sign outside a boss room isnt going to get you summoned as often as if you left it at the bonfire nearest to that boss room.

For example, yessterday i was assisting players with NG+ Smelter Demon, and throughout 8 summons there was less than 3 minuites of downtime.

 

[Vrach]

Well shit it's Gears of War 2 all over again. I had no idea people could do that, thanks for the info.

Well, putting aside the fact that the tactic's common knowledge since at least Dark Souls, if not Demon's as well, I've seen it first hand in the BoB arena. A guy walks up to the middle normally, I bow, he waves. I lift my shield a few times to signal we're good for combat, he moves a few steps, then starts visibly lagging and 5 seconds later he's behind me in a backstab with a one-hit-kill weapon. The game allows you to move around and just compensates for the lag by spawning you (from a third person standpoint) to where you're supposed to be according to the client. So it's quite easy to abuse this and just backstab your opponent. It's kind of the ultimate skill-less dick move.

Your chances of being summoned vary wildly depending on where you leave your sign. Also having 15m+ soul memory raises your chances significantly.

I've said this twice before in the above posts, so I'll just sum up:
- Placing a summon sign outside a boss room and waiting on top of the summon sign - wait time=infinite (sign will sooner or later get removed by an invasion that typically comes within 5-10 minutes and there's no chance of getting summoned from my experience)
- Placing a summon sign on the same spot and going inside to prevent an invasion - wait time=2 minutes tops

If it's blues that are your problem, don't sin... If it's reds, I envy you. I wished for some kind of interaction the whole way through, and got none until being a sinner in NG+.

Don't sin is easier said than done. I figured I'd mostly just spend my time PvPing, so I invaded some 100 times or so, probably more. It's gonna take a while until the Blues get my sin level off. I suppose I could just use up my Souls, turn on the game for a day, leave myself in a PvP hotspot and let my character get killed repeatedly. A day of AFKing might get my sin level down to a decent level.

But it feels a bit like a fuck you to the red phantoms. I get that they're seen as dicks mostly, but it's a part of the game and one many find fun (as you yourself said, you wish you would be attacked more by reds... I felt the same way in NG). Meanwhile, you can do the same shit as a blue phantom with no repercussions, only difference being that you need the Tokens from co-op to duel, though in NG+ you can just buy your orbs easily.

 

[gigastar]

Your chances of being summoned vary wildly depending on where you leave your sign. Also having 15m+ soul memory raises your chances significantly.

I've said this twice before in the above posts, so I'll just sum up:
- Placing a summon sign outside a boss room and waiting on top of the summon sign - wait time=infinite (sign will sooner or later get removed by an invasion that typically comes within 5-10 minutes and there's no chance of getting summoned from my experience)
- Placing a summon sign on the same spot and going inside to prevent an invasion - wait time=2 minutes tops

You mean to tell me that you never knew that resting at a bonfire protects you from invasions?

In addition if youve beaten that boss then you can place the sign outside then step into the boss arena, where invasion is impossible.

 

[EHKOS]

Is that why I had to start swatting blue people away every few minutes? Huh, never thought it was connected to NG+. Yeah, that was annoying, I haven't had to deal with it since I started playing Watch Dogs. Speaking of online rage...

 

[demoman_chaos]

I was pissing about at McDuff's trying to figure out what infusions I wanted to make on my weapons and was invaded (this is NG after I long since cleared the area). I handily destroyed them with my Sun Spear (the Sun mother fucka', do you praise it?). Later one I was testing damage output on the first enemy by the first Heide's bonfire on this same character still in NG, and I was invaded in about 1 minute (great magic barrier, dual washing poles each with some buff cast on them).

As a level 60 character, I was raided by a full havel great magic barrier invisible weapon using guy who moved quite quickly and hit me with a powerful lightning attack while at the Huntsman's Copse bonfire under the bridge.

I have had no problem really finding people to summon me as a Sun Bro, save for the time of night I had to play.

 

[Vrach]

You mean to tell me that you never knew that resting at a bonfire protects you from invasions?

It didn't use to in Dark Souls, I know that for sure, your character would just get up from a bonfire when the invasion started. In DS2, I've heard as much, but I've seen on at least one occasion, my character getting up from a bonfire and getting invaded. Could've happened while she was just taking a seat though, but I don't know.

In addition if youve beaten that boss then you can place the sign outside then step into the boss arena, where invasion is impossible.

I know mate, I've said the same thing three times in the above posts, one of which is the one you've quoted when you wrote that.

Is that why I had to start swatting blue people away every few minutes? Huh, never thought it was connected to NG+. Yeah, that was annoying, I haven't had to deal with it since I started playing Watch Dogs. Speaking of online rage...

It's not NG+ exclusive, you'd see it in NG as well if you stood in an invade-able area for a while (while not invading yourself, because it cuts them off). In NG+ however, you can buy the orbs for both the Blues and the Reds, so it takes out the hassle of having to grind them through the Arena, leading to much more invaders sitting in NG+ (you can't get invaded or co-op cross-NG according to the text when you start NG+)

 

[gigastar]

You mean to tell me that you never knew that resting at a bonfire protects you from invasions?

It didn't use to in Dark Souls, I know that for sure, your character would just get up from a bonfire when the invasion started. In DS2, I've heard as much, but I've seen on at least one occasion, my character getting up from a bonfire and getting invaded. Could've happened while she was just taking a seat though, but I don't know.

From what i can tell, the protection becomes active just as the mist effect starts clearing. I left a character sitting at Hiedes for 3 hours and i came back to find him the way i left him.

 

[Vrach]

From what i can tell, the protection becomes active just as the mist effect starts clearing. I left a character sitting at Hiedes for 3 hours and i came back to find him the way i left him.

Yeah, possibly. As I said, I saw it once just as I was sitting down, she sat, got up and the invader message popped up. I usually leave my sign in front of the boss gate though, which worked fine in NG with no invaders, but is impossible if you're a sinner (unless you've beat the boss already and can hide out in his room).

I got the habit from my first playthrough once I've realised that helping someone refreshes your Estuses, gets you back your Humanity and most importantly, repairs your gear (I'm running a Dexterity katana build, so it's a great boost to make sure my weapon doesn't fall apart mid-boss fight)

Which reminds be btw, anyone miss the time when you'd put your sign down at the beginning of the area and help someone all the way through it? I've tried a few times in DS2, but it takes ages to get summoned (compared to placing it in front of the fog gate) and usually it's people who go right for the boss as they've unlocked the shortcuts and the boss is a few mobs away :\

I used to love leading people through an entire area, rather than just help them cheese the bosses. There was something satisfying about showing them the hidden areas, often missed loot, how to avoid traps and such

 

[JagermanXcell]

This is a big issue with Dks2's invasion system and pvp in general.
It goes from being practically empty (NG) to batshit insane (NG+) in the blink of an eye. It's worse when you consider there's no infinite orb in the game. You have to either A. Buy an expensive amount or B. Compete in Dragleic's biggest cheese off for them (arena). I reeeeeally envy reds, cause blues get not only easy to farm blue orbs but the ability to invade any area that has a sinner even when they're not stationed there for invasions. And then there's Soul Memory, where no matter how good or bad you are, it will increase as a punishment for simply playing the game... in which after the 15mil SM mark you WILL get paired with the most cookie cutter high level mofos on the planet, and you will get wrecked...
over and over again. So not only do hosts suffer in the long run, invaders do as well and not by the traditional means you would expect.

I'm not saying a host should absolutely get invaded all the time, but the way this new invasion system is set up, it's simply not fun or as active as it should have been.

Dks1 had it's issues with the invasion system, the main one being twinks. But being invaded while hollow EVER SO RARELY NOW/in such a poorly programmed way of matchmaking, makes me really miss the consistency Dks1 had.
Wasn't this game supposed to be better?
Oh wait, B team.

 

[demoman_chaos]

It didn't use to in Dark Souls, I know that for sure, your character would just get up from a bonfire when the invasion started. In DS2, I've heard as much, but I've seen on at least one occasion, my character getting up from a bonfire and getting invaded. Could've happened while she was just taking a seat though, but I don't know.

I remember clearly in Dark Souls 1 resting at the bonfire just before the Demon Firesage when invaded. I was poking through the menu for something when it booted me out. I was greatly confused as to what was going on. It wouldn't let me rest and my homeward bone was blacked out. I don't remember what happened with the invasion itself (I may have simply quit the game because of how bullshit that was).

 

[garjian]

Meanwhile, you can do the same shit as a blue phantom with no repercussions, only difference being that you need the Tokens from co-op to duel, though in NG+ you can just buy your orbs easily.

Blue phantoms get sin too.

Yes, that is stupid.

 

[Vrach]

Meanwhile, you can do the same shit as a blue phantom with no repercussions, only difference being that you need the Tokens from co-op to duel, though in NG+ you can just buy your orbs easily.

Blue phantoms get sin too.

Yes, that is stupid.

Erm, source? You can get invaded even if you're a Blue Phantom if you're a sinner, but successful kills as a Blue Phantom should not increase sin count (and I can't find it anywhere that it does)

 

[garjian]

Meanwhile, you can do the same shit as a blue phantom with no repercussions, only difference being that you need the Tokens from co-op to duel, though in NG+ you can just buy your orbs easily.

Blue phantoms get sin too.

Yes, that is stupid.

Erm, source? You can get invaded even if you're a Blue Phantom if you're a sinner, but successful kills as a Blue Phantom should not increase sin count (and I can't find it anywhere that it does)

I'm on holiday right now, but in 5 days or so I can easily record a quick clip of a character who has never used Red Eye Orb invading with Blues and becoming a sinner.
Anecdotally I can tell you that each of my Blue Sentinel characters (I tend to choose between BS or BoB based on the character's alignment) have run into an issue at some point where my Blue Eye Orb use is interrupted by a Blue Sentinel. Instances in which I've lost to that invader put me back below the sin level, but after a few invasions it's back to sinner.
This is odd given how sin works, and must mean that not all invasions are giving me sin... but the fact is, Blue Orbs are giving me Sinner status one way or another. I can't find any reference to it online either, but there's no questioning that that's what's been happening to me. The only thing I can think of if it's not the invasions themselves is a bug with poison kills.

I assumed this was normal because nobody I've told has ever seemed surprised, and actually I remember doing blue invasions at the Tower of Flame with a friend recently we both became sinners. I summoned him and he watched me fight some guys as I was trying to show him how much Dagger's (well, Mytha's Blade's) damage varies with armour values (which is ridiculous by the way... it can be as high as 300 or as low as 12, same stats, same weapons).

Geez, I can even remember the first time it happened! It was the first time I ever heard Wacther's Shield's cool bell sound, and that guy was the first person to parry that dual-Dagger character (who was using actual Daggers at the time) and really make me worry about parrying on him. This was a few days after release in Shaded Woods, it was a female character in Watcher's Armour... I don't recall the weapon they were using, but other than that I remember it as clear as day.

No source apparently, just that. If that's not normal, I guess you're right about Blues getting to do the same thing with no punishment either way, so I guess at this point it doesn't really matter... but that's what happens to me.

 

[joest01]

At high enough SM level the wait for an invader in Heide's is close to 0. You can get chain invasions there. Beats getting tokens for the arena.

But I have popped the disc out and retired. Was starting to get the old flame messages from players. I stopped playing Demon's because of the same thing. (for the record: pure melee, no shield, light armor, I am very beatable)

I still think they should completely anonymize pvp. i.e. no players met log. And provide a decent mechanism for tournaments.

 

[Vrach]

At high enough SM level the wait for an invader in Heide's is close to 0. You can get chain invasions there. Beats getting tokens for the arena.

But I have popped the disc out and retired. Was starting to get the old flame messages from players. I stopped playing Demon's because of the same thing. (for the record: pure melee, no shield, light armor, I am very beatable)

I still think they should completely anonymize pvp. i.e. no players met log. And provide a decent mechanism for tournaments.

Try the PC version, I've done a ton of invasions and never got a single message, as you have to add someone on Steam in order to message them

 

[joest01]

At high enough SM level the wait for an invader in Heide's is close to 0. You can get chain invasions there. Beats getting tokens for the arena.

But I have popped the disc out and retired. Was starting to get the old flame messages from players. I stopped playing Demon's because of the same thing. (for the record: pure melee, no shield, light armor, I am very beatable)

I still think they should completely anonymize pvp. i.e. no players met log. And provide a decent mechanism for tournaments.

Try the PC version, I've done a ton of invasions and never got a single message, as you have to add someone on Steam in order to message them

Lol, I spent too many hours of my youth tuning rigs. I stopped playing altogether at some point because it was just so tedious to keep up with the latest games. So I moved to PS3 and voila, smooth sailing On a completely unrelated note, I am leaning more and more Wii U for my next platform. Bayonetta, Xenoblade, Devils Third and lets not forget Razors Edge would not be here without it. Not really sure about the controler though XD

To get back on topic, if you want less invasions lets not forget you can burn effigies as well.

 

[Azure23]

The invasion system is... Kind of pointless. If you want to invade others as a Black Phantom, you gain nothing from doing so, other than a small portion of copied souls from the host, and perhaps a hate-mail from Yours Truly. Not to mention that is is not balanced depending on your Soul Level, but rather your Soul Memory, and the peak stops at 12m+ SM, meaning you can get invaded, or invade, people with 100 more levels than yourself, turning the PvP into a Prank n' Spank.

You could always try and invade someone as a Blue Sentinel, but it can take ages, and you'll most likely find people who fight more desperate than a pack of cornered wolfs and with the strength of oxes. Not exactly your normal preying run. In fact, most of the time, YOU become the prey. Quite counter-intuitive.
Also, the cracked orbs are real expensive, and only made for people in NG++/+, so invading under any earlier time can be a very limited experience.

The only way to fairly invade others is through the Red Soapstone, which acts as a Summoning Sign, meaning it will only reach out to players in your cycle, and of those between 20+ or 20- of your level. You'll only be invading others who WANT you to invade them as well, which is a plus.
It's also the most fun, especially when you put it on the bridge outside Fire Keep. People like to make Arenas there with no rules, just honor and fair judgment . It's the most fun to PvP there imo.

We Blood Brothers invade to spill blood for Nahr Alma! No but seriously pvp is the point, asymmetric pvp to be precise. A humanity would be nice, sure, but really I do it for fun. As for levels, they only do so much and with the incredibly diminished gains at higher levels, a hundred levels does much less than you think. I stick to the level 135-150 range because thats when I feel like a build is properly finished, with pros and cons and options, but if people want boring builds that an do everything in the game I'll gladly rip them apart with my bare hands. If only for the look i imagine a lvl 700 Havel monster has on its face when I've danced around for ten minutes and punched it to death, so satisfying.

I love the souls series pvp and I've tried every facet of it in all three games, from darkwraith to blood brother to sentinel to dragon disciple. It's not counterintuitive when you invade someone's world and they best you, that's just life, sorry if the blood bro sinners give you a harder time than randoms. And by the way, you have to be over the 12 mil point to be invaded by max levelers, and it takes forever to accrue that many through pvp, I should know, I've gotten the same character to rank 3 in both the sentinels and blood brothers and I barely broke nine million. And that's with the ridiculous amount of killing you have to do in those covenants.

I see the word "fairness" bandied about quite a bit in these pvp discussions, and I hate it. I consider myself a fairly honorable player, I always try to bow, or do a character appropriate gesture before the fight begins. But fairness really has absolutely no place outside of the arena, and even then its meant to be fair in that both players can be as cheap with Estus as they want. If I've invaded you, I don't know where you are, if you have phantoms hiding in wait, how willing you are to run away and heal, and I have ten minutes to hunt you down and kill you or else I've wasted either a pvp victory or like ten k souls. I'm going to do my level best to kill you, whether you consider it fair or not. If I've decided that this character uses avelyns (unlikely, they're ugly and I can't find good armor to go with them) then I'm going to shoot you with them and get a good laugh out of the hatemail, with no nevermind given to what you think is cheap. I've hosted fight clubs and participated in some that lasted hours, I've seen builds both creative and unique, and I've seen copy pasted faith and hex/dex builds in the hundreds, at the end of the day we're all getting together to kill each other and have fun. But sometimes honorable fight clubs get stale, sometimes you want to invade and fight people who actually have something on the line, sometimes you just don't want to fight on the iron keep bridge for the seven hundredth time.

You have some real grievances, soul memory is dumb, sure, but its hardly the pvp ruiner you make it out to be, as for the rest, well, "fairness" rubs me the wrong way. It's already a game, there are already rules in place. If I'm invading and not hacking, (which I'm not, buncha dumb bullshit) I'm already playing fair. I can't speak for other pvp fanatics (speak up though) but anytime i hear "fair" in relation to basic mechanics or specifically weapons, i get annoyed.

 

[A-D.]

We Blood Brothers invade to spill blood for Nahr Alma! No but seriously pvp is the point, asymmetric pvp to be precise. A humanity would be nice, sure, but really I do it for fun. As for levels, they only do so much and with the incredibly diminished gains at higher levels, a hundred levels does much less than you think. I stick to the level 135-150 range because thats when I feel like a build is properly finished, with pros and cons and options, but if people want boring builds that an do everything in the game I'll gladly rip them apart with my bare hands. If only for the look i imagine a lvl 700 Havel monster has on its face when I've danced around for ten minutes and punched it to death, so satisfying.

I love the souls series pvp and I've tried every facet of it in all three games, from darkwraith to blood brother to sentinel to dragon disciple. It's not counterintuitive when you invade someone's world and they best you, that's just life, sorry if the blood bro sinners give you a harder time than randoms. And by the way, you have to be over the 12 mil point to be invaded by max levelers, and it takes forever to accrue that many through pvp, I should know, I've gotten the same character to rank 3 in both the sentinels and blood brothers and I barely broke nine million. And that's with the ridiculous amount of killing you have to do in those covenants.

I see the word "fairness" bandied about quite a bit in these pvp discussions, and I hate it. I consider myself a fairly honorable player, I always try to bow, or do a character appropriate gesture before the fight begins. But fairness really has absolutely no place outside of the arena, and even then its meant to be fair in that both players can be as cheap with Estus as they want. If I've invaded you, I don't know where you are, if you have phantoms hiding in wait, how willing you are to run away and heal, and I have ten minutes to hunt you down and kill you or else I've wasted either a pvp victory or like ten k souls. I'm going to do my level best to kill you, whether you consider it fair or not. If I've decided that this character uses avelyns (unlikely, they're ugly and I can't find good armor to go with them) then I'm going to shoot you with them and get a good laugh out of the hatemail, with no nevermind given to what you think is cheap. I've hosted fight clubs and participated in some that lasted hours, I've seen builds both creative and unique, and I've seen copy pasted faith and hex/dex builds in the hundreds, at the end of the day we're all getting together to kill each other and have fun. But sometimes honorable fight clubs get stale, sometimes you want to invade and fight people who actually have something on the line, sometimes you just don't want to fight on the iron keep bridge for the seven hundredth time.

You have some real grievances, soul memory is dumb, sure, but its hardly the pvp ruiner you make it out to be, as for the rest, well, "fairness" rubs me the wrong way. It's already a game, there are already rules in place. If I'm invading and not hacking, (which I'm not, buncha dumb bullshit) I'm already playing fair. I can't speak for other pvp fanatics (speak up though) but anytime i hear "fair" in relation to basic mechanics or specifically weapons, i get annoyed.

The thing is, if its ONLY about winning, then why are you bothering with PvP in the first place? What do you get? A token of spite if you invaded someone, maybe a couple souls, maybe a cracked orb from the arena? So you can repeat this ad infinitum, just to "win"? What do you get from that? Nothing really, you aint proving you are the better player, you aint proving you got more skills, or bigger balls, or how you are so uber-leet-haxxor-epic-skillzor that nobody stands a chance. Thats the ultimate problem with cheap builds, or as you call them "unfair".

Its not really about being fair, PvP isnt. If you are melee and im a caster, well there is no fairness, if i throw a sunlight spear in your face and it hits, you're toast, yes even with GMB, had Havel-scrubs with GMB trying to tank a Lightning DC+5 Sunlight Spear directly, those 1.2k damage didnt sit well with them. Course on the other hand, if you manage to dodge everything and i dont have any good melee options, im dead meat soon enough. Its not a level playing field there at all. However there are builds which are built specifically for the purpose of winning, in the form that requires the least amount of action on your part. If you could make a build, which can hit everything no matter what, do 2k damage per hit and as such kill everyone almost instantly, how is that "good" PvP? Its cheap as fuck, its not even PvP. Again you aint proving anything other than that you would be too lazy to bother actually fighting, and if you cant be bothered to fight, then dont do it at all.

PvP is supposed to be about fun, not about just winning imho. At least i consider it as a side-activity, i dont get mad if i lose, though i get mad if im invaded by the same cheap-ass build 20 times in the same zone, Havelyns, Havelmages, Hextanas, Dual Avelyns etc. Mind you this was before the recent nerf, but the point stands. If all you face is the same thing over and over its just boring and a chore, there is no fun involved, even if you manage to win. At the end of the day, you just beat Havel-scrub #2824812, whats the point? Also its 15 million, thats the last tier, which presents its own problem because if im 1 point over 15 million, some level 800 dude can now invade me, brilliant. Yes the benefit is less after the softcaps, but there is still a difference between having 99 STR or 40 for example even if the difference is very small, there should be more tiers at least.

FROM is taking steps in the right direction by at least balancing some things so its not utterly broken and everyone is using the same build. I rather fight 20 invaders with unique builds and lose, than fight one more invader thats just another build i've killed in the thousands and win. Plus i expect some basic decency from people. If i invade you, im at least going to bow, im not attacking you instantly, i'd love if people gave me the same courtesy (some actually do). I even on occasion guided an invader to a better PvP spot which worked well for both of us, instead of fighting cheaply in a tight hallway where i had the advantage due to using a spear.

 

[joest01]

The invasion system is... Kind of pointless. If you want to invade others as a Black Phantom, you gain nothing from doing so, other than a small portion of copied souls from the host, and perhaps a hate-mail from Yours Truly. Not to mention that is is not balanced depending on your Soul Level, but rather your Soul Memory, and the peak stops at 12m+ SM, meaning you can get invaded, or invade, people with 100 more levels than yourself, turning the PvP into a Prank n' Spank.

You could always try and invade someone as a Blue Sentinel, but it can take ages, and you'll most likely find people who fight more desperate than a pack of cornered wolfs and with the strength of oxes. Not exactly your normal preying run. In fact, most of the time, YOU become the prey. Quite counter-intuitive.
Also, the cracked orbs are real expensive, and only made for people in NG++/+, so invading under any earlier time can be a very limited experience.

The only way to fairly invade others is through the Red Soapstone, which acts as a Summoning Sign, meaning it will only reach out to players in your cycle, and of those between 20+ or 20- of your level. You'll only be invading others who WANT you to invade them as well, which is a plus.
It's also the most fun, especially when you put it on the bridge outside Fire Keep. People like to make Arenas there with no rules, just honor and fair judgment . It's the most fun to PvP there imo.

We Blood Brothers invade to spill blood for Nahr Alma! No but seriously pvp is the point, asymmetric pvp to be precise. A humanity would be nice, sure, but really I do it for fun. As for levels, they only do so much and with the incredibly diminished gains at higher levels, a hundred levels does much less than you think. I stick to the level 135-150 range because thats when I feel like a build is properly finished, with pros and cons and options, but if people want boring builds that an do everything in the game I'll gladly rip them apart with my bare hands. If only for the look i imagine a lvl 700 Havel monster has on its face when I've danced around for ten minutes and punched it to death, so satisfying.

I love the souls series pvp and I've tried every facet of it in all three games, from darkwraith to blood brother to sentinel to dragon disciple. It's not counterintuitive when you invade someone's world and they best you, that's just life, sorry if the blood bro sinners give you a harder time than randoms. And by the way, you have to be over the 12 mil point to be invaded by max levelers, and it takes forever to accrue that many through pvp, I should know, I've gotten the same character to rank 3 in both the sentinels and blood brothers and I barely broke nine million. And that's with the ridiculous amount of killing you have to do in those covenants.

I see the word "fairness" bandied about quite a bit in these pvp discussions, and I hate it. I consider myself a fairly honorable player, I always try to bow, or do a character appropriate gesture before the fight begins. But fairness really has absolutely no place outside of the arena, and even then its meant to be fair in that both players can be as cheap with Estus as they want. If I've invaded you, I don't know where you are, if you have phantoms hiding in wait, how willing you are to run away and heal, and I have ten minutes to hunt you down and kill you or else I've wasted either a pvp victory or like ten k souls. I'm going to do my level best to kill you, whether you consider it fair or not. If I've decided that this character uses avelyns (unlikely, they're ugly and I can't find good armor to go with them) then I'm going to shoot you with them and get a good laugh out of the hatemail, with no nevermind given to what you think is cheap. I've hosted fight clubs and participated in some that lasted hours, I've seen builds both creative and unique, and I've seen copy pasted faith and hex/dex builds in the hundreds, at the end of the day we're all getting together to kill each other and have fun. But sometimes honorable fight clubs get stale, sometimes you want to invade and fight people who actually have something on the line, sometimes you just don't want to fight on the iron keep bridge for the seven hundredth time.

You have some real grievances, soul memory is dumb, sure, but its hardly the pvp ruiner you make it out to be, as for the rest, well, "fairness" rubs me the wrong way. It's already a game, there are already rules in place. If I'm invading and not hacking, (which I'm not, buncha dumb bullshit) I'm already playing fair. I can't speak for other pvp fanatics (speak up though) but anytime i hear "fair" in relation to basic mechanics or specifically weapons, i get annoyed.

Without "Fairness" what do you get from your wins? If there are no rules to keep it balanced why bother. What I really read in your post is that you enjoy ganking on PVE players and they should shut up about it already.

p.s. how do you "try" to bow. I bow. If I die in the process so be it. I also bow at the end. No "character appropriate" gestures here. Well, except if you spammed estus on me I might shake my finger. But I usually die first because I just sigh and put the controller aside.