Darksiders
- Thread starter Yahtzee Croshaw
- Start date
I doubt it with the bows. Ever seen an archer in plate mail? It's a bit inhibitive of the dexterity needed to really utilize the weapon.s69-5 said:
When I booted up the game, I thought War looked like some sort of WoW reject. Especially when you get the flaming horse. Also he does have a really tiny head, its like the equivelent of parking a Smart Car in between a fleet of Hummers
While a lot of people here seem to think that WH40k is the same, i dont think it is. The out of proportion space marine armor does actually have a reason for being that way. The crazy eyes and other improbable stuff on chaos armor does have a reason for being that way, they are mutations by the chaos gods. The large amount of skull decorations on khorne warriors are there for a reason. The human soldier uniforms are all about practicality. The dark elf spiky armour is not practical but is there to inflict terror, and it also serves to distinguish from other races. Its not fair to compare warhammer to this.
Its true that most of the stuff is there to just be "awesome" but its not a random mess of angry faces and huge swords slapped together on a huge body, there is actual design philosophy behind them.
Its true that most of the stuff is there to just be "awesome" but its not a random mess of angry faces and huge swords slapped together on a huge body, there is actual design philosophy behind them.
Oh. My. God.
I'm not gonna lie here, War from Darksiders, from that pic looks like someone went apeshit with a male blood elf model, Arthas gear, some stuff not in the game, and a layer of some rogue's clothing all meshed together. If not WoW he looks like some other MMO character belonging to some guy who like most, care more about stats than what his character looks like and was forced to wear that crap. Other thoughts entail him looking alot like an assassin warrior robot with an absurdly large body and an apatite for creatine. If that's spelled right.
Now that I think about it though... if you took away the metal forearms and meaty hands that can't open doors, and the absurd amounts of gold trim and hood and hairdo, or just the hood, hairdo, and absurd amounts of gold trim, he might actually look alright. Maybe I can come to that conclusion because back when I used to play WoW I had a fire mage that looked attractive because after level 80 and a certain amount of dungeons, clothes start matching for some odd reason, then I had a male blood elf paladin in almost that exact same outfit at one point. Only thing is... he looked somewhat alright because of a certain shield and a manlier haircut... without looking like the guy that will become Left 4 Dead's tank when the infection comes.
I rambled. Now I forgot what I was originally gonna talk about. Oh, right, more rambling.
I guess I should be glad that Borderlands doesn't have outfits for this very reason. Besides, everyone knows the game's gun pron. Who cares about the people and how they dress?
I'm not gonna lie here, War from Darksiders, from that pic looks like someone went apeshit with a male blood elf model, Arthas gear, some stuff not in the game, and a layer of some rogue's clothing all meshed together. If not WoW he looks like some other MMO character belonging to some guy who like most, care more about stats than what his character looks like and was forced to wear that crap. Other thoughts entail him looking alot like an assassin warrior robot with an absurdly large body and an apatite for creatine. If that's spelled right.
Now that I think about it though... if you took away the metal forearms and meaty hands that can't open doors, and the absurd amounts of gold trim and hood and hairdo, or just the hood, hairdo, and absurd amounts of gold trim, he might actually look alright. Maybe I can come to that conclusion because back when I used to play WoW I had a fire mage that looked attractive because after level 80 and a certain amount of dungeons, clothes start matching for some odd reason, then I had a male blood elf paladin in almost that exact same outfit at one point. Only thing is... he looked somewhat alright because of a certain shield and a manlier haircut... without looking like the guy that will become Left 4 Dead's tank when the infection comes.
I rambled. Now I forgot what I was originally gonna talk about. Oh, right, more rambling.
I guess I should be glad that Borderlands doesn't have outfits for this very reason. Besides, everyone knows the game's gun pron. Who cares about the people and how they dress?
A lot of amateur character designs make this mistake- they go for what "looks cool" or "hardcore" and forget about "flow". Interesting character design will tell a story about the character- where he's been, what he does, how he views himself and the world. War, on the other hand, looks like the following conversation took place:
Boss: "Alright, gentlemen, we need to create the personification of conflict here. What stylistic angle should we take here?"
Employee A: "Well, we have a lot of room for expression here, how about a very physically-strong medival-themed character, worn down over the ages, face set with the sureity of purpose yet showing the conflict of his juxtaposition- a being who is the essence of strife, seeking to mend what came about from his very own actions."
Employee B: "Dude, you are SUCH an English major. Boss, we need to pile armor on this guy. Lots of armor! With, like, faces and stuff. And make it, like, mismatched, because he just doesn't care, you know? He's WAR. And a huge sword, because everyone knows you're an asskicker when you carry around a sword bigger than an airplane wing. And give him a hood so he's all shadowed and mysterious."
Boss: "We'll go with that! It'll be a hit with the kids."
Boss: "Alright, gentlemen, we need to create the personification of conflict here. What stylistic angle should we take here?"
Employee A: "Well, we have a lot of room for expression here, how about a very physically-strong medival-themed character, worn down over the ages, face set with the sureity of purpose yet showing the conflict of his juxtaposition- a being who is the essence of strife, seeking to mend what came about from his very own actions."
Employee B: "Dude, you are SUCH an English major. Boss, we need to pile armor on this guy. Lots of armor! With, like, faces and stuff. And make it, like, mismatched, because he just doesn't care, you know? He's WAR. And a huge sword, because everyone knows you're an asskicker when you carry around a sword bigger than an airplane wing. And give him a hood so he's all shadowed and mysterious."
Boss: "We'll go with that! It'll be a hit with the kids."
That picture is so unutterably horrible that it's a wonder I haven't had nightmares about it yet.s69-5 said:Oh Snap!The Great JT said:
Liefeld is the worst comic book artist to have ever been given a major comic book contract.
there should be a second head growing out of Caps shoulders
Has anyone here seen the Abyssal Armor set War can get in the game? Anyone?
It looks far better and it flows together much better.
It looks far better and it flows together much better.
Wow... just... that picture is physically impossible. No ones chest can extend that far out, even after years upon years of intense weight lifting. Look up Marcus Ruhl. That dude is huge and his chest isn't even that huge.The Rogue Wolf said:A lot of amateur character designs make this mistake- they go for what "looks cool" or "hardcore" and forget about "flow". Interesting character design will tell a story about the character- where he's been, what he does, how he views himself and the world. War, on the other hand, looks like the following conversation took place:
Boss: "Alright, gentlemen, we need to create the personification of conflict here. What stylistic angle should we take here?"
Employee A: "Well, we have a lot of room for expression here, how about a very physically-strong medival-themed character, worn down over the ages, face set with the sureity of purpose yet showing the conflict of his juxtaposition- a being who is the essence of strife, seeking to mend what came about from his very own actions."
Employee B: "Dude, you are SUCH an English major. Boss, we need to pile armor on this guy. Lots of armor! With, like, faces and stuff. And make it, like, mismatched, because he just doesn't care, you know? He's WAR. And a huge sword, because everyone knows you're an asskicker when you carry around a sword bigger than an airplane wing. And give him a hood so he's all shadowed and mysterious."
Boss: "We'll go with that! It'll be a hit with the kids."
That picture is so unutterably horrible that it's a wonder I haven't had nightmares about it yet.s69-5 said:Oh Snap!The Great JT said:
Liefeld is the worst comic book artist to have ever been given a major comic book contract.
there should be a second head growing out of Caps shoulders
Perhaps Valve got it right, but I hesitate to say perfect.
I don't think anyone deserves that kind of praise, even them, with all of their skill and wonderfulness.
The character (War, that is) does come across as some what of an enigma to me.
Why's he got screaming souls all over his armour?
Why does his sword look like an angry man has been frozen by Darth Vader and pressed into a sword?
Over all, I think he might have worked out better as an entirley inhuman character.
After all, why would angels, humans and a being of ultimate carnage all look roughly the same?
Surely he would be some kind of being comprised of energies pulled from the universe, pure and innocent in that his one purpose is to follow orders?
He actually does look like a mash of Chritian cliches about demonic/apocalyptic entities at this point in time and that makes me sad, because he could've been a lot more.
I don't think anyone deserves that kind of praise, even them, with all of their skill and wonderfulness.
The character (War, that is) does come across as some what of an enigma to me.
Why's he got screaming souls all over his armour?
Why does his sword look like an angry man has been frozen by Darth Vader and pressed into a sword?
Over all, I think he might have worked out better as an entirley inhuman character.
After all, why would angels, humans and a being of ultimate carnage all look roughly the same?
Surely he would be some kind of being comprised of energies pulled from the universe, pure and innocent in that his one purpose is to follow orders?
He actually does look like a mash of Chritian cliches about demonic/apocalyptic entities at this point in time and that makes me sad, because he could've been a lot more.
I tend to like intricately detailed designs (like some of H. R. Giger or Yoshitaka Amano's art), but in this case I do wish that War looked a bit simpler in order to look better at the distance you're usually seeing him and had much more of a consistent motif and color scheme. The only part I like unreservedly is his big hand, because I like big metal hands with lots of moving parts (they appeal to my love of both anatomy and machinery, especially of the clockwork variety).
Not that it matters, but his big hand is asymetrical because it's artificial. War was being an idiot and breaking things, so Death cut his hand off and War had to get a new one. This was in the book that came with the preorder and is essentially useless trivia except for maybe making war look a little silly (although I suppose the point of this thread is that he already does).
Not that it matters, but his big hand is asymetrical because it's artificial. War was being an idiot and breaking things, so Death cut his hand off and War had to get a new one. This was in the book that came with the preorder and is essentially useless trivia except for maybe making war look a little silly (although I suppose the point of this thread is that he already does).
I should probably have this "Yahtzee Intro to Character Design" printed and taped to my desk. Nice little reminder of keeping things basic, but also using symbolism.
Also, I have a Twitter too. Really has no point, unless you're super cool and famous.
Also, I have a Twitter too. Really has no point, unless you're super cool and famous.
clusterfuck gear can work in certain situations. in world of warcraft you know what each piece of your stupid outfit is, where you got it, and why you have it on. in an mmo that shit works because it's trophies, memories, and decisions. in a linear action game it's just "cuz i thought it was cool"
Also everyone check out this guy's blog, entire thing is dedicated to the same subject and explores it more thoroughly.
http://designreboot.blogspot.com/
Also everyone check out this guy's blog, entire thing is dedicated to the same subject and explores it more thoroughly.
http://designreboot.blogspot.com/
Very good points. I suppose I could play devil's advocate here and go on about how War is thousands of years old and all that crap could have some meaning, but that design is just too much.
I won't join twitter for you though. Not you, not Mythbusters, not even Eddie Izzard will get me to join.
I won't join twitter for you though. Not you, not Mythbusters, not even Eddie Izzard will get me to join.
Oh contraire, In Warhammer many parties have resorted to melee combat for whatever reason, so that is why it makes sense. I dont see any "symbolic contents" it seems to like like you're just trying to be conceited. Again you try to say that something in which you have claims is "incoherent and varied", you clearly do not realize the stupididty in this, as I have already pointed out that you have no standing to be able to make such a claim. Perhaps you need to choose your words more carefully.Shamanic Rhythm said:You're missing the point. In fantasy you do rely on suspension of disbelief, but that's created by symbolically linking the concepts of the fantasy world with concepts from our own. In the case of Warhammer 40k, for instance, the Space Marines continue to use swords because they're being associated with historical factions such as the Knights Templar. The point Yahtzee is making here is that the symbolic concepts (assuming they are intentional, and the guy didn't simply draw randomly) behind War's character design are too incoherent and varied to present a clear picture to the audience.ostro-whiskey said:
Fantasy isn't simply a license to do whatever you like and be justified in doing so. What you are thinking of is postmodernism
I never said Fantasy is a liscence to do whatever you want, you are putting words in my mouth, I said the concept behind trying to find fault in the design and practicality of items in a Fantasy world is absolutely stupid.
And had Yahtzee simply claimed that the armor is ridiculous from a technical point of view I wouldnt have said anything, but as usual he cant stop himself from trying to look like an over qualified smartass.Parallel Streaks said:
Ill use whatever word I want consarnit.
I think the character design is a bit ridiculous, but I can't help but enjoy the game play its like Zelda, but more kick ass since they added the violence from God of war. If you have ever wanted more blood in Zelda or a God of War game without the shittiest camera angles in game history then you should try Darksiders.
I keep seeing people trying to make the excuse for War having the complicated design because "He's the embodiment of War", but take a look at Kratos in his War armor.
He became a GOD of WAR, and his armor is surprisingly simplistic. Sure it's still very detailed, but compare it to the horseman War and you'd think that Kratos was still wearing just the skirt and sandals he had from his first game. Kratos is stylin' in that armor, War just seems to have slapped on whatever he thought looked cool.
He became a GOD of WAR, and his armor is surprisingly simplistic. Sure it's still very detailed, but compare it to the horseman War and you'd think that Kratos was still wearing just the skirt and sandals he had from his first game. Kratos is stylin' in that armor, War just seems to have slapped on whatever he thought looked cool.