David Goyer Says Warner Bros Has No Plans For Cohesive DC Universe

[hermes]

Weren't they making a Superman vs. Batman movie with Wonder Woman in it?

Yeah... They even moved it from "We are not trying to copy Marvel. We are our own thing..." to "We are out of ideas, out of faith and we want their money, so we are just going to compete with them in the most obvious way possible"

http://theweek.com/article/index/259499/speedreads-captain-america-3-and-batman-vs-superman-are-scheduled-to-come-out-on-the-same-day

 

[Hairless Mammoth]

It might not help that in DCs last ten years in of cinema only the Christopher Nolan Batman movies where even comparable in quality to Marvel's(except the Fantastic Four movies). It's possible to do pull it off but very hard to merge the movie 'verses of horrible films into one people will pay to see. They could make a Justice League movie right now or make it after releasing more individual hero's movies with no connection to the universe of each other of the JL movie.

Green Lantern was horrible. Both Superman movies were major let downs, with Man of Steel kinda ruining the righteous good guy who doesn't kill persona Supes had. Even Dark Knight Rises wasn't as well received as its predecessor(high standard there though). Just looking at DC list of recent films this past decade compared to Marvel is extremely slim(9 films counting Catwoman, Watchmen and Jonah Hex; compared to Marvels 12 not counting the 4 Spidermans, 2 Ghostriders, 2 FF4s, 2 Punishers, a Blade and Elektra. So 9 versus 24 cinema releases from 2004 to 2014.)They don't got the ammo to compete with Marvel because the sat and let opportunities slide while rushing poor scripts for major characters like Catwoman and Green Lantern out to be shot(regrettably with a camera not a flamethrower).

They could make a great stand alone Justice movie right now, but they're too scared the general movie audience won't recognize the characters and therefore not risk the $10 on it. I'd say they're either trying to copy Marvel but going slow(See the Batman and Superman with Wonder Woman movie coming soon along with their poor box office history I just typed), someone is trying but another group in the company is blocking it since they think they know how to make good movies(while wondering why people like them Marvel movies so much).

As long as they stop the damn reboots and origin stories, I don't care as long as DC gets their heads out of their collective ass. Have them gloss over the bad movies and build on the character's rich history without destroying the foundation and spending 100 minutes on screen pouring a new one. Wonder Woman can have flash backs occasionally to the time when she was Princess of the Amazons(well she still is but you know). Martian Manhunter can tell the other heroes how he became the last of his kind. Everyone is well aware that Bruce Wayne's parents were shot by a mugger when he was a kid. Man of Steel could have had Supes already stopping runaway trains and catching failing jets before Zod's crew dropped in for a dance with one scene with Jor-El quickly saying "me dad, you alien, planet dead, they bad." Likewise, Sony didn't need to reboot Spidey. All they had to do was throw in a couple flashbacks and a few lines about Peter being bit by a radiated spider while in the Lizard's lab and kick off the plot after Spidey already was in the public eye.

 

[Leonardo Huizar]

OR heres a silly idea... Just let Marvel & Disney's movies studios make the movies. Its not like both comic companies dont trade editors, writers, & artists. But pride and looking weak and the dozens of stuck in the past license holders of DC's hero properties etc etc.

 

[Ldude893]

You know, two years ago I had almost zero interest in the Marvel universe aside from a bit of Spider-Man. I was more familiar with DC superheroes from cartoons and comics, and I had almost no knowledge or interest in anything related to Marvel. In fact, I didn't even want to watch The Avengers when it came out because I wasn't familiar with any of the characters, but at least two weeks before it was pulled from theaters, I changed my mind and watched all four existing Marvel films (aside from The Hulk movies) before watching Marvel's crossover.

It took approximately one week for me to become a fan of Marvel superheroes. One, fucking, week. With the exception of maybe Iron Man 2, all it took was some great movies that relied on good storytelling and characters, and not on the fact that everyone watching had read the comics beforehand.

The only reason why Warner Brothers is pushing for a Justice League movie is because they think they could cash in their own superhero crossover, but all I see is a brash kid trying to copy another kid's class project with little planning, LOTS of bad decision making, and no idea on what made the project so great in the first place.

 

[008Zulu_v1legacy]

I wonder, what was behind the decision not to make a cohesive storyline like Marvel; Too much hard work? Perhaps they are stuck in the pre-Marvel mindset that people don't want a unified experience because it would be too confusing.

 

[RJ 17]

Personally I think that DC should keep on keepin' on with their track record of one-off movies and not try to tie into some big grand universe.

At least that way they can avoid the obvious trap of "Where the hell are the other super heroes when all this is going down?"

 

[V4Viewtiful]

DC has been sort off all over the place. chasing fads and trends... I mean look at new 52?

You should advise them not to.

Anyway, I watched The Winter Soldier Yesterday, I got to see the Falcon in a film for the first time, I bet no one out side of omics who are the majority of the audience knew who he was but Marvel actually went for it and made it work well. We are getting Guardian's of the Galaxy, one of Marvel's most obscure team this summer.

We will never see a movie with the New Gods, Doom Patrol or even Teen Titan's because DC's film division have no vision. Man of Steel is proof of that, "The Dark Knight was successful lets see the same approach with Superman even though it doesn't suit the genre or tone"

Ugh, and as for Goyer, he may have to jumble the plot thanks to outside sources but he can't be excused for the often stupid dialogue (and using Lois even though there's clearly no need). ¬_¬

 

[JET1971]

The thing about the Marvel universe all having tie ins to each other that I like is it is not required to have intimate knowledge of the other movies. You can watch the Thor movies and enjoy them and never see an iron man movie. Having the whole universe being connected is simply the icing on the cake for those that do watch them all. I cannot see that coming from DC because they keep trying to rebrand well known brands into something they are not.

There is also how the comics have always been done. DC had lots of different worlds that didn't have any real sense of connection to one another. Supermans world feels different than Batmans and trying to shoehorn Superman into Gotham city would feel just wrong, Batmans world is dark and gritty while Supermans is bright and new. Then you have The Justice League which feels like an entirely different world than the ones each hero had come from. It feels like that because they were all completely unrelated until The Justice league was started. Marvel on the other hand has always felt like they all belonged to the same universe, there was no need to remake the universe for The Avengers.

 

[Daaaah Whoosh]

Yeah, they probably scrapped the idea for a cohesive movie universe right about the time they realized having so many setups for a sequel in the Green Lantern movie was a bad idea.

 

[1337mokro]

Fire these people. They will kill your business Warner.

There's not allot of brand loyalty? Is this man insane? Yes there's not allot of brand loyalty for the grim dark Nolan superman, but might I remind you of a little company called Disney? They basically bought your competitor based solely on the billions it's making with the movies based on characters that supposedly have no brand loyalty.

If you actually make the character people want to see. That's when you get loyalty. Not when you turn loose the Nolan and combine it with the lens flare guy.

Seriously here's the formula. Create an over arching universe story that is extremely basic, but allows for enough creative direction so that the movies can converge on a single point. Then make movies based on the characters and try to capture the essence of that character as closely as possible, don't bother with the modernization or any of that nonsense, sometimes the corniness is what is required of the hero.

Make em distinct and actually stand for something. What you don't want is fans choking on their popcorn as Papa Kent tells Clark to "Let them die" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Swvf3w6hcY4

Brand loyalty exists for brands, you have to understand something different... you are more than a brand. You are the new gods. Everyone has heard of these characters. Everyone. There is not a person in this world that does not recognize the characters you have. There is no need to appeal to the audience. Make the movie and they will come. Make a universe and they will stay.

 

[faefrost]

Creating a cohesive all inclusive universe is hard? Hmmm? Maybe DC's first best call would be to get rid of contributors like Mr. Goyer and make a phone call to the nice people making Arrow? Or how about simply giving Bruce Timm and Paul Dini a call?

 

[shogunblade]

Directed? Goyer is the screenwriter he is writing the script for Sandman.

Goyer's writing credits.

Death Warrant (1990)
Demonic Toys (1992)
The Puppet Masters (1994)
The Crow: City of Angels (1996)
Dark City (1998)
Blade (1998)
Zig Zag (2002)
Blade II (2002)
Blade: Trinity (2004)
Puppet Master vs Demonic Toys (2004)
Batman Begins (2005) story and screenplay
Jumper (2008)
The Dark Knight (2008) story
The Unborn (2009)
Ghost Rider: Spirit of Vengeance (2012) story
The Dark Knight Rises (2012) story
Man of Steel (2013)

I wish there was a way to isolate parts of scripts so you could see who provided the most influence for what, because I have a hard time believing Goyer has that much talent to write movie scripts. A lot of those movies are written not just by him, but other people. I can't find what his influences are in a lot of movies, except that he writes a lot of sci-fi, but Dark City which I love and own, is more complex than anything he can really write.

OT: I almost think a DC universe movie would not and should not be made. Warner Brothers is behind on a lot of this, yes, but trying to follow the herd just won't work. Without giving us another Batman (If Superman V. Batman is anything to go by), and completely affecting the stories and ideas, I just don't know how it will work and be enjoyable or even any good. I could be wrong, I still want to see Lex Luthor played by Jesse Eisenberg to work, but a Justice League movie shouldn't be made, and setting it up to that inevitable conclusion is a bad idea.

 

[Vault101]

Weren't they making a Superman vs. Batman movie with Wonder Woman in it?

I guess putting her in their movie would be a nice cop out...cause no one knows who Wonder Woman is

 

[J Tyran]

Make em distinct and actually stand for something. What you don't want is fans choking on their popcorn as Papa Kent tells Clark to "Let them die" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Swvf3w6hcY4

I wont defend the films flaws but this isn't one of them, this is a problem with the audience not the film. "Maybe" is not the same as "let them die", its saying "I don't know" or "I don't have any answers for you Clark". The film isn't responsible for the lack of audience comprehension, seriously who would have the answers to something like that? Anyone pretending to would be arrogant or conceited, a young boy that is becoming invincible, doesn't need to breath and strong enough to lift a bus? How could you know what to do? Saving the kids seems obvious but if Clark was a normal kid they might well have all died anyway and the cost of Clark becoming exposed don't bear thinking about.

People could actually die, religious people would go crazy with some calling a messiah with others calling him a daemon or Antichrist and there would be riots and conflicts because of it. If the government got hold of him first he might have to face imprisonment, attempts at torture and dissection and might have to kill to escape it. His parents would disappear into the deepest blackest hole the government had because they hid him and the space craft.

So yeah, "maybe" isn't "let them die".

 

[Vault101]

What the fuck? No brand loyalty? The super hero comic book Industry LIVES on brand loyalty

 

[Johnny Novgorod]

Weren't they making a Superman vs. Batman movie with Wonder Woman in it?

I guess putting her in their movie would be a nice cop out...cause no one knows who Wonder Woman is

That's irony right? She's the most recognizable comic book superheroine in the world.

 

[Vault101]

That's irony right? She's the most recognizable comic book superheroine in the world.

BUT WHO WOULD WANT TO WATCH A MOVIE ABOUT HER HUH? HUH?

comicbook fans? all the poeple who went and saw thor/avengers/man of steel/dark knight/spider man/captain america/iron man

get in the real world man...

 

[Sarge034]

"You have to admire what Marvel's done," he continues. "It's really hard to create a brand, I mean, where people will follow your brand. Pixar's done it, and now Marvel has done it. It's really, really hard to do, because there's not a lot of brand loyalty anymore."

No, not really. Just give us a brand worth following. Also, if WB doesn't want to make the planet loads of money that Marvel is with a cohesive universe that is their prerogative. Now excuse me as I plan when to see Captain America: The Winter Soldier and geek out over the teaser at the end.