Dead or Alive 5 Director: A Lot of Fans Want Bigger Breasts

[Chiave]

So I get an infraction for referring to the people bitching about the game, who also don't play the game, as "pieces of shit."

Creepy pervs who play creepy perv games want more creepy perv content? Shocking.

At this rate I'm surprised Dead or Alive isn't just outright porn. It's more offensive than most of it out there already, that's for sure, and is insulting to the intelligence of fans and gamers by pandering in such a gross and stereotypical fashion. Might as well just cut out the whole "game" thing.

But it's okay to refer to the people who actually play and enjoy this game as "creepy pervs."

What's up with the selective reasoning mods? I've seen this hypocrisy occur in several topics now.

Are there actual guidelines to moderation on this forum? Or is it just based on political correctness?

 

[Grahav]

This news story and the accompanying comments are a fine example of the result of the changes to both the Escapist as a site and its community.

Gamasutra's title for this article was Team Ninja Learns to Fear its Fans. The Escapist summary of the Gamasutra article titled Dead or Alive 5 Director: A Lot of Fans Want Bigger Breasts.

It's like the summary of a news paper article being written for a tabloid for the purpose of causing an inflamed response. On the internet we call that behavior trolling.

And to the comment writers a little reading comprehension would tell you the feedback they were getting was about the alpha demo that was played by a few invited fans of DoA mainly pro gamers who played DoA competitively. If you were to really look into all the feed back those fans gave they also told Team Ninja to keep the 4-way counter system instead of going to a 3-way counter system.

Their fans only told them their game filled a niche in the market and that there was no reason for them to walk away from that because of people who don't play their game won't like it.

"If there wasn't a need for it, people wouldn't have responded to the alpha demo like they did, and send us feedback."

And by the way the Alpha Demo was toned down from usual aesthetic so no fans didn't want bigger breast they just didn't like the smaller ones of the Alpha demo. In other words fans didn't want Team Ninja to change the game because of feedback from non-DoA players.

The Escapist does that against any game that contains fanservice. They never addressed the launching of Skullgirls.

I like it here, but that particular characteristic is very irritating.

There are gamers like me and this guy here. We like fanservice and we don't hate women.

 

[Grahav]

So I get an infraction for referring to the people bitching about the game, who also don't play the game, as "pieces of shit."

Creepy pervs who play creepy perv games want more creepy perv content? Shocking.

At this rate I'm surprised Dead or Alive isn't just outright porn. It's more offensive than most of it out there already, that's for sure, and is insulting to the intelligence of fans and gamers by pandering in such a gross and stereotypical fashion. Might as well just cut out the whole "game" thing.

But it's okay to refer to the people who actually play and enjoy this game as "creepy pervs."

What's up with the selective reasoning mods? I've seen this hypocrisy occur in several topics now.

Are there actual guidelines to moderation on this forum? Or is it just based on political correctness?

There is A LOT of political correctness now on these forums and it basically boils down to the escapist being successful as a site. The more people come to it the more forum mods they need as volunteers and the more restrictions required to protect the more sensitive people who visit this site to prevent the site from getting a bad reputation.

I remember right as the Zero punctuation wave that I was part of you could have a very heated debate with swear words and all and not get in any trouble. Today? Good luck cause now moderators are basically given the broadest of powers to punish and the guidelines are so broad that they can basically enforce their moral standards upon others. So if you make an insult at someone and call them a ***** you can get reported.

Not to mention how many people actually abuse the report function by being so passive aggressive that they bait a person into breaking those nebulous guidelines and not actually get reported. Remember that moderators aren't supposed to care why and how the events lead up to your reported post, their job is to only judge if your post is against the rules. It's basically that shit zero tolerance policy where doesn't matter who started the fight, everyone just gets punished.

And that is why 4chan and youtube comments are necessary nowadays.

Kind of sad that the balance is obtained by having two extremes slaughtering each other instead of actual harmony.

But, to be fair, once I had a very enlightining dialogue in youtube about transgenders in that Poison documentary video.

 

[Xanadu84]

If you ask a bunch of boys and young men if they want larger breasts, they are going to say yes because they don't want to sound gay. They will continue to say yes long past the point of absurdity, and well into the realm where the breasts are grotesque and unappealing. Team Ninja is already a little bit over that cusp, trending away from a normal desire for large breasts and into the realm of creepy fetish. It is time to excersize a little artist control. Yes, listening to fans is great, but if they knew as much as you do about making games, they would be making the games that you are competing with. DOA will always be psuedo-porn, sure. But make the breasts a little smaller, and your characters will look better. Focus groups do not get what the group wants, they get a lowest common denominator. And honestly, I want my psuedo-porn to be better then that. Hot chicks? GREAT! But self-parody is not great.

 

[acosn]

Sex sells, news at six.

 

[Action Jack]

"What it means to be part of the series?"

But it sounds like he's talking about Ninja Gaiden's failure, not Dead or Alive.

And last I checked, IRENE DIDN'T HAVE MASSIVE TITS.

 

[Darks63]

I'm not gonna be interested in this series until they add a mechanic where said large breasts fly up and smack the fighters in the face cause Self damage making it possible to do self K.O.s.

 

[Riobux]

"We actually got a lot of feedback from people who were playing it, saying, 'We want bigger breasts. Make the characters more like that.' That was kind of surprising."

And this is why we can't have nice things.

large breasts are nice things.

You know what works too? Porn.

 

[Xanadu84]

If you ask a bunch of boys and young men if they want larger breasts, they are going to say yes because they don't want to sound gay. They will continue to say yes long past the point of absurdity, and well into the realm where the breasts are grotesque and unappealing. Team Ninja is already a little bit over that cusp, trending away from a normal desire for large breasts and into the realm of creepy fetish. It is time to excersize a little artist control. Yes, listening to fans is great, but if they knew as much as you do about making games, they would be making the games that you are competing with. DOA will always be psuedo-porn, sure. But make the breasts a little smaller, and your characters will look better. Focus groups do not get what the group wants, they get a lowest common denominator. And honestly, I want my psuedo-porn to be better then that. Hot chicks? GREAT! But self-parody is not great.

Okay I apparently have to type this over and over again but...

LADIES AND GENTLEMEN OF THE ESCAPIST! IF YOU HAVE ACTUALLY FOLLOWED THE DOA SERIES THE BREAST SIZE OF ALL THE FEMALE CHARACTERS HAVE BEEN CONSTANTLY REDUCED FROM GAME TO GAME! THE FRANCHISE HAS ALSO BEEN SUCCESSFUL NOT BECAUSE OF THE BREASTS BUT BECAUSE THE FIGHTING MECHANICS ARE ACTUALLY FUN TO PLAY AND UNIQUE! ALSO CONSIDER THAT THE FIRST DOA GAME AND ALL THEIR SEQUELS WITH THE EXCEPTION OF DOA VOLLEYBALL STATESIDE HAS HAD LITTLE TO NO MARKETING! THIS MEANS THAT THE FRANCHISE WAS SUCCESSFUL BECAUSE PEOPLE ACTUALLY SAW, PLAYED AND LIKED THE FRANCHISE! THROWING STONES FROM AN IVORY TOWER TO FEEL MORALLY SUPERIOR JUST DEMONSTRATES YOUR IGNORANCE AND SHALLOWNESS AS A HOBBYIST OF VIDEO GAMES BECAUSE YOU FEEL DEVELOPERS SHOULD DESIGN THE GAME TO YOUR MORAL AUTHORITY INSTEAD OF THEIR OWN IMAGINATION AND CREATIVE RIGHTS AS AN ARTIST!

...What are you talking about? DOA games are awesome. Ive played them all since 2, and it is easily my favorite fighting game of all time. You CAN actually criticize good games and not be some ignorant asshole just because one has a different opinion from you.

The breast obsession in DOA IS creepy. It's excessive, unhealthy, and if the girls of DOA were portrayed a little more reasonably to begin with, they would be seen as exactly as hot because the expectation would not be as insane. They would look more like women, and less like bulbous sacks of gelatinous flesh with a person growing out of them. I'm not saying to make the character stop being pornography. But its definitely good if they move towards shallow perfection, and away from bizarre freak-show.

Yelling your point does not mean that people arn't listening to you. People don't agree with you. There's a difference.

 

[Paragon Fury]

People ask them to make the characters boobs bigger just to see if they do it, and how big they make them. It's more like they are challenging them to be obscene.

<spoiler=Big picture for big breasts>http://www.comicbookmovie.com/images/users/uploads/10959/ridiculously_large_breasts.jpg

Notice that I got that from "fugly.com". No way in hell would I go out with a girl with those proportions, and they're the direction that Dead or Alive seems to be going.

Not gonna lie....she probably got it more for her face than anything else.

 

[axlryder]

"We actually got a lot of feedback from people who were playing it, saying, 'We want bigger breasts. Make the characters more like that.' That was kind of surprising."

And this is why we can't have nice things.

large breasts are nice things.

You know what works too? Porn.

Works? No one said anything about getting off. Large breasts just happen to be aesthetically appealing to some. Some people also happen to like solid fighting games. Put those things together and it's like peanut butter and bananas. Personally, I'm not a fan of the "in your face" variety of porn anyway. I like some things to be left to the imagination. That said, I don't even play the series myself.

 

[axlryder]

I'm not gonna be interested in this series until they add a mechanic where said large breasts fly up and smack the fighters in the face cause Self damage making it possible to do self K.O.s.

Great news, that feature has already been added to the alpha for DOA6.

 

[Kroxile]

I agree. I am a fan of breasts and the more the merrier... to a degree.

 

[Treblaine]

It's not JUST the breasts, it's the woman behind them that count.

Nothing is more a turn on than a beautiful mind and soul. But that's down to creative writing and coders, not jiggle physics.

Look at how Team Fortress 2 without any coherent plot can have characters that pass the red-letter-media test, you can describe them (in distinct ways) other than what they do or what they look like. They need to be able to do this with your female fighting roster as well.

 

[Treblaine]

Nothing wrong with a bit of "fanservice" IMO.

Transformers had Megan Fox "fixing" a car. Where was a mass outrage?

I remember people complaining quite a bit and Megan Fox has a rather tarnished reputation for taking such roles to the point where she turned down the money she would have gotten in the third film.

 

[deadish]

Nothing wrong with a bit of "fanservice" IMO.

Transformers had Megan Fox "fixing" a car. Where was a mass outrage?

If you don't like it, don't buy it.

They can change the series removing what made it (in)famous to try to reach a broader audience (and appease the whiny people who got "offend") but they risk alienating their current fan base - and if they fail to reach the "broader audience" in the process, it's more or less game over for the series. It's really up to the developers who they want to target and appeal to.

You obviously don't follow film press very much.

Ya, I don't. So maybe I'm off.

But I honestly don't see the difference between Megan Fox doing a few "close up" shots in Transformers and "actors" like Matthew Mcconaughey taking his shirt off nearly every damn movie.

Nothing wrong with a bit of "fanservice" IMO.

Transformers had Megan Fox "fixing" a car. Where was a mass outrage?

I remember people complaining quite a bit and Megan Fox has a rather tarnished reputation for taking such roles to the point where she turned down the money she would have gotten in the third film.

I think she turned it down because she was afraid of getting typecasted as a sex symbol. I think all actors are to some extend are afraid of pulling a Mark Hamill - 3 blockbuster movies later you are forever known as your character; this is especially true for new actors who debuted and made it big with those blockbusters and audiences haven't seen them in anything else.

 

[Treblaine]

Nothing wrong with a bit of "fanservice" IMO.

Transformers had Megan Fox "fixing" a car. Where was a mass outrage?

I remember people complaining quite a bit and Megan Fox has a rather tarnished reputation for taking such roles to the point where she turned down the money she would have gotten in the third film.

I think she turned it down because she was afraid of getting typecasted as a sex symbol. I think all actors are to some extend are afraid of pulling a Mark Hamill - 3 blockbuster movies later you are forever known as your character; this is especially true for new actors who debuted and made it big with those blockbusters and audiences haven't seen them in anything else.

I don't think it was a case of "being typecast as ANYTHING" but "being type cast as vapid fanservice".

Shia Le Beouf didn't jump ship.

And Star Wars didn't cost careers, Harrison Ford had a huge career to spite three appearances as Han Solo, also James Earl Jones to spite being the voice of Darth Vader.

 

[simple64]

First off, I never liked the whole "don't like it, don't play it" anecdote. That's a very poor way to argue. So what, we're not allowed to have an opinion on something? There must be a reason we don't like it, after all. Nobody is "forcing" their opinions down anyone's throats. Honestly, it sounds like you're just being a baby, and a hypocrite, too. "What, they have an opinion outside of my own! How dare they! They're trying to censor me! They should keep their views to themselves!".

Second, I in no way see how this qualifies as anything close to news. As I said in another thread, "Hentai game dev makes hentai game. Fans of hentai wants more hentai". I mean, duh. This "report" just seems like a really corny way of protecting himself from bad PR. "Well, we're not sexist, this is what our fans want!". This is almost as bad as the time he blamed it on a cultural thing.

And did someone on this thread actually compare this to fine art? It's just a softcore porn game, nothing more, made to titillate gamers.

Let's not kid ourselves. This isn't some revolutionary thing he's trying to start. This game is well known for it's jiggle physics. Someone here stated that this game is known for more. What was it, "grapple based combat"? No, it's known for big boobed asians. People that haven't even played it knows the game for that. I mean, that's it's reputation. It's a reputation that he damn well tries to embrace. It's just funny how quickly people here and other places are able to spin tales to make it sound innocent. "other games have jiggle physics", "there are real women with breasts like that, this game is sorta realistic", "these people that want bigger breast don't want them to be perverts", and my favorite, "you have a problem with the human body, it's natural, not sexual". If you enjoy the game for having huge tata'd women, then enjoy the game for having huge tata'd women, just stop trying to sell a story when people call ya creepy.

I just wish the dev would stop playing around, trying to make himself sound innocent himself. I mean, sure, if this is what fans want, then give it to them. Just please, stop telling us all of these stories to sound less like a womanizer. Just make the damn game for your fans and call it a day.

And yes, no matter how you spin it, the people that asks for this sound like creepy pervert. Hell, if you take this story and put it anywhere but a gaming website, you'll get a metric @#$%ton of people calling gamers basement dwelling nerds who needs virtual breast because they can't get a date.

 

[deadish]

I don't think it was a case of "being typecast as ANYTHING" but "being type cast as vapid fanservice".

IMO as a performer, you are always "fan service" to some extend.

I assumed like most actors, she was warily of getting typecasted but after a bit of research, it turns out I was wrong. For most part she didn't care. XD

As for her departing the series, a factor that played a huge part in that was her public remarks about Bay. While Bay didn't give a shit, her "public naming-calling" probably didn't go down too well with the executives. So to some extend, she was kind of fired.

Shia Le Beouf didn't jump ship.

As THE lead of the show, jumping ship was probably a tad bit harder for him. In the end, it's his decision if he wanted to risk being typecasted vs being paid load of $$$.

And Star Wars didn't cost careers, Harrison Ford had a huge career to spite three appearances as Han Solo, also James Earl Jones to spite being the voice of Darth Vader.

Ford was the only one to escape the death trap and he worked his ass off to do so. Ford was fortunate he had another high profile role roughly the same time as Star Wars, Indiana Jones. But even with that he was a risk of being typecasted as an action hero and he started taking non-action roles to try to diversify.

As for James Earl Jones, please. He was a voice! A voice processed through a "voice changer". Voice actors in general rarely get typecasted IMO. Most people don't remember them nor their voice - and most can do a variety of voices. Mark Hamill became a voice actor after Star Wars destroyed his acting career. He has done pretty well I must say.