Depression?

[Kragg]

I've had depression for a couple of years now, and before I got it, I never really understood it that well, and have met a lot of people that think people should just get over it. I'm just wondering what people think about it?

I was like you, basically.

And what happenned?

I gained a better understanding of people who suffer from it, and have to deal with it myself. People who say "get over it" just don't understand - I was like them once.

i am sorry guys ... but i laughed so hard when i saw the one guy with the lenin cat avatar tell the posh cat avatar guy he was "basicly like you" third time in 30 mins escapist made me laugh out loud

i have had periods in my life where looking back i probably was depressed a while, luckily that never snowballed into something bigger or worse

 

[khaimera]

People will hate me for this, but some psychiatrists believe that depression is a CHOICE. We choose it as the best way we know to fix a problem. Depression helps us avoid problems directly, stifles anger, gets us sympathy, gets us out of doing what we don't want to do, and allows others to help us. I sort of agree with this.

Depression is caused by depressive thoughts. Its not biological.

Here's a source.
http://www.wglasser.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=13&Itemid=28

Also, my avatar suffers from depression, so I'm kind of an expert.

That's some good trolling right there except the link you posted was a link to some new age psychobabble bullshit and you're confusing depression(a mental illness caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain) with plain negative thought patterns. If alleviating depression was as easy as re-programming your brain and reading self-help books(which in both cases requires very little effort) then it wouldn't be a problem.

Umm, thanks. Look I knew this wasn't going to be a popular opinion, but I assure you this is all legit. The creator of this website is one of the giants in the field of psychology and psychiatry. He was one of the first to challenge the traditonal medical model of depression. The medical model has obviously been markteted and sold well to the public. Look how everyone in this thread has the same opinion. "Its a medical disease that must be treated with meds"

The biological definition of depression is one designed ot make money, and it has.

I'm exiting this thread now becuase I realize this is not the place to have such intellectual discussion with a group of people who all know much less than I do about this subject.

My post was meant to get people to think of their depression in a new way. It didn't work.

So I leave you with 2 FACTS.

1. Talk therapy has been proven to be equally effective in treating depression as medication. If depression was biological, talking about it would never help.
2. The neurotransmitter behavior connection goes both ways, not just one.

I think you're right. I love this one line in a song, "They won't pay a cent to hear you laughing, they might pay a little to hear you cry. If you do it long enough, they might even pay attention, but they still won't pay respects until you die."

However, even as a choice, that doesn't necessarily mean the person is conciously thinking, "hmmm... I'm gonna be sad to get attention!" It's like a coping mechanism. A depressed person needs to recognize that there's other ways to cope.

Yes it can be caused by chemical problems with the brain, but people need to remember that chemicals in the brain are induced by our own actions. To put it into the dumbest way possible, imagine the normal brain is 50% happy chemical and 50% sad chemical. A person who has depression due to a chemical imbalance in the brain may have 75% sad chemical, causing it to overwhelm the happy chemical. Therefore, that person should do exercises to increase the happy chemicals and try to get the balance back or even tip it towards happy again. The situation when a person needs MEDICINE is when the sad chemical is in such quantities that no exercises can balance the scale again. Never the less, medicine can only do so much (say the average medicine only gives a +40% happy chemical - if you're 100% sad chemical, you will never get back to being happy again) so you NEED to have exercises too in order to ensure the balance is tipped towards the happy side.

Make sense?

First off, thank you for hearing me out and not immediately getting pissed and writing me off as an idiot. I do get what you're saying and you're sort of right. The problem is that science has not advanced enough for us to know how much of any brain chemical we have at a given type, unless you die, and then we immediately cut into the brain.

What anitdepresants do is help us use the chemicals we already make. The drug does not give us more chemicals, but allows those chemicals to stay where they need to be, so that we can feel their effects.

The problem with current scientific knowledge is that we're using teh age old correlation does not equal causation. Thats why therapy also works, as does a sugar pill for 30 perecnt of teh peoepl who take it. Hope mattter more than anyone knows. For example, we don't know how or why Ritalin works. Its a stimulant that calms some people. We dont know why, we just know that it helps.

My first post here was meant to be controversial and was unfortunately written off as invalid. I wanted to challenge most people's overly traditional views about depression. I don't belive that the choice is ever conscious, and its possible that Choice Theory is wrong alltogether. It fits for some and doesn't for others.

I'l stop now because I could write a dissertation on all this.

 

[KaiRai]

Surround yourself with good people. And something that is beneficial, but that you find punishing. Excercise is a good one, or playing an instrument. Seriously, anything that you find difficult, but you see a purpose to. Mine was running, and I came 12th in my county a year and a half after starting It felt good. Just ask yourself, what interests you that you never got round to?

 

[khaimera]

People will hate me for this, but some psychiatrists believe that depression is a CHOICE. We choose it as the best way we know to fix a problem. Depression helps us avoid problems directly, stifles anger, gets us sympathy, gets us out of doing what we don't want to do, and allows others to help us. I sort of agree with this.

Depression is caused by depressive thoughts. Its not biological.

Here's a source.
http://www.wglasser.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=13&Itemid=28

Also, my avatar suffers from depression, so I'm kind of an expert.

I don't want to agree, but I kinda do. Still it doesn't help on my seasonal depression, there's just no motivation or strength to drain when it kicks in. And if it's not biological, then why do intake of certain chemicals help? The mind works by chemicals, or so they say.

You are right. There is a mind body connection and medications do work. My issue is more about what causes it. Many people think that becuase meds help, then there must be a biological cause. Its like saying that headaches are caused by an aspirin deficiency. The logic doesn't hold. Its also good to remember that placebo (sugar pill) reduces depression in a third of the peopel who take it. Meds work on 66. Then there are one third who will receive no benefit from meds. The problem is that science hasn't adavcned enough. Drug companies will say otherwise, but their only goal is to sell more pills.

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

It fits for some and doesn't for others.

That's psychiatry and psychology all over. There's no one Solution For Everyone, never will be, and is one reason why I despise the 'checklist psychology' routine pushed by the pharma corps... another reason being I have 'atypical reactions' to several psych meds. Not fun when the common approach to most psych disorders is initially symptom suppression and you're a psychotic who gets worse when on anti-psychotics and tranqs.

 

[Soxafloppin]

I've never been depressed, i've felt really sad for a long period of time but there was nothing wrong with me.

You'l get over it mate.

 

[Rakkana]

I get depressed from time to time but I don't dwell on it.

 

[Sebenko]

I was depressed once.

Depression knows not to come back `till it's god damned needed.

I was just like "fuck you, what's wrong? nothing. Now fuck off before I stab your whiny ***** ass". And my depression was replaced with rage, so I went and played some stalker.

 

[SilverUchiha]

I've been depressed (not clinically) off and on for the past (what) three or four years(?). I'd say the source of it was coming out of a two-three year relationship and then just striking out / not meeting anyone good between then and about a month ago. I wasn't solidly depressed the whole time. I had / have a good group of friends that always manage to bring me back up when I'm feeling my lowest. And, in the past month, things seem to be (more or less) good. However, being as pessimistic as I am, something will set me back spiraling into a depression because it fails to meet my unreasonable standards for life... until then... let the good times roll.

 

[LostTimeLady]

As someone who has experianced the symptoms of depression I can understand the miasma of miss-information and miss-conceptions surrounding depression. I hasen to add I am not clinically diagnosed but I have seen a phycologist earlier in my life due to family break up issues, issues that still remain among other things.
Often depression or depressed feelings are triggered by lots of stuff, and it's difficult to catagorise what emotions are going on that actually represent a genuine lack of mental well-being (I prefer that term as well-being implies being happy and content, something you're not really when you're depressed).
I am among, I'm sure, a number of people who haven't been to the Doctor's to get diagnosed for a number of reasons; Here are a few I suspect I'm not the only one in feeling:
1. I worry that I'm exagerating and it's just hormonal or some such normalness.
2. I don't like to talk about what makes me feel down and sad, because it in turn makes me feel down and sad.
3. I don't want to be labeled as 'depressed' for fear of the stigma.

I'm sure that's not the healthiest thing to do but there's a real fear of diagnosis from a Doctor as with any illness.

I definately think that depression is a serious thing and anyone who suffers from it or cares for someone suffering from it needs very real support to help them through a tough time. One in four of us statistically will suffer from depression or other similar lack of mental well-being within our life time so we need to remove the stigma and offer each other all the support we can.

 

[SmartIdiot]

People will hate me for this, but some psychiatrists believe that depression is a CHOICE. We choose it as the best way we know to fix a problem. Depression helps us avoid problems directly, stifles anger, gets us sympathy, gets us out of doing what we don't want to do, and allows others to help us. I sort of agree with this.

Depression is caused by depressive thoughts. Its not biological.

Here's a source.
http://www.wglasser.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=13&Itemid=28

Also, my avatar suffers from depression, so I'm kind of an expert.

That's some good trolling right there except the link you posted was a link to some new age psychobabble bullshit and you're confusing depression(a mental illness caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain) with plain negative thought patterns. If alleviating depression was as easy as re-programming your brain and reading self-help books(which in both cases requires very little effort) then it wouldn't be a problem.

Umm, thanks. Look I knew this wasn't going to be a popular opinion, but I assure you this is all legit. The creator of this website is one of the giants in the field of psychology and psychiatry. He was one of the first to challenge the traditonal medical model of depression. The medical model has obviously been markteted and sold well to the public. Look how everyone in this thread has the same opinion. "Its a medical disease that must be treated with meds"

The biological definition of depression is one designed ot make money, and it has.

I'm exiting this thread now becuase I realize this is not the place to have such intellectual discussion with a group of people who all know much less than I do about this subject.

My post was meant to get people to think of their depression in a new way. It didn't work.

So I leave you with 2 FACTS.

1. Talk therapy has been proven to be equally effective in treating depression as medication. If depression was biological, talking about it would never help.
2. The neurotransmitter behavior connection goes both ways, not just one.

No no no don't leave, we could be onto something here. I do appreciate what you're saying and meds aren't the correct way to deal with depression (especially considering how irresponsibly doctors prescribe them these days) however I need to know, have you ever suffered from depression?

 

[RSJPaladin]

If it helps ill tell you little about my history if mental illness. I ve been suffering al my life from from various sort of things, lack of being recognise, low selfasteam, always setting the standards of how good i should be and ofc never being good enoff, bad eating habbits, little ore lack of sleep, constant worreing about what might happen, putting myself as wrong duer in peoples problem and as follows, guilt guilt guilt...

Al this bad patterns ive practiced al my life ore say 15 years atleast and for the last 5 years ive been dealing with al the shit it makes me do ore not do. I had a meltdown when I was about 19 and im now 24 and still struggleing with the above daily, as alot of these negative anomalies makes me do bad things ore practecly do nothing ore as they make me afraid sometimes and I run into otherworlds like computergaming, tv-series, movies ore food to forget and supress.

Seeing a psychologist and a doctor, having light medication and trying new things is something that helps alot. Also sorrounding yourself with people who are willing to understand you, boost you and help you, activities that activates your body as it realeases the bodys own "happie" substances and good food really helps to keep a higher curve in your mood.

Its hard sometimes and sometimes your down on the floor screaming your lungs out cuss it hurts, sometimes one performs as al the rest, and sometimes your better. The most important thing is to never give up, cuss the longer you keep at doing good to yourself, the more the body will learn. Even if it feels hopeless sometimes, cuss for me the bad has been there so long so its hard to make a dent in the wall of bricks just by blowing at it, but in time you will learn new ways of attacking the problems and soon youll be jusing a sledgehammer to brake down that wall.

Never give up my friend, but dont be afraid to rest either, sometimes its nice to take a step back and see how far one has come on the journey.

I hope me sharing this helps you understand that your not allown and if you need answers there out there and people are willing to share =)

And remember "It is always darkest just before the Day dawneth" ,1650 T. Fuller Pisgah Sight

(I apologise for my poor english, not my native language)

 

[khaimera]

People will hate me for this, but some psychiatrists believe that depression is a CHOICE. We choose it as the best way we know to fix a problem. Depression helps us avoid problems directly, stifles anger, gets us sympathy, gets us out of doing what we don't want to do, and allows others to help us. I sort of agree with this.

Depression is caused by depressive thoughts. Its not biological.

Here's a source.
http://www.wglasser.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=13&Itemid=28

Also, my avatar suffers from depression, so I'm kind of an expert.

That's some good trolling right there except the link you posted was a link to some new age psychobabble bullshit and you're confusing depression(a mental illness caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain) with plain negative thought patterns. If alleviating depression was as easy as re-programming your brain and reading self-help books(which in both cases requires very little effort) then it wouldn't be a problem.

Umm, thanks. Look I knew this wasn't going to be a popular opinion, but I assure you this is all legit. The creator of this website is one of the giants in the field of psychology and psychiatry. He was one of the first to challenge the traditonal medical model of depression. The medical model has obviously been markteted and sold well to the public. Look how everyone in this thread has the same opinion. "Its a medical disease that must be treated with meds"

The biological definition of depression is one designed ot make money, and it has.

I'm exiting this thread now becuase I realize this is not the place to have such intellectual discussion with a group of people who all know much less than I do about this subject.

My post was meant to get people to think of their depression in a new way. It didn't work.

So I leave you with 2 FACTS.

1. Talk therapy has been proven to be equally effective in treating depression as medication. If depression was biological, talking about it would never help.
2. The neurotransmitter behavior connection goes both ways, not just one.

No no no don't leave, we could be onto something here. I do appreciate what you're saying and meds aren't the correct way to deal with depression (especially considering how irresponsibly doctors prescribe them these days) however I need to know, have you ever suffered from depression?

Never thought I'd here you say that too me here. I thought I royally pissed you off. I knew what I was saying would offend some and enrage others, but there are different ways to view mental illness. Hopefully I opened up some minds. I promise you that this isn't my own theory and does have some research to back it up. This doctor is veiwed as a radical by many in the field.

As for your question. I was depressed for much of my adolesence. My father was abusive and very negative and I had no self-esteem becuase of it. I went to therapy, but did a lot of work on myself and after a few years. I beat it. It took me thinking about life and myself in new ways, and putting myself in new situations that the old me woudl have ran away from.

Also, I work in the mental health field and treat depression.

 

[SmartIdiot]

People will hate me for this, but some psychiatrists believe that depression is a CHOICE. We choose it as the best way we know to fix a problem. Depression helps us avoid problems directly, stifles anger, gets us sympathy, gets us out of doing what we don't want to do, and allows others to help us. I sort of agree with this.

Depression is caused by depressive thoughts. Its not biological.

Here's a source.
http://www.wglasser.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=13&Itemid=28

Also, my avatar suffers from depression, so I'm kind of an expert.

That's some good trolling right there except the link you posted was a link to some new age psychobabble bullshit and you're confusing depression(a mental illness caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain) with plain negative thought patterns. If alleviating depression was as easy as re-programming your brain and reading self-help books(which in both cases requires very little effort) then it wouldn't be a problem.

Umm, thanks. Look I knew this wasn't going to be a popular opinion, but I assure you this is all legit. The creator of this website is one of the giants in the field of psychology and psychiatry. He was one of the first to challenge the traditonal medical model of depression. The medical model has obviously been markteted and sold well to the public. Look how everyone in this thread has the same opinion. "Its a medical disease that must be treated with meds"

The biological definition of depression is one designed ot make money, and it has.

I'm exiting this thread now becuase I realize this is not the place to have such intellectual discussion with a group of people who all know much less than I do about this subject.

My post was meant to get people to think of their depression in a new way. It didn't work.

So I leave you with 2 FACTS.

1. Talk therapy has been proven to be equally effective in treating depression as medication. If depression was biological, talking about it would never help.
2. The neurotransmitter behavior connection goes both ways, not just one.

No no no don't leave, we could be onto something here. I do appreciate what you're saying and meds aren't the correct way to deal with depression (especially considering how irresponsibly doctors prescribe them these days) however I need to know, have you ever suffered from depression?

Never thought I'd here you say that too me here. I thought I royally pissed you off. I knew what I was saying would offend some and enrage others, but there are different ways to view mental illness. Hopefully I opened up some minds. I promise you that this isn't my own theory and does have some research to back it up. This doctor is veiwed as a radical by many in the field.

As for your question. I was depressed for much of my adolesence. My father was abusive and very negative and I had no self-esteem becuase of it. I went to therapy, but did a lot of work on myself and after a few years. I beat it. It took me thinking about life and myself in new ways, and putting myself in new situations that the old me woudl have ran away from.

Also, I work in the mental health field and treat depression.

I see. Again I was overly aggressive with my first response (perhaps subconsciously I do that so that I'm guaranteed to get one back...). Having been prescribed meds at a previous point in my life and having seen doctors liberally/irresponsibly throw them at people who don't even need them I understand the stance of needing to find other treatments for mental illness. However perhaps its just the way I'm interpreting it but the link you posted seems to be describing little more than counselling(another treatment I went through where we did the same things, talked it through, found ways to change thought processes i.e don't think 'I can't do this' think 'I'll give it a shot') and while this is a very useful way for dealing with depression the person really has to make an effort. I guess it comes down to how deeply affected they are. Obviously you know the classic scenario, when a depressive goes outside and finds that it's raining, it's only raining on them. Though I wouldn't go so far to say depression could be a choice(whether subconsciously or not). Then again perhaps I'm just frustrated that this theory didn't reach me sooner. And then again again, perhaps there's a fundamental link here that I'm just not getting.

 

[Girl With One Eye]

Well when I was feeling depressed I went to my GP who referred me to a therapist. Depending on what your exact condition is, depends on the type of therapy you will recieve. For example, I have problems with self-harm, so I was referred to a psychiatrist. A friend of mine who was depressed was referred to a counsellor at the doctors surgery. The best thing you can do is talk to your GP and discuss your options. Feel free to PM me if you have any questions.

 

[Yureina]

I was diagnosed with clinical depression when I was 18, and that was after years of wasting around and not bothering to talk to anyone about things that had happened four years before that. But the shrink who made that diagnosis then had to take leave for a while, and I haven't seen anyone since then.

I think i'm fine now.

 

[Griffolion]

People will hate me for this, but some psychiatrists believe that depression is a CHOICE. We choose it as the best way we know to fix a problem. Depression helps us avoid problems directly, stifles anger, gets us sympathy, gets us out of doing what we don't want to do, and allows others to help us. I sort of agree with this.

Depression is caused by depressive thoughts. Its not biological.

Here's a source.
http://www.wglasser.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=13&Itemid=28

Also, my avatar suffers from depression, so I'm kind of an expert.

That's some good trolling right there except the link you posted was a link to some new age psychobabble bullshit and you're confusing depression(a mental illness caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain) with plain negative thought patterns. If alleviating depression was as easy as re-programming your brain and reading self-help books(which in both cases requires very little effort) then it wouldn't be a problem.

Umm, thanks. Look I knew this wasn't going to be a popular opinion, but I assure you this is all legit. The creator of this website is one of the giants in the field of psychology and psychiatry. He was one of the first to challenge the traditonal medical model of depression. The medical model has obviously been markteted and sold well to the public. Look how everyone in this thread has the same opinion. "Its a medical disease that must be treated with meds"

The biological definition of depression is one designed ot make money, and it has.

I'm exiting this thread now becuase I realize this is not the place to have such intellectual discussion with a group of people who all know much less than I do about this subject.

My post was meant to get people to think of their depression in a new way. It didn't work.

So I leave you with 2 FACTS.

1. Talk therapy has been proven to be equally effective in treating depression as medication. If depression was biological, talking about it would never help.
2. The neurotransmitter behavior connection goes both ways, not just one.

No no no don't leave, we could be onto something here. I do appreciate what you're saying and meds aren't the correct way to deal with depression (especially considering how irresponsibly doctors prescribe them these days) however I need to know, have you ever suffered from depression?

Never thought I'd here you say that too me here. I thought I royally pissed you off. I knew what I was saying would offend some and enrage others, but there are different ways to view mental illness. Hopefully I opened up some minds. I promise you that this isn't my own theory and does have some research to back it up. This doctor is veiwed as a radical by many in the field.

As for your question. I was depressed for much of my adolesence. My father was abusive and very negative and I had no self-esteem becuase of it. I went to therapy, but did a lot of work on myself and after a few years. I beat it. It took me thinking about life and myself in new ways, and putting myself in new situations that the old me woudl have ran away from.

Also, I work in the mental health field and treat depression.

I don't remember myself saying depression was biological, i remember saying that research strongly suggests a significant biological component to depression. I also said that counselling and CBT were equally as required in the therapeutic process as medication is.

Oh and in response to your facts, yes talk therapy has been shown to be effective in combatting depression as it serves to reinforce 'positive' neural pathways in the brain while medication serves to increase neurotransmitter levels associated with positivity i.e serotonin. So note the biology of that which is inextricably linked to the psychology and the behavioural responses of an individual. And for the record, i agree about fact number 2. I also agree with you as far as saying its not all biological, but to dismiss it and argue to the extreme of the behavioural and psychological spectrum is as foolish as the lay-person comments these people who "know much less about this than you do" are making.

You're not the only one who's qualified to talk in this area and if that 'radical' scientist guy's theory picks up some legitimacy then i'll consider it further but forgive me and the rest of us for looking at it with some skepticism (due dilligence to others i would say).

 

[Outright Villainy]

My first post here was meant to be controversial and was unfortunately written off as invalid. I wanted to challenge most people's overly traditional views about depression. I don't belive that the choice is ever conscious, and its possible that Choice Theory is wrong alltogether. It fits for some and doesn't for others.

I'l stop now because I could write a dissertation on all this.

The thing is though, that this is not the popular opinion outside such a forum. Many people are downright ignorant about depression, and dismiss it as people being self absorbed or attention seeking. I think it's safe to assume that we both agree depression isn't overtly conscious in any way; people do not want it, try to fight it, and it gives them a really shit time, to put it lightly. It's just it seemed like you were being dismissive by saying it was all in their head. I know this wasn't your intention by any means, but you must understand why people would get pretty reactionary when they have to deal with people being dismissive every day, which doesn't help and would only make them feel worse.

For the record I'd believe it is caused by a chemical imbalance. Offshoots of depression such as bipolar, manic depression and such don't really seem to add up with your theory. I'm no expert in the field, but I know enough experience first hand, and from friends who do study it to be convinced that psychological factors alone cannot account for it.

 

[khaimera]

People will hate me for this, but some psychiatrists believe that depression is a CHOICE. We choose it as the best way we know to fix a problem. Depression helps us avoid problems directly, stifles anger, gets us sympathy, gets us out of doing what we don't want to do, and allows others to help us. I sort of agree with this.

Depression is caused by depressive thoughts. Its not biological.

Here's a source.
http://www.wglasser.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=13&Itemid=28

Also, my avatar suffers from depression, so I'm kind of an expert.

That's some good trolling right there except the link you posted was a link to some new age psychobabble bullshit and you're confusing depression(a mental illness caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain) with plain negative thought patterns. If alleviating depression was as easy as re-programming your brain and reading self-help books(which in both cases requires very little effort) then it wouldn't be a problem.

Umm, thanks. Look I knew this wasn't going to be a popular opinion, but I assure you this is all legit. The creator of this website is one of the giants in the field of psychology and psychiatry. He was one of the first to challenge the traditonal medical model of depression. The medical model has obviously been markteted and sold well to the public. Look how everyone in this thread has the same opinion. "Its a medical disease that must be treated with meds"

The biological definition of depression is one designed ot make money, and it has.

I'm exiting this thread now becuase I realize this is not the place to have such intellectual discussion with a group of people who all know much less than I do about this subject.

My post was meant to get people to think of their depression in a new way. It didn't work.

So I leave you with 2 FACTS.

1. Talk therapy has been proven to be equally effective in treating depression as medication. If depression was biological, talking about it would never help.
2. The neurotransmitter behavior connection goes both ways, not just one.

No no no don't leave, we could be onto something here. I do appreciate what you're saying and meds aren't the correct way to deal with depression (especially considering how irresponsibly doctors prescribe them these days) however I need to know, have you ever suffered from depression?

Never thought I'd here you say that too me here. I thought I royally pissed you off. I knew what I was saying would offend some and enrage others, but there are different ways to view mental illness. Hopefully I opened up some minds. I promise you that this isn't my own theory and does have some research to back it up. This doctor is veiwed as a radical by many in the field.

As for your question. I was depressed for much of my adolesence. My father was abusive and very negative and I had no self-esteem becuase of it. I went to therapy, but did a lot of work on myself and after a few years. I beat it. It took me thinking about life and myself in new ways, and putting myself in new situations that the old me woudl have ran away from.

Also, I work in the mental health field and treat depression.

I don't remember myself saying depression was biological, i remember saying that research strongly suggests a significant biological component to depression. I also said that counselling and CBT were equally as required in the therapeutic process as medication is.

Oh and in response to your facts, yes talk therapy has been shown to be effective in combatting depression as it serves to reinforce 'positive' neural pathways in the brain while medication serves to increase neurotransmitter levels associated with positivity i.e serotonin. So note the biology of that which is inextricably linked to the psychology and the behavioural responses of an individual. And for the record, i agree about fact number 2. I also agree with you as far as saying its not all biological, but to dismiss it and argue to the extreme of the behavioural and psychological spectrum is as foolish as the lay-person comments these people who "know much less about this than you do" are making.

You're not the only one who's qualified to talk in this area and if that 'radical' scientist guy's theory picks up some legitimacy then i'll consider it further but forgive me and the rest of us for looking at it with some skepticism (due dilligence to others i would say).

I think I understand what you are saying. Personally, I belive that the mind and body are connected in ways which we have yet to fully understand. Thus all mental illness is a combination of biological, cognitive, and behavioral factors. I was just pointing out that there are other ways to think about what causes these diseases. You are right on about the strengthened neural pathways (google neural plasticity) but the serotonin aspect is not so simple. For example there are at leat nine subtypes of serotonin. Most of whihc we have no idea what they do. Serotonin has been implictaed in motivation, anger, pain, etc. There is just more to it that it increases happiness, which it does, sometimes.

As for the radical, and he is one, here's a wikipedia article about him. I know its not the best source, but getting free psychological journal articles online isn't really an option. You'll see that he has been around forever, started his own movement which is still going strong 40 years later, and is now attempting to overall the way schools teach children. I highly reccomend his most popular book "Choice Theory". In it he argues that all mental ilness is unconsciously chosen as a means to an end.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Glasser

 

[khaimera]

My first post here was meant to be controversial and was unfortunately written off as invalid. I wanted to challenge most people's overly traditional views about depression. I don't belive that the choice is ever conscious, and its possible that Choice Theory is wrong alltogether. It fits for some and doesn't for others.

I'l stop now because I could write a dissertation on all this.

The thing is though, that this is not the popular opinion outside such a forum. Many people are downright ignorant about depression, and dismiss it as people being self absorbed or attention seeking. I think it's safe to assume that we both agree depression isn't overtly conscious in any way; people do not want it, try to fight it, and it gives them a really shit time, to put it lightly. It's just it seemed like you were being dismissive by saying it was all in their head. I know this wasn't your intention by any means, but you must understand why people would get pretty reactionary when they have to deal with people being dismissive every day, which doesn't help and would only make them feel worse.

For the record I'd believe it is caused by a chemical imbalance. Offshoots of depression such as bipolar, manic depression and such don't really seem to add up with your theory. I'm no expert in the field, but I know enough experience first hand, and from friends who do study it to be convinced that psychological factors alone cannot account for it.

we definitely agree that its not conscious. I knew the type of reaction I would get, but I was sharing a legitimate psychological theory which has been researched for decades. Most people don't know about it becuase it is a radical theory and its not really taught in psych classes. I just wanted to open people's eyes to a new way to look at it. I didn't think though about how it would remind people of the often dismissive attitude the general public and family members have about a depressed person. For that one, I apologize for not thinking about all the implications of my post.

I think that different mental illnesses have a diferent genetic componenet which is stronger for some than other. Bipolar and shizophrenia are two examples of diseases that are more biologically based. Though some still argue otherwise. There are those who have been able to cure both of these without any meds. Basically, I think that people inherit a tendency, or higher likelihood, of having a mental illness. It lays dormant until life experiences come into play and set the train in motion.