Developers: Steam Controller "Doesn't Feel Like a Trackpad"

[Lightknight]

This looks really weird. But maybe it's exactly what we need for controller gaming? I simply won't know unless I use it. This is probably my least favorite of the announcements with only appearances to go on. But with how many key bindings games have on pc I should have expected something unusual.

 

[MHzBurglar]

My initial reaction to this thing was a resounding "NO!". It just seemed like another touch-oriented device furthering my theory/tinfoil-hat-fear that the industry is waging a 'war on buttons' and eventually all we'll be left with is sloppy inaccurate touch controls with no tactile feedback.

After reading a couple of developers' accounts of the control, I'm a little less concerned about the trackpads despite having owned an Xperia play and finding that its touchpads/trackpads were practiacally useless for analog control. The button placement still concerns me, however. With the disclaimer that I (obviously) haven't tried it yet, here's where I still see huge problems:

1) Lack of tactile feedback: I know people are going on and on about "haptic feedback", but in my experience, haptic feedback just plain doesn't work. Mobile phones use "haptic feedback" for their virtual keyboards. Can any of you honestly say that when haptics are enabled that you actually feel the keys on your soft keyboard when you're typing? In my experience the phone just vibrates uselessly and maybe makes a "tick" sound through the speaker. I have a sinking feeling that the Steam controller will be more-or-less the same.

2) No D-Pad: I play a lot of 2-D platformers and oldschool games. As such, a proper D-Pad is important to me. The Xbox 360 controller had an atrocious D-Pad, but it was better than none at all. I find analog sticks too unresponsive to play games designed around 'digital' control. I worry that these touchpads will fare even worse given that now the element of proper tactile feedback has been (mostly) removed.

3) No (proper) face buttons: I'm aware that there's still shoulder buttons and two "underside" buttons, but the lack of face buttons for performing primary functions may make this contrroller cumbersome for use with games which require frequent and complex actions. It's likely a lot of player preference on this one, but I can't see myself being overly thrilled having to change up my muscle-memory and re-learn primary control elements that have been in place since the NES days at least. The trackpads are clickable, yes, but I see them being just about as much use as the "buttons" located underneath the analog sticks on the Playstation/Xbox360 controllers (read: not very.)

If I had a suggestion for Valve, it would be this: Change the right trackpad from one clickable region to 4, and 'simulate' the diamond face button configuration that most games use. Then, depending on how soft the trackpad's rubber is, make the center of those regions able to raise/lower from underneath the rubber to convert the trackpad to real face buttons when needed. The left pad could have a similar structure to turn it into a real D-Pad. As they are right now, the trackpad-to-button setup looks like a pain. Maybe this is too intricate to realistically implement, but it would be a hell of a lot better to actually create real tactile buttons on demand than to have some useless "haptic" vibrations.

I'll give this thing a chance, but I'm still not feeling warm and fuzzy about it.


...

Tl;dr: Button placement is worrying, the controller needs a d-pad; haptic feedback as it's seen today in mobile devices is just a useless "rumble" feature that accomplishes nothing; wouldn't it be nice if the touchpad had 4 real buttons underneath the rubber that could raise up when real buttons are needed instead of just making the pad one large click target.

 

[romxxii]

Yes, because the most reliable way to get information about a new product's quality is from the press release announcing it.

Yeah, but a guy from Double Fine said it was good, and Tim Schafer is PC gaming's super jesus.

Nope, Gabe Newell is PC gaming's current super jesus. Tim Schafer got demoted to regular PC gaming jesus for adding hackneyed RTS elements to a sandbox game, and for delaying Broken Age. ;P

 

[Clovus]

Knowing Valve I'm sure it is a clever design.

I wonder if those are one of those old ipod click wheels that has 4 direction buttons with slide sensors.

..because that would be kind of cool

Will never happen because Apple patents every orifice of their device so anyone who so much as puts the same phrase as an Ipod will get sued to high heaven.

It sounds like it can definitely work like a click-wheel. It can certainly track your thumb as you move it around the pad. The announcement indicated that it is clickable and that it can register those clicks as different buttons based on where you are on it when you click. It sounds like it can work as more than 4 buttons at once too.

I'm sure it's using significantly different tech to avoid patent problems with Apple. Or, you know, they just paid for licenses they needed.

 

[romxxii]

If I had a suggestion for Valve, it would be this: Change the right trackpad from one clickable region to 4, and 'simulate' the diamond face button configuration that most games use.

You should've read the Team Meat review: otherwise, you'd already know that you can map the four face buttons onto the right trackpad.

 

[MHzBurglar]

If I had a suggestion for Valve, it would be this: Change the right trackpad from one clickable region to 4, and 'simulate' the diamond face button configuration that most games use.

You should've read the Team Meat review: otherwise, you'd already know that you can map the four face buttons onto the right trackpad.

I did read the Team Meat review. But what I got from that was that while you can map face buttons to the pad, there's no region defining where your "button" is. It looks to be a touch-based mapping, rather than a click/press/button-based mapping, as there is only one clickable target under the trackpad. I'd suggest taking Tommy's "nub" idea one step further and making 4 real buttons/clickable targets under the thing and make the clickable areas feel physically different from the rest of the pad.

Maybe the single click target can work as 4 buttons with a combination of touch/click. We'll have to see. Regardless, it won't make it feel like 4 individual buttons. My worry there is that it'll be like those laptop trackpads that rock around when you click on them and generally feel unstable.

I have a huge problem with "touch" buttons in both the areas of feel and pressure that this thing in its current form seems to highlight rather than alleviate.

 

[Double A]

Yes, because the most reliable way to get information about a new product's quality is from the press release announcing it.

Yeah, but a guy from Double Fine said it was good, and Tim Schafer is PC gaming's super jesus.

Nope, Gabe Newell is PC gaming's current super jesus. Tim Schafer got demoted to regular PC gaming jesus for adding hackneyed RTS elements to a sandbox game, and for delaying Broken Age. ;P

I thought we were polytheistic with regards to Jesii.

 

[n00beffect]

Well, I couldn't possibly care less (although I do admit I have a pang of curiosity buried somewhere deep within my PC dominated heart). Now, at least we may hazard a guess as to why no Half Life 3/Portal 3 - they're holding out, trying to extend their reach to more consumers, before they announce the really interesting stuff. Not a bad tactic: the more you starve an audience, the more desperate they'll be, I suppose. Although, that does come with a price: Whenever they do announce Half Life 3/Portal 3 (maybe 10-15 years or so?) If those games don't turn out to be the Citizen Kane of games and best thing in the world ever, right up there with the cure for cancer and an answer to over-population and dwindling resources, then people are gonna be pretty pissed - the longer they make us wait, the bigger our expectations will be. Good luck with that, VALVe, I trust in thee.

 

[romxxii]

-snip-

Nope, Gabe Newell is PC gaming's current super jesus. Tim Schafer got demoted to regular PC gaming jesus for adding hackneyed RTS elements to a sandbox game, and for delaying Broken Age. ;P

I thought we were polytheistic with regards to Jesii.

Yeah we are, but we still rank them based on performance.

 

[romxxii]

-snip-

I did read the Team Meat review. But what I got from that was that while you can map face buttons to the pad, there's no region defining where your "button" is. It looks to be a touch-based mapping, rather than a click/press/button-based mapping, as there is only one clickable target under the trackpad. I'd suggest taking Tommy's "nub" idea one step further and making 4 real buttons/clickable targets under the thing and make the clickable areas feel physically different from the rest of the pad.

Maybe the single click target can work as 4 buttons with a combination of touch/click. We'll have to see. Regardless, it won't make it feel like 4 individual buttons.

I disagree; the nubs I can deal with, but making it too discrete physically might rob from the fact that it's trying to simulate mouse movement, which is a level of precision that four buttons or a thumbstick cannot match. Make the divisions clearer, put a nub, but don't make it actual face buttons to the detriment of an actual accurate aiming input system. I honestly don't understand how console players can live with themselves playing FPSes with 360 controllers; I've tried several times, and it always felt cumbersome even when compared to a shitty, poorly-maintained mouse.

My worry there is that it'll be like those laptop trackpads that rock around when you click on them and generally feel unstable.

I have a huge problem with "touch" buttons in both the areas of feel and pressure that this thing in its current form seems to highlight rather than alleviate.

The reviews already said that they feel nothing like trackpads, and feel more like track balls. You're worrying about something you don't have to.

 

[Aardvaarkman]

if anything consoles were always way more noisier becuase the dvd/BR drive is the noisiest part of computer anyway, and with PC your running off installed thing and not the disc.

The Steam Box seems highly unlikely to include an optical drive, as the whole point of Steam is online distribution.

Also, fans. Some computers have much noisier fans than their optical drives. The Steam Box may not even have any fans. And the size is most likely to be much smaller than a conventional PC.

 

[Strazdas]

if anything consoles were always way more noisier becuase the dvd/BR drive is the noisiest part of computer anyway, and with PC your running off installed thing and not the disc.

The Steam Box seems highly unlikely to include an optical drive, as the whole point of Steam is online distribution.

Also, fans. Some computers have much noisier fans than their optical drives. The Steam Box may not even have any fans. And the size is most likely to be much smaller than a conventional PC.

the only fans that are noisier than optical drivers are either ones that are badly installed or have worn out their lives (and needs replacement, think 3-5 years after use).
And steambox will have fans. unless it wants to do liquid cooling and i doubt that. If it wants to privide any actual power simple heatsinks ownt be enough. especially if the box is small. the smaller the box the harder the cooling.
We dont know if stemabox will ahve optical, but yes i do think the same, that its going to be an online one. Still, though, "noisy PC" thing is silly talk.

 

[MHzBurglar]

I disagree; the nubs I can deal with, but making it too discrete physically might rob from the fact that it's trying to simulate mouse movement, which is a level of precision that four buttons or a thumbstick cannot match. Make the divisions clearer, put a nub, but don't make it actual face buttons to the detriment of an actual accurate aiming input system. I honestly don't understand how console players can live with themselves playing FPSes with 360 controllers; I've tried several times, and it always felt cumbersome even when compared to a shitty, poorly-maintained mouse.

I agree that analog sticks are not adequate for any 'mouse-oriented' genres. I myself prefer keyboard and mouse for such games. But a controller should have proper buttons for just about every other genre (you know, the ones that typically play BETTER with a controller.) I still don't see why they couldn't have designed the controller a little differently and accommodated the trackpad AND face buttons. This shouldn't be an either-or scenario. I'm a huge opponent of touch controls, but I could deal with the trackpad in lieu of analog control and maybe even enjoy it. It's just a terrible replacement for digital control.

The reviews already said that they feel nothing like trackpads, and feel more like track balls. You're worrying about something you don't have to.

I was not referring to the laptop trakpads in terms of their ability to track motion (which is what the review referred to), but rather the horrible feeling of the entire (flat) plane your finger is on moving around and rocking on press, like a plate on the end of a pencil. I worry the Valve one will be a similar experience in that respect.