Discuss and Rate the Last Film You Watched

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Piscian

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Terminator: Dark Fate rewatch -

I still like Terminator: Dark Fate. Its a very consistent and competent Terminator film, at least better than the last three. It has some serious problems that I think are indicative of modern hollywood where in logic holes are ignored because the production is on a schedule and that is more important than respecting it's audiences intelligence enough to go back and fix it. Additionally the movie causes more problems than it solves. When you're dealing with Time travel and the super natural you have to have rules or the audience starts losing immersion in the story when nothing seems to make sense or matter. You have to make rules to bend them. Dark Fate isn't anywhere close to as bad as Terminator Genisys on that issue, but the idea that even after they stopped Judgement day more terminators were going to pop out willy nilly undercuts the weight of the previous canonical film. Its still a solid 7/10 for me as all the action is well filmed, Sarah Connors character made sense to me and I liked the exploration of a what Terminator might be like if left to it's own devices for that long. Unfortunately the John Connor surrogate character was so milquetoast that I can't even remember what the characters name was and I watched this two days ago.

Terminator 2: Judgement Day Theatrical

I couldn't sleep last night and ended up catching this one on Netflix. It's strange how well this holds up in pretty much every way. Theres a lot minute details in the film that are reflective of a time in hollywood when everything had to be done with large amounts of practical effects and it was important for all the pieces to come together and make sense. I find it fascinating that they had Sarah Connor remove all femininity from her personality. She's so traumatized by the experience in the first film that she only thinks of her mission. Her attitude and bodyshape reflect that. This is noticeably different from Terminator Genisys where in they take great pains to point out how pretty and kewpie doll like Emilia Clarke is. It's funny I was thinking while watching Dark Fate that theres no way the dumpster truck could smash through all those cars and outrun the people in the ford pickup, then while watching T2 when the Mac truck is barreling at them, the Terminator points out that the truck cant go above 55mph, providing logic as to why they are being overtaken. Someone clearly asked that question in production of T2, no one filming Dark Fate gave a shit.

Of note is that its rare that directors cuts add anything meaningful to the film. At best they are just more content. Despite not watching either in many years it immediately caught my eye that the Terminator does progressively get sillier towards the end, in the directors cut this is explained more forcefully, though not necessary, through them essentially turning on his emotion chip. I also did notice that it's not "clearly" explained why the T-1000 really starts to fall apart near the end, though if you pay attention at the beginning its noted hes a "prototype". In the Directors cut, I recall he slowly breaks down over the course of the movie with a few extra scene of him struggling to pull himself back together as he takes damage. I think in a vacuum I prefer the directors cut, but both versions are solid films.

*Im sorry I just dont like Terminator Salvation. I like a lot of the ideas, but I hate Sam Worthington. The resistance are fucking idiots and Kyle reese irritates me. I go back every once in a while trying to convince myself to like it, but I just cant. Even the heart thing was dumb.
 
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Xprimentyl

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And you know, she also kind of raped the dude.
Chances are, almost certainly not, but as you point out, that we're left in a position to ask is a bizzare choice of writing.
So yes, she very much raped him,
Verdict: no rape. Steve consents to sex with Diana.
It's rape, end of discussion.
Chalk another vote for "Wonder Woman raped a dude".
Ugh, can we just fast forward to the Zack Snyder remix of this movie already? I mean, I won't watch it, but apparently he can fix it.
 

BrawlMan

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Ugh, can we just fast forward to the Zack Snyder remix of this movie already? I mean, I won't watch it, but apparently he can fix it.
Zack Snyder literally does nothing for me at this point. I honestly don't need another cut in this movie. If it happens, whatever. WB, it's always two steps forward and then three steps backwards putting a rocket launcher towards your feet.

I know you're making a joke, I was just throwing that out there. Me venting.
 
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Piscian

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Ugh, can we just fast forward to the Zack Snyder remix of this movie already? I mean, I won't watch it, but apparently he can fix it.
I realize it's a joke, but I do think it's pretty unrealistic. WW84 was a big bland success. I'm sure the number crunchers have confirmed the numbers are good, but don't support a revisit. Its weird to think Zacks Justice League cut was a big success driven by "toxic fandom". I may be living in a bubble because moviebob ranted about it over and over, but I recall the media making a big deal about what a joke the snyder cut petitions were and how it was purely toxic comicbook fans. I didn't actively support it, but Im very obsessive about either seeing or finding out the details of half finished films. I'm happy it happened and it was icing on the cake that it was decent. I usually hate everything Zack Synder touches. So, does that make toxic fandom a good thing? Kinda of a mixed message, assuming everyone is in agreement that those fans were toxic.

With WW84 I think the media message has been consistent "Its a mess, but it's watchable. Moving on.." unless some bizarre vocal minority makes a stink about it I don't see an extended directors cut happening.

I'd love to see the 20-30 minutes that missing from the movie, but I dont see it happening.
 
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happyninja42

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So, does that make toxic fandom a good thing?
No, no it does not. No amount of good material (which is debatable) justifies acting like an asshole to other human beings, because someone is butt hurt about how a movie came out.
 

Xprimentyl

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I know you're making a joke, I was just throwing that out there. Me venting.
I realize it's a joke, but I do think it's pretty unrealistic.
You're both correct; I was being flippant regarding the resurgence of the back and forth in this forum over whether Wonder Woman is a rapist and how Snyder's Justice League cut was [purportedly] a vast improvement over the original release. I've not even seen the film to lend any credence to that latter statement nor do I care to see it.
 

Agema

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As I understand it, having not seen the film, the stone used a real dude's body, and basically just hijacked it and gave Steve control of it for a while. Which, if that is accurate, completely body snatched him, and stole all of his autonomy. So yes, she very much raped him, because he had no way to give consent. Being John Malkovich did something similar, and it was shown to be a pretty horrifying thing for the person being body controlled, and for the person being trapped inside the head.
I've not seen the movie, but I would take a guess and conclude it is not rape because rape is still subject to mens rea. In order for it to be rape, WW would need to have good reason to believe that a real guy's mind had been displaced from his body to make way for Steve's.
 

happyninja42

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I've not seen the movie, but I would take a guess and conclude it is not rape because rape is still subject to mens rea. In order for it to be rape, WW would need to have good reason to believe that a real guy's mind had been displaced from his body to make way for Steve's.
As I understand it that's exactly what happened in the film. It was Person A's body, but Steve was piloting it as his own. And then when Steve leaves at the conclusion, Person A is back in control of his body. The stone didn't magic up a new body for Steve, it took an actual person, displaced his sense of self and agency in the matter, and let Steve pilot him. Then Diana banged him while Steve was the pilot.

She SAW him as the other person, not as Steve. As I understand it, the fact that we see Chris Pine walking around in the film, is a favor to the audience, so we know "Oh ok this is Steve, not Johnny Random just talking to Diana." But SHE is still seeing the other dude's body. I could be wrong, because apparently this part of the script is part of what was heavily butchered in the rewrites and stuff but, that's the gist I've seen from sources online.
 

Johnny Novgorod

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I've not seen the movie, but I would take a guess and conclude it is not rape because rape is still subject to mens rea. In order for it to be rape, WW would need to have good reason to believe that a real guy's mind had been displaced from his body to make way for Steve's.
Steve co-opts another dude's body in mind and spirit against his consent (though it was WW's wish), then WW rapes the possessed body of this other guy. There's a mirror scene that makes it clear it's still 100% this other dude's body.
 

Piscian

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Steve co-opts another dude's body in mind and spirit against his consent (though it was WW's wish), then WW rapes the possessed body of this other guy. There's a mirror scene that makes it clear it's still 100% this other dude's body.
I would have to concur. The law explicitly states penetration without permission so if he were to press charges I think he'd have a case. I don't know any DC characters of the top of my head that are lawyers though. If I were handsome Man I would start by approaching Ralph Dibny who is both a detective and has experience with sort of thing after infinite crisis.

Man I couldnt find any major lawyers. Had to ask on reddit.
 
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Xprimentyl

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I would have to concur. The law explicitly states penetration without permission so if he were to press charges I think he'd have a case.
I'm sorry, but what straight man in his right mind would press charges if Gal Gadot "raped" him? If anything, I'd press charges because I wasn't "there," and demand a re-do.
 

happyninja42

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I'm sorry, but what straight man in his right mind would press charges if Gal Gadot "raped" him? If anything, I'd press charges because I wasn't "there," and demand a re-do.
.....you do realize that just because some woman is hot, doesn't mean someone wants to be fucked by them right? I mean seriously, swap the genders around and see how good that sentence sounds. "I'm sorry but what woman in her right mind would press charges if Brad Pritt "raped" them?"

Maybe he is married, and is now saddled with the fact that he slept with someone else, and thus cheated on his wife without his knowledge. Maybe he/she has an STD and now someone is sick. Maybe they're asexual and find the idea of sex with anyone as disgusting and horrific. Remove the fact that "hey it's the smoking hot Gal Gadot" from the equation and just look at the situation. It's not a good situation, no matter what way you slice it.

I mean hey, maybe Steve, after hijacking your body, turns out to be a criminal rapist, and goes around fucking a bunch of people against THEIR consent, with YOUR body, now you're on the hook for those crimes. Because nobody's going to believe "hey it was the dead ghost of Wonder Woman's cherry popper from 100 years ago that fucked those kids, not me"

It's just REALLY messy and icky, and really shouldn't have been how they took the plot if they were going to involve sex.
 

Piscian

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I'm sorry, but what straight man in his right mind would press charges if Gal Gadot "raped" him? If anything, I'd press charges because I wasn't "there," and demand a re-do.
Ah, but how do we know he's straight? I dont recall that being explicitly stated could be wrong. Worse what if hes already an abuse victim?

I hate to say it, but I think he's got a pretty solid civil case against WW. Criminal seems iffy. I'd need to rewatch to recall if she knew full well the implications of what she was doing. Shes lucky most of the major DC lawyers are MIA in the current DC Continuity.
 

happyninja42

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Ah, but how do we know he's straight? I dont recall that being explicitly stated could be wrong. Worse what if hes already an abuse victim?

I hate to say it, but I think he's got a pretty solid civil case against WW. Criminal seems iffy. I'd need to rewatch to recall if she knew full well the implications of what she was doing. Shes lucky most of the major DC lawyers are MIA in the current DC Continuity.
It's things like this that make me miss shows like Harvey Birdman Attorney At Law, and Venture Bros. where they actually point a real world lens at the insanity of things that happen in superhero universes.
 
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Gordon_4

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It's things like this that make me miss shows like Harvey Birdman Attorney At Law, and Venture Bros. where they actually point a real world lens at the insanity of things that happen in superhero universes.
Man that show would have had a fucking field day with WW84. And it would have been gloriously hilarious. I miss Harvey :(
 
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Xprimentyl

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Sorry my sarcasm filter is kind of broken when talking about people online making that very defense 100% seriously, so I wasn't sure.
*gasp* I would hope my reputation as an even-tempered-if-loquacious poster around here would precede me. That you would take me seriously hurts my feelings.;)
 
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Piscian

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It's things like this that make me miss shows like Harvey Birdman Attorney At Law, and Venture Bros. where they actually point a real world lens at the insanity of things that happen in superhero universes.
Thats where my head was at like ok if were calling it rape lets imagine how this would play out in court. Unfortunately theres no DC version of that the closest thing we have Harvey birdman. I should really pitch this to adult swim. I actually think it would be kind of hilarious if Two-face represented Handsome man.

Ironically the reddit thread where I asked about DC lawyers went around and around, but because DC gets reboots so much, so far no one knows any DC lawyers.

Hell l could see execs rebooting the DC movie universe again after the Black adam stuff gets done.
 
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happyninja42

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Thats where my head was at like ok if were calling it rape lets imagine how this would play out in court. Unfortunately theres no DC version of that the closest thing we have Harvey birdman. I should really pitch this to adult swim. I actually think it would be kind of hilarious if Two-face represented Handsome man.

Ironically the reddit thread where I asked about DC lawyers went around and around, but because DC gets reboots so much, so far no one knows any DC lawyers.

Hell l could see execs rebooting the DC movie universe again after the Black adam stuff gets done.
Personally I'd rather not see a case about magical body snatching + sexual assault for lulz? I mean I get your point, but there are some topics I wish they'd not bother with. And instead do things like debate Maritime Laws with Aquaman regarding Atlantis and such. :LOL:

As to the DC lawyer question, I think, given how often DC characters don't have double lives, at least on average as often as Marvel, they don't let them have mundane jobs? I mean several of them are literally mythic beings from other planets. You'd probably have to go to the supporting cast/sidekicks to find anyone with legal background.