Do you dislike JRPGs? (Flamewars unwelcome)

[Don Savik]

Here's some promotional art for three games NIS America just announced:

Spoiler

The classic angsty teenager character type is pretty much dead, you'll only see them pop up in 5 year old games getting brought over to the states. Hell even Square Enix is doing it (see FF13 X2's main character.

This unfortunately prompts a new question: Have any of those characters ever eaten or been out in the sun at all? The scrawny youth who is obviously still too young to buy booze is to Japan what the grizzled male with short brown hair is to the West.

Ok so no androgyny teens, but the characters I see are:

1. Teenage witch with tits, hat, and hair extremely out of proportion. Sexy fetish character
2. Cute 2-d loli girls with no defining differences (hair color is a common differentiating device in anime art...and its stupid)
3. Androngyny teens (wut?) and the boy is wearing a vest that my gay friend wouldn't ever wear because its that ridiculous. Why would anyone think someone would wear a vest that only is large enough to cover your nipples?

The bottom line about the whole "androngyny teens" thing is that some people just find the art design ridiculously silly for no apparent reason (besides the obvious fetish characters). Some may think its cool, but I think it looks like a tour bus crashed on its way to a fashion show. Different strokes for different folks I guess.

Oh, and 13-2's main characters are a meterosexual Jonas Brother and a submissive rape-bait girl, both japanese stereotypes I've seen numerous times before.

 

[jklinders]

I don't dislike them.

I don't particularly like them either. I prefer my RPG to have a bit more character customization. I Do like the idea of well written self contained story that JRPGs offer, but there is a bit too much of a cultural gap for me to cross. There tends to be too much separation between gameplay and story and the art design really can get on my nerves.

The predication of really too young folks involved in heroic roles is just the icing on the cake. Don't these writers ever think kids should be kids? I am pretty much quits with menu based combat as well. That is a 25 year old gaming convention that really needs to be buried and forgotten.

Those are the big points, everything else too nitpickey to mention.

 

[Charli]

Like some, dislike quite a few others, there are a few that break the formula (usually those that mix up the combat) for me and just shine. Others, I can see why the stereotype came into being in the first place.

With all things, I will never write off a genre entirely, I will always give them a chance to surprise me.


Kingdom Hearts and Tales of Symphonia ranked very highly with me. (I think I might have a fetish for mashing buttons and getting beautiful sparkles in return though)

 

[RedEyesBlackGamer]

JRPGs will do some crazy stuff story or setting wise that I don't see WRPGs doing. Fighting Hitler and and his army of supersoldier Nazis and mechs using aspects of myself that manifest as mythological figures is just awesome.

 

[Vegosiux]

Well Disgaea is cool!

As for JRPGs in general? I dunno, so far most that I played were tolerable at worst, so they can't be all that bad. I mean, stereotypes are present in both JRPGs and WRPGs.

J vs. W
15 year old kid vs. a grizzled veteran
Lots of unresolved sexual tension vs. lots of unresolved sexual tension
Story runs on drama/innuendo vs. story runs on contrived coincidences
Lots of level grinding vs. lots of mook zerg rushing
Obvious beef gates vs. Obvious locked doors and inexplicably destroyed bridges
Ragtag bunch of misfits for a party vs. ragtag bunch of misfits for a party

Stuff like that, both sides are guilty of stereotypes, and I've grown jaded enough to just accept the presence thereof, and only go "Wow, this one was awesome" when they are either downplayed, or overshadowed by what makes the game truly stand out (Aforementioned Disgaea where there's less drama and a lot more snark-to-snark combat for JRPGs - it also has prinnies, dood! - PS: T with a completely different protagonist and story type for WRPGs, for example)

 

[Kahunaburger]

Games are a great medium for story telling because you can have the player learn about your world through interaction.

Really, this is something that both WRPG and JRPG devs need to understand. There are some good examples of both (in JRPGs: I like how Shiren and Recettear tell stories through mechanics, and Atlus and From Software are really good at teaching you about their worlds in a natural way) but there are also a lot of bad examples (Bioware and Squeenix, I'm looking at you.)

If I may be so bold I would suggest it's not just the characters, I mean they can be great, but rather how the characters can interact with each other. Take ToS, that game does a great job of not only showing how characters interact with the main character Lloyd, but how they interact with each other. Zelos and Sheena irritate each other but do have a genuine friendship buried underneath it, Regal looks at Genis' romantic ambitions towards Presea with a sense of mirth, Raine knows something is up with Kratos, etc.

Also this.

 

[Onyx Oblivion]

It depends.

I'm an odd bird in that I play JRPGs pretty much purely for the combat systems, since the genre is much more diverse in that record than...anything, really.

All I need is a good combat system, and the story that's good enough to at least hold my attention, and I'm set.

So, FF13 and FF13-2 are pretty damn good in my eyes because I find the combat brilliant, but I know better than to suggest them to the more "classic" RPG player.

Now, NIS America just manages to put out horribly localized games that usually have combat systems that I feel are atrocious, while also having really boring plots. And Atlus...Well, let's just say I'm not a big Persona fan. Or SMT fan in general. It's the modern Japanese setting that makes me dislike them, honestly.

As for the Tales series, the only one I really enjoyed was Vesperia. I just got rid of Graces F after hating it. The combat was good but the story was too bad and generic for me to put up with it just to get to the combat.

 

[Waaghpowa]

I don't like most Japanese games in general. Can't say why really..

 

[renegade7]

I like a few, Golden Sun, Xenosaga, Tales series, and some of the Final Fantasy games, but those are an exception to the rule. Usually it's the story and characters that bother me, they are either too weird, too fantastic, too cookie cutter and cliched, or just impossible for me to like.

And also (and this is the main thing putting me off from playing more JRPGs), the same plot twists and themes used over and over get really old. "But he was just a pawn for the REAL bad guy" or "She/he has amnesia that will conveniently be cured in an emotional epiphany at an ideal plot point" or perhaps "man/woman who keeps their face hidden and is really really powerful turns out to be your long lost father/brother/sister/friend/lover/etc."

 

[Coldster]

I dislike the vast majority of JRPGs because I don't like the art-style, I hate the combat style when it feels incredibly stupid, and the characters are usually extremely unlikable. Yeah, this basically describes Final Fantasy from my point of view, but also many other similar JRPGs. The ones that are good are the ones that solve these issues. Pokemon is a good example of making the combat fun, the Mother series has really good storytelling, and Paper Mario is the best JRPG of all time because it has interesting characters, a simple and enjoyable combat system, and a perfect story that always makes you want to push on.

 

[Dfskelleton]

If by JRPG's you mean the ones where everyone is a whiny teenager who has really silly hair/outfits and swords bigger than Air Force One, then yes, I do dislike them. Very much so, to be honest. It just seems so goofy, and yet these games expect us to take them seriously.
If you mean any RPG from Japan, I've never found one I particularly liked, but hey, there's always a chance I could.

 

[Adam Jensen_v1legacy]

I don't see the appeal. Dark Souls shouldn't count just because it was made in Japan since the style is pretty much WRPG. But in case it counts, then I guess I like one JRPG.
Writing in JRPG's is atrocious, characters are laughable, gameplay is boring, art style is kind of stupid but I get it, and story in most JRPG's is not worth talking about. They just look so juvenile and I genuinely feel creators of those games are insulting my intelligence. It's just not for me. If you like it, more power to you. Enjoy. I'm sure there are games I like that some of you would find boring and stupid.

 

[Squidbulb]

They're not great, but at least they keep the world's hair gel producers in business.
Overused jokes aside, I do like some of them. I liked Disgaea 3 no matter how much it wanted me to hate it. In general, the characters are terrible, as are the plots, and the gameplay is terribly overused and unoriginal.

 

[ThePenguinKnight]

How to create a JRPG.
-------------------->
Step 1: Creating a cast of characters, a check-list.
1a. Sulking male lead with mysterious tragic past? Check.
1b. Naive but strong willed female love interest in constant need of protection? Check.
1c. Confident yet wacky male character destined to become your best friend? Check
1d. Energetic under-aged jail-bait character for virgins to gawk at and fat women to cosplay as? Check.

Step 2: Everything in the middle.
Make sure you insert several hours of grinding with a 40 hour minimum for general battles and a 100 minimal for farming materials for "ultimate weapons". Afterwards just sprinkle in a giant crab monster here and there, some kidnappings, and senseless dribble about the philosophy of life from the taunting villain.

Step 3: Fight the boss
Make sure the boss battle requires an additional 10 hours of grinding than upon victory, introduce who is REALLY pulling the strings. Please note that before the battle begins the boss is required to monolog about the philosophy of life as previously stated.

Step 4: Fight god.
Create a god or demi-god of sorts that wants to destroy the planet for some arbitrary reason that makes little to no sense, preferably beaten by the power of love and friendship. 2 to 4 additional forms are recommended before defeat, but not entirely necessary.

So yeah, I'm not a fan of most JRPGs.

 

[Arbi Trax]

Would Dark Souls count as a JRPG? It's made by a Japanese studio (I think) and it's got character customisation coming out the wazoo. Some of the subtelty is still lost in translation, but I'm having a blast with it all the same.

 

[Kahunaburger]

Would Dark Souls count as a JRPG? It's made by a Japanese studio (I think) and it's got character customisation coming out the wazoo. Some of the subtelty is still lost in translation, but I'm having a blast with it all the same.

I'd say yes. From what it sounds like (still waiting for it to come out on PC haha) it's similar to Otogi in a lot of ways, which is pretty clearly an ARPG of the J variety. I suspect Dark Souls tends to get classed as a WRPG because the setting looks Western. It certainly doesn't have any of the WRPG hallmarks AFAIK, and seems to stem from a distinctly Japanese ARPG tradition.

 

[Savagezion]

I don't care for traditional JRPGs. Heavy grind, corny dialogue/presentation, characters mostly fitting 1 of 3 personalities based on gender, etc.

JRPGs are starting to broaden out a bit more, which is good, for me. However, the competition being WRPGs who are consistently catering to my tastes makes me prefer them over JRPGs.

 

[Vern5]

I'm somewhat loathe to admit this but I do tend to enjoy JRPGs, especially those with ATLUS somewhere in their development credits. Of course, I use the term 'enjoy' rather specifically.

JRPGs entertain me in a way that is mostly nostalgic or as parody of old, clunky, turn-based games. I'm never one to doubt the presence of an ironic joke so JRPGs sort of make me laugh in that way.

I can tell where most of the resentment towards JRPGs in general comes from, though. If I were to ask one of my friends if they liked JRPGs they would probably recall what a boring time Final Fantasy was and tell me they suck. I'd have to agree with them in that regard; many of the most widely known JRPGs suck the fat one despite their fame. It could be said that they are famous purely because they create such a polarizing effect in those who are aware enough to attempt playing them.

On the other hand, there are little-known gems of JRPGs that many people overlook. Not all people, but many. Games like Saga Frontier 2, Legend of mana,Skies of Arcadia, Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Survivor, and Dragon Quest IX are all less than internet-renowned but are still amazing games in their own right. But to the layman, these titles are but mere gibberish.

If anything, I would have to say that JRPGs, on a whole, are misrepresented by shit titles shoved out by the rapidly decaying Square-Enix.