Don't Film These Games!

[ZeroMachine]

Remember that article that you wrote a while back, with the beautiful story about the aliens going to earth and asking the boy to tell them a story they've never heard? The one that doesn't glorify the overall picture, but says that it's all the little details that count? That was an amazing article. Beautiful story, beautiful lesson.

It's a damn shame you seem to completely ignore that lesson when it comes to Halo.

I like you, MovieBob, I really do, but every time I hear you bash Halo for being "just like everything else sci-fi", I just want to take that smiley face in your videos and punch it until it bleeds like the Watchmen logo.

From one nerdy Bostonian to another, man, I implore you, read the freakin' books. Look at all the little details. The game's stories aren't the best, yeah. But the Halo universe itself is rich and ripe for storytelling, and has some amazing characters in it.

If, after you've read the good ones (the Flood isn't one of the good ones...) you still don't like it and still find it bland, at the very least I'll be able to fully respect your view, if not totally understand it.


EDIT:

Shadow of the Colossus: You Have No Story

I adore this game, too. The idea of having a game consist of fighting giant colossi and their demise revolves around a puzzle is beyond genius. Here is the shocker: Shadow of the Colossus HAS NO STORY. It has a set up. Go and kill these colossi to save the princess. It just says, "Hey, we need you to kill these things. Just roll with us and do it." There isn't an option not to kill them incase you're feeling introspective; it's all about solving the puzzle of each colossi's defeat. And what about the ending? Did that make any sense to anybody? Again, I love this game but there is no story, just a feeling of being alone and sometimes remorse for having killed colossus. If you're convinced there is a story run through a synopsis of it in your head. Girl (because there is no way someone with that face is a guy) is told to kill colossi. Girl kills colossi. Battles are totally awesome. WTF ending, Girl gets horns. WTF.

Spoiler: The Story of Shadows of the Collosus

... The story is about Wander, a BOY who's lover died during a war. He brought her to a forbidden land said to hold the secrets of the dead, hoping to bring her back. All he brought with him was his horse, his bow and arrow, and a sacred sword that he... somehow... got... I'll give you that, the sword is never explained.

On arrival, a voice begins to speak with him and explains that to bring the girl back to life he must unlock the realm's power by defeating, you guessed it, the Collosi. He does so, defeating them one by one, becoming stronger with each kill, but with his physical appearance becoming more and more dark and demonic.

Meanwhile, the elder of his people and some soldiers follow him, in order to stop him from making a huge mistake.

Wander finally succeeds in defeating the last Collosus after losing his horse. The voice then admits his whole plan- he was a demon, Dormin, sealed in the realm ages long past, his power split into the sixteen mindless Collosi. Defeating them revived him within Wander's body, and the monster took hold. But, the elder chasing Wander caught up, and using his magic, stops the demon from being completely revived. Dormin is seemingly slain, and Wander is dragged into a magic well.

Wander's lover wakes up and walks over to the magic well to find a baby with horns laying in there. She picks up the child and begins to care for her.

Ico is a decendant of that very child.

EDIT: Looking back on what I just typed, I got a couple of the facts wrong (it outright states he stole the sword, the girl was not killed in a war but wrongfully sentenced to death) but the point still stands: the story for Shadow of the Collosus is there for all to see, it just isn't in your face.

 

[Arcane Azmadi]

As usual, an interesting article. A few points:

As we all know, they've already got a Shadow of the Colossus movie in development. It has the producer of The Scorpion King and the screenwriter of Street Fighter: The Legend of Chun-Li. It is going to be DIRE, unquestionably the worst video game movie ever made, largely because it is going to completely rape, violate and degrade one of the gaming industries most cherished Mona Lisas. I posted a thread suggesting that the ONLY way it could not suck was to make it a prequel which fleshed out the backstory and didn't even go NEAR the colossi, but response was unenthusiastic. So we're just going to have to settle for lynching the entire production crew once it comes out. Get the ropes ready.

One of the few things I've found I disagree with Bob on is his opinion on that Mortal Kombat short. I am personally so OVER Mortal Kombat- its style of absurdist fantasy where martial artists in funny hats, extradimensional stripper princesses, thunder gods, multi-armed dragon-men and cybernetic ninjas battle in a war to decide the fate of the universe by fighting each other one-on-one in an organized tournament is just so much 90's kitsch. Like the comics of Rob Liefield, it's something we thought was the definition of awesome when we were young and stupid, but now we're older and more mature we look back on it (or I do anyway) and realize it was just so DUMB. I've never seen the Saw movies so I'm not over that gritty style yet and I thought it made a serious attempt to justify the lunacy of Mortal Kombat's over-the-top cast of freaks and lunatics which seemed like it would actually work- don't tell me that portrayal of Reptile wasn't FAR scarier than the game character ever could be. I found it very interesting and exciting.

 

[00m]

Bob,
What about the pre-seven Final Fantasy games; final fantasy VI strikes me as game that could (with some effort) make a good 3-4 hour animated epic (Miyazaki directing, and Mark Hamill playing Kefka). I also believe the same applies to Chrono Trigger (if they gave Chrono a good personality). What is your take?

PS Thanks for getting me off of Halo and into classic SNES games.

 

[Dectilon]

The Mortal Kombat "trailer" looked pretty good. By that I mean the special effects and maybe a kick or two. The script was laughably bad. Fan-fiction-by-thirtee-year-old-boy bad, and although the first MK-movie was terrible it was at least campy enough to be entertaining. From what I could gather from the trailer it's a bit too ass to even work as that so I hope they don't get the response they need to make an actual movie.

Uncharted I think could actually make a decent film, but it's really hit-or-miss. Who says Indiana Jones is the only one who's allowed to hunt for treasure in exotic environments?

I haven't read any Halo books, but if they're anything like that one Mass Effect book I think it's safe to say it's a terrible idea. We gamers often get tricked into thinking the story of a game is worth a shit just because there's a lot of it. "Expanded Lore" is something I hear used as a positive phrase way too often. Mediocre writers producing pages upon pages of constrained crap isn't really doing the games any favors. Rather it reveals their plots for how stupid they are.

 

[NeoShinGundam]

You know what game would make a great movie? Plants Vs. Zombies!! Not a multiplex film, but a series of animated shorts would be a LOT of fun, IMHO.

 

[Vrex360]

I'd agree with most of those but I am dissapointed that once again you had to target Halo. As others have said there is well and truly enough room in the Halo-verse to make a good movie and Halo's story is not all just 'man versus aliens'. This is made very clear in Halo 2 where you find yourself playing AS the aliens themselves and see that they aren't really that different from the humans.

Sure, Masterchief isn't the greatest protagonist ever but there's still a plentiful supporting cast not to mention even at its most simple the Halo trilogy story is at least enjoyable enough to be a well put together Sci Fi epic. There's a lot of different angles to take like the Spartan Project, the Covenant civil war, the Foreunner Flood war, the Halo rings themselves. Then finally everything coming together for one huge final battle.

All I'm saying is, give it a chance. You yourself said that you enjoyed Legends and to be brutally honest, your claim that it undermined the franchise was outright false. Almost everything covered in Legends was true to Halo canon with the exception being a few depictions of characters and the Japanese styled elites.
All I'm saying is, the true hardcore fans are the ones who read the books, enjoy the story and listen to the music and of whom would love to see the depth of the franchise on the silver screen if done right.
Unfortunatley they are always confused with the annoying gibbering morons on Xbox Live who incidentally play the same game. These are the ones who go crazy for gun lovin' machismo which to be fair you yourself in the A-team review seemed to think wasn't actually a bad thing.

Sorry if that went too far I just felt I needed to explain my position. I still agree with you on most things and to be fair I'm still not entirely convinced that video game movies are ever a good idea and the occassional good ones haven't made me change my mind so I'm still not sure what my position is on this at all.

But for the record I may disagree with you on a few points but I still respect your opinion and very much enjoy your reviews.

 

[PrarieDog_319]

I mostly agreed with bob regarding movies and games. It's not that movies are inherently better at telling stories than games, its mostly down to "whats gonna sell". And that's knidof what the following rant is about.

I'd like to apologize in advance for the wall o text (skip to the bottom for the abridged version) but I've been thinking about this for awhile and this article reminded me. Consider everything between the dashes justification for the points at the bottom for the less easily persuaded.

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Look at these pictures of the Halo ODST trailer.

http://i636.photobucket.com/albums/uu85/BeforeCrisisIGN/odst-2.jpg
http://ugc.kontain.com/video/20090905/prod_1ed479e9-edbc-4476-a01e-df02e557bae5/tb_640x480.jpg
http://multiplayerblog.mtv.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/halo3odst_liveaction.jpg
http://www.co-optimus.com/images/upload/image/2009/halo3odst_live.jpg
http://img.youtube.com/vi/ub5eE7gk6Qg/0.jpg
http://i.ytimg.com/vi/PRhg1_BWHwM/0.jpg
* http://cache.gawker.com/assets/images/9/2009/09/500x_halo_3_odst-la.jpg

Some words that come to mind are:

Dark, Gritty, Serious, Compelling, tense, dirty, HUMAN.

Right off the bat you know who this character is (Tarkov is some Russian guy), what he's doing (Attempts and passes ODST training), why or what motivated him to do it (saw some dude die). You then see him dropping from down in his pod and enter a chaotic battlefield that the series will never visit. He gets pimp slapped by a brute who then gets teamkilled by a noob banshee pilot. The video ends the same way it started (at some guys funeral), where the viewer realizes that the trailer was Tarkov essentially reliving the experience that made him join the ODSTs in the first place. And since your subconscious just witnessed a second funeral, the viewer is then prompted to do what? Join the ODSTs of course. I'm telling you that in that 2.5 minutes you know (and subconsciously identify with and relate to) that generic space marine more than the protagonist(s) that the series is essentially about. So Bungie DOES at some level understand story telling.

*Edit: You also witnessed Tarkov undergo a change within his character albeit a very superficial one. This is called an "arc". He starts off as a scared recruit, but ends up as a competent soldier. Not a perfect example as he's not characterized, but name one difference between the Master Chief in Halo 2 and 3. There are none, because he is a nobody whom we are told nothing about, and are thus never given any reason to care about.

(Here's the trailer I guess)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRhg1_BWHwM&feature=PlayList&p=89A6102384166E9B&playnext_from=PL&playnext=1&index=21

Notice how the trailer lacks giggling grunts, stupid dialogue ("Orders are orders, and those are my orders" lt. Veronica), and soldiers wearing a hundred pounds of gear bouncing around the battlefield while maintaining perfect aim.

Now lets compare it to a few Halo games.

http://img.hexus.net/v2/gaming/screenshots_xbox360/halo3/halo2_large.jpg
http://images.wikia.com/halo/images/7/78/Grunt.jpg
http://hiphopolitic.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/jar_jar_binks_large1.jpeg
http://hardcoregaming.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/halo-wars-gameplay.jpg
http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/old/entertainment_videogames/images/2007/09/24/h3_thestorm_fp04_copy.jpg
* http://blogs.wvgazette.com/pluggedin/files/2007/08/4pftwbig.jpg

Definitely compare the last two screens, because it provides perfect contrast.

I think of words such as:

Bright, wacky, colorful, silly, shallow, clean, artificial.

Now this isn't a case of "omg trailer is fake!!11". It is much more than that. Bungie has made 5 live action trailers so far and they are all similar. I am seeing a definite pattern here. Find me one Halo player who doesn't like any of the trailers. The problem here is that even if you did, why would someone make an advertisement that people DIDN'T like? They spent the thousands necessary to bring an idealized version of their universe that IS NOT SHOWN IN THE GAMES.

I don't really enjoy Gears of War or COD4 that much (I'm a PC buff anyways), but they are closer to the mythical world of Halo Live Action Trailers than the actual Halo games are.

http://www.ripten.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/06/cod4_1_hr.jpg
http://splitscreenonline.files.wordpress.com/2008/02/gow1.jpg

My point is this. Bungie for some reason feels that it is necessary to advertise the Halo universe not as its wacky colorful midget space opera, but as a dark, and serious military shooter. So then:

WHY NOT MAKE A GAME LIKE THIS?

Obviously they would like to. My hypothesis is that Bungie has basically become the Halo fanbase's bitches where even the slightest change means a Tsunami of hate mail. Personally I think they'd like to make the game more like their novels and something I'd enjoy playing. So what if it looks more like other FPS games? The fact is Halo has visited some pretty big ideas in both the games and the novels despite its underwhelming presentation. Tell me now if stupid, asthmatic, gummy bear bad guys and plastic nerf guns should share the same space as thought provoking and relevant ideas like:

*Genocide
*Colonialism vs Independence
*Religious Fundamentalism and Holy war
*Rebelling against your society
*The Origins of life on Earth
*Collectivism vs Free Will
*Needs of the few vs Needs of the many
*Needs of the State vs Needs of the Person
***Using Children as experimental SOLDIERS against their will***

These are huge topics that could be explored in the GAME. But I kid you not, in Halo 3 the story is literally hidden away in terminals that most players probably walked past the first time to begin with. If they actually made the existing story in Halo part of the game and not some stupid pamphlet you pick up somewhere else, the series would finally deserve its reputation. Games are BETTER at telling stories than movies ever can be. A game has 10 hours+ to get its point across while a movie has maybe two and a half. But clearly whoever is responsible for the big, compelling ideas isn't in charge at Bungie and must find an outlet in the scattered terminals and the EXCESSIVE number of novels that must accompany the game to understand the story.

I mean even gameplay wise the plinky plonky toy gun models and sounds just ruin all of the tension. Needing 300 rounds to kill a baddie and being able to take a similar number yourself just deflates what little tension and immersion from it like a low quality balloon. In a game where every bullet, baddie, and space zombie could spell death for your character, all of a sudden the world becomes THREATENING and DANGEROUS (For example even the poorly designed Sacred Icon level in Halo 2 I still enjoy because the environment is so alien, where the flood could be hiding in any dark corner, that I am actually concerned for my characters safety. Contrast with Halo 3 where even in the bowels of infested High Charity its still bright and colorful as your average mario title). And what this mostly means for your brain is "I've been skewered by 10 bullets to the torso. That would probably hurt a lot or kill me". And when that happens all of a sudden you aren't in a GAME, but you are an actual soldier on an alien world with things that are actually trying to kill YOU and not some pixels on a screen. When you see your character with 10 spikes sticking through their head, all of a sudden your brain realizes "oh I'm playing a game, this doesn't really matter". And then you may as well go do something else at that point.

This is basic stuff and I wish whoever at Bungie keeps providing these glimmers of possible brilliance would get a chance to make them actually happen. And maybe with Reach coming up it will be different, and it being their last Halo title makes it somewhat plausible. Maybe their next project will let whoever made the trailers with the big ideas actually be in charge.

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TL;DR:

- Halo could be good. The trailers, Halo 3 terminals, and books have some great ideas. But their very existence shows a very weak level of story telling, immersion, and thus weak gameplay (I'm just sitting here playing a game, not a super soldier), in the game itself.

- COD4 and Gears of War do NOT have copyright on the dark, gritty, and human atmosphere that the live action trailers show. There's plenty of problems with those titles. Nothing is wrong with making Halo like this as long as its actually better.

- Please hire actual writers for Halo or at least let the writers get to put their ideas in the actual game.

- Bob is basically right because making Halo good would make it nothing like Halo.

 

[zelda2fanboy]

I think a Monkey Island movie could work, so long as they kept it low budget and stayed as far away from the Pirates of the Caribbean movies as possible. I'm thinking an oddball, actionless romantic comedy. Get somebody like Kevin Smith or Richard Linklater or Michel Gondry or Spike Jones. Hey, maybe Tim Schafer know how to run a camera. It's one case where an indie fan film might (emphasis on the might) be charming for once.

 

[billyzepher]

I enjoy the story of Halo, perhaps more than any other aspect of the game. It is engrossing, mysterious, with room for extrapolation. Neill Blomkamp, the rather incredible director of District Nine, and Peter Jackson, no introduction needed, both saw vast potential in the idea of a Halo movie. I'd say that it was a fair bet they got access to the Halo Bible and talked some pretty heavy story with the folks at Bungie. Now, forgive me if this sounds overly rude, but if you believe that based on your rather self admittedly limited experience with the game and neglecting to delve further into the universe of Halo at you can accurately call the story shit, you are incredibly arrogant.

Two of the pioneering minds of fantasy story-telling though it was worth the time to tell this story, whatever it may have panned out to be. And I would imagine it would have turned out to be slightly different than Starship Troopers, as the games themselves begin to deal with more human concepts, such as betrayal, manipulation, despair, sacrifice, and fear.

I think that people must begin to remember that Halo is one of those unique games that has a deep plot, but it does not beat you over the head with it. If you want to just sit down with an incredibly enjoyable shooter, you are perfectly free to do so. But if you want a game deeper than just that, it also awaits your discovery. That is, in my mind, one advantage games have.

So please remember before belittling the opinions of those who enjoy Halo that there are intelligent gamers who enjoy it for far more than big explosions and sweeping vistas. We love it because there is room to explore within it.

And regardless of YOUR opinion on it, many people enjoy it. Halo isn't going anywhere just yet, and shredding on it isn't going to make it do so. Though I can relate. There is nothing more that I wish to do than see the Avatar sequel fail in pre-production, but I can't do anything about that either, can I?

 

[RobfromtheGulag]

I could contend that games and movies run sort of parallel to each other. Swerving into the others' lane is generally a bad idea because your moniker is far better than you'll ever be.

Sure Prince of Persia's doing alright in the box office. But given time are people going to remember the game series or Gyllenhaal's rendition?

You essentially have 2 kinds of games. The Plot Heavy games and the Plot Light games. Halo and Modern Warfare are Light in that they sell games based on gameplay, not story. Making a movie would require writing a decent story and just tossing in elements from the game to let us know it's legit. Making a movie of a Plot Heavy game is going to end badly either way too; whether you try to retell the story in a different light, or if you just copy the story verbatim.

 

[Quiet Stranger]

How was that mortal kombat doohicky a saw knockoff?

Maybe that's just bob being an idiot, cause that's what it sounds like, it's not even Saw ANYTHING at all, I think Bob's feeling sick or something

 

[BlueInkAlchemist]

Christina Hendricks in a Power Girl uniform.

Do. Want.

OT: Pretty much agreed on most of Bob's thoughts, here.

 

[Traun]

One thing you can never make a movie out of - Mario. The thing is pretty much governed by dream logic and any attempt of cinematic representation is doomed to fail. In order for the movie to succeed you don't only have to butcher the story, but also the characters and the setting.

One thing you can make a movie out of is Legacy of Kain, since the game relies heavily on cinematic story telling and is linear as hell(then again it may be impossible to cramp the story within 120 minute movie). RPG's are a bad idea.

Is there really any need to complain about Bob hate towards Halo? I have already came in terms with the fact that the dude is having some illogical bias and feels the need to bash it, so I just let it slide.

 

[sunpop]

Don't forget heavy rain the game that's already more movie then game yet some company bought the rights to make it a movie..

 

[WhizEd]

I agree pretty much with everything Bob said there. Uncharted is cool, but Nathan Drake is a jerk. And I, personally, am sick of jerky protagonists in movies anyway.
I'm also a massive Halo fan. Massive. I bought the games ONLY for the campaign, and for multiplayer LAN parties (still played the multiplayer). Movie Bob has it down pat; my friends and I discuss it often; a Halo movie would only work with the Chief in a highly reduced role, or gone altogether. And any proper fan of the story (IMO) would realise that. Anyone whingeing about it obviously doesn't understand the first thing about character and plot in movies. The best thing a Halo movie could do (IMO) would be to either try and grasp the sense of scale from the games and short films (like in the "Believe" campaign), or to make it a much more human story, like "Homecoming" in Halo: Legends.
The best thing the game has going for it in terms of movie-adaptability is that the universe Bungie created for it is sooooo big, you can do pretty much anything with it. It can also be a disadvantage, possibly leading to a cheapening of the brand, but if used with respect, it could be really great.

 

[Fappy]

Hey cool, didn't know you were a Danny Rand fan Bob. Anyway I agree with the games that you listed and to be completely honest... its hard to think of a game that could actually translate well into a video game. News on Mass Effect being adapted has me horribly worried, but I suppose if any game has a chance Mass Effect might be one of them.

 

[Haukur Isleifsson]

That Sim's idea actually sounds fucking hilarious.

Now, I know a game that would make a great movie...no...a great TV show: X-Com UFO Defense.

Think about it. a team of multi-national secret agents fighting a constant war against a fucking alien empire that is invading the planet Earth with mysterious UFOs. You have so many character choices: The general commanding it all, the smarmy politicians who X-Com has to deal with it keep their funding, the squad that goes on the missions and the scientists who try to study the alien technology that the team captures, to turn it against the alien menace.

There is betrayal, as some nations secretly sign treaties with the aliens!

There are scary scenes, when the team first runs into fucking crysilids and their fucking goddamn zombies.

And finally, there is the fucking awesome climax, with the team taking on the alien base on mars, fighting desperately through hordes of aliens to set blow up the reactor and zoom home in a spaceship made from alien materials and good old fashioned human know how.


BAM! Awesome. Lets shoot it and make money.

That really reminds me of Stargate.

 

[Lazarus Long]

There are some good points here, in the article, and the comments. I have a couple of additions to make, though.
First, zombies are never over. There will always be an audience for it, no matter how shitty or sublime the product actually is. It's like Halo that way.
Second, I like the idea of video game movies as side stories, rather than direct adaptations. A Half-Life movie that is not about Gordon Freeman. If he's in it, it's a brief cameo with no dialogue. It's the story of either a side character like Alyx or Barney, or a new character altogether dealing with the same invasion.
An Assassin's Creed movie that does what I think the comic is going to do - focus on a new descendant of Altair and add its own wrinkles to the metaplot.
I can also see a Halo movie working if it's about some interesting grunts fighting the alien horde rather than MarySue Chief. But then, I can just watch Aliens for that.

 

[unacomn]

Correction POTC is a MI wannabe.

 

[yakapoe]

I totally agree on the whole MK trailer remake looking like crud. I think the problem is that it their attempt to make MK look feasible and gritty kind of falls on its face. Also, I've seen way too many cruddy MK movies. It's an ok videogame and makes for a worse movie.