Dragon Age II Review

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DracoSuave

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Talcon said:
Pugiron said:
Talcon said:
The towns are basically empty, and I got halfway through the demo by smashing the auto-attack button. How the hell does this deserve a perfect score?
Did you not notice all the advertising they have done on the Escapist over the previous months?
Call me a tool, but The Escapist is one of the few professional viewers I actually trust. I can't expect them to agree with me on everything, and it's easier for me to just say The Escapist is wrong on this one; I don't think they're being bought.

But yeah, the general consensus on the forums I visit is that DLC Age II is bad. I visited the Bioware forums, and the devs really do act like children, shutting down criticism with half-baked excuses.
The problem is that the people saying it's bad have no clue what they are actually talking about. When the lack of logic used in criticism is as bad as you actually see in this thread, you get an idea of why they shut down those discussions. If you open a thread that says 'DA2 WILL HAVE NO CUSTOMIZATION' when said statement is patently false, expect your inane rantings to get shut down.

The assborne-criticism is so bad that Something Awful created an article explicitly to SHOW how absolutely retarded it is. That's how absolutely rediculous it is. In this thread ALONE you have people insisting there's no item management, no customization, it's mass effect dialog, despite all evidence to the contrary.

The general consensus on those forums is that a bunch of people who've never actually even played the DEMO of all things are critiquing the game based on their imagination. Now, you can look at reviews from people who've played the game, or you can look at reviews from people who've decided they won't even look at the demo.

Just because it's a consensus doesn't change the fact it's a consensus of idiots.
 

PeetyPeencess

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Aug 18, 2010
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Weeee~ Wow this is such an early review! Helps with the decision whether the preorder is worth it or not... The game looks amazing! :D
 

MellowFellow

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Feb 14, 2010
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Talvrae said:
MellowFellow said:
I can't wait to play it tomorrow, glad to hear the game will be enjoyable. Now I just need to decide whether I want my character to be a tank or a two-handed wep warrior.

Does anyone know if you can be a dual wielding warrior because that's what I played in DAO. In the demo you couldn't play as a dual wielding warrior, so I don't think you can be one, which makes me a little disappointed but it's not that big of a deal.
No dual wielding is exclusive to rogue now... they did to make all classes different
Aww man. I thought this would be true, oh well, I will just have to play a rogue on my second playthrough.
 

Azaraxzealot

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Talcon said:
The towns are basically empty, and I got halfway through the demo by smashing the auto-attack button. How the hell does this deserve a perfect score?
just because a game isn't controller-snappingly hard doesn't mean it's a bad game. you WANT games to go back to the days of Ninja Gaiden and Battle Toads?
 

loremazd

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Dec 20, 2008
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Talcon said:
Pugiron said:
Talcon said:
The towns are basically empty, and I got halfway through the demo by smashing the auto-attack button. How the hell does this deserve a perfect score?
Did you not notice all the advertising they have done on the Escapist over the previous months?
Call me a tool, but The Escapist is one of the few professional viewers I actually trust. I can't expect them to agree with me on everything, and it's easier for me to just say The Escapist is wrong on this one; I don't think they're being bought.

But yeah, the general consensus on the forums I visit is that DLC Age II is bad. I visited the Bioware forums, and the devs really do act like children, shutting down criticism with half-baked excuses.
General consensus is always negative on all forums.

People dont stop playing something they like to get on a forum.
 

Jennacide

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You really should note this is a review for the 360, as unless you pay attention to the video suppliment, it's never stated. And unlike the first one, where combat was different but not by much, the games are DRAMATICALLY different between console and PC now. PC does have auto-attack, skills are balanced and weighted differently, and the amount of NPCs to bash on have been increased. (All of these are from the words of Bioware themselves)

Additionally, I have to sort of take issue with calling the game beautiful. Even by console standards it's pretty bland and uninspired, and just all the videos of it I've watched show that everything except humanoid models had polycounts lowered. /graphicsTalk

Don't get me wrong. Still bought the game, still hope it's good. But let's be honest here, the one thing DA2 can't possibly have increased in over DAO was graphics. DAO had some issues, but it looked far better than the really samey worlds now and completely ridiculous animation DA2 has.
Talcon said:
Pugiron said:
Talcon said:
The towns are basically empty, and I got halfway through the demo by smashing the auto-attack button. How the hell does this deserve a perfect score?
Did you not notice all the advertising they have done on the Escapist over the previous months?
Call me a tool, but The Escapist is one of the few professional viewers I actually trust. I can't expect them to agree with me on everything, and it's easier for me to just say The Escapist is wrong on this one; I don't think they're being bought.

But yeah, the general consensus on the forums I visit is that DLC Age II is bad. I visited the Bioware forums, and the devs really do act like children, shutting down criticism with half-baked excuses.
The comment about them acting like children is particularly what bothered me. When one of their devs used the term "gigglesquee" when talking about "how cute Merill is" I wanted to vomit. Also still trying to figure out how Merill went from looking like her mid 20's in DAO to looking 14 in DA2, when DA2 takes place AFTER the Dalish opening of DAO.
 

draythefingerless

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Jul 10, 2010
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suubersnake said:
What kind of Dwarf is BEARDLESS!? That is HERESY!! By Moradin's beard, I swear had I known this I would not have pre-ordered this game to promote such sacrilege >:U

Back to the topic at hand: On the other hand I'm not really sure about this one. I can only speak from the demo, but it being called the pinanacle of the RPG is probably going a little far; that position is already claimed by Planescape: Torment.

IMO it almost seems like Bioware is coming to be hailed as a grand RPG developer because they are one of the three triple A developers that actually make RPGs. But... I'm not so sure they're actually as good as my RPG starved brain thinks then are. >_>;;
BioWare realizes sth most story tellers dont. You can have the most amusing and captivating story in the world at your disposal, but it means NOTHING if you cannot connect or understand the personas involved in it. There are only TWO devs, of the bigger ones that come to my mind, that actually understand that a story is about its characters. BioWare and Atlus. Mass Effect series is one of the best RPGs ive played since im addicted to games, because it focuses and creates sooooo well rounded characters. Williams, Tali, Garrus, Joker, Mordin, Grunt, Thane, Legion, Shepard. And for Atlus, prety much everyone in Shin Megami Tensei. They make you connect to characters, and thats why, even if its a standard go kill baddie story, you like it. Cause you connect emotionally.
 

draythefingerless

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MellowFellow said:
Talvrae said:
MellowFellow said:
I can't wait to play it tomorrow, glad to hear the game will be enjoyable. Now I just need to decide whether I want my character to be a tank or a two-handed wep warrior.

Does anyone know if you can be a dual wielding warrior because that's what I played in DAO. In the demo you couldn't play as a dual wielding warrior, so I don't think you can be one, which makes me a little disappointed but it's not that big of a deal.
No dual wielding is exclusive to rogue now... they did to make all classes different
Aww man. I thought this would be true, oh well, I will just have to play a rogue on my second playthrough.
Dont listen to that comment. There is double bladed warrior(ITS ONE OF THE GODAMN SKILL TREES, FFS).

EDIT: no wait i was wrong. sorry. posting at 5 am.
 

Canadish

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Jul 15, 2010
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draythefingerless said:
MellowFellow said:
Talvrae said:
MellowFellow said:
I can't wait to play it tomorrow, glad to hear the game will be enjoyable. Now I just need to decide whether I want my character to be a tank or a two-handed wep warrior.

Does anyone know if you can be a dual wielding warrior because that's what I played in DAO. In the demo you couldn't play as a dual wielding warrior, so I don't think you can be one, which makes me a little disappointed but it's not that big of a deal.
No dual wielding is exclusive to rogue now... they did to make all classes different
Aww man. I thought this would be true, oh well, I will just have to play a rogue on my second playthrough.
Dont listen to that comment. There is double bladed warrior(ITS ONE OF THE GODAMN SKILL TREES, FFS).
No its not. Double check it.
Only Sword and Board/Two handed Buster Swords.
 

Bobbity

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Mar 17, 2010
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Whine whine whine Dragon Age 2 sucks whine whine whine.

Jokes.
Seriously though, I'm really excited for this game. I saw a poster up at EB yesterday saying March 8, so went out today and... FUCK. Turns out that was a mistake, and it's not out till the tenth here, same as Pokemon. I really do hate gaming in Australia.

Pugiron said:
I am using my psychic powers to predict there will be a hatefully bitchy female companion that will criticize your every move but still sleep with you if you choose to romance her. Also, is ther no character customization, because Hawkeeeee looks even dumber n game than in the cinematics, like Duncan's retarded son.
Pugiron said:
Talcon said:
The towns are basically empty, and I got halfway through the demo by smashing the auto-attack button. How the hell does this deserve a perfect score?
Did you not notice all the advertising they have done on the Escapist over the previous months?
Please stop spewing your hatred, although admittedly, you're most likely right about the bitchy but surprisingly seduceable female companion :p
 

PopcornAvenger

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Jul 15, 2008
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Given that it's predecessor was far from "excellent", another glowing-with-the-hyperbole Escapist review to view with suspicion. This is becoming a trend that is leading me to try to find an unbiased site, if they exist.

Dragon Age is far, far from the "heir apparent to Baldur's Gate" they touted it to be. It now sounds like more of a fantasy clone of Mass Effect, with gameplay suffering at the expense of cutscenes and endless dialog trees that, thank you, no, does not impel me to play the game again and again just to hear a NPC say something different.

I suppose I'll know for sure if/when I find some level headed reviews -or even more certain, when I buy it at a discounted price (sometime) in the future when sales have died down.
 

demogoblin

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Apr 16, 2009
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While I find this review to be informative on the mechanics of the game, I think it is further justification for why reviews should just be a bullet-point list. The writing is terrible, essentially it seems to be: "So I use to live in New York, which is exactly like this game! Remember Empire Strikes Back? Yeah, that was awesome, just like this game! Blood all over my face!"

And then this is just too good to paraphrase:

BioWare is one of the few companies that uses the advanced computing power available to modern game designers to let you actually play a role.
Thank god, I can finally stop playing my roles on my TI-83! This doesn't read like someone who even understands how technology works, and I'm certain that's not the case.

My advice (because I would like to see reviews of decent quality in regards to video games):
-Learn to pick out the bad of the game, if you can't see any, look harder or quit, it's there. Then judge the game based on how hard it was to find the faults, how much it annoyed you, and how much it may annoy a variety of users from the hardest of core to the most casual. But don't forget to actually include real criticism, if people just want a glowing list of features they'll look at the developers website to read features like "gives golden blow jobs".
-Write your review, then cut it down by 33%. I guarantee you that you won't have to throw out sentences with game play information if you do it right
 

Drakmorg

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Aug 15, 2008
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Too bad I'm gonna be too busy this week to actually play my copy after I pick up my pre-order tomorrow.
At least I'm a jaded friendless misanthrope with nothing better to do over spring break.
 

millertime059

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Jan 7, 2011
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draythefingerless said:
BioWare realizes sth most story tellers dont. You can have the most amusing and captivating story in the world at your disposal, but it means NOTHING if you cannot connect or understand the personas involved in it. There are only TWO devs, of the bigger ones that come to my mind, that actually understand that a story is about its characters. BioWare and Atlus. Mass Effect series is one of the best RPGs ive played since im addicted to games, because it focuses and creates sooooo well rounded characters. Williams, Tali, Garrus, Joker, Mordin, Grunt, Thane, Legion, Shepard. And for Atlus, prety much everyone in Shin Megami Tensei. They make you connect to characters, and thats why, even if its a standard go kill baddie story, you like it. Cause you connect emotionally.
It's honestly a double edged argument you make. I will completely agree with you on Bioware making interesting characters in there games. Mordin, Tali, etc. gave me a real sense of being in ME2. They didn't feel like plot devices (re: most other video game characters, and most Hollywood ones too honestly) they felt likepeople, with their own motives and desires. Even outwardly cliched ones were developed into something more (Jack). The main plot... more holes than swiss cheese at points.

DA:O had some interesting characters, and some bland ones. Overall character quality is lower. The setting though is interesting. Sure it is a generic fantasy trope fest. Diminishing elves, drunk dwarves, bland humans, blah blah blah. The main plot - kill the darkspawn, beat the big bad, save the world - also generic. Backstory is good, with a good amount of detail in the world. Hints of a deep history are nice touches.

What DA:O excelled at though was setting up the factions to be believable and unique. Things like the Anvil of the Void, there are two distinct sides that each have BELIEVABLE motives. The werewolves and elves, Harroment and Bhelen, and on. Their success was that they made two or more sides that I could see why they acted the way they do. It would have been easy to make the game have the factions be objectively 'good' or 'evil', but it painted shades of grey wonderfully. Few games succeed there, Bioware has risen to this recently, and I applaud it. I will gladly play through a lackluster main story if the game is sprinkled with little delightful tidbits that make me stop in my tracks and really think. Mordin's mission with the research, I sat and stared at my choices, and actually was challenged by the choice. Same with the Anvil of the Void.

The best works of fiction will challenge you to think about your own preconceived notions, and beliefs. They make you look at the world through a different lens. Asimov, Ender's Game, Planet of the Apes, Blade Runner, Minority Report, Lord of the Rings, and now Bioware they all have moments that transcend the story to communicate with the reader. Now we haven't hit the point yet (that I've seen) where a game is able to convey that tone cohesively throughout the entire game. For now we have little snippets, gems that come up from time to time. I have great hope that this is a trend that will grow, and someday soon we will have a game where the story as a whole will stand up and demand we take note. These glimpses of brilliance from Bioware make me believe that day could be soon.

Edit: I forgot my original point. Their style is double edged because characters have been great, and I appreciate the focus, c'mon guys is a better than generic main plot too much to ask. Character focus- good, character focus at expense of stupid main plot - less good.
 

Jandau

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Dec 19, 2008
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Greg Tito said:
Dragon Age II Review

Kirkwall, where everybody knows your name.

Read Full Article
You mentioned how the game gravitated you towards the "humorous" dialogue responses and wondered if that was a mechanic. Yes, it is. Each of your choices between the three major moods (diplomatic, humorous, direct) "stack" and determine your tone in the future. Stacks are cleared between major chapters in the game, but for the most part the game will use your decisions to determine Hawke's personality in general.
 

Grey_Focks

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Jan 12, 2010
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Christ, the internet really hates this game. Then again, they DID play a demo, and from that demo they all seem to have discovered it's a 10-hour long hack and slash dynasty warriors clone. Clearly.

Seriously though, what the hell is with you people questioning the sites integrity, just because they disagree with your views on a game? Fine, leave, the site would be a better place with people like you gone anyway.
 

esin

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Feb 17, 2010
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animehermit said:
Grey_Focks said:
Christ, the internet really hates this game. Then again, they DID play a demo, and from that demo they all seem to have discovered it's a 10-hour long hack and slash dynasty warriors clone. Clearly.

Seriously though, what the hell is with you people questioning the sites integrity, just because they disagree with your views on a game? Fine, leave, the site would be a better place with people like you gone anyway.
also, keep in mind that none of the naysayers have ACTUALLY PLAYED the game.
Some have already played the demo, or the cracked version of the game.
 

Astalano

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This review just pisses on your foot and tells you it's raining.

One of the bestlooking games of this generation? I'm sitting there looking at it and it still looks like shit to me? Should I get my eyes checked because Origins looked a ton better, even unmodded.

Better, more tactical combat? The demo did nothing for me, it's just an easy tromp with unrealistic and immersion-breaking animations and gameplay. Why does a dragon need to help me when I clearly could have mopped up dozens of more darkspawn? At least Origins' gameplay and the emotions it wanted you to feel were largely the same. When DA2 is telling me I should be scared, showing me running, then the characters turn around and destroy the darkspawn with ease, I have to ask where the fear came from. Plus, the review gameplay footage screamed easy as well. I know it's fine for a reviewer to have it on easy-normal to just finish up with a game and slap a score on it, but I'm going to be going through the game on hard if I ever play it to get the right experience.

Moreover, just Kirkwall? That doesn't sound fun, sticking to one location?

More choices and immersive story? I don't know about you, but here's my thoughts on the "wheel":

-It's rubbish

-It doesn't reflect what you would say, thus breaking immersion. It feels like watching a bad puppet play if anything. RPG's will always be best without main character voice (or ideally, many voices instead of just one, which is usually the british or american accent), because everyone will have a different experience playing them. That's that ROLE PLAYING part of the game. Someone might be Australian or Russian. Is he going to sympathise with your American Shepard or relate to him? Fuck no. Furthermore, you shouldn't relate to the character, you should feel like you ARE the character. Having no voice gives you total freedom to project yourself in the role and fill the void that exists there.

-It's limiting: Why should everything fall under angel/suave/villain? Isn't that a step backwards? I'm not an idiot, I can tell what type of emotion my character will convey when he picks a dialogue option and it makes things more black/white if you don't shape your dialogue system around a few emotions. In DAO I just left Redcliffe to be attacked and killed Witherfang for Zathrian. If I had a wheel there I would have ended with some stupid "+10 renegade points" rubbish. If I can excuse my actions in the game with logical justifications, I should be able to pick that option without the game telling me what it thinks my options are in terms of emotions or morality.

-Plus, giving multiple fully developed options gives the feeling of an immersive world, while the wheel makes you feel like you're on a rollercoaster. Hint: Having a menu come up and take up half the screen is IMMERSION-BREAKING.


I also agree with the person who said this review is just a bulletpoint list of features. If reviewers are going to have such low standards for games that they're not looking for points to criticise, then I don't see the point of reviewers, because they're not criticizing, they're just explaining.

/For The Love Of The Game