Xzi said:
unabomberman said:
Xzi said:
unabomberman said:
Xzi said:
Morrowind vs Oblivion. Enough said.
Morrowind was a freaking fantastic game, ESPECIALLY with mods. But it didn't play so well on consoles. Oblivion was a dumbed down POS single-player MMO, played well on on consoles if you were brain dead; NEEDED mods to be worth playing in the least.
Are you talking about what, exactly? How complex the game was, or what? That had it been made for consoles the game would have a had a higher learning curve ergo making it better overall? Better AI, better combat, what?
Unless you elaborate the comparison in useless.
Yes. Morrowind was far more complex and had a lot more freedom than Oblivion. It was made for PC and then ported to the Xbox. The Xbox version was inevitably terrible because of the limited control scheme, and inferior graphics.
After Morrowind, Bethesda decided there was more money to be made in the console market. So they designed Oblivion around the console control scheme, and then ported it to PCs. The result was a severely dumbed down game. None of the complexity of Morrowind, half the freedom and open-world element. Less freedom of customization. Literally dumbed down for consoles.
Now this isn't to say that console gamers are dumber, just that a certain amount of dumbing down is necessary when designing a game around consoles as opposed to starting at the PC platform.
Excuse me but what you said makes zero sense. How exactly are you measuring customization, or freedom, for that matter? Is it so much bother that now every town is a closed cell? Maybe you wanted more spells? Crafting wasn't to your liking, perhaps? The world area wasn't large enough? The levelling system was stupid (I thought it was)?
You don't specify what "dumbing down" even means within your context, or its properties or under what ideology you make your statements. Your oppinion is thus rendered useless, sadly.
If you wanted specifics, you should have asked for them. Stop attempting to invalidate me by changing your choice of words.
Morrowind: Had spell crafting system based around money sink. Larger game world. More possible class/spell customization. Entirely possible to break your character if you choose the wrong skill line. Fast travel system only works throughout certain main cities. Pause system to increase tactical feedback (IE Baldur's Gate).
Oblivion: Had no custom spell crafting system. Smaller, more linear game world (much fewer side-quests available off the beaten path). Less class customization/fewer pre-set classes available. Not possible to break your character, as damn near all skills were combat related. Fast travel system worked nearly anywhere. Quick-select wheel made game more action-based and more simplistic.
I can go on if you need me to. I realize that you may have enjoyed Oblivion, as many people did, but these are the facts of it.
I kind of enjoyed Oblivion but found Morrowing near unplayable. But yes, I played it on the Xbox, that by anyone's standards was the much inferior version, the graphics got botched and the voice acting was gonzo.
But from what I can gather from your oppinion is that you wanted "more" stuff somewhere and "less"stuff somewhere else. For example: you complain about there being fewer pre-set classes (less hand holding) but not about now being unable to break your character, or the game itself, or no more ransacking item shops ad infinitum until they're dry. Those are not bad things, I believe. On less class customization we agree.
Why the game was now more action oriented I really can't say as I'm not really a fan of the combat in Oblivion, but I don't see how that was a bad thing considering the combat in Morrowing was incredibly dull and uninspired. If you didn't like the wheel you didn't have to use it, though. The way I see it the game still needs more action and les standing about swinging and moving sideways. It is after all combat, right?
As for custom spell crafting thing: http://oblivion.wikia.com/wiki/Spellcrafting
So...yeah...maybe
that wasn't to your likeing? maybe not as thorough, perhaps.
As for the default spells mostly being combat related, that's right. That's one
real wrong thing with the game. But as for the world size? That's what Bethesda's been doing since after Daggerfall (making the world smaller), so Morrowind was a massive "dumb down," as it was, as not everyone was as hardcore so as to go through every ink and cranny of the whole game world. They had the same problem and so we ended with Oblivion which, to me, was as unispired and monotone in palces as Morrowind did, except shinier and less blocky.
The question should be:
why do we need a bigger world, or a more complicated interface? How does that benefit the game, or the experience in general? More polish instead of more stuff would have been better, IMHO. Bethesda could barely handle a game of Oblivion's size without becoming repetitive, and Morrowing was no better. A smaller, more discrete environment can sometimes make for a better, more focused experience and not lose its sense of epicness if handled correctly.
Hell, the game was plenty open ended on my account, you could just walk around and spend hours on end just doing random, useless shit for joe shmoe that didn't benefit you in the long road, or even give you important plot related stuff (you could even kill joe shmoe), you could go tomb raiding, item hunting, recipe hunting, book hunting, etc...though we may have to agree if you nitpick the fact that items were scattered haphazardly.
You speak about subjective stuff as if it were objective when it isn't, even going so far as to use the word 'facts'. I mean, c'm on.
What exactly would have made the game less dumbed down? No item wheel? A bigger world? More voices? Uh...wait...
