E3: Skyrim

Ghengis John

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Susan Arendt said:
We didn't get to see what the map inside a dungeon looks like, but the demo did feature the Clairvoyance spell, which will create a glittering trail pointing toward your next quest event in case you get turned around in one of Skyrim's 150 dungeons.
Hah, it sounds like Peter Monlyneux has had a bit of influence here! Having played Fable 2 and 3 I actually have come to miss the glittering trail at times when playing other games. Yes there's a degree of hand holding that comes with it, but there's also quite a lot of frustration saved. Glad to know that won't be a problem here.
 

ChupathingyX

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ultrachicken said:
If you can point out five ways that Morrowind is superior, I will be impressed.
Challenge accepted.

*Much larger variety of weapons including spears, crossbows, halberds, throwing knives and staffs being capable of melee.
*In the main story you're not just some errand boy who gets all the glory taken away at the end.
*Clothes can be worn underneath armour.
*Much more joinable guilds with different requirements and friendly/enemy factions.
*More realistic fast travel system (boats, silt striders, guild guides)

OT: Still no pictures of Argonians?
 

Kakashi on crack

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Sounds like I'll absolutely love this game, like I had expected.

Though I have to say... It almost seems like there was a main art "Style" but different artists working on it. (I understand the need, but like, artists with differing visions) For instance, the mountains just don't seem to mesh very well with the skies.

Also, extremely glad that they fixed the female shoulder thing, though the faces still almost look masculine.

I get the feeling I'll be restricted to the Nord race. That's fine, but at the same time I liked having the choice of race, as it exemplified my character.
 

PrinceOfShapeir

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ChupathingyX said:
ultrachicken said:
*Much larger variety of weapons including spears, crossbows, halberds, throwing knives and staffs being capable of melee.
*In the main story you're not just some errand boy who gets all the glory taken away at the end.
*Clothes can be worn underneath armour.
*Much more joinable guilds with different requirements and friendly/enemy factions.
*More realistic fast travel system (boats, silt striders, guild guides)
More != Better,

The ending to Oblivion didn't 'take all your glory away', you simply weren't the only hero of the story.

Who cares about clothes being able to be worn under armor? I mean, okay, it took away a lot of slots for you to put oodles of enchantments on your gear so you're stupidly overpowered. A tragedy, I know.

Having a ton of guilds likewise didn't make Morrowind a great game. Don't get me wrong, I like Morrowind, but let's at least praise it for things that actually make it better, not 'It had more of X'. A guild is just a quest chain, and Oblivion had plenty of non-guild related Quest chains.

I'll give you the fast travel, though. I don't like Oblivion's fast travel system.
 

cybran

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banksy122 said:
The game looks like a step up from Oblivion, but still a major step back from Morrowind again. The UI seems horrible and I still dislike the leveling system. I have being disappointed with everything from E3 this year. Well, everything from the gaming industry over the last few years TBH. Need to lower my expectations a lot it seems with the current age of gaming.
its made for consoles.... thus the UI with big, BIG bars so it can be played on the smallest of TVs -_-

http://www.gamersmint.com/bethesda-consoles-to-be-the-lead-platform-for-skyrim-aim-to-make-it-really-accessible
 

banksy122

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cybran said:
banksy122 said:
The game looks like a step up from Oblivion, but still a major step back from Morrowind again. The UI seems horrible and I still dislike the leveling system. I have being disappointed with everything from E3 this year. Well, everything from the gaming industry over the last few years TBH. Need to lower my expectations a lot it seems with the current age of gaming.
its made for consoles.... thus the UI with big, BIG bars so it can be played on the smallest of TVs -_-

http://www.gamersmint.com/bethesda-consoles-to-be-the-lead-platform-for-skyrim-aim-to-make-it-really-accessible
This is my issue. They shouldn't be making it for the lowest denominator. That is the worst design philosophy, it leads to no advancement and making the game worse over all. DICE have a good design philosophy for BF3. They are making it for PC and taking it down, making it a more polished product for everybody.

More developers should be like Eidos. They are making Dues Ex for PC and making a Console version separate from it. This will lead to the best possible product they could make, and from what I have heard from the beta, the new one rivals the first one.
 
Jul 27, 2009
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Whelp, time to beef up the gaming rig before this comes out. Second 6870, here I come! Here's to hoping that the game actually utilizes Graphics Cards in xFire (I'm looking at you The Witcher 2)
 

plainlake

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Did the landscapes look generic or did you feel that you needed to explore every nook and cranny? I know this is hard to say from a hands-off demo.
 

Chawx

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*0*


Im putting all my money on the fact that this is gonna be the greatest game ever made.
 

webby

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Susan Arendt said:
If you thought that Skyrim just looked like a prettier Oblivion [http://www.amazon.com/Elder-Scrolls-IV-Oblivion-Game-Pc/dp/B000V9C9FO/], you're not too far off the mark.
Am I the only one wondering why this is seen as a good thing? I don't want my sequels to simply be prettier versions of what already exists, especially since I was massively underwhelmed by Oblivion. To each their own though, I will leave this where I pre-emptively placed it, in the "meh, don't really care" pile.
 

Zom-B

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I don't want to take anything away from what Skyrim is trying to do or how great it is sounding, but I don't understand this point:

"the game lets you fight however you like simply by choosing what you'd like each hand to do."

Didn't we already do this in Oblivion? I often had a character that would blast away with spells from long range and once the enemy got closer I'd switch to melee. I guess what I'm not getting is how fundamentally different or superior the new version is. Game journalists keep touting the choice we have in combat, but it doesn't really sound new to me, just slightly evolved. Am I missing something here?
 

Susan Arendt

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Zom-B said:
I don't want to take anything away from what Skyrim is trying to do or how great it is sounding, but I don't understand this point:

"the game lets you fight however you like simply by choosing what you'd like each hand to do."

Didn't we already do this in Oblivion? I often had a character that would blast away with spells from long range and once the enemy got closer I'd switch to melee. I guess what I'm not getting is how fundamentally different or superior the new version is. Game journalists keep touting the choice we have in combat, but it doesn't really sound new to me, just slightly evolved. Am I missing something here?
Ah, ok, let me clarify. In Oblivion, you were either casting spells, or you were using weapons. In Skyrim, you put whatever you like in your left hand - a spell, a staff, a dagger, an axe, a shield, whatever - and then do the same for your right. Want to carry a shield and be armed with a heal spell? You can. Want to put a fire spell in each hand so that you can effectively wield a more powerful spell? No problem.

It's a more flexible mix-and-match approach to combat/defense. But I don't think you're wrong calling it an evolution of what was already there, though this allows for greater blending of playstyles, especially when it's combined with the new skill system.

plainlake said:
Did the landscapes look generic or did you feel that you needed to explore every nook and cranny? I know this is hard to say from a hands-off demo.
Well, the outdoor environments were very much like Oblivion - there are points of interest, like towns and caves and monuments scattered around, so exploring will definitely be beneficial. We didn't see a whole lot of dungeon, but I really liked what we were shown.
 

Zom-B

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Susan Arendt said:
Zom-B said:
I don't want to take anything away from what Skyrim is trying to do or how great it is sounding, but I don't understand this point:

"the game lets you fight however you like simply by choosing what you'd like each hand to do."

Didn't we already do this in Oblivion? I often had a character that would blast away with spells from long range and once the enemy got closer I'd switch to melee. I guess what I'm not getting is how fundamentally different or superior the new version is. Game journalists keep touting the choice we have in combat, but it doesn't really sound new to me, just slightly evolved. Am I missing something here?
Ah, ok, let me clarify. In Oblivion, you were either casting spells, or you were using weapons. In Skyrim, you put whatever you like in your left hand - a spell, a staff, a dagger, an axe, a shield, whatever - and then do the same for your right. Want to carry a shield and be armed with a heal spell? You can. Want to put a fire spell in each hand so that you can effectively wield a more powerful spell? No problem.

It's a more flexible mix-and-match approach to combat/defense. But I don't think you're wrong calling it an evolution of what was already there, though this allows for greater blending of playstyles, especially when it's combined with the new skill system.
No, no, I get that but even so, it doesn't really sound that different. I get that it's probably much better, but I think the emphasis that it's a "new" feature is misleading. Oblivion gave us lots of choice too and didn't really hammer us into a predefined class either. Sure, you chose or created one which gave your stats a starting point, but from there on out you could fight and cast spells however you saw fit, within your abilities.

Again, I'm getting that Skyrim will do it better, I just think the hype on the "choice" aspect is a bit disingenuous in some ways.
 

zefiewings

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/drool

(tried to say more, but my mouth was full)

okay I'm better. I hope the people I knew don't actually hope to see me anytime during those holidays...
 

Sulacu

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This is looking very intriguing as always. For one I'm so extremely glad that Bethesda have finally thrown away their extremely obsolete game engine for a much newer, much slicker one. If there was one thing that annoyed me about games like Oblivion and Fallout 3 it was that it was much too CPU-intensive for what was actually going on in game. My PC has run prettier games like Crysis and Crysis 2 with pretty much no framerate hitches whatsoever, and my PC still grinds down to a single-digit fps count during the final battle of Oblivion's main storyline unless I set all graphics slider to moderate-minimum. It was just plain inefficient. My hope is that Skyrim will run much better at a decent video quality. For the rest, I'm just plain looking forward to seeing it on my shelf as Blizzard, Valve and Bethesda are pretty much the only developers I care to spend money on.

The new combat system sounds especially intriguing. The interchangeability of the player character's hands sounds like unlike previous games it might actually be possible to swap between magic and combat without too much of a hassle. Still, what with the ability to switch between sword and shield, dual wielding, and magicing with either one or two hands, I hope it is still possible to wield two-handed weapons, since if magic can be made more powerful by loading a single spell in both hands, the same should be possible for melee, right? On that note, I hope that Skyrim will reintroduce a greater variety of weapons, since a lot of them went inexplicably missing between Morrowind and Oblivion.

Also, any one know if Skyrim will feature things like combat on horseback (which Oblivion, despite the ability to ride horses, sorely lacked) and better character animations? It would add a lot of immersion into the game that Oblivion in special failed to provide.

Ohe last thing; I hope that Skyrim will be a game that can stand on its own without the express need for mods. I realize that Morrowind and Oblivion thrive on its mod community, and that's not a bad thing; Morrowind, probably one of my top 3 most favorite games ever, as a game was greatly enriched by mods, adding detail and character to an already expansive game world backed by a mostly solid gameplay and interface (save for perhaps the infuriating lack of regenerating magicka and the clusterfuck quest journal), but in my opinion, Oblivion was much too reliant on third-party mods to enhance its gameplay to actual tolerable standards. When I first played through vanilla Oblivion and finished every quest I could find I was left feeling empty. The sights were wonderful and watching dead enemies ragdoll through the air in mad pirouettes after launching off of my magical lightning hammer was always fun, but as a whole the game didn't leave me with the same impression that Morrowind did, and the mods that added wandering adventurers and allegiances to the land of Cyrodiil, and new mobs to kill to the countryside of Cyrodiil, and more houses and stories to the cities of Cyrodiil and a risen water level to Leyawiin didn't manage to fill that void. All this third-party artifice made the experience more varied and enjoyable to a point, but I kept seeing things left and right and feeling that they shouldn't be there... No amount of added content could replicate whatever it was that Morrowind had and that Oblivion didn't, and as such I remained unfulfilled.

Many PC gamers today can't fathom playing Oblivion without inventory, gameplay and leveling overhauls. Between my real life friends and online acquaintances I can't find anyone that plays Oblivion without mods like O3 and Better Cities, and the fact that the actual mod support has developed actual third-party software like OBMM, designed for the express purpose of fluently incorporating mods into the game, is only further evidence of the necessity of mods to enhance Oblivion's core gameplay. All I'm saying is I hope Bethesda have been taking notes from all this third-party content, so that vanilla Skyrim will be an enjoyable experience without the whole rigmorall of mod-hunting to add spruces of substance and color to a bleak and empty shell of a game.
 

Nevyrmoore

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Has it yet been confirmed if you can duel-wield shields? Because I will be basing a character on that if it's viable.
 

T8B95

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Kahunaburger said:
On the Oblivion vs. Morrowind thing, I actually played Morrowind first, then Oblivion, then went back to Morrowind with enough graphics mods to make my laptop cry, and ended up liking Morrowind a lot better on balance. There's just more stuff to do, and the NPCs are a few steps further away from the uncanny valley. IMHO, Oblivion was a step forward on graphics and melee, and a step back on aesthetics, setting, magic, and everything else. But I definitely think there's room for difference of opinion on this issue :)
I also played Morrowind first, (on the Xbox), then stopped for a few years, then played Oblivion when I got a 360, then I decided to go back and play Morrowind again (PC this time) because I felt like Oblivion was lacking in atmosphere. Only to find out, to my shock, that there were so many problems with Morrowind that I hadn't remembered, and although I still had a blast playing it, I found that some of these problems were way more prominent than I remembered. At which point I started playing Oblivion again, and I found out what a great game it really was once I stopped comparing it to my nostalgia of Morrowind, and instead compared it to Morrowind itself.

One more thing:

...and the NPCs are a few steps further away from the uncanny valley.
What did you mean by that? The NPC's in Morrowind were essentially walking menus. They didn't do anything except wander in a predefined area. In Oblivion, NPC's have actual schedules (buggy, glitchy schedules, but still a damn impressive feat nonetheless), and they feel like real people instead of clouds of ones and zeroes. It was so endearing to me the first time I stepped into the Arena, and saw other people in there, cheering a team on. It made me feel really immersed into a world full of people.
 

Kahunaburger

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T8B95 said:
Kahunaburger said:
On the Oblivion vs. Morrowind thing, I actually played Morrowind first, then Oblivion, then went back to Morrowind with enough graphics mods to make my laptop cry, and ended up liking Morrowind a lot better on balance. There's just more stuff to do, and the NPCs are a few steps further away from the uncanny valley. IMHO, Oblivion was a step forward on graphics and melee, and a step back on aesthetics, setting, magic, and everything else. But I definitely think there's room for difference of opinion on this issue :)
I also played Morrowind first, (on the Xbox), then stopped for a few years, then played Oblivion when I got a 360, then I decided to go back and play Morrowind again (PC this time) because I felt like Oblivion was lacking in atmosphere. Only to find out, to my shock, that there were so many problems with Morrowind that I hadn't remembered, and although I still had a blast playing it, I found that some of these problems were way more prominent than I remembered. At which point I started playing Oblivion again, and I found out what a great game it really was once I stopped comparing it to my nostalgia of Morrowind, and instead compared it to Morrowind itself.

One more thing:

...and the NPCs are a few steps further away from the uncanny valley.
What did you mean by that? The NPC's in Morrowind were essentially walking menus. They didn't do anything except wander in a predefined area. In Oblivion, NPC's have actual schedules (buggy, glitchy schedules, but still a damn impressive feat nonetheless), and they feel like real people instead of clouds of ones and zeroes. It was so endearing to me the first time I stepped into the Arena, and saw other people in there, cheering a team on. It made me feel really immersed into a world full of people.
It might boil down to a personal preference thing. There are many things Morrowind does worse than Oblivion (melee combat, theft, and cliff racers being at the forefront) and many things it does better (world-building, magic, better mods, etc.) I personally like Morrowind a lot more, but I can see why other people might disagree with me, especially if you play anything other than a pure caster haha.

The uncanny valley thing is also a pure value judgment - for me, Morrowind NPCs aren't quite as off-putting as Oblivion NPCs because they're not trying as hard to be realistic. You can imagine what the text sounds like and so on. Oblivion NPCs annoy me because they talk about mudcrabs all the time and have questionable voice acting, so that's one case where I think more technology can actually be a bad thing. But once again, this is more my opinion than a factual statement, and I can see why someone else would disagree :)
 

nekroskoma

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hello drizzit clones

a topographical map will a godsend, i cant remember how times i tried to go somewhere in Oblivion and ended up climbing a mountain, or two

and the modding, love modding bethesda games
 
Nov 7, 2009
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Klagermeister said:
11/11/11: The day I say goodbye to society to play Skyrim forever in my basement.
Friends, activities, family, food... All meaningless distractions from the glory that is Skyrim.
This.

OT: I am actually annoyed about that UI font. Though the PC gaming master race being what it is, a mod'll pop up within 10 minutes to change it.