EA Share Price Slides Over Old Republic Concerns

Yureina

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May 6, 2010
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Azuaron said:
Sixcess said:
Azuaron said:
Let me get this straight, an MMO that got over a million subscribers in under two weeks, making it the fastest growing MMO at launch ever, isn't doing good enough?
Not if EA's expectations were that it'd launch with two million. I stress if because I don't know, but it wouldn't surprise me - they've been very very ambitious with TOR. EA didn't throw this kind of money around to get a moderately successful MMO.

One million isn't really that good. Warhammer Online, an infamous flop, launched with 800,000 subscribers, and that wasn't hyped to near the level of The Old Republic.

TOR runs the real risk of being unable to live up to the unrealistically high expectations of not only its playerbase, but of its investors, and that's not a good place for it to be at.
Well, let's make up some numbers and do some math here:

Star Wars: The Old Republic retails for $60, and you get a 1 month subscription with that. You can buy the thing straight from Origin, so retailers don't necessarily get a cut, and there are also a collector's edition and "security key" thing that you can buy. Ultimately, let's say they average to $50 profit per sale for the first month (I think that's probably low). It has now been a month, and, while EA/Bioware haven't released precise sales figures, current estimates place subscriptions at 1.5 million, and are expected to reach 3 million by the end of the year.

Which means EA/Bioware have currently made $75 million on the game, and will probably make $150 million by the end of the year on initial sales alone. I can't cite actual figures of MMO dropout rates, but, for the sake of mathematical simplicity (and because the numbers happen to line up that way), let's say that every time someone drops out, another person takes their place, so, at the end of the year, with 3 million initial sales, there will still be 1.5 million current subscribers. 1.5 million $12/month (they have deals, so we take the low number) for 11 months (initial month came with the game) comes out to about $200 million. Which means that, after one year, they'll have made back around $350 million.

For a non-MMO, this would be very bad. A non-MMO would need to make its money back, plus profit, basically on launch day to be considered a success, but EA/Bioware are, obviously, in this for the long haul. With 1.5 million subscribers following the first year, they'll hit the half a billion mark around August 2013, but that's assuming zero dropouts and zero newcomers. Every newcomer is $50 additional profit plus $12/month, while every dropout is only $12 loss per month. After that, everything is pure profit while they work on expansions, and expansions are much cheaper to make and easily make back their money quickly while getting new subscribers and encouraging veteran subscribers to stick around longer.

I expect EA and Bioware are perfectly happy with their sales figures. A year and a half ROI isn't bad, if you're thinking about the long term, and after that they're making millions a month while doing very, very little.
Assuming your highly optimistic guesses regarding EA making money off of TOR are correct, you still have to factor in the ongoing costs of running the game itself (servers, support, etc). Not to mention the fact that they will still be sinking money into the studio in order to generate new contest, since an MMO without new content is dead in the water once people get bored of it (and that doesn't take long).

Give TOR ~3 more months or so, and then we will probably know for sure whether or not it will sink or swim. Personally, I think it is going to sink hard. Even worse than Warhammer Online did.
 

Canadish

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Jul 15, 2010
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No Fun Allowed: The Thread.

.


Seriously though; interesting to hear. This game is huge, regardless of whether it will end in success or failure. The splash is going to effect the industry, either marking EAware as the king of the MMO market or drag them down with ship.

I'm no fan of EA and Bioware as of late (or rather, their business tactics and treatment of their customers utterly disgusts me, from the smug and snide comments of their writers, all the way to their lies, strong arm tactics and invasive spyware) and so I can't help but chuckle slightly when I hear about them stumbling. I'm hoping it knocks some sense into them and shows them that their bully behavior isn't the best tactic.
More likely they'll just assume they didn't spend enough on marketing though...

(Just another wee off topic note here: I read through the thread before posting, I'm guessing I'm not the only one a little off put my the staffs bias coming through in their OPs?
If any of the staff are reading this: Your job is to report the news as is. Don't stoop to attacking your readers just because you're not happy to hear them bashing your buddies in Bioware. As someone else said, you aborted discussion in the first post. This isn't a blog, it's a forum.)
 

Absolutionis

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Sep 18, 2008
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Jahandar said:
http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/01/20/the-force-is-with-swtor-ea-stock-bounces-back-budget-revealed/
I think many people missed this really important post.
 

Imbechile

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Aug 25, 2010
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Great!
The only way EA will stop acting like Teh EVIL is if they suffer some losses.
But I really don't understand what's the fuss. So it didn't return the investment in the first month. We need to wait about a year and then we'll see if it's a faliure or not.

Off topic:
Andy Chalk said:
The irony, it is killing me.
Actually he's right. Maybe you didn't want to, but you really did come off as a whiny fanboy who is mad because a game he likes isn't universally praised.
Maybe you didn't want us to discuss about whether or not TOR is good, but infact it's financial success. There were a lot of ways to say it nicely.
 

jimbob123432

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Apr 8, 2011
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I personally attribute the "not living up to expectations" to the general downfall of the Star Wars name. Couple that with the dislike people have over Origin and it's not surprising that this game isn't doing as well as expected. I don't play MMOs and I used to like the Star Wars franchise, but since the franchise started to slip, I didn't hold high hopes for the game. That, and why would I play a MMO (if I were to play one) that I have to pay $12+ a month for when I can play one for free (WoW, Runescape, Planeshift, DDO, LoTR, EverQuest II...)? If it was optional to pay for an improved account, I might try it, but paying for something I'm not sure about it too much of a gamble for newbs like me.
 

octafish

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Apr 23, 2010
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YOU DON'T NEED ORIGIN TO PLAY TOR! BUY A DISK AND YOU WILL NEVER HAVE TO SEE ORIGIN ON YOUR PC.

I don't mind Origin, it works as well as if not better than Steam for me. TOR isn't even released here yet, but then again I don't get enough time to play games that any P2P game is a worthwhile indulgence. I'll play it when it goes F2P.
 

TitanAtlas

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Oct 14, 2010
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EA's BS alert!!!

I belive like this last Star Wars MMO, is not my favourite cup of tea, but it's not a bad game. With a little of work between the devs and the community, you can get a pretty solid thing...

Unfortenatly this project is between the almighty, corrupt and capitalist EA. So even if Old Republic is not my favourite thing in the world, i feel sorry for them, and i acctually feel afraid for it's own future...
 

risenbone

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Sep 3, 2010
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You know what all game companies share prices do this. Seriously watch Activisions share price from when they announce a big new game till a couple of weeks after launch. You will find that as more and more people become aware of the new product the share price rises till it hits a high point a couple of weeks after launch and drops back down again. This is because game publishing companies don't generally pay out a dividend and the only way to make actual money off the shares of said company is to buy when it's low and sell when it's high. The low point is around the announcement of the new product as more people start buying those shares and create demand and the high point is just a bit after the release of the product when more people are looking to cash in on their returns and not many are buying. This is the basics of how the stock market works.
 

jp201

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Nov 24, 2009
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TitanAtlas said:
EA's BS alert!!!

I belive like this last Star Wars MMO, is not my favourite cup of tea, but it's not a bad game. With a little of work between the devs and the community, you can get a pretty solid thing...

Unfortenatly this project is between the almighty, corrupt and capitalist EA. So even if Old Republic is not my favourite thing in the world, i feel sorry for them, and i acctually feel afraid for it's own future...
You know the last star wars mmo made was by SOE and not EA. They are two completely different games in the way they played.
 

Denamic

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Aug 19, 2009
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Azuaron said:
Let me get this straight, an MMO that got over a million subscribers in under two weeks, making it the fastest growing MMO at launch ever, isn't doing good enough? What do you want? Your computer to start laying golden eggs every time your character gains a level?
In those two weeks, sure.
That's just a trick of statistics to fool the casual observer though.
You can't just pick a small timeframe where the sales peaked particularly high and call that good statistics.
The mean between launch and now isn't nearly as impressive.
 

TilMorrow

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Jul 7, 2010
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Well I can't really comment on the quality of the game or anything as I don't own it and I was unable to get a chance to play at all during the Beta test in November (server list issues and rage aplenty).[sub][sub][sub][sub]I might play it if I knew if they had gametime cards for it[/sub][/sub][/sub][/sub]

But aren't the launch subscribers first paying month starting around now seeing as the game was released on the 20 Dec? So...
 

ReinWeisserRitter

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Nov 15, 2011
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Maybe the next guys will think twice before they assume copying the top dog, but with a budget that could block out the sun, is all it takes to make hundreds of millions overnight.

Ha. Sure they will.
 

lowkey_jotunn

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Feb 23, 2011
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I've been fairly on the fence about SWTOR, but EA is the anti-selling point for me.

If SWTOR really did look like the MMO to end all MMOs, I might give it a shot, but as a somewhat amusing, middle-of-the-road game, with decent potential... I just can't get into it. Not when I have well over a dozen other middle-of-the-road games that I bought on steam sale over the holidays :)

Ain't competition a *****.


And like I said, EA is really what kills it for me. I just can't get behind the company responsible for the Origin fiasco AND who backs SOPA.

(p.s. yes I know you can buy a retail disk and not mess with Origin, but it's the principle of the thing)
 

TheGauntman

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Dec 8, 2011
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Once again, we see people receive warnings for calling out a contributor for their unprofessional conduct. It's becoming quite a theme around these parts.

OT: Did the game perform as well as EA/BioWare would have liked? Maybe not. But considering their high standards, what would have been good enough? Considering the game hasn't been released in Australia, and that we have yet to see comprehensive data on the actual numbers involved, I'll chalk this up to normal fluctuation and wait a couple months until the numbers smooth out.
 

Cyrus Hanley

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Oct 13, 2010
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TheGauntman said:
Once again, we see people receive warnings for calling out a contributor for their unprofessional conduct. It's becoming quite a theme around these parts.

OT: Did the game perform as well as EA/BioWare would have liked? Maybe not. But considering their high standards, what would have been good enough? Considering the game hasn't been released in Australia, and that we have yet to see comprehensive data on the actual numbers involved, I'll chalk this up to normal fluctuation and wait a couple months until the numbers smooth out.
Maybe if we report him the moderators will pull their heads out of their alimentary canals.
 

beniki

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May 28, 2009
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I think that the quality of the game leads directly to sales, and particularly re-subscription. Maybe asking not to discuss it was a mistake?

Having played the game now (after a month trying to get the damn thing) I can say this: It's not half bad.

Buuuut, I think that EA shareholders might have been fooled over the hype more so than the average gamer. They might have been expecting the second coming of WoW, and even Blizzard can't pull that off.

The Old Republic is like a great Summer blockbuster. Hits all the right notes, delivers entertainment, and leaves good memories (except for the arses in General chat doing the equivalent of throwing popcorn everywhere). It'll make a lot of money.
 

wooty

Vi Britannia
Aug 1, 2009
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Slap Star Wars on anything and people think it will sell.

I still think people jump the gun on this, give it time, the general rule of thumb on MMO's. Its very smooth for a new launch title, especially one that was this much in demand.
 

Little Duck

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Oct 22, 2009
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I would really love to own and play this game for a month or two. But apparently half a billion dollars doesn't quantify the potential mac investment.
 

rapidoud

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Feb 1, 2008
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For the laymen, I'd also like to note that companies aren't directly affected by Share Prices.

It just means how many shares they have to issue if they seek more Capital for another big venture and how confident the market is in their company.
 

TitanAtlas

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Oct 14, 2010
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jp201 said:
TitanAtlas said:
EA's BS alert!!!

I belive like this last Star Wars MMO, is not my favourite cup of tea, but it's not a bad game. With a little of work between the devs and the community, you can get a pretty solid thing...

Unfortenatly this project is between the almighty, corrupt and capitalist EA. So even if Old Republic is not my favourite thing in the world, i feel sorry for them, and i acctually feel afraid for it's own future...
You know the last star wars mmo made was by SOE and not EA. They are two completely different games in the way they played.
What made you think i believed otherwise?