Elder Scrolls Online Removes Six-Month Subs, F2P Rumors Arise

[Rawbeard]

Good, let's now hope it doesn't turn into a SWTOR fiasko when it goes F2P.

 

[Tiamat666]

I tried the Beta and decided Elder Scrolls Online has too little Elder Scrolls and too much MMO in it for me to like it. If Bethesda ever manage to make an MMO that plays and feels like Oblivion or Skyrim, I will play and pay for it for sure. Until then, they should better focus on their single player RPG's, which is what they're best at.

 

[Sight Unseen]

~snip~

~also snip~

It's admirable how hard you guys stick up for this game. I sincerely wish I could agree with you both, or the rest of the ESO fans who've stuck it out to see it improve. But no matter what updates they push out, no matter how many bugs they fix, there are problems at the core level turning an Elder Scrolls game into an MMO that nothing Zenimax does will solve.

ES games are sandboxes, defined by freedom and personal choice - a style which is utterly at odds with the MMO conventions of level-restricted gear, quest-locked areas, and the "theme park" location mentality that TESO does nothing to break away from. They built an MMO first and grafted some Elder Scrolls flavor to it. No matter how solid the game is functionally, it's just not the experience a lot of TES fans wanted, and so that "anti-hype train" is the kind of backlash you'll see from people disappointed and underwhelmed by what TESO turned out to be.

Is it fair? Not entirely - even as one of those disaffected fans, I'll concede it might have transformed itself into a decent, even good game by now. Ideally, it would be judged just on its own merits. But it bears the label "Elder Scrolls," and with that comes the weight of expectations it needs to live up to, or die trying. And sadly, it sure didn't manage the former.

I agree. Anyone expecting this to be "Skyrim with MMOs" is going to be disappointed. But this game does try its best to still stay true to the Elder Scrolls name in as many ways as possible without breaking the MMO fundamentally.

Is ESO completely open? No. But it has massive, extremely gorgeous zones that have a ton of freedom within them. You can pretty much go anywhere and do anything within the zone that you're currently in. The game relies on you exploring to find the game's quests, Skyshards, mage's guild books, hidden treasure chests and resource nodes. Of course you can just look this stuff up, but I think it adds immensely to the exploration value of the game to not do that. All of the quests, while many still do eventually come down to some of the typical MMO tropes, are given appropriate context and weight behind why you're doing them with interesting stories that are intertwined with other quests in the zone. Each zone has its own major narrative, which nearly all the sidequests are linked.

The crafting system does its best to mimic the exploration, personalization and creativity of the Elder Scrolls as well. Alchemy is copied nearly completely from Skyrim albeit with fewer ingredients. Again, you can look up guides on the best recipes but half of the fun is the journey and experimentation that it openly allows. The same can be said about the game's class system.

There are people who play this game like WoW. Grind to max level by farming mobs, then do PVP/raids all day. But I think that those people are fundamentally missing the joy of this game. I played ESO from launch until the beginning of September (and want to go back again now that university is done) and I did not reach max level. I'm still not even a veteran rank yet (although I'm close). But my girlfriend and I have thoroughly explored the worlds that the game takes place in, done as many quests as we could find and found as much as we possibly could, and we fucking loved it. This game very much embodies the spirit and the feeling of an Elder Scrolls game to me if you treat it less like a typical MMO and more like an Elder Scrolls game. Yes, it had to make many concessions to make the game viable as an MMO. No, I don't think that means that it's no longer an Elder Scrolls game or a generic MMO wearing an Elder Scrolls layer of paint.

And the best is still yet to come. The justice system is coming out in the next few months that will add the Thieves Guild and Dark brotherhood back into the game, as well as the ability to steal from and kill NPCs (I'm a bit out of the loop so not sure exactly how it'll work though). A spell crafting feature is being added where you'll be able to create your own spells based on the standard Elder Scrolls magic types and will require you to explore the landscape to the fullest to be able to gain the knowledge to create them. the Imperial City will soon be opening; creating a massive PVP-enabled dungeon where the factions have to fight to be allowed to enter the dungeon and earn its rewards. The game has gotten better with each update and they're still proudly teasing upcoming features.

You're free to disagree with me but that's how I feel as a fan of both ESO and the past Elder Scrolls game. And as a person who normally doesn't enjoy MMOs at all.

Fair enough, I think I am just still annoyed that they said that they wanted it to be a P2P model because they didn't want to hold anything back from their players and having a P2P model would allow that. Then they added a store with in-game items.

There is no cash store in the game. The only things you can pay for with real money is an upgrade to the imperial edition for $20 or a horse for I think $10. The horse is the weakest one in the game and most people can earn it themselves before level 20 (and it really isn't necessary until later levels anyway). The horse gives a marginal speed boost while riding it (~15%). Hardly game-breaking stuff.

 

[Sight Unseen]

I tried the Beta and decided Elder Scrolls Online has too little Elder Scrolls and too much MMO in it for me to like it. If Bethesda ever manage to make an MMO that plays and feels like Oblivion or Skyrim, I will play and pay for it for sure. Until then, they should better focus on their single player RPG's, which is what they're best at.

See my above post. Also just want to remind you that this game isn't made by Bethesda, it's made by Zenimax Online, which were created to make this game in association with Bethesda.

 

[Lunar Templar]

huh

I'd forgotten this game even existed, yay for it still chugging a long I guess?

*shrugs*

 

[snekadid]

I tried the Beta and decided Elder Scrolls Online has too little Elder Scrolls and too much MMO in it for me to like it. If Bethesda ever manage to make an MMO that plays and feels like Oblivion or Skyrim, I will play and pay for it for sure. Until then, they should better focus on their single player RPG's, which is what they're best at.

See my above post. Also just want to remind you that this game isn't made by Bethesda, it's made by Zenimax Online, which were created to make this game in association with Bethesda.

I stopped playing this game in the first month after its launch. That thing was a mess. I never suffered the crash amount that others complained about, maybe 5 from beta to launch, but the rest was mind numbing. Enemies that would suddenly fly into the air, gain hulk strength and do all of your health in a single attack that before would have barely dented your hair, enemies attacking from underground like street sharks, enemies that were unkillable but still liked killing you, quests that couldn't be completed that made major chains uncompleteable, Dungeons that grouped you and then wouldn't let you into their instance. I stop now because going on would be endless, that game DESERVED the anti-hype it got from it's launch.

If they want to fix this hate, they should invite players back with a few free weeks or something. Show people that they changed their ways and that you couldn't permanently ruin a character by leveling a skill that then bugged and locked skill progression(that happened to a friend and was the final straw for me) and then be told that the only way to fix was to reroll by support 3 weeks after you quit the game because of no response.

To be fair, it was pretty and looking at what they were trying to do, it looked like one of the best wow clones I've seen in awhile. No where near as original or interesting as The Secret World, but it was trying.

Now to be less fair, I laughed my ass off when you mentioned 100s of players in the PVP map at the same time. That may be true now but all i remember from launch was 60 players and the servers dying horribly, losing track of player positions and teleporting people thru and inside walls while it stroked out.

 

[Sight Unseen]

I tried the Beta and decided Elder Scrolls Online has too little Elder Scrolls and too much MMO in it for me to like it. If Bethesda ever manage to make an MMO that plays and feels like Oblivion or Skyrim, I will play and pay for it for sure. Until then, they should better focus on their single player RPG's, which is what they're best at.

See my above post. Also just want to remind you that this game isn't made by Bethesda, it's made by Zenimax Online, which were created to make this game in association with Bethesda.

I stopped playing this game in the first month after its launch. That thing was a mess. I never suffered the crash amount that others complained about, maybe 5 from beta to launch, but the rest was mind numbing. Enemies that would suddenly fly into the air, gain hulk strength and do all of your health in a single attack that before would have barely dented your hair, enemies attacking from underground like street sharks, enemies that were unkillable but still liked killing you, quests that couldn't be completed that made major chains uncompleteable, Dungeons that grouped you and then wouldn't let you into their instance. I stop now because going on would be endless, that game DESERVED the anti-hype it got from it's launch.

If they want to fix this hate, they should invite players back with a few free weeks or something. Show people that they changed their ways and that you couldn't permanently ruin a character by leveling a skill that then bugged and locked skill progression(that happened to a friend and was the final straw for me) and then be told that the only way to fix was to reroll by support 3 weeks after you quit the game because of no response.

To be fair, it was pretty and looking at what they were trying to do, it looked like one of the best wow clones I've seen in awhile. No where near as original or interesting as The Secret World, but it was trying.

Now to be less fair, I laughed my ass off when you mentioned 100s of players in the PVP map at the same time. That may be true now but all i remember from launch was 60 players and the servers dying horribly, losing track of player positions and teleporting people thru and inside walls while it stroked out.

I can say from experience that I never experienced any of the issues that you have. I'm sorry that you had such a rough time with the game. The only issue I had was some lag in PVP. I'm pretty sure every grievance that you listed has long since been fixed though, since I played for 4 months and never experienced any of that.

Also they did try to apologize for the crappy launch by giving players an extra 6 days ( I think) of subscription added to their first month. Although I agree that maybe allowing people to have 3 days or a week free trial available would maybe help convince more people that the game is better now.

 

[oldtaku]

Not even touching this for free, much less 'free'. Way too many great games in the pile now to spend on a merely damned with faint praise game.

Now where's the next real TES game?

 

[iseko]

The day eso goes free to play is the day I quit. Which is sad because Im having fun as second in command of a pretty big pvp guild on the EU server

 

[snekadid]

I can say from experience that I never experienced any of the issues that you have. I'm sorry that you had such a rough time with the game. The only issue I had was some lag in PVP. I'm pretty sure every grievance that you listed has long since been fixed though, since I played for 4 months and never experienced any of that.

Also they did try to apologize for the crappy launch by giving players an extra 6 days ( I think) of subscription added to their first month. Although I agree that maybe allowing people to have 3 days or a week free trial available would maybe help convince more people that the game is better now.

You misunderstand, it doesn't matter what YOUR experience is. That was what the experience was at launch for everyone that put money in on that game. It doesn't deserve a second chance after that. It needs to create its own, which would take effort on their part. You expecting people to give a damn about a game that pissed on the people that bought it and never made an effort to make recompense or even apologize for its ridiculous levels of broken content is unreasonable. They only have themselves to blame if the game does go down.You promising that your September experience was different is meaningless.

 

[Sight Unseen]

I can say from experience that I never experienced any of the issues that you have. I'm sorry that you had such a rough time with the game. The only issue I had was some lag in PVP. I'm pretty sure every grievance that you listed has long since been fixed though, since I played for 4 months and never experienced any of that.

Also they did try to apologize for the crappy launch by giving players an extra 6 days ( I think) of subscription added to their first month. Although I agree that maybe allowing people to have 3 days or a week free trial available would maybe help convince more people that the game is better now.

You misunderstand, it doesn't matter what YOUR experience is. That was what the experience was at launch for everyone that put money in on that game. It doesn't deserve a second chance after that. It needs to create its own, which would take effort on their part. You expecting people to give a damn about a game that pissed on the people that bought it and never made an effort to make recompense or even apologize for its ridiculous levels of broken content is unreasonable. They only have themselves to blame if the game does go down.You promising that your September experience was different is meaningless.

I played from launch UNTIL September and the game wasn't that bad for me even at launch. So clearly not everyone experienced the same troubles as you did. Lots did, yes, I agree. The devs did everything they could aside from delaying the launch (which may have been a good idea, but I don't think for a second that it would have affected the perception of the thousands of people who had already ruled the game out well before it ever even came out) to fix the problems as quickly as possible, and they DID offer extra days of subscription to apologise to the subscribers who had to go through the rocky launch.. And I agreed with you that they probably should allow for free trials to get people back in.

 

[Indecipherable]

Every single time.

It's the TORtanic all over again, I will never be able to grasp how people continue to have faith in these kinds of projects.

What's interesting is that TOR is now making money hand over fist and has done for quite a while now. Their most recent major update (I'm hesitant to call it an expansion) might cause some grief to EA/Bioware.

 

[Sight Unseen]

Everything angry joe said was both true and valid At the time. everyone understands mmos adapt and change.

Actually a lot of things in Angry Joe's review were not true and valid even at the time (all mobs only drop 1 coin being the main one I can think of off the top of my head), and even some of the things that were true were grossly overstated or exagerated to the point of being borderline lies. All of the positives he only spent a few seconds on, but he spent like 5 minutes talking about how you have to save up 19,000 gold to buy a horse and how you have to do that 1 gold drop at a time. He clearly never played past level 10 of the game because almost all of those issues disappear once you get off the fucking tutorial island.

I lost all respect for Angry Joe after seeing his review of the game, and haven't watched anything by him since.

 

[Kittyhawk]

I say this is a good thing, if true. I'd certainly try it once it does as I love the trailer. I have never played an Elder Scrolls game either (my bad), so I'd be open to trying it.

Now if we could just get FFXIV to do the same, I'd play that too. Wishful thinking.

Also add some optional controller support, if its not there.

 

[Shinkicker444]

Have they made Werewolves less shit? That's the reason I lost a lot of interest, that and the boring VR levels. I don't want to level 1-50 again... twice. I expected my faction invading or something, anything than what we got.

 

[GAunderrated]

The day eso goes free to play is the day I quit. Which is sad because Im having fun as second in command of a pretty big pvp guild on the EU server

So when you no longer have to pay to enjoy a game you are currently enjoying and paying for is the time you need to quit? Are you only invested in the game because you are paying money for it?

Don't get me wrong there are lots of people who are quick to say they will never join ESO unless its F2P but you are no better than them. In fact you are the same extreme on the opposite side.

 

[Sight Unseen]

The day eso goes free to play is the day I quit. Which is sad because Im having fun as second in command of a pretty big pvp guild on the EU server

So when you no longer have to pay to enjoy a game you are currently enjoying and paying for is the time you need to quit? Are you only invested in the game because you are paying money for it?

Don't get me wrong there are lots of people who are quick to say they will never join ESO unless its F2P but you are no better than them. In fact you are the same extreme on the opposite side.

Games going f2p has a proven track record of destroying the community with trolls and people that are less fun to play with. The inevitable cash shop would also make it so that you'd be pressured to pay more real money to get the best items (cosmetic or not), and exp boost selling will make the game unfair for the people who just want to play the game properly. Not to mention the possibility of locking content such as dungeons or bank space behind paywalls. I agree with the person you quoted, if ESO goes F2P then it will very likely make the game objectively worse as a result, and I would likely lose interest in it as well.

 

[Grumman]

I wouldn't touch this game even if it was free "free" and not $80 + microtransactions "free". I know exactly what I would put into the game to make it more fun for roleplayers without adversely affecting the mechanics, but I also know that the developers have admitted they're too incompetent to do it.

 

[GAunderrated]

The day eso goes free to play is the day I quit. Which is sad because Im having fun as second in command of a pretty big pvp guild on the EU server

So when you no longer have to pay to enjoy a game you are currently enjoying and paying for is the time you need to quit? Are you only invested in the game because you are paying money for it?

Don't get me wrong there are lots of people who are quick to say they will never join ESO unless its F2P but you are no better than them. In fact you are the same extreme on the opposite side.

Games going f2p has a proven track record of destroying the community with trolls and people that are less fun to play with. The inevitable cash shop would also make it so that you'd be pressured to pay more real money to get the best items (cosmetic or not), and exp boost selling will make the game unfair for the people who just want to play the game properly. Not to mention the possibility of locking content such as dungeons or bank space behind paywalls. I agree with the person you quoted, if ESO goes F2P then it will very likely make the game objectively worse as a result, and I would likely lose interest in it as well.

Wow this is such a well reasoned and polite response that I am in shock. It is such a rarity to have someone calmly explain a situation without attacking personally. I can now see your reasoning behind wanting to keep it a sub based community and why you are worried about F2P model. There are many F2P models that are very exploitative and halt the progression to make you want to pay in game money. If ESO does go F2P I really hope they do not adopt that particular model.

I feel sad that anytime a good idea for gaming is born (free to play, DLC, crowdfunding) it is abused and perverted so heavily that the once great idea becomes a disease of the gaming community.