Election results discussion thread (and sadly the inevitable aftermath)

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Iron

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I've sadly lost two friends in this election. They have both voted for Trump. And I can't have them in my life.

Why? Because Trump didn't even try to contain the Virus. He didn't warn people. He didn't make mandates. He politicized a deadly virus which we know how he knew was deadly. He said himself, he always wanted to play it down.

And he got up on that stage, knowing how this will kill people, and said it was just going to go away.

He offered snake oil. He knew that it was airborne and that masks could help. And in fact, he disrupted a perfectly good supply chain of PPE and he chose five companies at 'random' to actually stand to make a profit from the virus.

If Trump failed in his ACTUAL attempts to control the virus... I would still have my friends. I wouldn't even mind him winning the election because he tried for the American People. But the truth of the matter is that he saw a hard battle. And he didn't want to feel like he would have made an effort that he would probably lose. So he politicized it, left it up to Americans, so if they failed... they failed. He didn't lose.
I guess you weren't good friends if you let politics of all things break up your friendship. I said it earlier, this political polarization is only hurting regular people like you and giving you absolutely nothing but heartache.
 

Gordon_4

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I guess you weren't good friends if you let politics of all things break up your friendship. I said it earlier, this political polarization is only hurting regular people like you and giving you absolutely nothing but heartache.
I'm pretty sure he means they died, dude.
 
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Thaluikhain

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"Anyone"?

Biden or Clinton likely wouldn't have handled it much differently, but there are plenty out there who could have crushed it.
One might note the leaders of other nations, who've have different degrees of success, often much greater, at dealing with covid. You might argue that the world's richest nation is at a terrible disadvantage at providing for it's citizens, but even so.
 

Iron

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3 days and they haven't decided who won, Biden's side hadn't officially declared victory yet. WHAT IS THIS TIMELINE
 

Hades

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Trump didn't cause the pandemic. Without the pandemic, Trump would have won in a landslide. That's not karma, that's genuine misfortune. But I think even a narcissist like Trump would agree that election impacts are the least important downside of a pandemic.
Even with the Pandemic Trump would have won if he didn't deliberately chose to handle it in the worst way imaginable. Its actually not very hard for leaders to increase their support during a crisis. In most other countries many leaders, even Boris Johnson got a large surge of support regardless of how well they performed. Because they actually made an effort to protect the nation. Whatever the result the electorate could see they were doing their best and many got rewarded for it.

And I very much doubt Trump has other opinions about Corona than the election result. He likely thinks its a tragedy purely because it cost him personally.
No, there's nothing exceptionally different anyone would have done about the pandemic.
Yes there is. I don't think any other president would have abolished a pandemic response unit just because they hated their predecessor. I don't think other presidents would have downplayed it despite knowing what a big deal it was. I don't think other presidents would have repeatedly undermined medical advice to the public or put their weird son in law in charge and fantasize about not giving help to blue states in order to punish them.

Even in a crisis where so much can go wrong such as a pandemic Trump's approach stands out as particular incompetent and malicious.
 
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Iron

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Even with the Pandemic Trump would have won if he didn't deliberately chose to handle it in the worst way imaginable. Its actually not very hard for leaders to increase their support during a crisis. In most other countries many leaders, even Boris Johnson got a large surge of support regardless of how well they performed. Because they actually made an effort to protect the nation. Whatever the result the electorate could see they were doing their best and many got rewarded for it.
Check recent break-downs of voters by groups so far, Trump lost 5 points in relation to Biden with white males (compared to 2016 against Clinton). This is unfathomable
 

MrCalavera

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No, there's nothing exceptionally different anyone would have done about the pandemic. I know people are stuck on this idea that Trump did terrible and made lots of people die, but that's not true.
It is true. Proven by other existing countries that did better with the pandemic.

Check recent break-downs of voters by groups so far, Trump lost 5 points in relation to Biden with white males (compared to 2016 against Clinton). This is unfathomable
Why? Biden is a white male.
 

Seanchaidh

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Heh.

One might note the leaders of other nations, who've have different degrees of success, often much greater, at dealing with covid. You might argue that the world's richest nation is at a terrible disadvantage at providing for it's citizens, but even so.
You don't get to be the richest nation on earth under capitalism without treating your citizens as expendable pawns, I guess.

Check recent break-downs of voters by groups so far, Trump lost 5 points in relation to Biden with white males (compared to 2016 against Clinton). This is unfathomable
You really don't think 1/20 white male voters would be willing to vote for Biden, a white man, but not Hillary Clinton?
 
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Iron

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It is true. Proven by other existing countries that did better with the pandemic.


Why? Biden is a white male.
would be epic if white men voted 5 points less to Hillary just because she didn't have a john
 

Seanchaidh

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would be epic if white men voted 5 points less to Hillary just because she didn't have a john
sir, the proper term is willy.

anyway, there are never 1:1 comparisons for things like this, but Biden and Clinton were very close to the same candidate apart from Biden being less coherent and a man.
 

Johnny Novgorod

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No, there's nothing exceptionally different anyone would have done about the pandemic. I know people are stuck on this idea that Trump did terrible and made lots of people die, but that's not true.
He did nothing but downplay the gravity of the situation. Still does.
 

ObsidianJones

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I'm pretty sure he means they died, dude.
Actually, no. They are alive and voted for Trump.

A few of our mutual acquaintances have passed. More have lasting complications. My mother, my Grandmother, my Uncle, and my cousin are not alive. They wouldn't have voted for Trump.

My ex-friends have met my mother on a number of occasions. They were treated like family. My mother asked how they were doing all the time.

These Politics that think Old people should die for the economy are politics I will lose friends over. Because they are politics that are immoral.

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020/03/dan-patrick-coronavirus-grandparents
 

tstorm823

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Yes there is. I don't think any other president would have abolished a pandemic response unit just because they hated their predecessor. I don't think other presidents would have downplayed it despite knowing what a big deal it was. I don't think other presidents would have repeatedly undermined medical advice to the public or put their weird son in law in charge and fantasize about not giving help to blue states in order to punish them.
The famous Obama pandemic playbook is out there. You can read it. It was followed basically exactly.
It is true. Proven by other existing countries that did better with the pandemic.
The majority of places that seem to have done better are just counting differently. The places that did do better were places like New Zealand and South Korea that did things that could not be done in America regardless of who is president. If you want to argue the right president could get the American people to buy into South Korean style surveillance, feel free.
 

Agema

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PA is now blue by 6,000, with 150,000 estimated yet to be counted.
 

Iron

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The famous Obama pandemic playbook is out there. You can read it. It was followed basically exactly.

The majority of places that seem to have done better are just counting differently. The places that did do better were places like New Zealand and South Korea that did things that could not be done in America regardless of who is president. If you want to argue the right president could get the American people to buy into South Korean style surveillance, feel free.
Europe is going into a second round of lockdowns.
PA is now blue by 6,000, with 150,000 estimated yet to be counted.
How's the lockdowns treating you?
 

Agema

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How's the lockdowns treating you?
Working from home, where I am absolutely, utterly, hopelessly buried and I am only commenting here just to get some sort of break.

My inbox has dozens and dozens of unread emails, and I'm doing things in order of people saying "Where's that thing I need in the next 15 minutes?" I have days with five hours of meetings, teaching, interviews, all generating more piles of paperwork to add to thepile I already have, plus on Monday also a ton of marking drops into the in-tray.

So honestly, I have little idea of what's going on in the country. My attention of the outside world barely stretches beyond the live US election updates.
 
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