Escape to the Movies: Dungeons & Dragons
- Thread starter MovieBob
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Never watched a Movie Bob review before this one. Now I regret my apathy. This review was excellent.
I think I'll have to watch more of these.
I think I'll have to watch more of these.
I actually liked M&M. I say that as a die hard fan of rpgs and an independent game designer.
Tom Hank's character is troubled from the get go and latches on to the game early on. It is clear that even among his gaming buddies he is the one that is taking it too far and his gaming pals catch on. In the end they have to go hunting for him and are saddened to see their friend go that far down the spiral.
It isn't like he joined a cult of game obsessed devil worshipers.
the film makers might have been trying to make an Anti gaming movie. but they failed IMHO. Even the much worse "Honor thy Mother" which featured a murder, that at first seemed to be because of gaming, had to admit that it was not a game that made these people kill just a motivation to kill that took on aspects of the game they played.
thats all.
Tom Hank's character is troubled from the get go and latches on to the game early on. It is clear that even among his gaming buddies he is the one that is taking it too far and his gaming pals catch on. In the end they have to go hunting for him and are saddened to see their friend go that far down the spiral.
It isn't like he joined a cult of game obsessed devil worshipers.
the film makers might have been trying to make an Anti gaming movie. but they failed IMHO. Even the much worse "Honor thy Mother" which featured a murder, that at first seemed to be because of gaming, had to admit that it was not a game that made these people kill just a motivation to kill that took on aspects of the game they played.
thats all.
I couldn't agree with this statement more although I would recommend Bender's Big Score over The Beast with a Billion Backs.SomeBritishDude said:
I think the problem with a Dungeons & Dragons movie adaptation is that the game doesn't have a set-in-stone backstory or characters. Everyone makes their own unique person.
On the other hand, the world of Warcraft ( yes, the first word is uncapitalized
) has loads of history, events and plenty of characters. I wouldn't be too surprised that people find the latter better film material.
On the other hand, the world of Warcraft ( yes, the first word is uncapitalized
) has loads of history, events and plenty of characters. I wouldn't be too surprised that people find the latter better film material.
For shame, Bob. Are you really saying you want more terrible movies based on licensed properties to clog up theater space? Turn in your cinemaphile card now, man. I thought you were above this!
Launching rant in 3....2....1....
The problem with D&D as a movie as stated before is that there is no defined story. That's why so many people find their D&D fix in movies that have nothing to do (directly) with the game such as LotR, and others get entirely dissapointed with actual D&D movies such as that silly bit with Marlon Wayans and Riff.
Most "official" D&D movies and tv series, the ones that aren't traditional self-parodying fan service, (not that I don't love things like Dorkness Rising)are basically generic fantasy movies with a few words tossed in from sourcebooks. You can take out all the passing references to Obad-Hai or some poorly implemented guard-beholder, change the title of the film and no one will ever know that behind all this (unfortunately sub-par)are 3-5 regular Joe's sitting around a dinner table rolling funny shaped dice.
The fact of the matter is most actual D&D GAMES are intended to be Fantasy genre sterotypes, usually written out by people who would be considered amatures and hacks by Holywoods albeit dubious standards. The reason we all love the game so much isn't its story it's the immersion.
When we play the game we all put a piece of ourselves in the character (or if we're the DM in the world) when we look to our party members we see behind that dwarves eyes lies a good friend who we're at least familiar enough with to let our social graces down enough to "play make-pretend" with for awhile.
We take these tightly woven bonds we've formed before the game begins and now we take those pieces of ourself and put them into an imaginary world where we can experience great adventure, and maybe even get a few rare chances to act completely unlike ourselves, without fear of harm or consequence befalling us.
With the exception of that old saturday morning cartoon (and those fan made comedies), none of the official D&D media I know of have ever tried to translate that feel of real people thrust into a fantasy setting onto a script and thats why IMHO they've always failed to live up to fans of the series, or the general public as anything more than bad generic fantasy.
Here's my idea of a potentially succesful D&D movie formula.
1. Take 4-5 people who ACTUALLY PLAY D&D.
2. Make one of them a confused new player so things can be organically explained to an audience not familiar with the game.
3. Find a way to "magically" teleport the players into an already well established official D&D campaign setting. Preferably one that is not identical to Middle Earth.
4. The change from our world to theirs should allow the players to be or act in ways they couldn't have in their normal world. Yes, they are now in the bodies of their characters. D&D is all about being able to identify with the heroes of your adventure and any gamer will have tons of fun identifying with the players thrust into their own game. If you want to toss in some interesting drama have them come into conflict by making them have to struggle with their own personality and the personality of the character they designed.
5. Give them an adventure of their own set in the official campaign setting. Have key figures, events, and characters of the setting make cameos and assist and hinder them along the way, but don't let "our" heroes break the setting or "Save the World". Even though we would probably identify with our main characters I'm willing to bet the gaming world would be annoyed if "Holywood" gave their favorite campaign setting a "Happy Ending". Making the plot of the movie a story within a living world would only add to the "Game" feeling that we're currently missing in current D&D movies.
The problem with D&D as a movie as stated before is that there is no defined story. That's why so many people find their D&D fix in movies that have nothing to do (directly) with the game such as LotR, and others get entirely dissapointed with actual D&D movies such as that silly bit with Marlon Wayans and Riff.
Most "official" D&D movies and tv series, the ones that aren't traditional self-parodying fan service, (not that I don't love things like Dorkness Rising)are basically generic fantasy movies with a few words tossed in from sourcebooks. You can take out all the passing references to Obad-Hai or some poorly implemented guard-beholder, change the title of the film and no one will ever know that behind all this (unfortunately sub-par)are 3-5 regular Joe's sitting around a dinner table rolling funny shaped dice.
The fact of the matter is most actual D&D GAMES are intended to be Fantasy genre sterotypes, usually written out by people who would be considered amatures and hacks by Holywoods albeit dubious standards. The reason we all love the game so much isn't its story it's the immersion.
When we play the game we all put a piece of ourselves in the character (or if we're the DM in the world) when we look to our party members we see behind that dwarves eyes lies a good friend who we're at least familiar enough with to let our social graces down enough to "play make-pretend" with for awhile.
We take these tightly woven bonds we've formed before the game begins and now we take those pieces of ourself and put them into an imaginary world where we can experience great adventure, and maybe even get a few rare chances to act completely unlike ourselves, without fear of harm or consequence befalling us.
With the exception of that old saturday morning cartoon (and those fan made comedies), none of the official D&D media I know of have ever tried to translate that feel of real people thrust into a fantasy setting onto a script and thats why IMHO they've always failed to live up to fans of the series, or the general public as anything more than bad generic fantasy.
Here's my idea of a potentially succesful D&D movie formula.
1. Take 4-5 people who ACTUALLY PLAY D&D.
2. Make one of them a confused new player so things can be organically explained to an audience not familiar with the game.
3. Find a way to "magically" teleport the players into an already well established official D&D campaign setting. Preferably one that is not identical to Middle Earth.
4. The change from our world to theirs should allow the players to be or act in ways they couldn't have in their normal world. Yes, they are now in the bodies of their characters. D&D is all about being able to identify with the heroes of your adventure and any gamer will have tons of fun identifying with the players thrust into their own game. If you want to toss in some interesting drama have them come into conflict by making them have to struggle with their own personality and the personality of the character they designed.
5. Give them an adventure of their own set in the official campaign setting. Have key figures, events, and characters of the setting make cameos and assist and hinder them along the way, but don't let "our" heroes break the setting or "Save the World". Even though we would probably identify with our main characters I'm willing to bet the gaming world would be annoyed if "Holywood" gave their favorite campaign setting a "Happy Ending". Making the plot of the movie a story within a living world would only add to the "Game" feeling that we're currently missing in current D&D movies.
The problem is (as it often is): Politics.
Wizards of the Coast (then TSR) sold the entertainment (read: Movie and TV) rights to Courtney Solomon, who was lucky enough to have a billionaire bankrolling him at the time. Courtney is currently amusing himself with SyFy/direct-to-dvd horror movies at After Dark Films, so there's no real desire for him to work with WotC.
Some properties related to DnD (like Dragonlance) are getting pushed by Cindi Rice and John Rosenblum over at Epic Level Entertainment, but they're only working with titles that don't need licensing from DnD. Senior management at TSR/WotC have a history of letting licensing opportunities slip through their fingers - they famously passed on working with the X Files because nobody had watched the show. The main champion WotC had for entertainment deals, Scott Rouse, stepped down at the end of last year.
The main issue is that Brian Goldner, the CEO of Hasbro, decided that all Hasbro and Hasbro subsidiary properties are to be internally developed - and has set up a new studio division to do so. GI Joe was their first big feature, and they have Battleship (directed by Peter Berg from Friday Night Lights), Monopoly (directed by Ridley Scott), and Stretch Armstrong (starring Taylor Lautner) on the way, with Magic the Gathering in development. They've set up distribution deals with Universal and Discovery Communications, and like Lucasarts they're recalling all other properties where they can so that they don't have to work with outside producers (Don Murphy, who produced the first two Transformers movies, commented that Goldner is "bogarting everything").
So until Hasbro decides to work with external producers again, WotC gets a new entertainment champion, and Courtney Solomon decides to give up the rights, there's probably not going to be any DnD movies in the near future.
Wizards of the Coast (then TSR) sold the entertainment (read: Movie and TV) rights to Courtney Solomon, who was lucky enough to have a billionaire bankrolling him at the time. Courtney is currently amusing himself with SyFy/direct-to-dvd horror movies at After Dark Films, so there's no real desire for him to work with WotC.
Some properties related to DnD (like Dragonlance) are getting pushed by Cindi Rice and John Rosenblum over at Epic Level Entertainment, but they're only working with titles that don't need licensing from DnD. Senior management at TSR/WotC have a history of letting licensing opportunities slip through their fingers - they famously passed on working with the X Files because nobody had watched the show. The main champion WotC had for entertainment deals, Scott Rouse, stepped down at the end of last year.
The main issue is that Brian Goldner, the CEO of Hasbro, decided that all Hasbro and Hasbro subsidiary properties are to be internally developed - and has set up a new studio division to do so. GI Joe was their first big feature, and they have Battleship (directed by Peter Berg from Friday Night Lights), Monopoly (directed by Ridley Scott), and Stretch Armstrong (starring Taylor Lautner) on the way, with Magic the Gathering in development. They've set up distribution deals with Universal and Discovery Communications, and like Lucasarts they're recalling all other properties where they can so that they don't have to work with outside producers (Don Murphy, who produced the first two Transformers movies, commented that Goldner is "bogarting everything").
So until Hasbro decides to work with external producers again, WotC gets a new entertainment champion, and Courtney Solomon decides to give up the rights, there's probably not going to be any DnD movies in the near future.
As Moviebob said D&D didn't really have a story or established setting. The closest thing I have seen that get D&D "right" is a relatively obscure 1990 anime OVA series called "Record of Lodoss War" which actually started life out as transcripts of actual Game sessions turned into narratives published back in 1986.'
In fact it has been anime where D&D or at least D&D like worlds have thrived. The Slayers anime series is one the longest live of these returning after a near decade long hiatus and doesn't take itself serious about half the time and the rest very seriously.
In fact it has been anime where D&D or at least D&D like worlds have thrived. The Slayers anime series is one the longest live of these returning after a near decade long hiatus and doesn't take itself serious about half the time and the rest very seriously.
Funny you should mention the Tom Hanks film.... I am a medical student at a UK University and one of the MCQs that has recurred in the 'Progress Test' (a twice yearly adventure that is taken by every year of the course as a mark of increasing experience/knowledge/ability/whatever) regards the classification of the psychosis/delusions being experienced by a 'patient' who , if I remember correctly, is concerning his mother due to increasing withdrawal from social interaction and references to fighting dragons etc...
Not sure if a direct game reference is in the scenario but every time I see it I feel a little pissed, firstly due to there being no true evidence of pathological problems, secondly due to the limited information and thirdly due to the possible derision that may underline a scenario presented by an establishment that is supposed to promote reason and education!
I mean, seriously, aside from possibly the withdrawal/ choice not to engage socially, there isn?t much to question in terms of mental health! Possibly some florid delusions may be present, but the example hardly gives anything to gage this by and so it just feels like a cheap shot!
Naturally I may be being too thin-skinned about all this, but it does just feel a little like a perpetuation of the stigma referenced by MovieBob by a source that really should know better!
Not sure if a direct game reference is in the scenario but every time I see it I feel a little pissed, firstly due to there being no true evidence of pathological problems, secondly due to the limited information and thirdly due to the possible derision that may underline a scenario presented by an establishment that is supposed to promote reason and education!
I mean, seriously, aside from possibly the withdrawal/ choice not to engage socially, there isn?t much to question in terms of mental health! Possibly some florid delusions may be present, but the example hardly gives anything to gage this by and so it just feels like a cheap shot!
Naturally I may be being too thin-skinned about all this, but it does just feel a little like a perpetuation of the stigma referenced by MovieBob by a source that really should know better!
Indeed Mr. Movie Bob, you are right, right, right, that it is wrong, wrong, wrong. A WoW film before a decent one on the work that made possible any and everything that has RPG on its description that is not a rocket propelled grenade? Except for The Lord of the Rings, there can be no other claims to seniority on this genre. A D&D film should come before a WoW film, not only alphabetically.
But I reckon we may have to wait a little bit before that happens.
But I reckon we may have to wait a little bit before that happens.
Though the very idea of WOW movie sounds...unethical.....producers would jizz their pants when they actually reviwed the revenue pulled buy the MAMORPAGER...thinking"instead of paying 12 dollars for subscriptions, they'll pay 12 dollars to see this movie! in 3D!!!