Escapist Podcast: 50: The 3DS XL & Gamer Angst
- Thread starter The Escapist Staff
- Start date
I really don't get how people can say that it's "awesome" that people like stuff that you don't like. I don't mean that you should be negative towards someone with differing tastes, but I guess what I'm trying to say is that it's kind of the same attitude, but in reverse. It seems just as silly to me to say it's awesome that you disagree on something than saying that the person deserves to die or whatever. Sometimes it even seems kind of passive aggressive to me. What could possibly be "awesome" about not having something in common?
I don't mean to imply we should all be apathetic to each other's tastes, discussion is great, but I really just don't see how the simple fact that there is a disagreement could possibly be described in such a way. It doesn't make sense.
I don't mean to imply we should all be apathetic to each other's tastes, discussion is great, but I really just don't see how the simple fact that there is a disagreement could possibly be described in such a way. It doesn't make sense.
I think you're being a bit too literal-minded here. They don't actually mean that it's an amazing and fantastic thing when someone disagrees with you. It's just fine, right? "Cool, we disagree, let's move on." Just mild exaggeration for effect.Scrustle said:
Now bear with me here.
*clears throat* Space Muffins! A story about a rag tag band of smuggler muffins aboard The Celiac flying through space, following a tip of a large cinnamon deposit (The Spice Must Flow!) located in a nearby system. With both military and local police forces (The Star Bucks) hot on their baking sheet, the crew hides out on a nearby desert planet only to discover the ruins of an ancient civilization. They accidentally re-awaken the creatures when one of the members spill water upon an altar; waking a giant Flying Spaghetti Monster. The Monster appears to be the hive mind of a vast army of pasta related (think macaroni) delectables. Will our heroes be able to escape this deadly city? Can they stop the spread of the ravenous horde? Find out on...Space Muffins!
P.S. Also sub plot of all this being a result of bio-engineered foods gone wrong and this is actually a future universe >.>
Opinions?
*clears throat* Space Muffins! A story about a rag tag band of smuggler muffins aboard The Celiac flying through space, following a tip of a large cinnamon deposit (The Spice Must Flow!) located in a nearby system. With both military and local police forces (The Star Bucks) hot on their baking sheet, the crew hides out on a nearby desert planet only to discover the ruins of an ancient civilization. They accidentally re-awaken the creatures when one of the members spill water upon an altar; waking a giant Flying Spaghetti Monster. The Monster appears to be the hive mind of a vast army of pasta related (think macaroni) delectables. Will our heroes be able to escape this deadly city? Can they stop the spread of the ravenous horde? Find out on...Space Muffins!
P.S. Also sub plot of all this being a result of bio-engineered foods gone wrong and this is actually a future universe >.>
Opinions?
The geeky thing I've never been interested in is Firefly or Serenity or whatever its called. I saw the movie and I thought "Meh, is ok I supose?"
Yeah I never understood the "getting upset at others opinions" thing. I even made a forum thread about it some time back. the only instance I can see that it would bother me would be if someone I was close to (good friend, family member, ect.), had an opinion which caused them to act in such a way that made us not be close anymore. For example, say I had a friend that recently joined a religion that said people of Norwegian ancestry were evil. Therefore they now hated me because of that.
I find myself wishing I could draw as well, but considering the ideas I threw out before I settled on this one, think the world's a safer place for it ^_^Susan Arendt said:
Aren't there people at the Escapist who draw webcomics? As my dad told me when teaching me to fly a kite: "Just run with it"
Thank you Susan, I to am so sick of this shouting down of people who have a different opinion or world view for that matter, and the 'its the internet' or 'grow a thicker skin' arguments, such bollocks.
(If only I knew that putting vegan in a screen name would attract trolls and haters)
I a-tribute this to a seance of entitlement, 'This is my PC so I can treat the people in it however I like' kind of thing. Just hope people will grow the hell out of it soon, they probably wont in my life time but still got to hope.
As for Geeky things I don't like,
On going comics, I like a story to end so I only get the collected editions or Graphic novels.
RPG's that play like Dragon Age, a game is an over complicated maths problem why turn it back into a maths problem.
And I don't know if it counts but meme's, I find some funny but I don't get how hearing the same joke quoted out of context is funny.
But hey, to each their own and thank you again Susan for saying what needed to be said.
(If only I knew that putting vegan in a screen name would attract trolls and haters)
I a-tribute this to a seance of entitlement, 'This is my PC so I can treat the people in it however I like' kind of thing. Just hope people will grow the hell out of it soon, they probably wont in my life time but still got to hope.
As for Geeky things I don't like,
On going comics, I like a story to end so I only get the collected editions or Graphic novels.
RPG's that play like Dragon Age, a game is an over complicated maths problem why turn it back into a maths problem.
And I don't know if it counts but meme's, I find some funny but I don't get how hearing the same joke quoted out of context is funny.
But hey, to each their own and thank you again Susan for saying what needed to be said.
Comments about: ~1:28 - ~1:34
On Differing Opinions and Hostile Assumptions
(I'll pretend it's a title)
A lot of those arguments boil down to "You like something I don't like, therefore I hate you."
Obviously stupid and childish, but I think I just described half the Internet there. Most of modern online gaming culture anyway.
But that isn't always the whole story: some of the most-intense arguments of that nature stem from a long-running frustration.
For the sake of clarity, I'll use a personal example:
Games transitioning from being sold as Products, and being sold now as Services.
I don't like this trend. At all. I can criticize it, but I am utterly powerless to stop it. (I have my reasons, but they aren't directly relevant to my point here)
So naturally, a significant portion of the market begins to embrace that model despite these future problems. I'm left shaking my head and sighing.
So, armed with a dissenting opinion, I'm off to the Internet to voice my concern like thousands of other gamers.
As an individual member of the gaming community, I recognize that my opinion is tiny, insignificant shard representative of the whole.
Yet, it's often very tempting to rage against the masses of the community, because I know ultimately, that it's most of THOSE people who keep pushing gaming into a future where I will have to pay more for less and put up with more bullshit from the publisher just to play a fucking video game.
It's sometimes difficult to avoid thinking like this:
"The masses supporting games that support trends I don't like is going to lead to those trends becoming dominant."
Which, with enough time, bitterness and cynicism can very easily twist into "They like stuff I don't like, so I hate them for it."
(Kind of sounds like partisan-politics when you get down to it, doesn't it?)
THE POINT:
Part of growing up is accepting that some (most, really) part(s) of your life will inevitably change, and for most of us, it's by that part going to shit. Mostly because people are more assholes than angels. Internal competition under the veil of social cooperation.
So people are going to complain. A LOT.
Yet, I know that sitting around and mindlessly complaining won't get you the change you want (for better or ill). It's better to attempt rational, civil discourse than screaming your demands like a child.
And for that, you need to separate the issue from the audience wherever it's possible.
You need to avoid subjectivity where possible, yet still respect it no matter how absurd (as long as it remains strictly-subjective. True "opinions" cannot be wrong until objective proof contradicts them. Putting "I think.." in front of an obvious contradiction does not make it an opinion, it makes it willful idiocy).
I'll risk a platitude here: "If everyone screams their complaints, nobody is heard."
Hating another person just for having a differing opinion is "screaming". It's whining like a child who doesn't understand, and most keep screaming their demands because they don't WANT to understand: they just want to be heard.
So in that, I definitely agree that (from the podcast) the forums, and gaming culture in general, could use a lot less mindless screaming, and learn how to better disagree. At least with the latter, you can walk away understanding more about the situation other than "That guy was a screaming asshole".
(*Sure, I could have wrote a pithy one or two line reply here, but where's the fun in that?*
Besides. I'm currently strung up in bed with (I think) a crushing allergic reaction from something I breathed in when I returned home from a long distance trip. Eyes are puffed up a bit and I've been sneezing something fierce. Nothin' better to do.)
On Differing Opinions and Hostile Assumptions
(I'll pretend it's a title)
A lot of those arguments boil down to "You like something I don't like, therefore I hate you."
Obviously stupid and childish, but I think I just described half the Internet there. Most of modern online gaming culture anyway.
But that isn't always the whole story: some of the most-intense arguments of that nature stem from a long-running frustration.
For the sake of clarity, I'll use a personal example:
Games transitioning from being sold as Products, and being sold now as Services.
I don't like this trend. At all. I can criticize it, but I am utterly powerless to stop it. (I have my reasons, but they aren't directly relevant to my point here)
So naturally, a significant portion of the market begins to embrace that model despite these future problems. I'm left shaking my head and sighing.
So, armed with a dissenting opinion, I'm off to the Internet to voice my concern like thousands of other gamers.
As an individual member of the gaming community, I recognize that my opinion is tiny, insignificant shard representative of the whole.
Yet, it's often very tempting to rage against the masses of the community, because I know ultimately, that it's most of THOSE people who keep pushing gaming into a future where I will have to pay more for less and put up with more bullshit from the publisher just to play a fucking video game.
It's sometimes difficult to avoid thinking like this:
"The masses supporting games that support trends I don't like is going to lead to those trends becoming dominant."
Which, with enough time, bitterness and cynicism can very easily twist into "They like stuff I don't like, so I hate them for it."
(Kind of sounds like partisan-politics when you get down to it, doesn't it?)
THE POINT:
Part of growing up is accepting that some (most, really) part(s) of your life will inevitably change, and for most of us, it's by that part going to shit. Mostly because people are more assholes than angels. Internal competition under the veil of social cooperation.
So people are going to complain. A LOT.
Yet, I know that sitting around and mindlessly complaining won't get you the change you want (for better or ill). It's better to attempt rational, civil discourse than screaming your demands like a child.
And for that, you need to separate the issue from the audience wherever it's possible.
You need to avoid subjectivity where possible, yet still respect it no matter how absurd (as long as it remains strictly-subjective. True "opinions" cannot be wrong until objective proof contradicts them. Putting "I think.." in front of an obvious contradiction does not make it an opinion, it makes it willful idiocy).
I'll risk a platitude here: "If everyone screams their complaints, nobody is heard."
Hating another person just for having a differing opinion is "screaming". It's whining like a child who doesn't understand, and most keep screaming their demands because they don't WANT to understand: they just want to be heard.
So in that, I definitely agree that (from the podcast) the forums, and gaming culture in general, could use a lot less mindless screaming, and learn how to better disagree. At least with the latter, you can walk away understanding more about the situation other than "That guy was a screaming asshole".
(*Sure, I could have wrote a pithy one or two line reply here, but where's the fun in that?*
Besides. I'm currently strung up in bed with (I think) a crushing allergic reaction from something I breathed in when I returned home from a long distance trip. Eyes are puffed up a bit and I've been sneezing something fierce. Nothin' better to do.)
So I'm actually quite happy that you didn't write a pithy response especially since it was a rather pithy statement that started this whole conversation.Atmos Duality said:
It's interesting that now with so many modes of communication, people are still so bad at communicating.
I don't think this method of simply raging or hazing is limited to the internet or internet culture. It probably has more to do with external culture in general! I mean, take a look at the Middle East. There are riots spreading through the region. Whenever the Hong Kong government or China passes a declaration to Hong Kong, the populace protests. Heck, there are plenty or protests every day here in America. I'd even go so far as to say that this attitude is the result of remnants of the anti-war and anti-other things mindsets.
Now we couple that with the blogging mindset. People see internet forums, blog pages, and image boards as their personal soap boxes and it's kinda encouraged. People expect that by presenting their opinion strongly they will be heard. I mean, that's how we've been told to deal with bullies right? (Lawful Evil) This is a bully victim's dream house. You can out the bully and s/he will have a hard time finding you in the haystack. But can a bully's argument be any less valid?
At the same time, I don't think (<-- notice I used the words "I" and "think") we should be limited to rational, civil discourse or that screaming makes me childish. Not all arguments are about the point and some can by about the venting. I mean, Susan vented and raised her voice about this issue. Was she being childish?
You know, I appreciate that people do talk about this because it seems that people prefer the pithy to the fleshed out. I mean, this is the medium that invented tl;dr. It's swept under the rug mainly because it takes too long to pay attention enough to work it out. Does the moderator system work? Yes. Is there a better way? Maybe.
Man...I should start a blog. ...I'll couple it with my Space Muffins comic >.> People seem to pay attention to the opinions of web comic writers.
I really liked this podcat, 'specially the "Console Preferences" portion. Fanboys are a blight on the galaxy IMO; but sometimes it could just mean that those people are either juvenile, behave juvenile, or are just extremely competitive people who thrive on conflict. I'm related, by blood, to people like that, and 17 years of being around them has taught me that ignoring their challenges is the best way to neutralize any flourishing emotions, it also has taught me it is hard to have a tasteful discussion with them on video games -- that's why I frequent The Escapist Magazine website (my favorite website).
Keep up the awesome guys! =D
Keep up the awesome guys! =D
Thing is, corruption is a very fucking serious accusation to make. There might be a pattern, there might even be a clear motive, but those things on their own aren't enough to reinforce such an accusation. Unless you have real, hard evidence, rather than just here-say and conjecture, that someone is genuinely on the take, you do not even go near the subject. Seriously, if you can't back it up with anything concrete, just don't fucking go there. Not only does it make you look like a jerk, using 'You're taking bribes!' as a last resort because you can't accept a difference of opinion, but because it's also slander, which can get you in some pretty deep shit.Sylveria said:
This was the thing that pissed me off most about the whole ME3 thing. I got pissed off with a lot of things, on both sides of the 'debate', but this more than any other. The throwaway nature with which people were laying down these serious accusations, with no proof at all. They'd rationalised it to themselves, therefore that was enough to accuse someone of compromising the integrity which is so vital to their career, and in my opinion, even though I'll concede that some of these reasonings had some logic behind them, it was just fucking disgusting. Disgusting and counter-productive, because if you accuse someone of being on the take, and you are then called upon to prove it, when you can't, then why should anyone take anything you say seriously after that, when you've cried wolf in such an over the top fashion?
Accusing a journalist of corruption because you disagree with them and think they are misrepresenting you, is akin to accusing a politician of corruption because you don't feel their policies represent you. Without solid, watertight evidence, it is a completely ludicrous accusation. That doesn't mean you can't critisise journalists if you dissagree with them or don't like their manner, you can do that all you like, but accusations of bribery without proof more than cross the line.
Yeah I remember reading someone's post on this website that went along the linesNinjaDeathSlap said:
"I refuse to play Mass Effect 3 solely because of all the game journalists and reviewers they have bought off. Its Disgusting!"
I could barely contain my rage at reading this statement, out of all the totally valid reasons to not play Mass Effect 3 you had to decide not to play because of your baseless paranoia.
This actually kinda links to what Susan was talking about with opinions and something they didn't talk about (or at least I think they didn't its 1:00 in the morning right now :C ) is that on the internet since it is anonymous the only information you have on people is the opinion they've expressed. Sooo if you hate the opinion you're almost forced to hate the person as well because that's the only info you have. Its kinda an unexpected consequence to the anonymity of the internet.
*Ahem*Susan Arendt said:
Because I'm bored and I have some drawing skills, without further ado, I give you: The adventures of that crazy trio known as Space Muffins and their never ending battle against the evil Zpaghetacotl the Ancient (Yeah, I dunno).
No, seriously, get the best artist at The Escpaist and make this happen.
(Slow clap) Susan, your argument on preferences was amazing-awesome. The podcasts always make me smile, but that was smile-squared for me.
Now on geeky things:
I love,
Doctor Who, Firefly, Star Trek, Star Wars, and Stargate(except Universe, perfect example of why not to change the formula of a franchise with a new series, being that if it is a big change, core fans are gone and said series fails, and the franchise is dead.).
I don't like Battlestar Galactica, new, old, doesn't matter which. Especially didn't like the filming style of the new one, and later couldn't believe "SyFy" chose to use the same style with Stargate Universe.
Reason: I don't like that style because I don't think it fits science fiction television. When I watch such shows, it is an escape from reality. That filming style makes me feel like they were trying to create a real life drama. It is the whole slightly grainy film, and the panning between people talking like somebody is holding a camera like a filming of a documentary that makes me hate the style.
Now on geeky things:
I love,
Doctor Who, Firefly, Star Trek, Star Wars, and Stargate(except Universe, perfect example of why not to change the formula of a franchise with a new series, being that if it is a big change, core fans are gone and said series fails, and the franchise is dead.).
I don't like Battlestar Galactica, new, old, doesn't matter which. Especially didn't like the filming style of the new one, and later couldn't believe "SyFy" chose to use the same style with Stargate Universe.
Reason: I don't like that style because I don't think it fits science fiction television. When I watch such shows, it is an escape from reality. That filming style makes me feel like they were trying to create a real life drama. It is the whole slightly grainy film, and the panning between people talking like somebody is holding a camera like a filming of a documentary that makes me hate the style.
Ah, schoolyard arguments on what system was better, in the days before arguing about what politician is better.
If there's one thing I learned, it's that if you look back to how you were 10 years ago, you will think "Wow, I was an idiot back then." 10 years from now, you will look back at today and think "Wow, I was an idiot back then." I am sure that if I live to be 1000 years old, I will look back on my 990th year and say "Wow, I was an idiot back then."
Things I don't like.... Hmmm.... A lot of video games, actually. And the anime I like don't seem to be the ones anyone else likes. I loved loved loved sCRYed and Eureka Seven but don't get much positive response from others, particularly for sCRYed (what's not to like about a show where most of the superpowers on display are physical manifestations of the users' psychological problems?). Also, I didn't like Blood/Blood+ and don't understand what the fuss is with Akira and apparently there's something wrong with me because of that.
Though speaking of taste.... The best review I ever got of anything was on a forum, someone read the manga of an anime I liked and I asked his opinion as I was considering buying the omnibus editions and reading them. His response? "The manga's WAY better. It doesn't have all the annoying moral ambiguity of the anime." I thanked him for his opinion.
I never bought the books.
If there's one thing I learned, it's that if you look back to how you were 10 years ago, you will think "Wow, I was an idiot back then." 10 years from now, you will look back at today and think "Wow, I was an idiot back then." I am sure that if I live to be 1000 years old, I will look back on my 990th year and say "Wow, I was an idiot back then."
Things I don't like.... Hmmm.... A lot of video games, actually. And the anime I like don't seem to be the ones anyone else likes. I loved loved loved sCRYed and Eureka Seven but don't get much positive response from others, particularly for sCRYed (what's not to like about a show where most of the superpowers on display are physical manifestations of the users' psychological problems?). Also, I didn't like Blood/Blood+ and don't understand what the fuss is with Akira and apparently there's something wrong with me because of that.
Though speaking of taste.... The best review I ever got of anything was on a forum, someone read the manga of an anime I liked and I asked his opinion as I was considering buying the omnibus editions and reading them. His response? "The manga's WAY better. It doesn't have all the annoying moral ambiguity of the anime." I thanked him for his opinion.
I never bought the books.