EVE Online Politics: A spy just screwed a few thousand players, years of work.

[Consistence]

Man I need to start up eve again, but now for my rant.

It has always been BoB,and Goonswarm sort of in a eternal war. Parts of these wars were hot, and others cold, but there always was a tension, the idea that even if my alliance was attacked and defeated by one of these powers, the other will always be there to oppose it. The Soviet Union, BoB has collasped leaving the world of EVE, only one sole super power left, Goonswarn,U.S. I've always in the past favored Goonswarm, but now I just don't know if what happened was right, and I'm not sure the polotics of EVE will ever be the same again.

 

[Oswald D Grant]

They often do [http://www.gaia.com/quotes/topics/insanity].

None of those quotes mention intelligence, except one, which says that "To weave a net first the essence of intelligence. The Definition of Insanity is to jump believing you can weave the net midair."

Which is pretty much what you're doing. You leap on a position and then invent evidence to support it. You say that Haargoth must have felt one thing even though he said another. You say that the only possible way he could fall out with his corp is because the game was boring - not because they ignored or disrespected him, for example, things that happen frequently even outside games. You say that there were only a maximum of 70 players active in BoB - even though that information comes from a speech by the Mittani, a propagandist for BoB's sworn enemies. You write this whole imaginary little story where the game was so dull that it was the only possible reason for this guy's defection - even though he's still playing the game and still finds it fun! Obviously you know his heart better than he does!

And then you conclude that defection is something that the devs need to rewrite the game in order to prevent, because it's so terrible that a major alliance have lost control of some of their space and assets. Which is bizarre, given that your complaints about the game were mostly that you couldn't compete with the older players.

Why would they want to change it, given that this is exactly how it's supposed to work? Empires rise and fall, alliances are made and broken, sovereignty isn't permanent but doesn't change hands every day.

 

[geldonyetich]

I know I said I'd let you have the last world, and so I apologize about this, but, so as to not have your typing be a complete waste.

I'm tired. There reaches a certain point in a conversation where I have to trust you to at least try to see things my way. If you're calling me insane, that's out of the question. So, also, is my conversation with you.

Right now, I'm not even going to bother to read that last post, because I don't want to be tempted to reply to it.

 

[jdnoth]

Never forget that the goons are basically the fathers of /b/. They will do shit like this from time to time. Anyone else catch what they did to Second Life?

 

[geldonyetich]

Never forget that the goons are basically the fathers of /b/. They will do shit like this from time to time. Anyone else catch what they did to Second Life?

Oh, totally, much like EVE Online, Second Life is a game that gives the players enough power to really screw around with it if they want to, and that's awesome for a Goon.

This is probably what you're referring to [http://foo.secondlifeherald.com/slh/2008/09/the-great-goon.html], but they're known as infamous invasions and pranks [http://secondlife.wikia.com/wiki/Goon] in general.

 

[Bulletinmybrain]

Anyone see what they did with urban dead? They killed the game for.. FUN.

 

[geldonyetich]

Maybe EVE isn't done well, but, it's not helpful to compare it to games that aren't even trying to do what EVE is trying to do.

Fair enough.

I will look forward to the day when there's a game that does what EVE Online does while still being able to capture some of the appeal of games that aren't inhibited by such an overhead.

 

[Haddi]

I tried Eve, and quit because it didn't feel like a game, it felt like a goddamn SECOND JOB.

Ugh, the whole thing stank of schedules and lots of communication. Never felt like I could really do something stupid and fun without screwing myself over. But still, awesome premise though.

 

[smallharmlesskitten]

Your playing it wrong perhaps?

 

[geldonyetich]

It's actually pretty easy to play a MMORPG wrong. Head into City of Heroes and play it like World of Warcraft and you'll be scratching your head at it what the appeal is. Head into EVE Online playing it like any other MMORPG and it's the same deal. MMORPGs are a big collection of activities, and you can get mired down in activities that don't appeal to you.

However, you have to temper that with the knowledge that everybody likes different things. Cruising lowsec space in a frigate spotting marks for your friends to gank will not appeal to everyone. Being ganked by your friends, even less. Maybe schedules and communication was the way he could enjoy the game the best, and it wasn't enough because he talked himself into paying for a second job.

So, if everybody likes different things, what was I blathering on about? Something more universal: This BoB thing points out that risk vs reward isn't very coherent in EVE Online. Short of reading the defector's mind, there wasn't anything they could have done to prevent it, and bloop: there goes an empire.

I figured that was a fair universal to point out. However, there's other aspects about EVE Online to enjoy, such as the drama. It was never right for me to suggest that the game shouldn't appeal to anyone, no matter how much of a sublime game mechanic appreciator I think I am.

 

[Locastus]

EVE must be a really boring game.......

You are so very very wrong. No other game gets the adrenaline flowing quite like Eve.

This man, who played it for many years, has just suddenly thought to himself: "You know what, I've lost the will to live, I'm going to delete the entire alliance with a few thousand people......" I think that speaks for itself.

He didn't lose the will to live and delete the alliance, he *betrayed* those few thousand people and joined their rivals. The alliance that orchestrated the betrayal - Goonswarm - claim that he was a sleeper agent.

This is allowed within Eve and similar things have happened before, no one who plays it is saying its evidence of the game being boring.

If you don't like the sound of that then don't play it - stick to the sanitary and undynamic World of Warcraft.

 

[TheMatt]

At the risk of being flamed I have a favour to ask all of you Eve heads. Just by reading this thread I am very very intrigued in the game. Is there a site where I can go and read for real gameplay? Not, EVE.com which states emphatically "the game is awesome" over and over but perhaps a strategy guide of some kind? (read wowwiki)

is it worth starting now? like if someone new told me they were going to start playing WoW I'd tell them not to bother as the world is too advanced.

I want to play a massive multiplayer game of WCrivateer. Is this the game I am looking for?

 

[smallharmlesskitten]

Its never too late to start. You can always help out even though you wont be in a titan for a long time. look around for the thread about the escapist corp i am starting

 

[Theo Samaritan]

is it worth starting now? like if someone new told me they were going to start playing WoW I'd tell them not to bother as the world is too advanced.

I want to play a massive multiplayer game of WCrivateer. Is this the game I am looking for?

Its never too late to start - all the skills in the game have a finite maximum they can reach, older players just tend to have more choice.

But it is not an MMO version of Privateer. The closest so far to that is Jumpgate Evolution, which is in open beta atm.

EDIT: Feel free to contact me if you fancy a hand.

 

[TheMatt]

Thank you and I surely will. I need to get a new comp (first) as mine just went kaboom about a week ago.

I can handle not being in a "titan" (which if youtube videos are to be believed are giant flying mushrooms) for a while. I'm a grinder of near infinite patience. Nor do i expect instant gratification I just want gratification (i.e. completely chromed out super fighter that fires kitten bombs) to be an ever approaching thing rather then "maybe next year I can afford the chassis" for aforementioned kitten firing super fighter.

 

[geldonyetich]

I'm a grinder of near infinite patience.

Say no more - EVE Online and you will get along swimmingly.

(Granted, that's a critique I could level against 99.9% of the MMORPGs out there.)

 

[TheMatt]

lol, nice.

I can find fun in almost everything. For example - 2 lads from my guild and I (in WoW) (manifest destiny, oh i miss you so) once followed some newb around STV for literally 3 hrs protecting him and killing all of his objectives. Sounds senseless and boring yes? That's until you find out that we were naked the entire time and adamantly refused to speak to him. He was literally yelling, "Who are you? Why are you helping me?" The entire time. It was good fun.

Re-reading my post I have come to realize that it still sounds senseless and boring. Well, we were all pretty high, that probably had something to do with it.