Expert Warns of Possible Catastrophic Effects of California Videogame Law
- Thread starter Logan Westbrook
- Start date
Gameinformer gave more details on the law. In short it is this; If a game has any resemblance of violence towards humans, humanoids, or anything that can assume be a human, another VERY noticeable label will be placed on the game case stating that the game is NOT to be sold to minors. Not a rating, but actual words this time.Zachary Amaranth said:
World of Warcraft is a target, Halo is a target, Most MMO's are targeted, and do you believe for a second there are no unspoken "strings attached" when it comes to American laws coming out? California politicians would regulated what they would consider as "violence" towards a human. Considering how well the ESRB is with ratings, what do you think politicians (who don't care about he medium) do? This is the trouble of this law, the medium itself would be regulated.
I hate this law the more i read about it...
in all honosty, they are trying to Punish the video game industry simply because of bad parenting skills. Hell, a majority of M Rated games which get into the hands of children go through the hands of Parents in an entirely Legal transaction.
this law is stating that it is the Fault of the retailer for Suzan Rottencrotch being a bad mother and shutting her kid up by throwing colorful games at them...
in all honosty, they are trying to Punish the video game industry simply because of bad parenting skills. Hell, a majority of M Rated games which get into the hands of children go through the hands of Parents in an entirely Legal transaction.
this law is stating that it is the Fault of the retailer for Suzan Rottencrotch being a bad mother and shutting her kid up by throwing colorful games at them...
Fallout, Mass Effect, Duke Nukem, Modern Warefare, Halo, Grand Theft Auto. These games are merely the tip of the iceberg on games that were far more successful on US soil than over seas. They required ALOT of money to make and games like these would come FAR less frequently once the law comes out, but less frequently over seas, in the U.S. they may not even sold.
Its punishable to sell a minor R rated movie tickets to a theater, is it not?
I honestly don't see the implications in that sector of the undustry: M rated games wont cease to exist.
Now, the issues I have with this legislation is the wording, as its trying to define something that is clearly free speech as not free speech. Thats a tricky slope, because once one form of speech can be supressed, it opens up the doors to more.
We start with videogames, they are harmful to minors afterall. Then again, so is Saw... Lets do the same to movies. Hrmm... TV could be harmful to minors (seeing a cartoon cat get hit by a cartoon dog is just harmful). Magazines are giving kids AWEFUL ideas, lets regulate them. Books too while were at it. And lets not give out any violent news in news papers. Better yet, lets have the government regulate them, so if we dont approve it, it doesnt go out! And of course we need special police to search for contraband, we dont want any children's minds corrupted. Lets also regulate schools, to un-corrupt the students minds...
Laugh if you will, but supressing one type of freedom inherintly gives a power-boner to the idiots who did it, and they dont stop until:
A. Citizens rebel and throw them out of power (usually violently)
B. They get total control of everything.
This bill isn't about restricted sales of M rated games or industrial loss. Its about what truely constitutes the freedoms we are granted from the Constitution. A point being brought up too is the right of minors and parents; California also said something along the lines of it should have the right to support parental values. But not everyone shares the same view as the California. Also, rights of minors, why is that you have no say in whats best for YOU until you turn 18? Does your brain magically mature on your 18th birthday? These are the questions that need to be discussed with this bill.
I honestly don't see the implications in that sector of the undustry: M rated games wont cease to exist.
Now, the issues I have with this legislation is the wording, as its trying to define something that is clearly free speech as not free speech. Thats a tricky slope, because once one form of speech can be supressed, it opens up the doors to more.
We start with videogames, they are harmful to minors afterall. Then again, so is Saw... Lets do the same to movies. Hrmm... TV could be harmful to minors (seeing a cartoon cat get hit by a cartoon dog is just harmful). Magazines are giving kids AWEFUL ideas, lets regulate them. Books too while were at it. And lets not give out any violent news in news papers. Better yet, lets have the government regulate them, so if we dont approve it, it doesnt go out! And of course we need special police to search for contraband, we dont want any children's minds corrupted. Lets also regulate schools, to un-corrupt the students minds...
Laugh if you will, but supressing one type of freedom inherintly gives a power-boner to the idiots who did it, and they dont stop until:
A. Citizens rebel and throw them out of power (usually violently)
B. They get total control of everything.
This bill isn't about restricted sales of M rated games or industrial loss. Its about what truely constitutes the freedoms we are granted from the Constitution. A point being brought up too is the right of minors and parents; California also said something along the lines of it should have the right to support parental values. But not everyone shares the same view as the California. Also, rights of minors, why is that you have no say in whats best for YOU until you turn 18? Does your brain magically mature on your 18th birthday? These are the questions that need to be discussed with this bill.
I think some people are hyperbolizing what will happen if this piece of legislation takes effect. That being said, I still don't agree with it 100%. It will definitely at least make some developers think twice between shooting for a T-rating or an M-rating. A game like GTA might not have that choice, but any developers walking the line between T and M rating, may want to shoot for the T.
Ok, i dont get what the fuss is about...? I live in the UK, I have worked in retail selling videogames (and dvds). Selling someone an 18 rated game is illegal, and you can be fined for it. Isn't this just the same thing? I havent seen a massive 'reduction' in the number of 18-rated games sold here, it's not like retailers have stopped stocking games aimed at the older market... Regardless, children will just get their parents to buy the game for them anyway, which I saw happen all the time! I don't see what the massive fuss is about I am going to be honest, it just sounds like the USA is catching up with the rest of the Western world with something that should have been implemented a long time ago.
So basically what you and the original person interviewed believe is that the games industry only really thrives off the sale of games to minors? That if minors are unable to buy M-rated games that whole market will simply 'collapse'? I am sorry if I misinterpreted what has been said, but what you are saying makes it sound like minors are a massive market for m-rated games, and that we should essentially allow this to continue so that there is no economic backlash against the games industry?Modus Operandi said:
Basically exactly what I was going to put.tk1989 said:
I really don't see this being that much of a problem, retailers will just need to crack down on employees and make sure they are asking for ID when kids want games rated games. If they don't have ID, then no game unless their parent buys it. It's been like that here for years, I remember having to get my Mum to buy me games a lot of the time when I was younger.
That's not what the argument is about. It's about the possibility of retailers either downsizing or refusing to stock those M games. It's not about minors buying them at all, but retailers reacting to the fear of minors buying them and the retailer getting fined due to it.tk1989 said:
Should that happen, the simple act of retailers not stocking M rated game, or even just stocking less of them, will make the development of those games a more risky investment, and big titles usually try to avoid risky investments. So the knock on effect would be less big M rated titles, as it would be a better choice for the company to simply make the game a T rated one and avoid the risk.
This effect would be felt in all game markets, as in general, AAA games are developed with the US market in mind, as what does well there can usually be marketed to Europe easily, and Japan most of the time.
Ironically this will simply move games away from consoles (where you have to buy the physical disk at a regulated seller's facility) and toward PC gaming, which is increasingly downloadable.
Much like other "mature content" on the internet, the downloading source will ask you "are you over 18?" and when you say yes then they're off the hook.
So this will have the end result of not stopping much of anything, but driving juvenile gamers to a market in which they have a much GREATER possibility of exposure to potentially offensive content.
Much like other "mature content" on the internet, the downloading source will ask you "are you over 18?" and when you say yes then they're off the hook.
So this will have the end result of not stopping much of anything, but driving juvenile gamers to a market in which they have a much GREATER possibility of exposure to potentially offensive content.
I think the fear that our american friends have is that retailers will stop selling 18 rated games because they might get fined for selling it to someone under 18.
This will not happen (not the fining of course, that'll TOTLALLY happen, and rightly so). No, the thing that will not happen is retailrs suddenly stopping selling 18 rated games entirely. That would be absurd, and the stupidest business move any retailer could make. Games make too much money to suddenly stop selling them. Any retailer who stops selling games would lose a fortune. And if they did stop selling it, then either a rival store will just open up nearby and start selling those same games that the previous store will no longer sell, and take all their profits, or other nearby retailers whohaven't stopped selling those games will make more money instead.
This is not going to change anything other than fining a few people who might stupidly sell 18 games to minors. The stores themselves will not stop selling the games.
This will not happen (not the fining of course, that'll TOTLALLY happen, and rightly so). No, the thing that will not happen is retailrs suddenly stopping selling 18 rated games entirely. That would be absurd, and the stupidest business move any retailer could make. Games make too much money to suddenly stop selling them. Any retailer who stops selling games would lose a fortune. And if they did stop selling it, then either a rival store will just open up nearby and start selling those same games that the previous store will no longer sell, and take all their profits, or other nearby retailers whohaven't stopped selling those games will make more money instead.
This is not going to change anything other than fining a few people who might stupidly sell 18 games to minors. The stores themselves will not stop selling the games.
im scepticle that this law will have much affect at all tbh
isnt it already illeagle for under 18s to buy M rated games anyway? and if its not i doubt there are actually that many retailers who are selling them to under 18s, so there wont be a huge drop in sales maybe a minior one but not much at all
and as some people have said, with digital distrobution developers can still sell really well
isnt it already illeagle for under 18s to buy M rated games anyway? and if its not i doubt there are actually that many retailers who are selling them to under 18s, so there wont be a huge drop in sales maybe a minior one but not much at all
and as some people have said, with digital distrobution developers can still sell really well
Of course the results will be Catastrophic! Imagine if all the annoying, yelling 12 year olds that populate XBL could no longer squeak profanity at people online and would thus have to COME OUT of their houses to squeak profanity at people in the REAL world. that force itself, could tear America asunder! (sorry for joking on such a serious post, but i had to get that out there)
The fact of the matter is that Americans place a much higher value on the freedom of speech than the British do. That's why things like Holocaust denial are legal in the U.S.tk1989 said:
No. What will happen is many retailers will be afraid of the legal repercussions of accidentally selling to minors, and will stop selling M-rated games entirely in order to avoid that.tk1989 said:
First of all, nobody said anything about a "collapse". But it could definitely change and not in favour of high production value M-titles. I personally don't even really care that much, since the big companies haven't put out a single genuinely scary or interesting mature game since Silent Hill 2, but I also don't think that hampering their sales (see below) is the way to go about fixing that.tk1989 said:
Second, it's not about selling to minors. It's about retailers having to ask for IDs and having to train and monitor their employees on one more thing, making them reconsider and re-evaluate whether the income from those games justify the administrative overhead AND the possibility of legal punishment if some illegal sales do happen. And the bigger the retail chain, the bigger the overhead and potential fines, therefore the bigger chance that games like Silent Hill will be pushed to some back corner of the shelf, if not dropped completely.
heres a great solution make all game systems non region coded and if M rated games never come out here by them from europe
also then i could finally play a Japanese 360 game on my 360
also then i could finally play a Japanese 360 game on my 360
