Extra Punctuation: Getting Innovation Wrong

[grumbel]

Clauging up the display is NOT "perfectly fine" it is "the best we can do."

It is not about clogging up the display, its about putting the information where your eyes are. Even on the DS most games stick all the critical information on the primary screen instead of the secondary, as you really do not want to waste time switching screens just so you can look at your healthbar. And on the DS both screens are the same distance and close together, with a TV and a controller you would have even bigger issues.

That is not to say that I can't see uses for it, in a slower paced complex military simulation, sure a touchscreen could help quite a bit. But I don't really see Nintendo going into that direction anytime soon and you could get most of the benefits just by sticking a few more buttons on the controller much cheaper.

Having a screen on the controller just sounds to me like a solution looking for a problem. Maybe there is that killer game concept that utilizes it in amazing ways, but even after five years of NintendoDS and playing through FourSwords on the Gamecube/Gameboy I just don't really see it.

 

[windlenot]

I'm definitely against 3D. It reminds me of full motion video in the 90s where it didn't really work and was just a gimmick because of it's "new technology."

 

[Jabberwock xeno]

I disagree.3d, when done well, is Immerisve.

In avatar, it was used to give depth to the background and secenery.

Bad 3d is stuff popping out.

 

[Scow2]

Okay... I have to say I disagree with Yahtzee on the entire motion-control issue. Maybe it's because I love action-adventure-RPG games, but I found the Wii's gesture controls to be untapped potential. In games that focus on melee combat and the like, the gesture controls allow RPG-type games to have the number of combat options of a Fighting Game with 1/4 the buttons tied up.

I also liked the cursor-like precision I had in the Wii's FPS games (I found Modern Warfare to be far more enjoyable on the Wii than the "superior" 360 version), but what frustrated me was the lack of a thumbstick on the main wiimote for turning.

Honestly, I think gesture control is only as gimmicky as it's implemented. I'm looking forward to whip and sword combat in LoZ: Skyward Sword, but the bow definitely seems like a gimmick. But 3-D is a gimmick.

And HD is pretty nice, especially for text-driven games. Unless I'm missing something special about it, I think I've been taking it for granted.

 

[regalphantom]

I'll say this, in my opinion the first DS was a success. Nintendo managed to incorporate 2 major innovations into their system (the touch screen and the dual screens) in a meaningful way which added dimensions to gameplay, and that's what caused the system to sell. I was initially skeptical about 2 screens, but after getting the original DS I quickly fell in love with the concept.

The 3DS, however, doesn't really have any innovations other than the 3D, which, in my opinion, is utter rubbish. I was playing around with a friend's (who claims that it is the best thing since sliced bread) and at first had no idea what the 3D was actually doing other than giving me a headache. After playing around with it for a bit while playing the AR games and Pilot Wings, I had the eureka moment "Oh, THATS what the 3D is doing", followed closely by "Oh, THATS not very impressive". Was it a neat little gimmick? Yes. Did it add any value to the game? No.

Additionally, I'm becoming suspicious that Nintendo doesn't think very highly of gamers anymore. One of the big reasons for this is the lack of a second analog stick on the 3DS. The PSP was heavily criticized for not including one, so why didn't Nintendo clue in. Also, Pilot Wings feels like a cheap excuse to steal money from us. I remember greatly enjoying Pilot Wings for the Super Nintendo and the N64 because of the wide variety of levels and challenges. PW:SR doesn't have that, its short and lacking in variety.

I'm not a complete cynic yet, but I feel cheated by the 3DS. Even ignoring the 3D, it isn't quite enough of an upgrade to the DS to justify purchasing, in my opinion.

 

[pyramid head grape]

3D sucks so deal with it.

 

[hooby]

Well most of you guys seem to young to remember, but exactly - EXACTLY - the same thing happened back in the early 90ies, when games where switching from 2D hand-drawn sprites to 3D engines with polygons.

And damn where those first 3D games ugly. Blocky models, flat low-res textures, bad lighting. But almost every new game coming out was called "GAMETITLE 3D" and everyone made big fuss about it.

And guess what, back then many people said "3D sucks, let's stay with 2D, that looks way better." And there where people complaining about headaches and nausea.

It's just history repeating, but this time it's about stereoscopic 3D.

 

[CrawlingPastaHellion]

All I can say is: neuronic controller FTW!!!

 

[Robert Filomeo]

One of the major things that i dont like about 3D is simply not being able to see it. One of the things that these companies are overlooking is that people with lack of depth perception is that they cant see 3D becuase their eyes cant see the images equally. I'm tired of going to movies and being forced to pay for a feature that i cant even see. For people like me 3D is a dead end with no future in our lives.

 

[thepyrethatburns]

Nintendo's user base:
1. Fanbois who will buy their shit no matter what.
2. People that just want to play Pokemon, Zelda and SSB.
3. Idiots drawn in by cheap gimmicks.
4. People that realise that their latest console is bullshit but buy it anyway to justify hating it.
5. Your Gran.

Those five groups cover about 90% of the population. Notice how only one of those groups is drawn in by actual games, and those are games that haven't changed since the 90's.

I like how this quote is acceptable and totally not a fanboy but:

Wow if that's not a clear fanboy line, I dunno what is. Okay I can play that ignorant game too:

Microsoft and SONY's user base:
1. People who prefer graphics over gameplay and are wowed by HD.
2. Hillbillies who only want to play war based games and shoot things.
3. Madden junkies.
4. Pretentious, elitist snobs who only care about tech specs.
5. Your drunken uncle.
6. Worthless neanderthals who think CoD hasn't stagnated faster than any Nintendo franchise.
7. Petty, opinion-less blobs that listen to Metacritic and only Metacritic.

See how stupid arguments towards a company or console like this really are?

This one is probation worthy.

Frankly, if I were Lordofthesuplex, I would have pointed out:

1. Fanbois who will buy their shit no matter what.

As opposed to fans of Halo, Call of Duty, Metal Gear Solid, Half-Life, etc.

2. People that just want to play Pokemon, Zelda and SSB.

Because, if it doesn't have "blood n' boobs" in it, it just isn't worth playing.

......Except when it crosses over to the other consoles such as No More Heroes or Dead Space Extraction did. Then it's kewl.

3. Idiots drawn in by cheap gimmicks.

Which is why the other two consoles have been shamelessly swiping everything from Miis to Motion Controls from Nintendo.

4. People that realise that their latest console is bullshit but buy it anyway to justify hating it.

Because massive failure rates and credit card theft is so much better.

5. Your Gran.

Which is a funny statement given that, by selling to people outside the 15-24 male category, Nintendo has done more to make video games accepted as a "lifestyle" as well as the NEA's recent acceptance of Games being art than the other two have put together. It's doubly funny because Sony broke into the market with the PS1 by advertising video games as something that you didn't have to be a basement-dweller to enjoy. This adds just the right amount of irony to these pronouncements when it's a Sony fanboy doing it.

As for this Extra Punctuation:

*Shrug* Yahtzee strikes me as an increasingly bitter old man who is feeling left behind by the industry. It isn't so much that he hates the Wii as he continually makes statements like:

"But with the Wii and 3DS innovation one-two punch that dismally failed to connect,"

except in areas of sales, market, innovation. From that perspective, I can understand why he like the PS3 and the 360 because they are, for the most part, just beefier versions of their predecessors. But the fact that he's already beginning to trash the new Nintendo console before it's even out.....Well, actually, that's pretty much what I expected him to do. In this, I suppose I have to admire the fact that he is remarkably consistent.

 

[exampleAccount]

Snip

Because disliking one company automatically makes me a fanboi of one of the other two?

Look, I buy nintendo products myself (DS's) because I want to play pokemon. I wasn't saying those where bad games, just that they are the only ones worth getting a Wii or DS for.

And yeah, the other consoles are ripping off motion controls but they had other selling points before hand.

The point is, Nintendo isn't moving the gaming medium forward at all. All there new stuff is shit.

 

[thepyrethatburns]

Because disliking one company automatically makes me a fanboi of one of the other two?

It does when your post amounts to just trolling people for buying a console.

Look, I buy nintendo products myself (DS's) because I want to play pokemon. I wasn't saying those where bad games, just that they are the only ones worth getting a Wii or DS for.

This is true in the same way that there is no reason to buy a 360 if you are not a Halo Fan or a PS3 if you are not an MGS fan.

And yeah, the other consoles are ripping off motion controls but they had other selling points before hand.

Yes, for 18-24 year-old males who are content in playing consoles that were just beefier iterations of the previous one.

Nintendo, on the other hand, has actually managed to bring in more new gamers than the other two combined.

The point is, Nintendo isn't moving the gaming medium forward at all. All there new stuff is shit.

Because your "extensive" knowledge of Nintendo's product as well as your blind fanboyism makes you the best judge of Nintendo's market appeal.

But, hey. It's not like your sentiments aren't repeated ad nauseum on Gamefaqs/Gamespot so they must be right.

 

[Moeez]

I want to say 3D is a fad. But then we all thought Wii motion controls was a fad, and it's less convenient than controllers. But nope, everyone jumped on the bandwagon. For what reason? That there are millions of potential customers who don't play games will now have brand loyalty? Didn't those same people leave their Wii to dust? And their Kinect?

But as long as the company gets the sale, they don't care how long you spend on the product.

I could see this thread full of probation badges.

 

[exampleAccount]

Because disliking one company automatically makes me a fanboi of one of the other two?

It does when your post amounts to just trolling people for buying a console.
Learn what trolling is please.

Look, I buy nintendo products myself (DS's) because I want to play pokemon. I wasn't saying those where bad games, just that they are the only ones worth getting a Wii or DS for.

This is true in the same way that there is no reason to buy a 360 if you are not a Halo Fan or a PS3 if you are not an MGS fan.
I disagree, there are plenty of good games on both the other consoles and PC. On the Wii there are roughly... three, maybe four.

And yeah, the other consoles are ripping off motion controls but they had other selling points before hand.

Yes, for 18-24 year-old males who are content in playing consoles that were just beefier iterations of the previous one.

Nintendo, on the other hand, has actually managed to bring in more new gamers than the other two combined.I know a lot of these new "gamers" first hand, they barely even use their Wii's unless loads of people come round and get pissed. Anyway, just attracting new customers isn't moving the medium forward.

The point is, Nintendo isn't moving the gaming medium forward at all. All there new stuff is shit.

Because your "extensive" knowledge of Nintendo's product as well as your blind fanboyism derp makes you the best judge of Nintendo's market appeal.

But, hey. It's not like your sentiments aren't repeated ad nauseum on Gamefaqs/Gamespot so they must be right. Because that makes me wrong by default ...herp

Don't imply that I haven't formed this opinion myself, I did give the Wii a chance because I didn't want to be an ignorant naysayer. I just can't see any advantage over the other consoles or any real innovation that actually made it better

Response in bold.

 

[cefm]

We're at a plateau right now where technical capacity can't really advance anymore without surpassing our ability to design games that will utilize it (on an affordable budget).

We were there back in the 80's with the original NES too. The next step up was the video arcade game that cost thousands. Didn't make sense. So the main focus had to remain on making better quality games through game-play, level design and story. You couldn't out-do the competition with graphics only.

Game designers should be focusing on making better games or figuring out if there is a new category of game that should be created (what's the next FPS?). 3-D sure as hell ain't the answer because it makes the game WORSE, not better.

 

[Jfswift]

I still think Nintendo was right on the money with their N64 controller. It was perfect or would be with just a few modifications imho.

As for 3D. I think it's neat to be able to see depth but it's rarely used properly. I'm not sure if I like super HD displays either. Take the newer batman movie with the joker. At one point there's a close up of his face while he's speaking and I swear I can see the stage makeup. It just.. doesn't look right. *shrug*