For the Better?

[shadow skill]

Because apparently rythmic, syllable-laden descriptive poetry spoken aloud over a steady beat is causing the intellectual down fall of the human race. How dare they use language to tell a story using metaphor and symbolism?

And if that was what the majority of Rap was I might agree with you. Sorry, listening to generic black rapper #3570824 talking about his drugs, his hoes, his guns and how he ran from the cops doesn't exactly speak to me on a deep metaphorical or symbolic level. If the genre of Rap purges itself of these simpletons then rap, in and of itself, is not a bad thing. The people representing it on the other hand...well, they're not doing it any justice of the way you described it.

Because what you hear on MTV, BET, or the radio is really an indicator of what an art form is.........................

 

[electric discordian]

Humanity is doomed, we have no concept of what we are doing because we allow about one percent of our entire species to make out decisions, decree what is acceptable and create our technological advances. I for one am not in the remotest bit scientific and I and all the other non scientific apes have no concept how our Microwaves, Dvds or Xboxs work. Technology has advanced faster than humanity has had a chance to cope with. Hence why most of our technological advances have first had military applications, the brains invent the toys and then the gorillas in the Pentagon find a new way of using them to break there opponents skulls.

I fear what will happen if the do discover Anti Matter and find a way of harnessing it. On that topic it is no concidence that many people thought the world was going to end because of those scary scientists. We are driven by the wrong definitions of beauty, our minds are corrupted by religions and ideas that have been so diluted over the years as to have no meaning any more.

We unless we can evolve mentally and emotionally as well as technologically are approaching a fast cycling drain.....

On the plus side my inherent Nihilism is lessening!

 

[Danny Ocean]

Because what you hear on MTV, BET, or the radio is really an indicator of what an art form is...

What people hear on MTV, BET, or other popular channels is what the majority of people will see it as. So the majority of newer rappers will be rapping crap about drugs guns and hoes. It only seems to be the older rappers who actually say anything meaningful. Eventually they'll fade out of fashion due to the newer generations being slaves to pop-culture, and rap will really go off the rails.
It's like the chicken and the egg. Did rapping start all this stupid culture, or did the stupid culture just pick up a microphone?

Ugh, R&B though, so samey.

I fear what will happen if the do discover Anti Matter and find a way of harnessing it.

I do believe we're (humanity, not me, hah.) already making it in small amounts.

 

[The_Deleted]

Mankind would be far better off without The Church. After women had the rights of worship taken from them by men, we have been told, by a select few, what is and is not right, unless what is not right serves a higher purpose for the benefit of the select few.
We need to respect each others Faith. We need to respect the doctrine of the 10 Commandments on the whole. And we need to realise that the only people we really harm are the generations that follow.

 

[Imitation Saccharin]

In my opinion, the human race is headed in all sorts of directions.

The question implies the mean

Humanity is doomed, we have no concept of what we are doing because we allow about one percent of our entire species to make out decisions, decree what is acceptable and create our technological advances.

This from the "I'm going to make up random figures and then become appalled at their implications" school of arguement apparently

Technology has advanced faster than humanity has had a chance to cope with.

No it hasn't, you're just being lazy.

Go on How it works and look up microwaves. Boom, mission accomplished.

You can't say if humanity is heading in the right direction because you have no idea what direction (in the long run) is the right direction.

You can have(has?) no idea what ultimately will become of us, yes, but you can tell if we're ascending or descending, and we are, in my opinion anyways, most assuredly climbing.

And if that was what the majority of Rap was I might agree with you. Sorry, listening to generic black rapper #3570824 talking about his drugs, his hoes, his guns and how he ran from the cops doesn't exactly speak to me on a deep metaphorical or symbolic level.

The issue isn't that the majority of rap is holding quality X, your claim was all rap does. This is clearly not the case, as counter-examples exist in plenty.
Take this track

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZA7_GtlSC8&feature=related

or this


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k8Xk5fpxh30

or this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lrsj653088E

 

[Amnestic]

, your claim was all rap does

If by "your" you're referring to Khell as opposed to me, then you'd be right. I've not stated that all rap does. In fact I explicitly stated "Majority of Rap" as opposed to "entirety".

And if we're getting into an argument, then the issue is that the majority of rap is holding the qualities I listed.

Oh nice, just got up to a certain point in the first song you linked me to. "***** N-a" gives me awesome hope for this song. Would you care to explain the symbolism in the lyrics by the way? I've got a link with them up and honestly I can't make head nor tail of what they're on about.

 

[Imitation Saccharin]

If by "your" you're referring to Khell as opposed to me, then you'd be right.

Person A makes statement a.
Person B defends the validity of statement a against arguement b.
Therefore, Person B makes the claim of a's validity against those aspects criticized in b
If b is the claim entirely, then a is b.
The defense is of a, as a=b
A is claimed to be valid in completeness

Thus, you too made the claim.
As for a "majority", that was used to validate the dismissal of "all" (note the point that this originally derives from is "rap" -no divisional word- is in need of removal), and thus is utilized in a manner to indicate a sufficient quantity to indicate the entirety. Thus, "all".

Would you care to explain the symbolism in the lyrics by the way?

Ahh, because vulgarity negates art. I'm sorry.

We need to ring up Shakespeare quick!

 

[Imitation Saccharin]

If you didn't mean that Amnestic, I'm sorry. Its just the impression I got.

Would you care to re-state your own position so I can better understand it?

 

[John Galt]

Let's see...I don't live in a soot-stained ghetto overlooking a child-employing factory, and we've just fired up the most advanced machine ever made. I think we're on to something here.

We've been progressing exponentially since we pulled out of the Dark Ages. First the Renaissance, then the Industrial Revolution and Enlightenment. The first 50 years of the 20th century seemed a little rocky but we pulled out of that and have gone from massive wars fought by conscript armies to lengthy occupations and small-scale raids against even smaller-scale terrorists. We've got our highs and lows but you must agree that we're moving in a good direction. Who knows? Maybe we'll hit the Singularity within our lifetimes?

 

[Beowulf DW]

Humanity is almost always heading towards a better direction.

I agree totally.

I won't deny that we have some major problems to overcome, but we are in the process of overcoming them. War, disease, world hunger, etc. are all being worked on by the U.N.

Religious intolerance is a different matter though. Unlike many of the people here who have posts regarding this, I do not believe that abolishing religion is the solution. People are going to hold on to their faith no matter what you do, so in a sense, you'd only perpetuate the cycle of religious intolerance. You fail to realize that religion and spirituality is not a bad thing in and of itself. Religions have been a major factor in the developement of humanity. Religions have contributed to the laws and basic moral standards which allow us to live with one another in relative peace. I won't deny that horrible things have been done in the name of religion, but these events were mostly due to religious fanatics and power hungry individuals who misinterpreted or twisted their own spirituality to suit their own purposes. It's the institutions built around certain religions that seem to invite such abuse.

 

[The Lyre]

Problem is, more than half of us aren't to be trusted.

Did someone say, GENOCIDE?!

Let's see...I don't live in a soot-stained ghetto overlooking a child-employing factory, and we've just fired up the most advanced machine ever made. I think we're on to something here.

We've been progressing exponentially since we pulled out of the Dark Ages. First the Renaissance, then the Industrial Revolution and Enlightenment. The first 50 years of the 20th century seemed a little rocky but we pulled out of that and have gone from massive wars fought by conscript armies to lengthy occupations and small-scale raids against even smaller-scale terrorists. We've got our highs and lows but you must agree that we're moving in a good direction. Who knows? Maybe we'll hit the Singularity within our lifetimes?

What that thar smart man done said.

As a species, humanity is always advancing through necessity - as long as their is a disease to cure or an unanswered question then we will always strive to advance.

As individuals however? Oh dear God, get the sawed-off, there's idiot noobs that needs a puttin' out of their misery.

 

[Amnestic]

Ahh, because vulgarity negates art. I'm sorry.

We need to ring up Shakespeare quick!

I was just remarking that needlessly throwing the "N" word into a song hardly gives me the impression that the song is deep and holds symbolism. The question concerning an explanation of the lyrics was whole hearted though. They made no sense to me beyond a string together of phrases which rhymed, vaguely.

Would you care to re-state your own position so I can better understand it?

My position is that rap, as I said, in and of itself is not a particularly bad thing. Rather, the people who, dare I say, infest the genre are not representing it in the way you described, not in any way, shape or form in fact. While the description you gave of Rap may be it's correct definition, culturally what it is at the moment is anything but deep and meaningful. As I said, the majority of Rap is about guns, drugs, hoes and running from the cops.

 

[Imitation Saccharin]

I was just remarking that needlessly throwing the "N" word into a song hardly gives me the impression that the song is deep and holds symbolism. The question concerning an explanation of the lyrics was whole hearted though.

He's being a braggard with metaphor. He's more Reservoir Dogs then Quentin Tarantino, for instance.
Hence, a rap song utilizing metaphor.

They made no sense to me beyond a string together of phrases which rhymed, vaguely.

Hehe- O death, where is thy sting? Oh Hades, where is thy victory?

culturally what it is at the moment is anything but deep and meaningful.

The masses enjoy their gangsta fantasy, and I can't really see a reason to begrudge them.
There'll always be Aesop rock's for those wanting something different.

 

[Imitation Saccharin]

*sigh*
Of all sad words of tongue and pen, the saddest are these: "It might have been."

 

[Eiseman]

All I know is that whenever someone mentions that they've "lost all faith in humanity," I just want to hurl a javelin in their chest. I figure I'd be doing them a favor, the self-important little pricks.

Human civilization is working out just dandy, as far as I'm concerned.

 

[Jamanticus]

Let's see...I don't live in a soot-stained ghetto overlooking a child-employing factory, and we've just fired up the most advanced machine ever made. I think we're on to something here.

We've been progressing exponentially since we pulled out of the Dark Ages. First the Renaissance, then the Industrial Revolution and Enlightenment. The first 50 years of the 20th century seemed a little rocky but we pulled out of that and have gone from massive wars fought by conscript armies to lengthy occupations and small-scale raids against even smaller-scale terrorists. We've got our highs and lows but you must agree that we're moving in a good direction. Who knows? Maybe we'll hit the Singularity within our lifetimes?

I suppose so... But is there a limit to human potential? Is there ever going to be a point where we give up and say, "Ah, I'm through..."
I don't think there will be.
Oh, and by the way, next time you're around that LHC, could you pick up a handful of anti-deuterium and send it to me? I've always wondered what it would look like to have a matter-antimatter reaction in a fish tank...

 

[shadow skill]

People that have no concept of a given people's history and by extension culture really don't need to comment on the nature of their music.

 

[Imitation Saccharin]

People that have no concept of a given people's history and by extension culture really don't need to comment on the nature of their music.

Doesn't this negate all musical criticism?

 

[shadow skill]

People that have no concept of a given people's history and by extension culture really don't need to comment on the nature of their music.

Doesn't this negate all musical criticism?

No it just negates retarded generalizations on the part of the ignorant. It's not impossible for those not already part of a given culture to find out about it if they want to.

 

[Imitation Saccharin]

No it just negates retarded generalizations on the part of the ignorant. It's not impossible for those not already part of a given culture to find out about it if they want to.

You've created an artificial barrier to criticism that only you know precisely how to overcome. Thus it is in effect a No True Scotsman fallacy, where in you're now able to negate all arguments you don't like as "ignorant".