Gabe Newell thinks Windows 8 will be a catastrophe?

thesilentman

What this
Jun 14, 2012
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cotss2012 said:
TheSniperFan said:
I don't use any WYSIWYG crap like Dreamweaver - I code from scratch
Same here. Time for a brofist!

[/quote]
I have immense respect for people who work from scratch as I myself am starting C++.

OT- I have a bad feeling about Windows 8 as Microsoft is, well, Microsoft. Despite using Vista (somehow it works well only for gaming) for my desktop and 7 on my laptop, Gabe, your fears are misplaced.

That's what I thought at first.

Then I remembered that this was Money$oft. They removed DVD support, forced a UI that would be better on a Mac (fuck that, useless on any platform 'sides tablets), and REMOVED THE START BUTTON! (I'm never living that down, and yes I know about the Start8 download).

Yes, Money$oft I know you're greedy, but step back and tell me why I should upgrade to Windows 8. It's Windows 7 with a convoluted interface. Is it faster than 7? I don't want faster startup times, I want better performance and better multitasking. Is it the interface? As someone who uses task manager a lot, and is used to Vista/7's Windows Explorer and is a beginning developer, tell me that Metro will help me find critical files that aren't programs with a straight face, Money$oft.

There is a reason people cite 2000/XP/7 as good OSes. They worked and they were open enough to develop for.

Looks like no one can argue when I say that Microsoft is copying Apple by closing up.
 

Epona

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jcb1337 said:
Well. It looks like I'll need to upgrade my 5 years old Vista system to one that runs 7 before the horribleness that is Windows 8 taints PC with its presence.
Anything running Vista will run 7 better. I put Windows 8 on a Vista machine and it runs 8 alot better than Vista.
 

thesilentman

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Jun 14, 2012
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Speaking of which, what are the system requirements for Win 8? Might buy for Vista, but I'll still game on 7.

captcha- mom and dad

Yyyyyeeeeeeaaaaaaahhhhhhh, no. Not at all.
 

evilneko

Slava Ukraini
Jun 16, 2011
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thesilentman said:
OT- I have a bad feeling about Windows 8 as Microsoft is, well, Microsoft. Despite using Vista (somehow it works well only for gaming) for my desktop and 7 on my laptop, Gabe, your fears are misplaced.

That's what I thought at first.

Then I remembered that this was Money$oft. They removed DVD support, forced a UI that would be better on a Mac (fuck that, useless on any platform 'sides tablets), and REMOVED THE START BUTTON! (I'm never living that down, and yes I know about the Start8 download).
Start Button's still there, it just hides til you move your mouse there. Then it either provides shortcuts to useful stuff if you right click it (including task manager), or takes you to the start menu if you left click it. I can still use the normal Windows search via the searchbox in Windows Explorer.

And what do you mean removed DVD support? Granted, I just popped a DVD in and 8 did nothing, but that's because I told it to do nothing some time ago. I can quickly change that though. Please explain this remark!

Yes, Money$oft I know you're greedy, but step back and tell me why I should upgrade to Windows 8. It's Windows 7 with a convoluted interface. Is it faster than 7? I don't want faster startup times, I want better performance and better multitasking. Is it the interface? As someone who uses task manager a lot, and is used to Vista/7's Windows Explorer and is a beginning developer, tell me that Metro will help me find critical files that aren't programs with a straight face, Money$oft.
8's Windows Explorer is superior to 7's. ;)

There is a reason people cite 2000/XP/7 as good OSes. They worked and they were open enough to develop for.

Looks like no one can argue when I say that Microsoft is copying Apple by closing up.
I'll argue by saying they're not actually closing anything up.

Because they aren't.

Windows 8 != Apple iOS. [small]*grumbles about there being two very different operating systems called IOS...*[/small]
 

Death916

Senior Member
Apr 21, 2008
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oplinger said:
Wayneguard said:
WoW Killer said:
__snip___I dare anyone to try and get kotor 2 to work on windows 7.
...All I had to do was check some boxes, and it worked fine. Many things work on windows 7 with a little tweaking.
---Snip---
Check a few boxes? I tried everything to get kotor 2 to work and eventually just gave up after days. Don't think I just have no idea what I'm doing, I do. Gotten all sorts of different games movies etc in different formats to work on every operating system. Kotor just stumped me. Heard it had something to do with who made your graphics card basically and some people were just f'ed.

OT though I hated Windows Vista and got the 7 beta as soon as i heard about it. I think i'll stay with 7 until 8 has a few updates, and I hear some reviews.
 

Tharwen

Ep. VI: Return of the turret
May 7, 2009
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evilneko said:
Tharwen said:
evilneko said:
Performance wise, 8 and XP are virtually identical. So no "massive system hogging" here.
Wait... really? How?
Seriously. I've been using 8 on my laptop for weeks. It's no slower than XP (which was on the laptop previously) and possibly somewhat faster. I've also tried 7 on both my laptop and desktop (back when it was in RC stage, and also comparing to both XP32 and XP64) with much the same result (no noticeable gain or loss). On my hardware, XP, 7, and 8 are all pretty much the same though I might say 8 is slightly faster (and oddly enough, less annoying). It sure as hell isn't slower (*coughcough*Vista*cough*).
*Narrows eyes*

What hardware?
 

thesilentman

What this
Jun 14, 2012
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evilneko said:
thesilentman said:
OT- I have a bad feeling about Windows 8 as Microsoft is, well, Microsoft. Despite using Vista (somehow it works well only for gaming) for my desktop and 7 on my laptop, Gabe, your fears are misplaced.

That's what I thought at first.

Then I remembered that this was Money$oft. They removed DVD support, forced a UI that would be better on a Mac (fuck that, useless on any platform 'sides tablets), and REMOVED THE START BUTTON! (I'm never living that down, and yes I know about the Start8 download).
Start Button's still there, it just hides til you move your mouse there. Then it either provides shortcuts to useful stuff if you right click it (including task manager), or takes you to the start menu if you left click it. I can still use the normal Windows search via the searchbox in Windows Explorer.

And what do you mean removed DVD support? Granted, I just popped a DVD in and 8 did nothing, but that's because I told it to do nothing some time ago. I can quickly change that though. Please explain this remark!

Yes, Money$oft I know you're greedy, but step back and tell me why I should upgrade to Windows 8. It's Windows 7 with a convoluted interface. Is it faster than 7? I don't want faster startup times, I want better performance and better multitasking. Is it the interface? As someone who uses task manager a lot, and is used to Vista/7's Windows Explorer and is a beginning developer, tell me that Metro will help me find critical files that aren't programs with a straight face, Money$oft.
8's Windows Explorer is superior to 7's. ;)

There is a reason people cite 2000/XP/7 as good OSes. They worked and they were open enough to develop for.

Looks like no one can argue when I say that Microsoft is copying Apple by closing up.
I'll argue by saying they're not actually closing anything up.

Because they aren't.

Windows 8 != Apple iOS. [small]*grumbles about there being two very different operating systems called IOS...*[/small]
'Smacking himself for forgetting about DVD support' I probably misunderstood no DVD support with no default DVD player. I take fault for that.

As for the Windows Explorer, I've never been a fan of the Ribbon interface, do I either hope Microsoft has an option to customize that or opt for a Classic theme as I don't see how Microsoft managed to integrate Windows Explorer with Ribbon. I really don't, so I'll stay a skeptic till I see the final release.

I want Windows Explorer to be a blend between 'as little as possible' and 'information overkill' while still telling me that a file's type. This may be fixed in the options. And the 'Windows 8 Explorer is better' is an opinion, for God's sake.

For the start button, a conspicuous one certainly wouldn't hurt and I would like a button that works in the explorer interface without Metro. Something like Windows Vista/7's start menu (and Win 2000/XP's).

The options do look exciting (thank God Microsoft finally caught on to cloud settings and Windows To Go), but I want something that couldn't have been part of a service pack. Like I said above, I want changes in the way Windows operates, not a software update.
 

Tharwen

Ep. VI: Return of the turret
May 7, 2009
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evilneko said:
Tharwen said:
*Narrows eyes*

What hardware?
Hardware that's a few years old now. The laptop's only got 2GB RAM, too. :p
Hmmm... I think you've just had Windows 8-y specs this whole time and not noticed because XP never needed it all... *Suspicious*
 

evilneko

Slava Ukraini
Jun 16, 2011
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Tharwen said:
evilneko said:
Tharwen said:
*Narrows eyes*

What hardware?
Hardware that's a few years old now. The laptop's only got 2GB RAM, too. :p
Hmmm... I think you've just had Windows 8-y specs this whole time and not noticed because XP never needed it all... *Suspicious*
Unless your computer is getting damn near ten years old, so have you [http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/archive/2012/02/29/running-the-consumer-preview-system-recommendations.aspx].

1 GHz or faster processor
1 GB RAM (32-bit) or 2 GB RAM (64-bit)
16 GB available hard disk space (32-bit) or 20 GB (64-bit)
DirectX 9 graphics device with WDDM 1.0 or higher driver
Also requires PAE, NX, and SSE2 support on the CPU, all of which you already have if your CPU is anything less than perhaps 5-6 years old.
 

Tharwen

Ep. VI: Return of the turret
May 7, 2009
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0
evilneko said:
Tharwen said:
evilneko said:
Tharwen said:
*Narrows eyes*

What hardware?
Hardware that's a few years old now. The laptop's only got 2GB RAM, too. :p
Hmmm... I think you've just had Windows 8-y specs this whole time and not noticed because XP never needed it all... *Suspicious*
Unless your computer is getting damn near ten years old, so have you [http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/archive/2012/02/29/running-the-consumer-preview-system-recommendations.aspx].

1 GHz or faster processor
1 GB RAM (32-bit) or 2 GB RAM (64-bit)
16 GB available hard disk space (32-bit) or 20 GB (64-bit)
DirectX 9 graphics device with WDDM 1.0 or higher driver
Also requires PAE, NX, and SSE2 support on the CPU, all of which you already have if your CPU is anything less than perhaps 5-6 years old.
Hmph. Looks like you're right. Those requirements are still a hell of a lot higher than XP's though. My 10-year-old desktop would shrivel up and cry if it saw numbers like that.
 

zumbledum

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Nov 13, 2011
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evilneko said:
zumbledum said:
Sober Thal said:
Still using XP here.

That being said, why should I care what Gabe (valve drone) has to say about anything?
do you like the idea of every game using games for windows live?
I don't really care either way, actually.

do you want to start paying console prices for pc games?
Console and PC games are both 60 bucks at release excepting special editions, then gradually go down from there. So... we kinda are.

do you want to keep on using firefox/chrome?
Not particularly, no. Opera fan here. ;)

do you use itunes or youtube or any online service?
*shudders* itunes...
But yes I use youtube. What does this have to do with Gabe Newell spouting off unjustified bullshit?

do you like having a choice in what media player to use? what email system to use? which IM program to use?
Why yes, and I will continue to have that choice no matter if Gabe Newell vomits or not.

then you should care
You've not made a very good case yet.

every single thing from program and games to apps exists because windows has been open. the minute windows 8 closes that no one will be able to use windows to do anything without paying for a licence and MS can choose who they give that licence to.
Windows 8 is not going to break any of the things you listed.
well im sorry your hatred for gabe is so extreme you are blinded to the dangers this change in windows 8 brings to the market, doesnt seem to be any point trying to make a case your clinging to this with the passion of a religious extremist , but when your forced into paying subs for opera and whatever things on the net you do use or simply cant any more because MS doesnt want them around , well you were warned.
 

yuval152

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Jul 6, 2011
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I acutally liked windows 8 and I might buy it,although I will be abit disappointed if steam won't support windows 8.

Also can someone please explain to me how windows 8 is closed?
 

zumbledum

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Nov 13, 2011
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EternalFacepalm said:
zumbledum said:
Microsoft certainly has its moments of anti-consumerism, but their goal is still ultimately making money. Would locking the system to this degree earn them money? No. Therefore it will never happen.

Still, though, I can see them locking the system to a certain degree, even trying to push it as far as possible. However, if this were to happen, and Linux finally starts getting some real support from ATI/nVidia, then I can see people migrating to Linux.
[sub]I can dream, can't I?[/sub]
i hope your right i really do , i just see there being a lot of room for them being able to leverage their monopoly power to cost us a vast amount more than they currently do. Maybe they wont go full evil straight off maybe its going to start with all devs having to charge an extra 20-30 for games to cover the new licences , maybe were going to have to subscribe to windows gold to come to the escapist visit you tube and anything else you do.

its simple pascal style logic for me. windows going to closed could at very best be no worse than it is now, that is the full breadth of options of a good result for us the consumer.
the other side of the coin if it should fall can only be bad.

Which leads to the next logical point why make it closed if your not going to do anything with the new state? answer-you wouldnt. they must have a plan and a reason for doing this and its going to be to charge us more.
 
Jun 11, 2008
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evilneko said:
Console and PC games are both 60 bucks at release excepting special editions, then gradually go down from there. So... we kinda are.
I don't know where you buy PC games but you're getting ripped off.
 

SpAc3man

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Jul 26, 2009
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WoW Killer said:
I'm still using XP. And I'm still waiting for a valid reason to use anything else. Will there be any point to 8? Like does do anything XP doesn't that would justify the massive system hogging that would accompany it?
Windows 7 is a lot more efficient than XP when it comes to utilising system resources. If your machine meets the recommended specs then there is no reason you should still be using XP. Memory management/allocation is terrible on XP.


OT: Sounds like Gabe has spoken before thinking again. Just like he did with the PS3. Effective Steam integration with Metro could be very very good if done right. I would like to see live tiles for various aspects of Steam. Store, Library, Friends, Community and even some for individual games. Of course there would still have to be support for the legacy desktop for people afraid of changing.