Gamers make bad feminists

[Loonyyy]

MASSIVE SNIPPAGE

Well, I think what it comes down to is even though I agree with their motives, trying to reduce domestic violence against woman and stopping sexism, I cannot abide by many of their methods any longer, and it has left me Jaded to the whole endeavour.

Totally fair. The most of them I've encountered have been on the net, and I'm singularly unimpressed by their net presence. Even some more reasonable sites like the posted Manboobz one are full of attempts at using (Incorrectly) terminology typically used by skeptics and rationalists (My favourite bloggers), and failing horribly at it, especially when it comes to understanding logical fallacies, particularly False Equivalence and anything relating to the Mean.

They also tended to misuse and reappropriate terms, most basically coming to the conclusion that they were "Equity" Feminists, which they defined as meaning "Working towards equality for both genders". You're an Egalitarianist! They were more interested in clinging to a label than meaning something. More interested in being seen as radical than being radical.

Most of the ones I've met irl are ok, so I guess it's just the internet letting people be jerks again,GITDWT etc, like that youtube comments on that kickstarter video (Actually, that's kind of a good example of some of them, and the Escapist panel a while ago on women in games was good too).

 

[Loonyyy]

Yup, have to confess, totally not getting the furore over the new Tomb Raider. Seems like games devs are damned if they do and damned if they don't.

Oh yeah. Everyone's looking to be offended rather than actually trying to be considerate. There's plenty of offensive rubbish out there, but instead we look for meaning where there isn't. There's really nothing to the Tomb Raider thing, and the Hitman trailer's simply a poorly considered PR move, considering most people's attitude to violence towards women, and sex in games.

 

[Oirish_Martin]

Totally fair. The most of them I've encountered have been on the net, and I'm singularly unimpressed by their net presence. Even some more reasonable sites like the posted Manboobz one

I would not consider Manboobz to be a reasonable site.

It's like the ShitRedditSays subreddit, which has taken to policing men's rights threads among others. It's not a place for serious argument, it's for people to circle-jerk over how offended they are (although arguably some of the MRA subreddits are like that. Nothing wrong with that per se, they certainly have every right to do so, but it's hardly the most reasonable place to be.

 

[Loonyyy]

Totally fair. The most of them I've encountered have been on the net, and I'm singularly unimpressed by their net presence. Even some more reasonable sites like the posted Manboobz one

I would not consider Manboobz to be a reasonable site.

It's like the ShitRedditSays subreddit, which has taken to policing men's rights threads among others. It's not a place for serious argument, it's for people to circle-jerk over how offended they are (although arguably some of the MRA subreddits are like that. Nothing wrong with that per se, they certainly have every right to do so, but it's hardly the most reasonable place to be.

Serious argument != Reasonable.

I was referring to both the blog part and the community.
The blog, pretty good, guys reasonably reasonable and rational. Discussion or respect isn't required in my mind for reason. He's not a misandrist or a misogynist, so I'd be happy to say he's reasonable, and not terribly objectionable.

The forums were terrible, and disappointed me, being largely a group of people who'd had a basic education in critical thinking, (Too basic), and then proceeded to fail in a general circle of patting themselves on the back, and degenerating the word feminist until it meant "Person who respects everyone". While they were mostly good on the note of not wanting to remove genitals, they seemed to be on the poor note of not knowing what they were talking about, which bummed me out.

So I guess by reasonable I mean not "DivineFemitheist" crazy, or Dworkin (Or whatever her name was) level of insane.

 

[Darkmantle]

MASSIVE SNIPPAGE

Well, I think what it comes down to is even though I agree with their motives, trying to reduce domestic violence against woman and stopping sexism, I cannot abide by many of their methods any longer, and it has left me Jaded to the whole endeavour.

Considering your ability to not read things in context, getting tired of things is not a surprise. People who are against them rarely seem to be fair in their assessment. The horror at their methods never seems to consist of substantive criticism.

And here me and this feminist were having a nice conversation and you had to jump in eh?

I know what I'm talking about, maybe you should calm the hell down before posting, because you seem pretty mad bro.

 

[Darkmantle]

MASSIVE SNIPPAGE

Well, I think what it comes down to is even though I agree with their motives, trying to reduce domestic violence against woman and stopping sexism, I cannot abide by many of their methods any longer, and it has left me Jaded to the whole endeavour.

Considering your ability to not read things in context, getting tired of things is not a surprise. People who are against them rarely seem to be fair in their assessment. The horror at their methods never seems to consist of substantive criticism.

And here me and this feminist were having a nice conversation and you had to jump in eh?

I know what I'm talking about, maybe you should calm the hell down before posting, because you seem pretty mad bro.

In other words you lack the integrity to back up your claims about feminists and instead choose to ignore that I called you on your lack of substantive criticism of their methods.

Btw, you might want to actually make a decent post before posting. Not half-assed reading like your earlier reply to me.

well If you bothered to read the conversation me and the other fellow were having, you would have noticed I posted the names of some feminist organizations that were using fraudulent Domestic violence statistics, and stated that I cannot in good conscience support any organization that actively lies to play the victim card, and it puts the whole movement in ill repute in my eyes. but that's if you bothered to read, not likely.

the organization is "Men Against Violence Against Women" the faulty stat is "90% of domestic abuse victim are female" which may have been true in the 70s or 80s, but is not true now, every study past about 2006 pegs it at about 60/40, give or take. Such as the yearly stats Canada studies for example, who are not considered bias by anyone here.


I don't like liars, your feminism is full of them. Either work to clean up your "label's" act, or don't be surprised when people with integrity don't agree with it. Call out the liars in the movement you clearly support, or don't expect to be taken seriously. It's that simple.

 

[ultrachicken]

Thats not true I am an amazing feminist. I fucking love tits and am all for giving them equal rights.

Then you're not a feminist but an equalist. Feminists, these days, are only all about women's rights. No longer about just equal rights. Or rather, feminists these days are all about getting special treatment just so they can 'feel' equal to men even though they do less work, are weaker, etc. (Not saying women all do less work or are weaker, just that the ones that are want to still feel equal for doing/achieving less.)

So yea, you're an equalist! Same with me.

The term "feminist" means the advocacy of women's rights so as to be equal with men. And even if it doesn't, what you're arguing about are labels. That is the most pointless aspect of the conversation that could possibly be focused on.

That said, I am fond of being an equalist.

Spoiler

 

[Kashrlyyk]

sexualizes women in a bad way.

I can't find what you quoted! Was my post deleted? Did I delete that part of the post myself? No idea. And since you don't quote the entire post I can't answer. I need the context of that sentence for that.

 

[ElPatron]

sexualizes women in a bad way.

I can't find what you quoted! Was my post deleted? Did I delete that part of the post myself? No idea. And since you don't quote the entire post I can't answer. I need the context of that sentence for that.

I can't even travel trough the dense brush of posts in this thread so let's call it even.