Games that have lost their way

[The White Hunter]

I'd say the Sonic series can safely be added to the list.

The last few have been really good actually. Everything between Sonic & Knuckles and Sonic Colours is pretty bad though...

 

[The White Hunter]

Finalfantasy, by making direct sequels and MMOs.
Resident evil , it stopped being survival horror , funny thing is people on this site has no idea what SURVIVAL means .
Bomberman , anyone remember this game? Anything after Bomberman64 was shit .
Crash bandicoot . After 3 it went downhill .
Dmc. I'm not even starting on this one.
CoD . Yeah i said it .

The OP claims Dead Space was ever survival horror. Dead Space was always a third person action game with a shitload of gore.

Survival horror is something EA would never publish, survival horror is a niche market and will never hit their sales targets.

Resident Evil 5 was the end of anything close to mainstream survival horror, you can argue that it was Resi 4, but 4 retained a lot of good survival horror elements, it had slow and deliberate gameplay, a fair bit of inventory management, and relative scarcity of ammo (unless you play like me and only aim for the head and only ever use the handgun until the very end of the game) along with a great atmosphere.

Does ZombiU count as survival horrow? I haven't had chance to play it yet so I can't be sure.

 

[chozo_hybrid]

Mass Effect (went from RPG to action)

I've played all three Mass Effect games, and I'm kind of surprised people defend the RPG aspect of the first one so vigorously. I mean, if I had to choose between a simpler, yet more accessible, gameplay that had a greater focus on action, and gameplay that emphasizes "RPG elements" that just come off as obtuse and unnecessary , I'm pretty sure which one I'd choose. Personally, I don't think the "RPG elements" have EVER been that great in the ME series, but at least the last two didn't feel like shoving that shit down your gullet.

Thank you. While I like the first games story etc, the gun play and stats were rubbish. Here you are, Commander of an elite squad and you still need training/more stats to aim straight? Or to even be able to aim with some weapons? I get how they were trying to restrict weapons to classes, but still giving some access to weapons, like the sniper rifle and not being able to look through the scope was utter horse shit.

 

[Shoggoth2588]

Final Fantasy (went from open-RPG to linear-action-RPG)

I think this and Metal Gear Solid went from actual games to games that don't want to be played considering all of the beautifully crafted cutscenes that just seem to happen every several steps you take as a player. Also, in Final Fantasy, you went from controlling parties of 3 to 5 (there were parties of 5 in some FF games, right?) to controlling one person and making suggestions that the CPU should follow I guess. They look great sure but, you might as well just watch Advent Children again.

---

Star Wars: The Force Unleashed. Originally you were going to play as a Force-Sensitive Wookie but that was changed to Starkiller, who I saw as a place-holder of some sort honestly because of his bland design (just use Cole McGrath, nobody will notice). I liked how the original told a new story based on the formation of The Rebel Alliance and looked forward to Force Unleashed being a nice anthology series covering lesser known tales from the expanded universe. Then Force Unleashed 2 shit all over the idea by Palpatining Starkiller and trying to force a romance into a story where there was none to begin with.

Assassins Creed: I'm one of the weird people who really liked the first installment and while I loved the second, I thought it was kind of weird that I wasn't allowed to stab more than 3 people at a time without being desyncronized. Then Assassins Creed 2 decided to happen twice more and each review talked about more gameplay mechanics that had nothing to do with stabbing people in the throat. I'm going to have to quote Yahtzee and ask Assassins Creed, "What is it with you and NOT stabbing people!?" or rather, discouraging me from stabbing people. I was excited that the fifth console Assassins Creed would get the number 3 in it but then I found out it was taking place in Colonial America...then I found out about the naval combat aspects of the game and after thinking to myself "that sounds and look pretty bad ass" I followed that up with "but I don't want a naval combat sim, I want to stab people in the throat with the blessing of historical figures from centuries ago...also what happened to The Templar?"

 

[Jesse Billingsley]

I agree with Dead Space because I didn't play any of the other games you listed. I too noticed how it went from 96% Horror 4% Shooter, to 50% Horror 50% Shooter, to 4% Horror 96% shooter based on the demo I saw where a Walker came stubbing out of a snow storm only to get cut down by a fully automatic machine gun. Big name developers don't seem to understand that the more fire power you give a player, the less frightening the game itself becomes. Indies seem to get that a lot and usually plop the player into a dark basement with nothing more but the clothes on their characters back.

 

[Pulse]

The reason I got the first mass effect was BECAUSE it had action at it's core and was relatively light on the rpg elements. So IMO it hasn't lost its way at all unless you were hoping for a different direction.

I agree that assassins creed has kind of lost its way. It's more like exploration:history.
Simple gameplay where you assassinate, fight armies, control battleships, craft items, fix your homestead. Not neccessarily a bad thing....but I'd rather have one or two areas of excellent gameplay rather than a mediocre bit of everything.

 

[lacktheknack]

Fallout's still an open-world sci-fi post apocalyptic WRPG. The only thing that's changed is the camera perspective.

That's not true, and you know it. The first Fallouts were comparable in gameplay to, say, XCOM, Jagged Alliance or Final Fantasy Tactics (especially Fallout: Tactics). The new ones take place in real time, that's a MASSIVE change, and you can keep firing when it's "not your turn", and the AP refills over time rather than between "turns", etc, etc...

OT: Rayman REALLY suffered this in the Era of the Rabbids (AAAAAAAAAAAUUUUUUUUUUGH), but they seem to have righted it with Origins and Legends.

 

[chozo_hybrid]

Metroid. Though that just ties in with just how much Nintendo sucks. They sucked with Prime Hunters, nobody cared about Prime Pinball, and Other M speaks for itself. How hard would it have been for Nintendo if they just did what Konami did for Castlevania, and used their GBA games' formula, except with better graphics? How easy would it have been to take my money, Nintendo, and yet, you continue to stagnate, fapping to the pile of money Mario has made and will make, instead of taking risks and expanding your horizons.

The Prime Trilogy was amazing, then what came after... Not so much. I honestly think they should get Retro to make the next game on WII U, wonder what would happen then.

 

[Gearhead mk2]

Final Fantasy, through and through. I havent played much of the series, but reading up on them, I understand why the series was so beloved from I to VII. VIII was where it went horribly wrong, and apart from IX, XII, Kingdom Hearts and Dissidia 012, I can't think of that many good things that's came out of the series since then. Square, I loved the characters and the stories. Enough with the angsty pretty boys! Enough with the stupid, stupid weapons! Enough with the eye-searing visual design! And actually add GAME-play in your next GAME because you are a GAME company, not a movie studio! I want to like you, really I do, but you just keep forgetting what made VI, VII and Dissida 012 so great.

 

[The White Hunter]

Does ZombiU count as survival horrow? I haven't had chance to play it yet so I can't be sure.

Absolutly does. Well, I'm no expert in survival horror since I have not played many. But I know it is since ammo is scarce and having more than 2 zombies on the screen is already a challenge.

Thats good then, defining things as survival horror is flame bait (I keep typing horror as horrow I dont know why...), it looks it to me and from the review GameTrailers gave it it seemed like they were expecting something like CoD's zombie mode rather than an actual survival horror game.

With survival and stuff.

 

[Coach Morrison]

I agree with Dead Space because I didn't play any of the other games you listed. I too noticed how it went from 96% Horror 4% Shooter, to 50% Horror 50% Shooter, to 4% Horror 96% shooter based on the demo I saw where a Walker came stubbing out of a snow storm only to get cut down by a fully automatic machine gun. Big name developers don't seem to understand that the more fire power you give a player, the less frightening the game itself becomes. Indies seem to get that a lot and usually plop the player into a dark basement with nothing more but the clothes on their characters back.

You say dead space 1 was 96% horror and then say that more fire power you give a player the less scary a game is. That seems kinda contradicting since the plasma cutter is pretty much the only weapon you need while ammo for it is plentiful. I still haven't fully completed dead space 1, but I still remember that my strategy was just cut the legs and curb stomp. The game was never scary, they just took a shooter and attached some cliches to it.

 

[MacSkops]

I think I can safely say Final Fantasy and Crash Bandicoot.

Final Fantasy went downhill more or less when FF13 hit the shelves. It felt quite restricted due to the linear paths that occurred for a large section of the game and it didn't feel like a traditional Final Fantasy game to me, more like a typical JRPG.

Crash Bandicoot...it was all of the characters' radical redesigns alone that was mostly off putting for the more recent additions to the series.

 

[NerfedFalcon]

I'd say the Sonic series can safely be added to the list.

The last few have been really good actually. Everything between Sonic & Knuckles and Sonic Colours is pretty bad though...

*ahem* Advance Trilogy. Possibly also Rush, but Advance Trilogy definitely.

OT: Serious Sam seems to be this way. The original game went somewhere between realistic and cartoony in order to deliver on its over-the-top action. SS2 retains most of the original's action, but since it's really a sequel to the Xbox game, it adds a lot of things that people playing the PC versions would find to be a bad thing, such as lives or going even further towards the cartoony side. SS3 tried to move further towards realistic, but went a bit too far. It gets better after the warship battle, but still not as good as the originals.

Then again, I haven't played Jewel of the Nile, so.

 

[The White Hunter]

SNIP

]

Final Fantasy games have indeed featured parties of five. Final Fantasy 4 being the prime example.

I agree on AC, 1 was great but had an issue with being kind of dull and repetititve and everyone had sand up their arse.
2 fixed this and focused on infiltrating, cimbing huge ass cathedrals and stabbing people.

Then brotherhood and revelations saturated us with faffing about and less assassination side quests. Which is the best kind of sideuest.

Then there's AC3.

My opinions on this boring, tedious, slow paced crawl through nothing but old men arguing over the price of tea are well documented within this forum.

Naval combat? Cool, but I want to stab people.
I don't want broken chase sequences where I have to cheat to win, I don't want to wander around low-lying boring colonial villages with no particularly fancy architecture to jump off and STAB PEOPLE.

Man AC used to be about stabbing people. I tolerated brotherhood, and Revelations at least had a great city to travel around, but 3 is just dull sidetracking and very little else.

While we're at it can I have a fucking good Prince of Persia again Ubisoft? No?...

 

[The White Hunter]

I'd say the Sonic series can safely be added to the list.

The last few have been really good actually. Everything between Sonic & Knuckles and Sonic Colours is pretty bad though...

*ahem* Advance Trilogy. Possibly also Rush, but Advance Trilogy definitely.

OT: Serious Sam seems to be this way. The original game went somewhere between realistic and cartoony in order to deliver on its over-the-top action. SS2 retains most of the original's action, but since it's really a sequel to the Xbox game, it adds a lot of things that people playing the PC versions would find to be a bad thing, such as lives or going even further towards the cartoony side. SS3 tried to move further towards realistic, but went a bit too far. It gets better after the warship battle, but still not as good as the originals.

Then again, I haven't played Jewel of the Nile, so.

I apologise for excluding the exquisite advance trilogy, though my favourite of those is easily the first, then the 3rd and the second is the weak link for me. Advance 1 is actually probably my third or fourth favourite game, my favourite being 3 & Knuckles (favourite game of all time), then probably 2 and 1 tied for second. The Rush games are pretty good in my opinion. Both Adventure games are very over rated, the first is fun but the second is easily the second worst 3D sonic game I've played after that 2006 abomination. Shadow the Hedgehog is playable but it's far from good. Heroes is okay but the dodgy grinding, extremely long levels and the fact every story has the same levels in the same order detract from a decent experience (brilliant music though, one of my favourite Sonic OST's). Unleashed is... good, but it requires already knowing the levels in their entirety to not die constantly to your own sub-godly reflexes. Colours and Generations are brilliant. Need more 3D from them though.

Sonic 4 is appalling and I will not forgive Dimps for it.

Secret Rings is dreadful.

The Black Knight... y'know, it would have been good if not for the terrible control? The waggle is atrocious, I'm no motionc ontrol hater but Black Knight would have been much better with a gamecube or classic controller or just an ATTACK BUTTON rather than relying on the standard wii remotes imprecise shaking.

Almost all of the Sonic games have a saving grace in having brilliant soundtracks though.

 

[Jesse Billingsley]

I agree with Dead Space because I didn't play any of the other games you listed. I too noticed how it went from 96% Horror 4% Shooter, to 50% Horror 50% Shooter, to 4% Horror 96% shooter based on the demo I saw where a Walker came stubbing out of a snow storm only to get cut down by a fully automatic machine gun. Big name developers don't seem to understand that the more fire power you give a player, the less frightening the game itself becomes. Indies seem to get that a lot and usually plop the player into a dark basement with nothing more but the clothes on their characters back.

You say dead space 1 was 96% horror and then say that more fire power you give a player the less scary a game is. That seems kinda contradicting since the plasma cutter is pretty much the only weapon you need while ammo for it is plentiful. I still haven't fully completed dead space 1, but I still remember that my strategy was just cut the legs and curb stomp. The game was never scary, they just took a shooter and attached some cliches to it.

Didn't say it was always scary, but there were parts that scared me, man.

I only used the Pulse gun, and I couldn't find ammo for that thing anywhere, so things got freaky when I only had one mag left and a room full of the undead hiding out somewhere.

 

[Zen Bard]

I hate to say this but; The Elder Scrolls. I still enjoy the games a lot(300+ hours logged on Skyrim just to give you a rough idea)but Bethesda keeps removing more and more RPG elements with each instalment, what some people might call streamlining others might call dumbing down, and I'm inclined to agree with the latter.

Totally agree with this. Seems they're following the Peter Molyneux model with the Fable series.

Which is another example of a really good action oriented RPG that continuously stripped away its role playing elements with each iteration until it's become a barely serviceable kiddie action game.

All this in the name of "Accessibility"

 

[The White Hunter]

I agree with Dead Space because I didn't play any of the other games you listed. I too noticed how it went from 96% Horror 4% Shooter, to 50% Horror 50% Shooter, to 4% Horror 96% shooter based on the demo I saw where a Walker came stubbing out of a snow storm only to get cut down by a fully automatic machine gun. Big name developers don't seem to understand that the more fire power you give a player, the less frightening the game itself becomes. Indies seem to get that a lot and usually plop the player into a dark basement with nothing more but the clothes on their characters back.

You say dead space 1 was 96% horror and then say that more fire power you give a player the less scary a game is. That seems kinda contradicting since the plasma cutter is pretty much the only weapon you need while ammo for it is plentiful. I still haven't fully completed dead space 1, but I still remember that my strategy was just cut the legs and curb stomp. The game was never scary, they just took a shooter and attached some cliches to it.

They also dowsed dead space in blood. Not what I'd call survival horror. Resident Evil 4 is closer to it than Dead Space and was a nice hybrid between Survival Horror and Action (and that Merchant...).

Then there was Resident Evil 5....

 

[CriticalMiss]

Final Fantasy has lost it's way, as many others have said. So much so that some of the games look more sci-fi than fantasy, maybe Square wanted to 'blur the line' or something? Not every game has been too bad, I'm thinking more along the lines of 7,8 and the 13s. Yes they have magic but they also look far too industrial compared to what I expect of a 'fantasy' game.

 

[Ieyke]

Assassin's Creed 3 got a lot of things wrong, but the series is far from actually having lost its way.

Castlevania and Casltevania:Lords Of Shadow are two different series. Lords Of Shadow isn't Castlevania "losing its way", It's just a different interpretation of the base story concepts.
You could say Symphony Of The Night was Castlevania "finding its way", since it was EPICALLY better than all the games before it, but clearly a very different path.

Sonic The Hedgehog.....I can't say precisely WHERE it first went horribly wrong, but clearly it has. There's one thing that has always been clear to me about Sonic - the Archie Comics version is the only good overall canon for Sonic.

Final Fantasy hasn't lost it's way....it just sucks ass. Always kind has, post-SNES. The only good Final Fantasy game is Final Fantasy Tactics(/War Of The Lions), and that doesn't even count because it's not even meant to be the same type of game.

Fallout....I can't say it "lost" its path, but it sure as hell changed to a completely different path. I'm willing to admit that the new format is probably an improvement, since I want little more than Arcanum:Of Steamworks & Magick Obscura 2 to be done in the new Fallout/Elder Scrolls style - essecntially making it the exact same transition from one game type to the other.

Megaman X....after X4 things started to get stupid. Luckily, the most recent game, X8 was sort of an improvement over X5-7.
The X series lost its way in ways that probably only make sense to people very familiar with the series. I'd certainly say it was a turn in the wrong direction.

Diablo 3 - There are so many things wrong with that game... It LOOKS great and feels solid....but everything is implemented all wrong, and the game world is just an unimaginative retread of Diablo 2.
Taking one of the best game series and making it...."meh"...is clearly NOT staying to the correct path.

Pokemon - Clearly I'm not the only one who looks at a lot of the more recent Pokemon and goes "What the hell is this bullshit???"
But I don't think it's so much lost its path yet as it's just...stumbling along the path.

Resident Evil should've probably stopped at 4.

Dead Space may have lost its way (I dunno, never played any of them) but all I know is that all three games look awesome, and 3 is the one that has me most convinced to start playing the series *shrug*

Sidescroller Mario games - They're on the path. They refuse to deviate AT ALL. Somehow, they've become souless and boring despite being technically competent in every way. The imagination and whimsy is just...missing. The 3D Marios and Paper Marios all appear to be doing great though.