Games that you love to watch, but hate to play

[Dalisclock]

I often don't finish 4X games, precisely because you inevitably tend to hit a point where it's just a mopping-up operation, and if it's a long and tedious mopping up operation (Stellaris) going through the motions, it's not worth the bother. You've won and you know it, the game just hasn't realised yet.

Yeah, Stellaris has that too. Ironically, I ended up in a situation where I quit prior to the end of the game during the big endgame crisis. There had been a War in Heaven and both of the two sides were still at it when the big crisis showed up and I was on the far side of the galaxy from the crisis(the invading aliens). Also, the Crisis zone was hitting a group of xenophobic fascists' head on(not that I feel bad for them). So I've got the two awakened empires blocking my path on either side and the fascists' who still want to be at war with me even as invaders sweep through their territory from the far side, so I have to fight my way through those guys before I can even attempt to fight off the invaders, while the invaders take more and more territory and, really, it was just kinda sad and anti-climatic. By the time I could reach the invaders space I was so tired of having to claw my way across system by system I didn't really fucking care anymore and just quit.

And got forbid anyone attempt an alliance to fight the extra-galactic threat, even if just a detente. Nope, people were just as interested in continuing to fight me and each other then the invading aliens, because fucking priorities. I mean, I fucking get people are dumb and would rather struggle over petty shit then a common threat sometimes but there's no way to even attempt to convince them "Hey, seriously guys, can we cool it for a bit until the crisis is past? At least let me move my ships through so I can support offensive operations"

 

[laggyteabag]

I often don't finish 4X games, precisely because you inevitably tend to hit a point where it's just a mopping-up operation, and if it's a long and tedious mopping up operation (Stellaris) going through the motions, it's not worth the bother. You've won and you know it, the game just hasn't realised yet.

I have the exact same problem with Total War.

Once I've got a few 20 stack armies of top-tier units running around, there isn't really much that anyone can do about that.

Then im just going from faction to faction, and I can't be bothered, because the game map is humungous.

I tend to find with a lot of games, that the early game is much more interesting than the endgame, because at least when you have just started, you actually have weaknesses that you have to account for.

 

[happyninja42]

I often don't finish 4X games, precisely because you inevitably tend to hit a point where it's just a mopping-up operation, and if it's a long and tedious mopping up operation (Stellaris) going through the motions, it's not worth the bother. You've won and you know it, the game just hasn't realised yet.

Yeah, I think something that helps, is to give yourself a narrative theme to go for. One of my favorite Youtubers, Many a True Nerd, LOVES the 4X games, in particular titles from Paradox, and has done multiple, long duration runs of the game, with a story behind it. For example, he did a CK3 playthrough recently, and the whole goal was to restore the Viking culture. He picked a point in the timeline, where the Vikings were basically just gone. I think down to only 2 locations under their control, and he played to try and expand and grow them into a globe-spanning empire. And he did. He picked some of the large scale goals the game has for you, like "Restoring the Dane-Law", and that was the final objective. Once he had accomplished whatever his particular goal was, he would end the run. He also did something similar with Stellaris, and went for a pacifist run, where he never engaged in any offensive campaigns. His only exception to this, is if he was part of a federation, and he wasn't in charge of it, and they ordered people to provide ships to go to war, he was forced to do so.

So that might help you get more mileage out of your 4x experience? *shrugs* I know I tried something similar with CK3, and go for a pacifist run, of just using politics, marriages, etc, to expand my family holdings. No conquests/wars (unless ordered by my liege), and no assassinations. I asked on the steam forums and people were like "oh yeah, it's totally doable" but I wasn't even able to get a fucking duchy going after multiple generations of characters. So I gave up. Perhaps the mechanics are just not really fleshed out enough to do that, or maybe I just don't know the mechanics of that game well enough, but I never seemed to find any way to try and do things like "hey, my family has loyally served you for decades, I am your most trusted advisor, and actual Best Friend. You've married multiple of your children to mine, and we are as tight as can be. Do you think you could grant me a duchy title from your holdings?" Nope, no way to apparently do that, other than backstabbing, bribery, threats, etc. And I frankly didn't want to play it that way.

 

[SckizoBoy]

I have the exact same problem with Total War.

Once I've got a few 20 stack armies of top-tier units running around, there isn't really much that anyone can do about that.

Then im just going from faction to faction, and I can't be bothered, because the game map is humungous.

I tend to find with a lot of games, that the early game is much more interesting than the endgame, because at least when you have just started, you actually have weaknesses that you have to account for.

Try challenge campaigns. This Is Total War/unit restrictions etc. they keep things interesting if you like having shake-ups to the campaign. Granted that's not for everyone and I get why that might not appeal.

That said, I do find that some titles have really dumb victory conditions (especially Total War: Warhammer 2) that require a lot of end-game grinding that I either don't bother, or achieve them purely by accident (hell, it's possible to get a full map completion and NOT achieve long campaign victory, it can be ridiculous at times).

 

[Agema]

Yeah, Stellaris has that too. Ironically, I ended up in a situation where I quit prior to the end of the game during the big endgame crisis. There had been a War in Heaven and both of the two sides were still at it when the big crisis showed up and I was on the far side of the galaxy from the crisis(the invading aliens). Also, the Crisis zone was hitting a group of xenophobic fascists' head on(not that I feel bad for them). So I've got the two awakened empires blocking my path on either side and the fascists' who still want to be at war with me even as invaders sweep through their territory from the far side, so I have to fight my way through those guys before I can even attempt to fight off the invaders, while the invaders take more and more territory and, really, it was just kinda sad and anti-climatic. By the time I could reach the invaders space I was so tired of having to claw my way across system by system I didn't really fucking care anymore and just quit.

And got forbid anyone attempt an alliance to fight the extra-galactic threat, even if just a detente. Nope, people were just as interested in continuing to fight me and each other then the invading aliens, because fucking priorities. I mean, I fucking get people are dumb and would rather struggle over petty shit then a common threat sometimes but there's no way to even attempt to convince them "Hey, seriously guys, can we cool it for a bit until the crisis is past? At least let me move my ships through so I can support offensive operations"

Stellaris can be particularly problematic because it slows very, very badly in the late game (I mean game speed more so than gameplay). I ended my last game a while after the Scourge arrived. They chewed straight through my main enemies and an obstructive Fallen Empire. When they got to my territory I had 200k+ fleet power (albeit more effectively against the Scourge as it's easy to optimise against them). That was a lot less than theirs in total, but the Scourge didn't concentrate fleets effectively, so after some cat-and-mouse with some careful selection of fights, and with concentrated fleet development, I ended up with well over 400k fleet and had destroyed so much of the Scourge they weren't even a credible threat to me any more. And I still had a massive chunk of the galaxy to take over before the game would end.