Gay characters in children's cartoons

[Small Waves]

This is an absolutely stupid idea. Honestly, you want to be gay. Be gay, somewhere else. Stop trying to invade everyone else's life and just LIVE YOUR OWN!

a reason gay people are needed in kids cartoons are above lets all rise above this this moral akwardness

Equal rights do not mean special rights. I have problems with any group that feels they need special treatment for one reason or another over any other.

How is being shown in the same light as heterosexuals "special rights"? I never understood these words since they do not demand anything heterosexuals do not have already. The phrase is EXCLUSIVELY used to whip up a storm of senseless moral outrage and if you debate otherwise you're only lying to yourself.

Just because they aren't displaying homosexuality doesn't mean its bias towards hetrosexuality. Its a kids show!!!!

Cardcaptors Sakura had a gay couple, and that show was from the late 1990s. What does it say about America that only we cannot have homosexual characters on children's television (Y, Y7, and some PG), but we also are incapable of handling it in a tasteful manner or pull it off without having it stick out like an elephant in the room or include gay characters for any other reason than to get a ratings boost?

Children's television has tackled topics that are a lot more difficult than homosexuality. Take Arthur for example, the show that talked about dealing with the death of a pet, autism, and Alzheimer's Disease. In the advent of the internet, our culture might as well wave the white flag from trying to "protect the children" from these topics, so we might as well wing it with more controversial topics. We have nothing to lose by trying to progress as a culture and break the barriers built by previous generations.

 

[Caligulust]

Is it a problem if there are more homosexual characters? No, not at all.


However, it should not be imperative for shows to include them.

 

[BrEnNo1023]

This is an absolutely stupid idea. Honestly, you want to be gay. Be gay, somewhere else. Stop trying to invade everyone else's life and just LIVE YOUR OWN!

This is why there are so many arguments in this thread. It's a hot topic that some people just aren't reading properly.

It's about equality and teaching equality and encouraging kids to see what most adults cry and kick and scream and squirm uncomfortably about and label as abnormal as instead, normal. This is about fighting to eradicate the judgement, kill off the needlessly negative stigma that it's abnormal and wrong and bad and disgusting, replace it with a positive culture of acceptance. It's about helping people love and accept who they are, and also love and accept who others are.

This is not about 'pushing it into people's faces'. By reacting with such hostility, you completely display that your 'them vs us; keep to yourself we keep to ourself' attitudes are part of the reason why the OP started this thread. This is about providing a method to fix the institutionalised hostility that's been drilled into *adults'* heads, so that it doesn't get drilled into the children's heads. To me the whole concept of 'let's not freakin hate each other, guys' sounds like a good idea.

 

[Antari]

Equal rights do not mean special rights. I have problems with any group that feels they need special treatment for one reason or another over any other.

Go look in a mirror.

I presume (and correct me if I'm wrong) that you're looking at a heterosexual male.

Look at how the society around you is set up. Listen for people talking about their spouses and kids. Look at how people behave around each other and consider how that might become inappropriate if they were gay. Look at the way visual media is constructed, look at how images of bodies are used. Above all, look at normality.

Your life already invades the life of every single person who doesn't conform to it. We live in an overwhelmingly heterosexual culture in which heterosexuality is not even a norm, it's an assumed totality broken only through outright identifying as gay. We all live in your heterosexual culture, not some neutral culture which comes from nowhere and is experienced the same by everyone.

You talk about groups demanding special treatment, but you have gotten so used to special treatment that you don't even have to demand it any more. You are so so caught up in the heterosexuality of the world around you that you assume it applies to everyone, and then the second evidence to the contrary has the temerity to appear. The second you might have to contend with the idea that you're a particular human being and not representative of every other human being on earth, you whine about groups demanding special treatment. Can you see the irony there?

The fact is that unless a character, intended for children or otherwise, is outed as gay then they are straight because heterosexuality can always be assumed for everyone everywhere. If that's not an 'invasion', what is?

To a certain extent some of that is true. About the only thing I can say for you at that point is welcome to planet earth. Its not perfect for anyone. And no I don't recieve special treatment from the government or anyone for that matter. I have to work for everything I have. But its literally a point of, ok fine we know your gay, and thats ok. But we aren't part of that lifestyle. And we really don't care to hear about it. There are some parts of conforming to the society your in that you just have to accept. I'm not allowed to go all grand theft auto and drive on the sidewalks at 90mph. There's more than a few people who don't like it. So its best if I didn't. When you know the majority of the population is not homosexual, then why do you feel an absolute need to display it loudly and proudly? Thats less about being homosexual and more about being someone who needs a slap upside the head.

 

[Ilyak1986]

Once again, what's the difference between being best friends and being homosexual?

The sexual aspect. Even if it doesn't mean the deed itself, the mannerisms unique to homosexuals need not be included. After all, what's the point? To show that people are different for the sake thereof?

No thank you.

 

[A Weary Exile]

This is an absolutely stupid idea. Honestly, you want to be gay. Be gay, somewhere else. Stop trying to invade everyone else's life and just LIVE YOUR OWN!

This is why there are so many arguments in this thread. It's a hot topic that some people just aren't reading properly.

It's about equality and teaching equality and encouraging kids to see what most adults cry and kick and scream and squirm uncomfortably about and label as abnormal as instead, normal. This is about fighting to eradicate the judgement, kill off the needlessly negative stigma that it's abnormal and wrong and bad and disgusting, replace it with a positive culture of acceptance. It's about helping people love and accept who they are, and also love and accept who others are.

This is not about 'pushing it into people's faces'. By reacting with such hostility, you completely display that your 'them vs us; keep to yourself we keep to ourself' attitudes are part of the reason why the OT started this thread. This is about providing a method to fix the institutionalised hostility that's been drilled into *adults'* heads, so that it doesn't get drilled into the children's heads. To me the whole concept of 'let's not freakin hate each other, guys' sounds like a good idea.

At least someone is reading the OP. Very well-put sir.

I don't even have to respond to the bad posts anymore because there's just as many smart posts that come along and rip them to shreds. ^_^

 

[Farseer Lolotea]

Or perhaps its just a childrens show and this sort of stuff doesn't belong there. Just because there are gay people doesn't mean we need to start educating people at the age of 3 about it.

Would you say the same of heterosexuality? Because otherwise, Small Waves is right. Your argument is not that gay people shouldn't get "special treatment," it's that straight people should continue to get it.

Keep in mind, gay people ARE a minority. Its not racism its just a FACT. There are some things about being a minority you'll just have to accept. Complaining about it at every possible turn, including children's programming. Will not get you anywhere.

So only the majority should be acknowledged?

Once again, what's the difference between being best friends and being homosexual?

The sexual aspect. Even if it doesn't mean the deed itself, the mannerisms unique to homosexuals need not be included. After all, what's the point? To show that people are different for the sake thereof?

No thank you.

Even if we argue that there actually are mannerisms that are "unique" to gays (or, for that matter, that a gay character would have to be "swishy"), it's not just about sex. Romantic subplots aren't exactly unknown in kids' shows, even if they're kept G-rated.

 

[Small Waves]

Once again, what's the difference between being best friends and being homosexual?

The sexual aspect. Even if it doesn't mean the deed itself, the mannerisms unique to homosexuals need not be included. After all, what's the point? To show that people are different for the sake thereof?

No thank you.

Maybe having a same-gendered couple and hinting at they like each other "like a husband or wife" or "that way".

Anything, really. I don't care as long as it's better than that Buddy G. bullshit, which screams "LOOK AT ME LOOK AT ME THIS FAMILY HAS TWO MOMS LOOK AT ME LOOK AT ME".

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[Antari]

Or perhaps its just a childrens show and this sort of stuff doesn't belong there. Just because there are gay people doesn't mean we need to start educating people at the age of 3 about it.

Would you say the same of heterosexuality? Because otherwise, Small Waves is right. Your argument is not that gay people shouldn't get "special treatment," it's that straight people should continue to get it.

Keep in mind, gay people ARE a minority. Its not racism its just a FACT. There are some things about being a minority you'll just have to accept. Complaining about it at every possible turn, including children's programming. Will not get you anywhere.

So only the majority should be acknowledged?

Gay rights have been acknowledged in the majority of society, atleast around here. After that expecting much more when there is a majority is just stupid. Your talking about human nature here. Your not going to change that, throughout written history. Majority always rules.

 

[sharpsheppard]

This is an absolutely stupid idea. Honestly, you want to be gay. Be gay, somewhere else. Stop trying to invade everyone else's life and just LIVE YOUR OWN!

a reason gay people are needed in kids cartoons are above lets all rise above this this moral akwardness

Equal rights do not mean special rights. I have problems with any group that feels they need special treatment for one reason or another over any other.

How is being shown in the same light as heterosexuals "special rights"? I never understood these words since they do not demand anything heterosexuals do not have already. The phrase is EXCLUSIVELY used to whip up a storm of senseless moral outrage and if you debate otherwise you're only lying to yourself.

Just because they aren't displaying homosexuality doesn't mean its bias towards hetrosexuality. Its a kids show!!!!

same kind of person who fought the civil right movment are with antari they don't deserve the same treatment how many rasist said that

 

[Farseer Lolotea]

It is just as pointless as a straight crush. I'm just saying that there really is no need to bring in sexual orientation in most anything. It is always a pointless plot device, as in the movie The Joneses when the young guy comes out of the closet for no reason what-so-ever except to make him more of a vulnerable character.

So...are you, in fact, saying that an opposite-sex romantic subplot is just a plot device to show that this and that character is straight?

Like I said before, I have no problem with gay characters in any television shows at all, as long as they aren't stereotypically flamboyant. That would be a terrible, terrible role model.

I don't think anyone's asking for "flamboyant." It's annoyingly clichéd.

Gay rights have been acknowledged in the majority of society, atleast around here.

And yet, whenever a topic like this comes up, people still throw out the "special treatment" argument.

After that expecting much more when there is a majority is just stupid. Your talking about human nature here. Your not going to change that, throughout written history. Majority always rules.

Various civil rights movements throughout history would beg to differ.

 

[Antari]

This is an absolutely stupid idea. Honestly, you want to be gay. Be gay, somewhere else. Stop trying to invade everyone else's life and just LIVE YOUR OWN!

a reason gay people are needed in kids cartoons are above lets all rise above this this moral akwardness

Equal rights do not mean special rights. I have problems with any group that feels they need special treatment for one reason or another over any other.

How is being shown in the same light as heterosexuals "special rights"? I never understood these words since they do not demand anything heterosexuals do not have already. The phrase is EXCLUSIVELY used to whip up a storm of senseless moral outrage and if you debate otherwise you're only lying to yourself.

Just because they aren't displaying homosexuality doesn't mean its bias towards hetrosexuality. Its a kids show!!!!

same kind of person who fought the civil right movment are with antari they don't deserve the same treatment how many rasist said that

Really how is placing homosexual characters into cartoons going to expand your rights? The only thing its going to do is add a sexual element where one doesn't belong.

 

[Farseer Lolotea]

Really how is placing homosexual characters into cartoons going to expand your rights? The only thing its going to do is add a sexual element where one doesn't belong.

And again: does this also apply whenever a character openly displays their heterosexuality on a kid's show (i.e. swoons over someone of the opposite sex)?

 

[Antari]

It is just as pointless as a straight crush. I'm just saying that there really is no need to bring in sexual orientation in most anything. It is always a pointless plot device, as in the movie The Joneses when the young guy comes out of the closet for no reason what-so-ever except to make him more of a vulnerable character.

So...are you, in fact, saying that an opposite-sex romantic subplot is just a plot device to show that this and that character is straight?

Like I said before, I have no problem with gay characters in any television shows at all, as long as they aren't stereotypically flamboyant. That would be a terrible, terrible role model.

I don't think anyone's asking for "flamboyant." It's annoyingly clichéd.

Gay rights have been acknowledged in the majority of society, atleast around here.

And yet, whenever a topic like this comes up, people still throw out the "special treatment" argument.

After that expecting much more when there is a majority is just stupid. Your talking about human nature here. Your not going to change that, throughout written history. Majority always rules.

Various civil rights movements throughout history would beg to differ.

When the majority has the same view, then the change takes place. In this particular case there's only so much change that can be taken. Your not going to convert the whole planet. Unless our species is about to blink out like a light and stop reproducing.

 

[sharpsheppard]

This is an absolutely stupid idea. Honestly, you want to be gay. Be gay, somewhere else. Stop trying to invade everyone else's life and just LIVE YOUR OWN!

a reason gay people are needed in kids cartoons are above lets all rise above this this moral akwardness

Equal rights do not mean special rights. I have problems with any group that feels they need special treatment for one reason or another over any other.

How is being shown in the same light as heterosexuals "special rights"? I never understood these words since they do not demand anything heterosexuals do not have already. The phrase is EXCLUSIVELY used to whip up a storm of senseless moral outrage and if you debate otherwise you're only lying to yourself.

Just because they aren't displaying homosexuality doesn't mean its bias towards hetrosexuality. Its a kids show!!!!

same kind of person who fought the civil right movment are with antari they don't deserve the same treatment how many rasist said that

Really how is placing homosexual characters into cartoons going to expand your rights? The only thing its going to do is add a sexual element where one doesn't belong.

kids don't see sex anyway when they look at the partents and see caretakers since they are young but they will start to build around them what they see to be normal/okay with them. I will gain nothing since i am not gay but homosexuals people would perhaps benifit by it becoming more of normal to the next generation and make it easier for people in the gerneration after that to come out as gay to and so on etc.

 

[Farseer Lolotea]

When the majority has the same view, then the change takes place. In this particular case there's only so much change that can be taken. Your not going to convert the whole planet. Unless our species is about to blink out like a light and stop reproducing.

...you do know that one doesn't have to be gay to disagree with the special-treatment argument, right? And that gay people do have kids (albeit with third-party assistance), right?

 

[chowderface]

I think it wouldn't go amiss to have more gay characters, but I also think it's important that the RIGHT characters are gay. It's all well and good to have gay characters but stereotypical ones are just doing more damage than good. Possibly you will meet people who perfectly fit stereotypes (although I hope I never do because nothing riles me up quite like someone behaving like their stereotype. Campy gay people, herbalists that hate doctors, the entire litany of behaviors that The Boondocks classifies as "nigga behavior"; you name it, and I'll froth at it) but it's far more likely you'll meet people who have personalities instead; so it's much better to teach kids that being gay doesn't define you in and of itself. So to continue the MLP comparison, Rainbow Dash is entirely the wrong character for teaching kids about homosexuality BECAUSE she behaves in a stereotypically lesbian manner. I would probably choose Rarity or Fluttershy, or both, instead (this has the bonus of matching up with my own life experience; I've met one lesbian, ever, who was in any way notably masculine, the others were quite girly).

Isn't Spongebob gay?

Spongebob has a gigantic crush on Sandy. So he's not gay, he's tremendously deviant.

*ragesnip*

let the show die off. its a waste of time

We're not actually talking about the show in particular. We're just using it because one of the characters makes for a handy example. Chillski, bro.

 

[BrEnNo1023]

At least someone is reading the OP. Very well-put sir.

I don't even have to respond to the bad posts anymore because there's just as many smart posts that come along and rip them to shreds. ^_^

Mm, yes, it's a pity that the bad posts flooding this thread exist. The good posts in topics like this usually don't change opinions, just start useless arguments :S But i guess that's just people; that said, i think it's wrong that it takes a 'smart' person to make a sensible post on a topic so fragile as this. Shows humanity has a lot of growing up to do regarding equality. Who knows, if your idea works out and the cartoons start teaching the right messages to kids today, maybe that won't take long at all