Goodbye World of Warcraft, hello Rift?

[Torlux]

As many have stated, the issue doesn't lie in WoW being flawless or overly amazing, it's actually quite bland and unimaginative, but it is polished and well-seated due to having had plenty of time to solidify it's current role as ''King''. Any MMO willing to dethrone it is going to have to try something new and alternative, or be left grovelling beneath it's shadow ( and that's one hell of a shadow by now ).

RIFT shot itself in the foot by advertising as a ''WoW killer'' with that imbecilic slogan ''You're not in Azeroth anymore!'' - a failed attempt to look bulkier and menacing, yet offering nothing fresh. The only innovation is the class system, and it's quite good - but simultaneously incredibly out of balance: some combinations are so powerful as to make others utterly redundant.

If I had to put money on any MMO possibly competing with WoW, it'd be Warhammer 40.000: Dark Millennium Online. No, not Star Wars - EA unmade nearly any and all popularity the franchise had by making a bazillion games and squeezing out every breath of life it had. W40K always had a devoted fanbase, and with the not-so-recent advent of the Dawn of War franchise it gained even more. Moreover, the MMO looks sexy from the minor previews we've been granted thus far.

---

tl;dr version ( for the lazy gits ):
RIFT isn't gonna kill WoW, it'll be an entertaining alternative for a while
W40K: Dark Millennium Online is gonna consume lives ( and souls! ) when it releases...unless they muck it up beyond belief.

 

[God's Clown]

WoW won't be killed by a copy cat game like Rift, specially since Rift sucks.

No game will kill WoW, Blizzard might kill WoW by doing stupid things, or old age might, but no game will.

 

[Kwaren]

Brown...psht.

Here you go.

Spoiler: screenshot full of BROWN

Now go crawl back into your cave, troll.

I'm sorry, but this is too ironic...

That's from WoW. Both games contain areas of dreaded nightmare hue called brown. In all honesty, part of the reason I quit WoW (after about 10 levels) is that I reached the Barrens, and found it depressingly bleak and lifeless.

Really, this is stupid. Why is brown inherently horrible? Why does it ruin games? If a game only drew colors from the neon-pink spectrum, would that somehow be better than brown? I think what people are really concerned about is a lack of variety, and both games have pretty definitely displayed that they have variety.

That is a good example of why I don't play WoW either.

You must like the Wii a lot then. That and Bioshock compose about the only games that aren't devoid of 90% of the color spectrum.

This is for you and everyone else in this thread. If you don't like what I have to say ignore it or form an argument that isn't based on an opinion.

 

[Cowabungaa]

That is a good example of why I don't play WoW either.

Because a savanna [http://atlas.riken.jp/~fkeizo/photos/savanna.JPG] area is obviously supposed to be all brightly coloured right?

If any MMO has an almost schizofrenic diversity of landscapes, it's WoW. Sprawling cities (in all shapes and sizes, from the damp crypts of the Undercity to bombastic Silvermoon City to majestic Stormwind, etc), lush jungles, pine forests, alien hell-scapes, icy plains, burned out wastelands, crazy broken realms where dimensions collide, murky swamps, etc etc etc.

Sure it has it's brown areas, but why is that bad? It has white areas, green areas, black areas, blue areas, yellow and red areas, even pink and purple areas. The game is one big rainbow extravaganza of different colours, styles and atmospheres.

Trying something new with a couple inspirations automatically entails failure. Like Mass Effect and what comics do to each other, being the giagantic failures they were.

Honestly, that excuse is stupidly contrite at this point, WoW having assembled a rogue's gallery for the playerbase to pick off unceremoniously. In Cataclysm, the recent expansion, we'll know that there'll be this jerkoff who'll make cheeky appearances throughout the expansion before the final confrontation, and then die, his/her/it's pressence never to be heard of in the same loathing again.

So yeah.

I'm not really seeing what kind of point you're trying to make here. I was talking about things like how the Horde has developed over time, how the Alliance has developed over time, how their relationship has twisted and changed. The world you're in has history, lots of shit has happened and many people have 'witnessed' that shit happen, all the way down from the first Warcraft. It makes players feel a lot more involved in the world. Rift doesn't have that, and that is a disadvantage, especially because MMO's focus on big, persistant worlds.

Not only that, but from what I've read Rift's story is amazingly cookie-cutter. Doesn't speak well for the game.

Personally, I didn't care for WoWs story or lore (except that surrounding EPL and Stratholme), but obviously people like games for different reasons. Some people like WoW to collect pets or finish a raid instance, I like to explore new areas and level, like WoW's expansions gave me, but Rift is giving me now, which brings me to..

That's what I like about WoW so much; it offers so many ways to play it. I get your point though, but I must say that how Blizzard has fleshed out the new Horde is really well done. I hope they continue down that line. It makes the game world a lot more interesting to be in.

I hear the next one isn't out for about a year, have fun grinding those justice points. Though in all honesty I'll probably be back for WoWs next expansion, end game raiding just doesn't do it for me any more.

Oh believe me, I ain't grinding that crap. I'm more like you, it's just that I still haven't seen the majority of the content; all the new Alliance areas, most of the Horde ones (been playing an Orc Shaman for a while now, almost level 40!) and still some 80+ areas I want to see. Plenty of stuff for quite a few months of playtime, as I only play a few hours each week.

As long as I haven't seen the good stuff, an MMO has to do something amazing to pull me in. Rift doesn't seem to do that. Now if they'd release an MMO with a little Star Wars...*cough*

That's from WoW. Both games contain areas of dreaded nightmare hue called brown. In all honesty, part of the reason I quit WoW (after about 10 levels) is that I reached the Barrens, and found it depressingly bleak and lifeless.

Really, this is stupid. Why is brown inherently horrible? Why does it ruin games? If a game only drew colors from the neon-pink spectrum, would that somehow be better than brown? I think what people are really concerned about is a lack of variety, and both games have pretty definitely displayed that they have variety.

You're not required to go to the Barrens, not at all. There are in total 8 level 10-15/20 zones available ranging from spooky forests to rustique lakes to an almost Wild West like frontier and of course the bleak savanna.

I myself liked those bleak, lifeless zones though. Especially the Barrens, it felt so vast and tranquil.

 

[Kwaren]

Let me sum up this whole thread in two images.

 

[Wrann]

I really wish threads like this were put in with the stop making them because there are so many its really annoying category. I will say what has been said a million times and will be said a million times after because a million "will this kill WoW" threads will pop up.

WoW will not be killed by anything other than itself.

That is that any game that comes out trying to be a "WoW killer" will fail or get no ware because every one is just, oh look its WoW but with better graphics and all the problems that WoW has fixed over the past 6 years. I really wish these threads would stop entirly but I know there will be like 11 more becuase next month someone will post another about Rift and there will be 5 about SW:Tor (which I really hope fails I hate Bioware) and another 5 about GW2.

 

[Jessta]

Not by a mile. The game is real shiny and that's about it. There are already some incredibly glaring problems with core gameplay seen in just the first day from all I've heard. It doesn't have the Blizzard name behind it, nor the power of previous success of franchise behind it either.

And why is Blizzard such an important name to have on an MMO? WoW was their first go at the genre, and there were TONS of glaring problems with it at launch. Far more than RIFT has now.

I think it's also to Trion's benefit that there are no previous games in the franchise. It just means there's no backstory/lore to ruin like WoW did.

OT: Nothing will kill WoW, nor is there a need for anything to kill WoW. It will slowly lose subs on its own, as all MMOs do. Then Blizzard will release their next MMO and get them all back. But others can co-exist just fine.

The reason Blizzard is such an important name to have on a game, not an MMO in particular, is that they are successful, they have more money and thus more money to put into making the game. Plus despite not having any other MMO's blizz has around 10 years of experience with MMO's from just that one game.

As for the Lore, I honestly wouldn't say having allot of lore that might play out in dis favorable ways is a minus. Thats like saying we are more likely to lose more money because we have more money to lose thus the money is a bad thing... I personally find the lore in WoW pretty amazing and just looking at the little things behind it really put the finishing touches on making it feel like a true world. For example walking into Dalaran I see Rhonin the mage from Day of the dragon, or going to eastern plague lands I run into the deathknight from the Manga Death knight or other things like that. WoW is a world, its not just a story anymore, its an actual fully shaped world with hundreds of stories that have molded it.

I do totally agree with the fact that WoW will eventually die on its own, depending on what you say is its own. Its not gonna be done in by a single MMO thats gonna wisk away all of its players, its going to go to several different games as people get bored of its somewhat stiff, annoyingly unskillful, grind based game play. I'm personally looking at DC online because of these reasons, considering waiting for Guild wars 2 because I heard there would be no subscription fees and also thinking of getting Rift because I see the adds everywhere and they are getting to me ><.

also to all you guys QQing about the fact that another thread like this has popped up, you are PERSONALLY participating in keeping it alive... just thought you should think about it, if you don't think a thread is interesting, don't even touch it.

 

[Vaer]

Rift has nothing on WoW, it's just a clone and a poorly made one at that, I don't even play WoW anymore but if I did I wouldn't leave it for Rift, there are other better MMO's out there other then WoW that are better then Rift already and I suspect Rift won't survive much. Maybe it will get some people from WoW in for a month or 2 but I wouldn't count on them staying more.

Not only is WoW better and more polished with a deeper and more familiar lore but people are already invested in it, have characters, friends, guilds, etc. and I don't see why they'd leave it for Rift.

 

[twiceworn]

ANOTHER WOW KILLER "SIGH" you really cannot beat wow at their own game you CANNOT! if you like games that play like wow then.you.will. play. WOW!!! original beats clone every time and making a game with better graphics that plays the same will not entice players as i have talked to people who think i am a graphics snob for not liking neverwinter kinghts for the outdated graphics, AND THEY DON'T EVEN PLAY WOW. just imagian how littel actual wow players are going to care about the same thing but with less content less experenced devolepment and LESS TO DO, coppying wow means you WILL FAIL don't argue with this COPY WOW AND YOU FAIL, F.A.I.L copying a game in order to surpass it IS REALLY DUMB (as in stick your nob in a letterbox dumb)

and you know what, i really want a new kind of MMO like a hack and slash mmo or a hack and slash stealth and fps mmo all live action as in press A to slash or shoot live action NO AUTO ATACKS AUTO ATACKING IS REALLY BORING.

 

[Torlux]

and you know what, i really want a new kind of MMO like a hack and slash mmo or a hack and slash stealth and fps mmo all live action as in press A to slash or shoot live action NO AUTO ATACKS AUTO ATACKING IS REALLY BORING.

^ That ( just with paragraphs and punctuation )

We play games because we want to play. Playing means activity. Auto-Attacking isn't active, it's passive - and a bit of an oxymoron, come to think of it. Attacking is an action that has to be performed, not automated... But I digress!

A lot of people complained that the combat in DCU comes down to button mashing, but there's a small snag in that: it's fun. Mashing buttons is fun. It's why some of us, most who played them even, liked games like Baldur's Gate, Champions of Norrath and the like. And there's no rule that states ''Hack'n'Slash combat can't be complex'', because a lot of games proved that it indeed can.

 

[Anah'ya]

and you know what, i really want a new kind of MMO like a hack and slash mmo or a hack and slash stealth and fps mmo all live action as in press A to slash or shoot live action NO AUTO ATACKS AUTO ATACKING IS REALLY BORING.

^ That ( just with paragraphs and punctuation )

We play games because we want to play. Playing means activity. Auto-Attacking isn't active, it's passive - and a bit of an oxymoron, come to think of it. Attacking is an action that has to be performed, not automated... But I digress!

A lot of people complained that the combat in DCU comes down to button mashing, but there's a small snag in that: it's fun. Mashing buttons is fun. It's why some of us, most who played them even, liked games like Baldur's Gate, Champions of Norrath and the like. And there's no rule that states ''Hack'n'Slash combat can't be complex'', because a lot of games proved that it indeed can.

Have you tried Age of Conan?

Age of Conan was brilliant. It was different, had an actual engaging combat system, and allowed you to pull the heads off other players with your bare hands. How awesome is that?

Fell flat on its face because of that though--and the lack of things to do once you hit the magic "max level". It's still going, but while it hasn't suffered the same fate as Warhammer Online, it has seen some significant server merges. And if I wasn't so tired of the RP community there (yes, I play my MMOs primarily for RP), then I would probably still be there.

Maybe The Secret World will bring something new to the table, though I cannot say much of it right now as I do not follow unreleased games as closely as others do.

 

[Pyro_203]

Sure let's copy wow and say were better so people will buy our game!

Spoiler

 

[GotMalkAvian]

Unfortunately, WoW is too much of an all-encapsulating juggernaut to topple so easily. Some damned good MMOs have come and gone, but most of them just can't pull enough people away from WoW to make a profit. Think of it this way:

If you play WoW, then odds are that you're in a guild, and odds are that you enjoy playing the game with these people; it might even be safe to say that your guilds and in-game friends account for some of the enjoyment that you get from the game. Some of them may even be your friends fom real life. Now, let's say that you decide to pick up a game like Rift. As much as you enjoy Rift, all of your friends are still playing WoW, and unless you can convince all of them to jump over to Rift with you, it just won't be as much fun without the people you know so well. So, you might as well just keep playing WoW, since all of your friends are still on and it's only another month or so until the next content patch.

This is why I fear for games like Guild Wars 2, Rift, and especially Old Republic. I'm terrified that games will be released that are superior to WoW in every conceivable way, yet these games will atrophy and die simply because people are too afraid to leave the well-worn comfort of WoW for unfamiliar new territory.

 

[BeeRye]

They do add a lot that's new for each class. Examples: healer/buffer rogue (bard), healer/buffer mage (chloromancer/archon), pet-using warriors, DPS or tank clerics, so on. Each class can also have its own meta-game mechanics tacked on depending on which soul trees you choose. The mage has one regardless, called charge. It builds up as you cast spells and your mana depletes, and then allows you to enter different modes depending on the soul trees you've chosen (ex a mode that heals all allies near you every tick, or a mode that repels enemies). A warrior has stamina, attack points, and should you choose the void knight tree, a mechanic called pacts which absorb magic damage/mana from mages and can be released to damage or heal.

So on and so forth. You get the idea. There's plenty new in addition to the old.

There may be variety, but it doesn't really matter. Sure you can have a healer/buffer rogue, but once the theorycrafters figure out that it isn't optimal it won't be played. Same for the other quirky combinations. It's not the game's fault, more the players. They always want to be told what's best and follow it blindly. I think of the example of sub rogues in wow at the moment. They are quite playable in PVE, but they aren't played because the reward:effort ratio is too low compared to mutilate and combat. So even while some specs may be fun to play and even very viable, they'll be neglected because they aren't the best. Expect everyone to roll the exact same spec for their class, especially when recount style addons are commonplace.

I see a lot of arguments to effect that "WoW wasn't that great when it was released either, this game is much better than WoW in its early days". People seem to forget that they aren't competing with vanilla WoW. They're competing with WoW as it stands today, not how it was before. New games need to be better on their first iteration than WoW is right now after years of development, which is not an easy task. There's also the issue of content. Each time a new game comes out, it never seems to have enough content to keep players there. They're keen to play, fly up through the levels, then reach a dead end with nothing to do. What do you do then? Level up another character to hit the dead end again? From my perspective, only EVE releases expansions with near enough frequency. WoW doesn't release expansions constantly but drip feeds the content through patches to keep the player hooked. I really think this will be a problem with Rift, and I don't see it toppling wow

 

[Zaik]

It's almost the exact same damn game. I couldn't even be bothered to play to the level cap during any of the betas I was invited to because it's so samey it's kind of depressing.

I mean, there are a few interesting concepts there, sure. I like there's like 12 different talent trees or something per class, and you pick 3. But there's already a bazillion free to play "WoW + x feature" games already. Why in the world would I pay any amount at all for what adds up to the exact same thing?

 

[Telemachus]

rift may be a better game, but WoW has 11million users. I was for a while, luckily i noticed i wasn't having much fun. So i left and played Mass Effect. Greatest move of my life. Rift just looks like another WoW clone. It will fail.

 

[MakazeX]

I still don't see the appeal in either of the games. A lot of people say "You would understand if you played them." I did play them. They were exactly the same as all the other MMO's just more colourful.

If I'm going to say, I found myself preferring RIFT because it was more visually bearable. But I doubt I'll even considering pay a subscription for it, especially with Guild Wars II not to far away. Everyone to there own though, I guess I'm just not the type to get into this serious MMO concept, I play MMO's sure, but I can't stick with them.

Anyways, back on topic, we all know that WoW will never die until blizzard pulls the plug, people have serious addictions to it. RIFT will get a steady following sure, but it'll never kill WoW. Maybe just poke at it a little with a stick.

 

[Thaeliana]

Hm. I've been playing RIFT since March 6th and I'm loving it. I played WoW for 4 1/2 years. To me, and to a lot of other people I know, it seems as if the developers of RIFT took a bunch of the most popular games and combined them. That, along with comments from players of these games. RIFT is by far, better than WoW as far as I am concerned. I haven't wanted to go back to the other games I play since I bought RIFT. I don't think I will either. A lot of the people I have met in game used to be major wowaholics and they wouldn't think of going back to it now.

If you are seeing nothing but brown when you log in, you might want to check out your graphics card and then all your graphics settings, because hunny, the graphics are AMAZING. Besides, it should just be the prettiness of the game that draws you in. What about the story? The games history? What made ME fall in love with this game, was the story behind everything.

 

[Zaik]

Good Bye x, hello x!

Way to crawl out of a bear trap and into a box trap.