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Digital_Hero

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Borrow a DS and make him play through the professor layton games. If you want a game that is non-violent and beneficial (which is what he may want to see) make him play layton. Excellent narrative, in the second and third a more engaging story, some ridiculously challenging brainteasers and really...... who can say a puzzle game is a waste of time? :D if he does, you keep easily say the same about books. If nothing else, a game like layton is basically a book where you have to work to turn the page.
 

lumenadducere

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I would say you have to show him Planescape: Torment, but if you're a non-gamer playing it for the first time it's nowhere near friendly. With the old AD&D ruleset and meandering pace, plus a lack of hand-holding, I don't think that he'd be able to get through it unless he's really determined.

Honestly I'd say Portal 2. It's a great title, non-violent, has great humor, and for a non-gamer will be challenging as hell. Portal 1 is good as well but its narrative relies much more on exploring, which he may not do if he's not used to gaming. Portal 2's narrative is much more focused and presented to the player in a more direct way.
 

GonzoGamer

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THEJORRRG said:
So I got into a discussion with my dad about how a game can be as engaging, worthwhile, and with a story as good as a book. He sees games as violent, blood filled, time wasters with no value, so I want to convince him otherwise!
I can?t really defend either of you.
I think you both got blinders.
Your dad obviously doesn?t know anything about what games are. However, I have yet to find any game that?s as engrossing as a really really good book.

That said, I would start him off with Portal to show what a really good game can be and how a game without blood & guts can be great.
Then get him to play Fallout 3 to show him that even though some games have blood & guts, it?s not why people play them. It will give him a chance to explore a world that wont completely chew him up.

Both of those games are probably the closest things I?ve got to games that are as engrossing as a really good book. They also don?t rely on specific timing and are generous to new gamers in that there?s never too much going on at once. Many anti-gamers tried games once, felt like a fool for not knowing what to do, and dismissed it as a "waste of time."

Then if he?s still interested, show him Burnout Revenge so he knows that even though there?s grinding metal and explosions, it can still be cerebral...I miss crash junctions.
 

Et3rnalLegend64

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Okami is a good one (PS2/Wii).

My most immediate suggestion might be Persona 4 and likely Persona 3 as well (haven't started yet). I'm playing P4 currently and loving it. The downside to showing him this is that he has to stick around for quite a while before the plot gets moving and he may not like the dungeon crawling (the game isn't exactly easy and the dungeon crawling takes a good bit of time). He has to see the Shadow bosses and follow at least one character all the way through his or her Social Link. Definitely not mindless shooting and violence.
 

Vibhor

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Did anybody suggest Shadow of the Colossus yet?
Surprisingly it fills every checklist you have.
 

DaHero

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THEJORRRG said:
So I got into a discussion with my dad about how a game can be as engaging, worthwhile, and with a story as good as a book. He sees games as violent, blood filled, time wasters with no value, so I want to convince him otherwise! I got him to agree that if I could find a game I thought he would appreciate, he would play it all the way through.
So I need suggestions.
My first thought was Red Dead, but I haven't played it myself so I fear that the missions might just be shootout after shootout. Second thought was Silent Hill, but I don't want him to shit his pants.

So, I need a game that represents games at their absolute best, but something accessible enough for a total non-gamer to play and enjoy.
(Also, it'd have to be a PS2, PC, or Xbox 360 game)
Plants Vs. Zombies

Also: Make sure that when you give the "fun and engaging" argument there are no FPS games around, since most of them are strictly for multiplayer, the argument shatters right then and there.

You need to get him into a good solid RPG. Oblivion, Morrowind, I guess Mass Effect 1 (ONNNNNEEEE!!!) would be a good example. OH!

Who here forgot Deus Ex for the PC? Heck I still offer to gift that game to people that think RPGs are boring.
 

Malrock

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nulmas said:
Otherwise, I'd suggest Planescape: Torment. Great story, great morals, a good philosophy and, in a way, similar to a book (over 800.000 words, bigger than LOTR, if I'm not mistaken).
Wow good shout, I concur! Planescape: Torment was purely epic! If you want to demonstrate gamings ability to tell a great story and to use gameplay to engauge you like no other medium can, this is a great game to showcase.
 

Nuke_em_05

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Story-Engagement:
Myst
Portal
Bio-Shock
Mass Effect
KOTOR

Non-violent but fun:
Lego-anything
Rockband/Guitar hero and variants
Peggle

The problem you run into is games have two parts: the story and the gameplay. You can't enjoy the story if you are too busy learning how to play; which is a problem when trying to demonstrate story to people who have limited gameplay experience. That's why I'd say something simple like Myst; can't get much simpler than point and click. Portal requires quite a bit of focus on gameplay, and towards the end has a lot of reaction time requirements. RPGs generally have a good story, and the intensity isn't as demanding, but there is still a lot of number-crunching to focus on in order to progress smoothly. I suppose easy modes would help...

Good luck.
 

Wintermute_

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Shadow of the Colossus- Artsy while having wonderful atmosphere and fun unique gameplay.
Jak and Daxter Trilogy- Just so amazingly fun and the story leaves very little to be desired.
Okami- Stupendous art style. Unique story and gameplay. Great game.
Portal 1 & 2- obviously...
Half-life series- cause its a shooter that isn't as mindlessly violent as MW2.
Pikmin 1 & 2- adorable, fun, engaging and again, unique. First game I ever owned. Love it.
Banjo Kazookie- Go a little retro. Fun game it is.
Metroid Prime Trilogy- Best thing Nintendo produced in years
 

Nulmas

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Yosharian said:
THEJORRRG said:
So I got into a discussion with my dad about how a game can be as engaging, worthwhile, and with a story as good as a book. He sees games as violent, blood filled, time wasters with no value, so I want to convince him otherwise! I got him to agree that if I could find a game I thought he would appreciate, he would play it all the way through.
So I need suggestions.
My first thought was Red Dead, but I haven't played it myself so I fear that the missions might just be shootout after shootout. Second thought was Silent Hill, but I don't want him to shit his pants.

So, I need a game that represents games at their absolute best, but something accessible enough for a total non-gamer to play and enjoy.
(Also, it'd have to be a PS2, PC, or Xbox 360 game)
Blade Runner on the PC. Portal and Heavy Rain were suggested by other people in this thread and I agree that those are good choices, however Portal requires an FPS skillset to enjoy - the awkwardness while he learns the controls might put him off. Civilization 4 would be an excellent choice only if he is of a strategic mindset.

Malrock said:
nulmas said:
Otherwise, I'd suggest Planescape: Torment. Great story, great morals, a good philosophy and, in a way, similar to a book (over 800.000 words, bigger than LOTR, if I'm not mistaken).
Wow good shout, I concur! Planescape: Torment was purely epic! If you want to demonstrate gamings ability to tell a great story and to use gameplay to engauge you like no other medium can, this is a great game to showcase.
You're recommending PS:T to a person who a) has never played a game and b) hates games? Wow. Do not follow this advice.
Gameplay wise, PS:T isn't that hard to grasp once you get the basics. Of course, convincing him to get the basics would be the tough part.

Oh, and congratulations, sir!

Blade Runner is indeed a fine game and one of a great example of good (and branching) storytelling in a game :) And way easier to get into than PS:T.

Now I'm wondering where my Blade Runner discs are... :( I miss playing it.


***EDIT: By the way, any idea if Blade Runner runs on Windows 7?
 

Aabglov

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I recommend Portal and Sid Meyer's Civilization 5. Civ5 can be hard to get used to if you've never played an RTS, but it's a pretty addicting game with plenty of things to do besides murder. If you play your cards right you can get through the whole game without declaring war on anyone...except maybe barbarians.
 

No_Remainders

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THEJORRRG said:
So I got into a discussion with my dad about how a game can be as engaging, worthwhile, and with a story as good as a book. He sees games as violent, blood filled, time wasters with no value, so I want to convince him otherwise! I got him to agree that if I could find a game I thought he would appreciate, he would play it all the way through.
So I need suggestions.
My first thought was Red Dead, but I haven't played it myself so I fear that the missions might just be shootout after shootout. Second thought was Silent Hill, but I don't want him to shit his pants.

So, I need a game that represents games at their absolute best, but something accessible enough for a total non-gamer to play and enjoy.
(Also, it'd have to be a PS2, PC, or Xbox 360 game)
Hmm...
I'd say Portal. The original one anyway, haven't played the second.

It has great puzzles and will prove games are not just violent and blood-filled time wasters with no value.

Red Dead Redemption is... It's ok. I got bored of it and had to force myself to finish it but that might just be because I really amn't a fan of Westerns.

Actually, thinking about it, Batman: Arkham Asylum, perhaps? It's fairly accessible with both combat and stealth moments. Might be a good idea?
 

Nulmas

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Yosharian said:
Yeah it is a great game, I didn't mean to shoot down your suggestion quite as harshly as I probably did, it's just I'm an RPG fanatic and I found PS:T incredibly difficult to get in to, gameplay-wise. And frankly the story is a bit confusing too. I wouldn't suggest it to a newbie.
No harm done, I understood where you were coming from :)
 

Malkavian

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Jan 22, 2009
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I don't mean to bash anyone, but there's a lot of really bad suggestions on this thread.

Here's a list of games that you should NOT pick:

- Platformers, like Donkey Kong or Super Mario. They may be great, they may be clever, but in the end of the day, they will most likely not make a man who already has his mind against gaming, suddenly see the medium as intelectual and strong in storytelling. He may enjoy himself, but he can easily play it off as still being childish entertainment, not a serious medium.

- Shooters. Of any kind. Be it Doom, Call of Duty, or even Half Life. He will, for one thing, likely miss the storytelling aspects of them, and it will not help disprove his argument that games are just violent time wasters. Again, he may be entertained, but they will not convice him that gaming is a medium.

- RPG's. They are long, they are complicated, and giving him an RPG as his first modern gaming experience would be a terrible idea, because he will likely not make good on his promise, and play it through to the end. And eve if he does, he will not sink the time into it that it deserves.

- Japanese games. Most games in consideration here would be JRPG's. It would be a terrible choice, because the stories are really not for everybody, and certainly not for the inexperienced gamer, with no ties or experience to japanese culture. He will, most likely, not like/understand the story.

- Fighters/Racers/Sports games/whatever. Anything without a story, or if a story, the sorriest excuse for one. Again, he will look at them, maybe find them funny, but not consider gaming a relevant medium.

- Strategy games. While they are games that certainly display gaming as more intellectually engaging than "childish etertainment", the stories in them aren't all that good. The games are usually very long, too.


Damn. That's a lot of darn good games we just excluded.

Now here's what you want in the game you show him:

- Accesability. That's the most important part. He has to be able to actually play it, and play it without your help. So, the gameplay must be simple, but still challenging. Keep the rules simple.

- Short lenght. You need to be able to tell him, honestly, that he can complete it within the foreseeable future, even though he is an adult, has other responsibilities, and other hobbies he may want to pursue. Give him something he, as an inexperienced gamer, can complete in at least 8 hours.

- Accesible story. By that I don't mean that you should choose something with a "simple" story, but choose something that doesn't start out with a 5 minute cutscene, and don't require much prior knowledge. And, and this is something I think most people in this thread forgot, it has to be something that can be understood by someone who is not a gamers/geeks. Seriously. A lot of the stories we see in videogames makes much better sense to us, because we are used to that kind of stuff. Maybe we ar eused to it because of movies, or comics, or fantasy/sci-fi novels, or maybe from other videogames. But if you haven't already experienced some of the other "geeky" stuff, then videogames, and their stories, will be harder for you to understand.

- Non-violent. That doesn't just mean you dishing it out, it goes the other way too. Mirrors Edge is a terrible choice, same with MGS. It doesn't matter whether you fire a gun or not. What matters is if ANY guns are fired. Violence, not matter the recipient, means the game is about adrenaline(generalization taken to the extreme, but I hope you know what I mean), and if it's about adrenaline, then it is the games equivalent of action movies. And action movies are NOT what you want to show to someone who doesn't regard movies as a medium.


With those criteria in place, I will sugest: Portal.

It is short, so with effort, he can get through it without regretting your bet, and maybe evven giving up. Tell him how quickly it can be sppedrunned, and tell him how fast normal people complete it. It is completely non-violent for the most part, and the parts where guns ARE fired(the turrets), it is still not about adrenaline and running, but about figuring out how to get past them/deactivate them. The turets are interchangable with a pit, acid, whatever. It also gets going right away, without any lenghty cutscenes or explanations. The story is small, so not that hard to understand, but the beauty is about how it's told, and that will make a great argument in your favour. Also, the gameplay is incredibly simple: 2 portals, and physics. The game is not easy, so he will have to engage his mind(another point that will help your case), but he should be able to grasp the core principles of the gameplay fairly well, so he can pour his concentration into the game, instead of into how it works.

Don't tell him anything about the story. Let him explore it for himself. See if he can figure out what happened at Aperture. Just tell him that all he has to do, is explained in the game. Tell him it's short. And tell him to enjoy it, and promise to pay good attention to it.

If that doesn't change his mind, then nothing will.
 

Subbies

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Has anyone said Psychonautes? cause in terms of story setting and game-play it's really good, it's fairly easy in the beginning so a good way to start. Unfortunately it gets nigh impossible near the end so that's a drawback.
 

Seraj

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Wuggy said:
I'd suggest Portal 2: Engaging, non-violent, great narrative. Definitely on the high end of gaming.
I agree with this guy. No blood too :p
 

LarenzoAOG

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THEJORRRG said:
So I got into a discussion with my dad about how a game can be as engaging, worthwhile, and with a story as good as a book. He sees games as violent, blood filled, time wasters with no value, so I want to convince him otherwise! I got him to agree that if I could find a game I thought he would appreciate, he would play it all the way through.
So I need suggestions.
My first thought was Red Dead, but I haven't played it myself so I fear that the missions might just be shootout after shootout. Second thought was Silent Hill, but I don't want him to shit his pants.

So, I need a game that represents games at their absolute best, but something accessible enough for a total non-gamer to play and enjoy.
(Also, it'd have to be a PS2, PC, or Xbox 360 game)
Metro 2033, great atmosphere, good pacing, great story, and while it is an FPS there are many parts of the game that discourage violence and reward you for opting out of a shootout.

If you're trying to convince him that games can have as good stories as books this is the game for you because it was written by the author of the book by the same name.
 

ryo02

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metal gear solid series the whole point is NOT to kill as for art ico shadow of the colossus

I quite like breath of fire 3 and 4 you could try alundra , metro 2033 the first 2 oddworld games
 

Savber

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I suggest Portal 1+2, Heavy Rain, or even Mass Effect.

It really depends on what he likes.
 

hailfire

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Bioshock. it poses philosophical questions about perfection, scientific alteration, and utilitarianism. bioshock actually made me sit down and wonder what I would do in a situation where I had to kill to save. on top of that, the plot and story line are original and well written. all in all a good game.