How many people were outraged when Ned Stark...(spoilers)

[DJjaffacake]

People who were outraged are the kind of people who aren't suited for the 'reality ensues' aspect of ASOIAF.

Spoiler: A Storm of Swords spoilers

Robb's death pissed me off a lot more, but my outrage was mainly directed at the Freys and Boltons. My main non-story complaint was that it was basically just a repeat of what happens to Ned: standard fantasy hero is doing well, bad shit happened but he seems to have overcome it, he makes a mistake and blam, reality ensues.

 

[teebeeohh]

So no, I wasn't exactly outraged. Although once I started to read the books I got kind of annoyed that George R. R. Martin seems to have something against the family. I mean, give them a break, they are one of the few decent people in the series entire frigging world.

I was more sad about the wolves though.

well they kind of are unequipped to handle the real world and are trying really hard to die, you would have thought Sansa learned at some point that the world is not a fucking fairy tale. I am honestly surprised that any Starks who are not Arya are still alive.

Spoiler: last book spoilers

i mean really jon? you cut through 1000 years of tradition halfway efficiently, the whole thing is held together by string, duct tape and you and you decide to leave? i know they are probably gonna revive you but just how dumb are you really?

and the whole point is that decent gets you killed, even if you have noble goals and try to do the right thing you either need to be a dick yourself or need somebody to be a dick for you.

If my favorite character (Cersei) is still alive and kicking, all is right with the world.

If she died...

RAGE RAGE RAGE... sudden realization I have never read any of the books or watched any of the episodes and only like the character because she the closest thing the world will ever get to a competent real-life Azula.

interestingly enough Azula gets her status as heir to the fire nation and favourite child because she is really good at firebending and also very smart while Cersei will never wield any power of her own(basically all the power she wields is the power of the men around her) because she is a woman and Westeros is a shitty place to be a woman.

 

[Hades]

I didn't mind because Ned had it coming.

Ned reached the point where his honour didn't seem like a positive trait anymore. In the book littlefinger spells out in detail that choosing Stannis will start a war because nobody likes Stannis and Stannis himself hate those who fought for the Targyrians. Neds response to that is ''Then we will have a war''. Littlefinger may be a liar but Ned trusted him so when he says Stannis will bring war Ned would believe it, he just found it an acceptable risk. Considering this is a setting where war is anything but glorius thats kind of heartless of him.

 

[Yuno Gasai]

These are the people who didn't read the books before watching. Or didn't know who Sean Bean was.

You hit the nail on the head, there.

I'm accustomed to Sean Bean's antics. I was waiting for it to happen, the only thing I couldn't predict was how.

I was a bit sad when he died (namely because of Cersei's reaction), but that's okay.

 

[The Funslinger]

If my favorite character (Cersei) is still alive and kicking, all is right with the world.

If she died...

RAGE RAGE RAGE... sudden realization I have never read any of the books or watched any of the episodes and only like the character because she the closest thing the world will ever get to a competent real-life Azula.

I wouldn't say she's competent. Blind and cocky, more like.

OT: It's a shame. I liked Ned. I picked up the books after watching series 1, so his death was unexpected for me (aside from the Sean Bean effect, of course.)

 

[bartholen_v1legacy]

I was not shocked. Not because of the Sean Bean factor (he survived Silent Hill, after all, and I read the book first), but because he was the only completely honest, honorable member of the cast. Well, until Brienne of Tarth. But he was just an idiot as well.

Spoiler: Spoilers about Cersei and Ned's fate

Yeah, confront Cersei, telling her you know that the father of her kids was Jaime, then finish it by threatening her. Seriously, it was just the two of them. You could easily just, you know, tell Robert, the king you are serving, and have him "handle" his wife. Instead, you try to give her an "honorable" out, and you get decapitated. Brilliant fucking job.

The reason he didn't tell Robert at first and got fucked over in the first place was because Robert was hunting at the time, and when he got back, i.e. when Ned could have told him, he had been mauled and died shortly thereafter, leaving Ned in a royally (see what I did there?) buttfucked situation which lead to his demise.

OT: I knew that he was going to die before even watching the show or reading any of the books, so it wasn't really a shock. It was refreshing though, seeing another show that isn't afraid to kill off main characters.

That was my exact reaction as well. Which is a damn shame as he is one of my favourite actors. He also played the part perfectly.

So no, I wasn't exactly outraged. Although once I started to read the books I got kind of annoyed that George R. R. Martin seems to have something against the family. I mean, give them a break, they are one of the few decent people in the series entire frigging world.

I was more sad about the wolves though.

I've felt an undertone in the fate of the Stark family: holding high honor and loyalty is respectable and honorable, but it can also screw you over if you refuse to budge from your morals. Littlefinger encouraged Ned to take the throne when the opportunity rose, but Ned was too honest and loyal to his honor. See also Stannis for a more clear example. The metaphor someone (I forget who) uses for Stannis in the books was that he was iron: hard and unrelenting, but brittle. He'll shatter before he bends. I think it was very well said.

 

[grey_space]

I've been reading the books for far too long now (At this point I'd be ecstatic to only wait 4 years between books). So it wasn't exactly a shock, though getting to watch the utter horror on the SOs face when it happened was pretty amazing.

Ha ha this. She was incensed.

I was sad enough myself when I read it first. I feel that Ned is a tragic character rather than a foolish one, trapped as he is in following a code of honour that he knew full well would lead him to disaster. In many cases he knew what the politic thing to do would be, but instead listened to his conscience and did the morally correct thing, even though it would lead him to his doom.

Indeed I feel that it is inflexible moral extremism of any kind that leads characters to destruction on the world of Game Of Thrones.

You see it time and time again with Ned Twyin, Jamie, Cersei,Rob, all show a moral and emotional inflexibility or even willfull blindness that leads them to their own individual falls.

 

[repeating integers]

That video... fucking hilarious, man. I didn't realise anybody actually talked like that in real life.

"They killed mah nigga NED!"

 

[hermes]

Outraged is not the right word. I was shocked, and interested that they pulled such a move in a fantasy series.

 

[Tom_green_day]

This is the same as

Spoiler

Dobby's death

from Harry Potter and other similar circumstances. It happened in the book and no-one seemed to care, but when it happened on TV/film then everyone got upset about it. I wasn't surprised as it happened in the book years before the TV series.

 

[Woodsey]

Honestly, I was pretty much expecting it. Mainly because they picked Sean Bean to play the part.

Spoiler

Since we all know that Sean Bean dies in everything.

Indeed. If someone tells you that he doesn't die in it, that's when you get pissed off about spoilers.

Anyway, it's a pretty big move. The show's an ensemble but he was really perceived as the leader of the pack.

 

[IamLEAM1983]

Honestly, I was pretty much expecting it. Mainly because they picked Sean Bean to play the part.

Spoiler

Since we all know that Sean Bean dies in everything.

Pretty much this. Oh, and having read the books as well, I could safely expect Ned to die. It didn't cut back on the emotional charge, though, and I still was outraged, at least in a certain sense. I'm really looking forward to Joff getting kicked out of the playing field.

Props to Jack Gleeson for playing a murderous sociopath so well, I guess. I hear that actors have to come to live with the fact that some fans aren't going to be able to discern between the character and themselves, which can lead to some pretty odd instances of complete strangers flipping the bird at you...

 

[HBaskerville]

Disappointed, but not outraged. It lets you know what this series is: a soap opera.

Disappointed because he seemed like the only decent character. Just my tastes, but none of the others are at all likable. If I'm going to spend that much time with a book/show I want at someone to be likable. No outrage because this kind of storytelling is nothing new.

This series is one of those "lets heap misery on everyone" kind of stories. If you enjoy that kind of story, you'll like this series. If not, move along to something else and don't waste your time.

 

[thebobmaster_v1legacy]

I was not shocked. Not because of the Sean Bean factor (he survived Silent Hill, after all, and I read the book first), but because he was the only completely honest, honorable member of the cast. Well, until Brienne of Tarth. But he was just an idiot as well.

Spoiler: Spoilers about Cersei and Ned's fate

Yeah, confront Cersei, telling her you know that the father of her kids was Jaime, then finish it by threatening her. Seriously, it was just the two of them. You could easily just, you know, tell Robert, the king you are serving, and have him "handle" his wife. Instead, you try to give her an "honorable" out, and you get decapitated. Brilliant fucking job.

The reason he didn't tell Robert at first and got fucked over in the first place was because Robert was hunting at the time, and when he got back, i.e. when Ned could have told him, he had been mauled and died shortly thereafter, leaving Ned in a royally (see what I did there?) buttfucked situation which lead to his demise.

True, in the end, it wouldn't have worked out. But Ned didn't know that. He could have waited for Robert to get back, then when Robert was injured and couldn't live, have a talk with Cersei as the back-up plan. But have a better solution than "Leave this place, or I'll tell everyone you are dancing the horizontal tango with your brother". Especially now that you know she is untrustworthy.

 

[lucky_sharm]

Disappointed, but not outraged. It lets you know what this series is: a soap opera.

Disappointed because he seemed like the only decent character. Just my tastes, but none of the others are at all likable. If I'm going to spend that much time with a book/show I want at someone to be likable. No outrage because this kind of storytelling is nothing new.

This series is one of those "lets heap misery on everyone" kind of stories. If you enjoy that kind of story, you'll like this series. If not, move along to something else and don't waste your time.

I disagree on the "lets heap misery on everyone" thing. Everyone's woes in the story are brought upon by the agendas of other characters, and some of the time the characters bring tragedy upon themselves as a result of their own flaws.

 

[JochemHippie]

Not really.

The man is a walking spoiler as is so I kinda saw it coming.

 

[R3dF41c0n]

My wife read all the books and spoiled that plot point for me early on. She told me I couldn't be mad because that was a 16 year old spoiler.

 

[XMark]

I had that spoiled for me way before I got into the TV or book series.

And I had a certain very shocking plot development in the third book spoiled for me ahead of time as well. It's way too easy to stumble upon spoilers on the internet these days.

I'd say it's a great plot development in that it lets you know that nobody in the series is going to have a "protagonist force field" around them, and anyone can die.

It's almost like natural selection. Everyone vying for the iron throne has different character traits and those without the right traits get killed. It's survival of the fittest. Not necessarily the strongest, since the strongest guy also died (Khal Drogo). We have yet to see what specific combination of honor, strength, ruthlessness, cunning, etc will win out. My money's on Tyrion.

 

[Weaver]

When I read the books, Eddard's death was the moment I realized Ice & Fire was going to be different from other series. The only man ruled by personal honor -- the guy we're supposed to root for, the guy who "wins" in most fiction -- is beheaded with his own sword on the whim of a foolish boy.

I wasn't outraged. I took a minute to think, then realized I was pretty sure I liked the series better for making characters suffer realistic consequences for their actions. I miss Eddard, but I miss other characters who died, too.

Myself as well. It drove home the point that acting only out of honour and virtue is simply not a way to live in the "real world". It helps to make what is a completely fictional world seem very real.