I don't understand why people enjoy Dark Souls/Demon's Souls

[Sack of Cheese]

Big bosses! I love big bosses, I cannot lie.

Right at the moment I saw the first boss in Dark Souls, I thought to myself "This is the game for me!"
It is atmospheric, and the act of getting through the game itself simply makes you feel like a badass!

 

[Headdrivehardscrew]

...and, YES - as it's been mentioned/questiond on GT just recently - if you watch the mimics closely, you'll not only see subtle differences in design, you'll actually see them breathe and move ever so slightly.

i just had to comment on this...

REALLY?! O.O!! someone just stood there and watched a mimic? and it breathed?

*snickers* XD

ohmigawd!! that's freakin' awesome, that small tidbit of detail XD so much love for these games for their odd small details :3

and yes, i agree in a way, just something about Demon's Souls that's a step above, if i put the two next to each other Demon's Souls always wins (i may be biased though since it has Maiden Astraea...) even though Dark Souls is definitely smoother, more stuff, and blindingly beautiful... there's just something THERE about the Nexus that Lordran doesn't have... -.-

and Priscilla is a nice try, but no... fluffy doesn't win the game!

Well, if, after the first time you get caught unaware by a mimic you don't adapt and go at it ever so carefully, there must be something off with how you go at things in the first place. Honestly - the first time one encounters a mimic and doesn't even know they exist, you're just not bound to forget that experience, that feeling of absolute and utter dread. Not to mention jumping into holes, rolling off walls or riding elevators to the very top, even though the floor is caked in blood.

As for Maiden Astrea - that's hands down one of the most confusing, disturbing and 'different' boss fights I've seen so far. When Dark Souls came out, I thought it was excellent that they did away with the Nexus, but now, after having gone back to play/live/breathe/smoke Demon's Souls, I must say that the Nexus is just pure awesome in a box. It's a safe zone, a personal space mostly detached from all the suffering and dying and killing and having to be very careful; in the Nexus, you can die at absolutely no cost... fling yourself off the top balcony, why not? I like to have options, even when I have to discover all of them myself.

 

[major_chaos]

and exploring more deeply will reward you with better equipment and better items. There's no way this is counter-intuitive in the slightest.

As someone who actually likes Dark Souls (although far less than someone like you)I would still say that 99% of the time my "reward" for exploring is getting my face peeled off by something I can't even figure out how to hurt, let alone kill.

OT: People like things, other people may not like those same things. For example: I like the combat in Dark Souls, but I still don't understand all the gushing about atmosphere, however I get that all it comes down to is a difference of opinion/taste, I don't need to make a thread about it, and neither did you, especially considering you admit knowing the topic has been done to death.

 

[Mr Companion]

Here is a list of "dull, washed out" levels from Dark Souls:

-A massive marble city of the gods perched atop a mountain illuminated by an illusionary sunset.
-An endless sea at the bottom of the world holding up the earth with twisted trees miles high.
-An orange glowing hellscape of strange temples and deformed demons
-A mysterious eerie forest ruled by a matriartrchal cat-bear.
-A creepy, decrepit flooded town of ghosts
-The past where humanity is corrupting the order of the old world
-A bleak painting where the bastard child of god and dragon is hidden away in shame.

Each of these places has a wildly differing aesthetic and the whole game is thick with tension, atmosphere and wonder.

Just using snazzy fancy and buzzy words to describe something doesn't actually change it, you know. I am one of those people who found DS simply boring and dull. Uninteresting. Not motivating. It's currently sitting on my backlog and will be getting another chance sometime later, but what you did here is more like how real estate ads will list "cozy" when the property in question is "small and cramped", or "retro look" when it's obvious it hasn't been renovated in decades.

(edited for brevity)
How far did you play it? Because the areas I described are way more fascinating than I made them sound. Its not like these are just buzzwords these are the chosen aesthetic of the levels and they play into the gameplay mechanics. Every feature of the environments I mentioned in the last post is tied into the gameplay, often very directly. Its not like Final Fantasy where a great big pretty thing in the background is just a skybox because in Dark Souls that big background thing is always very important and something you can explore extensively.

Virtually everything you see in Dark Souls is exploreable and has earthy, creative lore behind it unlike most fantasy games where you find yourself in familiar, safe scenarios. Its a matter of atmosphere and adventure. If something feels familiar we don't fear it, and without fear and danger its not an adventure, just routine. Slaying an evil guy as a powerful hero to save the kingdom is farmiliar. Nothing in Dark Souls is familiar and nothing is safe. You are not a hero, there is no villain and the kingdom is beyond saving. Dark Souls is a game for adults who want to feel that sense of adventure again in a strange world they don't understand. Dark Souls is hard because it needs YOU to be afraid, Dark Souls is "bleak" because thats the atmosphere.

Something like Dragon Age Origins (which I played through recently) is for people who want to walk the beaten track of popular fantasy fiction again. Dark Souls is unique.

On the other hand, Bed of Chaos is bulls**t.

 

[Imperioratorex Caprae]

I actually like the series despite the difficulty curve. I grew up in the NES era, and the first game I ever owned besides SMB was Ghosts n' Goblins, one of the hardest games ever. But also one of my favorite games of all time. Dark/Demon's Souls feels like a spiritual successor evolved. GnG has a difficulty curve that can be overcome by learning mechanics and navigation, much like the Souls series in that you need to learn basic mechanics and the map structures on where to go, what to kill and how, but it doesn't require absolute knowledge and total exploration.
The Souls series are also a min/max-er's dream but its not required to enjoy or beat either game. I have some issues with the games, but acknowledge their beautiful artwork, interesting level design and concepts.

 

[Pink Gregory]

The real question here is, why does it bother you?

 

[[REDACTED]]

Here is a list of "dull, washed out" levels from Dark Souls:

-A massive marble city of the gods perched atop a mountain illuminated by an illusionary sunset.
-An endless sea at the bottom of the world holding up the earth with twisted trees miles high.
-An orange glowing hellscape of strange temples and deformed demons
-A mysterious eerie forest ruled by a matriartrchal cat-bear.
-A creepy, decrepit flooded town of ghosts
-The past where humanity is corrupting the order of the old world
-A bleak painting where the bastard child of god and dragon is hidden away in shame.

Each of these places has a wildly differing aesthetic and the whole game is thick with tension, atmosphere and wonder.

Just using snazzy fancy and buzzy words to describe something doesn't actually change it, you know. I am one of those people who found DS simply boring and dull. Uninteresting. Not motivating. It's currently sitting on my backlog and will be getting another chance sometime later, but what you did here is more like how real estate ads will list "cozy" when the property in question is "small and cramped", or "retro look" when it's obvious it hasn't been renovated in decades.

But those areas are exactly as amazing as he described them. How far did you play? Only the earliest areas in the game could be reasonably described as drab.

 

[Insideout Ink Demon]

I can't see why people lap up CoD or some generic title
Different strokes for different folks

 

[DementedSheep]

Why is it that Dark Souls and Demons Souls seems to attract this so much? Some people like the game, some people don?t. Everyone has different tastes. I don?t know why people who don?t like the game keep making threads wanting an explanation from people who do.

I can't speak for Demons souls since I've not played it but for Dark Souls:

Dull, boring, washed out levels? Some may find it that way but I don?t. One of the reason I like Dark souls is the art direction. The crystal cave, forest, ash lake and ano londo in particular are all very beautiful to me.

You don?t need to know where everything is. I played it mostly blind the first time (I did look up a more in depth explanation of the stats, how upgrading works and how to access the DLC content though). I missed shit of course, I never even knew ash lake existed and never met to Kaathe (this one slightly annoyed me though just because finding him requires you do stuff in an order that doesn't really make sense) but that?s part of the fun. You?re meant to be exploring and thats big part of the appeal of the game. I?d say playing it with a guide is not playing it how it?s meant to be played.

Of course the best items and equipment should be hardest to find. Is there any game that isn't completely linear where this isn't the case? It not like you need them to finish the game. It?s not even much of an issue in Dark Souls since the weapons and armour are all different from each other rather than simply being outright better in most cases.
Hell the sword the Baldur knights drop, a spear and a longbow were the most reliable weapons to me for most of the game and you get those right at beginning.

 

[Baron_Rouge]

Dark/Demon's Souls could've been easy and I would have still loved them to bits. Sure, I like the difficulty. It makes it more challenging. It's not the reason I buy the games though; the gameplay is great, the combat is tight, the online features are fascinating, the enemy designs are unique, the levels are spectacular, the scope is incredible, the story is compelling, and the world has been amazingly and lovingly crafted.

I mean, that moment in Dark Souls when you first arrive in Anor Londo and look down over the city? Spectacular. One of my favourite moments in any video game. And that bit where you look across the surface of the Ash Lake, and that haunting melody plays, and you see the black hydra moving slowly towards you? Amazingly atmospheric. That euphoria that you get when you beat Ornstein and Smough for the first game, and the gratitude you feel to your fellow warriors who assisted you (or the pride if you did it alone)? Unparalleled. Or how about that moment in Demon's Souls where you look up and see the Storm King flying overhead and you wonder how you can possibly beat that thing? These are the experiences that you just don't get anywhere else.

I happen to like the difficulty and challenge in Dark Souls, but if it was removed, I'd still buy it. It might not be my personal pick for Game of the Year/Generation/All Time as it is now, but you'd still have a damn good RPG.

 

[Something Amyss]

The biggest misconception surrounding the series is that people only play it for the difficulty.

I personally love the atmosphere of the series, sure, the difficulty plays a huge part in setting that feeling of dread, but the world these games take place in are a lot deeper than they first appear.

Based on responses in most threads, I'd say people mostly do play it for the difficulty. You will gt a ton of folks conceding that the story or atmosphere is crap, but that its punishing nature makes it awesome and if you don't like it you should go back to your call of duty games that take you by the hand.

 

[infinity_turtles]

The biggest misconception surrounding the series is that people only play it for the difficulty.

I personally love the atmosphere of the series, sure, the difficulty plays a huge part in setting that feeling of dread, but the world these games take place in are a lot deeper than they first appear.

Based on responses in most threads, I'd say people mostly do play it for the difficulty. You will gt a ton of folks conceding that the story or atmosphere is crap, but that its punishing nature makes it awesome and if you don't like it you should go back to your call of duty games that take you by the hand.

While the games'... unforgiving nature, as I don't think they're that difficult just very strict, is probably first and foremost why I love the games, I certainly wouldn't say the their atmosphere or story are crap. The games' stories are a bit of a puzzle, meant to be pieced together, and the games do a good job of maintaining a somewhat dreary atmosphere while still evoking a bit of wonder over the varied areas(which helps motivate players' to piece together the stories).

So I may play them for the challenge they offer, but that's not the only reason. I think if it seems that way it's because most of the threads on the Souls games have been specifically linked to the games' difficulty. Also, I think the derogatory bit about games taking people by the hand is a bit of an exaggeration. Most Souls fans who go on about wanting the games to stay difficult and unforgiving say things more like "Not every game is made for everyone, so if you don't like the difficulty of this one go play nearly any other game that doesn't handle difficulty this way"

 

[RedEyesBlackGamer]

The biggest misconception surrounding the series is that people only play it for the difficulty.

I personally love the atmosphere of the series, sure, the difficulty plays a huge part in setting that feeling of dread, but the world these games take place in are a lot deeper than they first appear.

Based on responses in most threads, I'd say people mostly do play it for the difficulty. You will gt a ton of folks conceding that the story or atmosphere is crap, but that its punishing nature makes it awesome and if you don't like it you should go back to your call of duty games that take you by the hand.

Also the freedom. It throws you into the world and just says "go do that shit". You can do a number of bosses in different order, you can skip whole sections of the game (I skip the Capra Demon, the Sewer, and Blighttown most playthroughs I do now), and you are free to go into any play style or class that you desire. Some people are overwhelmed by this, other people love it.

 

[KoudelkaMorgan]

I see this thread, while I'm listening to Nameless Song from Dark Souls OST. I enjoy the series because they are a joy to play. That should be all the reason anyone needs, but I could spend more time than is prudent pouring out my love for the series.

My wtf though, is why do people enjoy the PVP in these games so much. I know why the complete dicks like it, but not so much the regular people.

I get zero satisfaction in killing an invader, no sense of having overcome an obstacle. I have zero desire to invade another person and mess with them either.

Fights are either over in 5 seconds or less, or become a game of hide and seek. I mean I prefer that because of chameleon etc. providing some funny moments but it got old quick.

 

[Windcaler]

Here is a list of "dull, washed out" levels from Dark Souls:

-A massive marble city of the gods perched atop a mountain illuminated by an illusionary sunset.
-An endless sea at the bottom of the world holding up the earth with twisted trees miles high.
-An orange glowing hellscape of strange temples and deformed demons
-A mysterious eerie forest ruled by a matriartrchal cat-bear.
-A creepy, decrepit flooded town of ghosts
-The past where humanity is corrupting the order of the old world
-A bleak painting where the bastard child of god and dragon is hidden away in shame.

Each of these places has a wildly differing aesthetic and the whole game is thick with tension, atmosphere and wonder.

Just using snazzy fancy and buzzy words to describe something doesn't actually change it, you know. I am one of those people who found DS simply boring and dull. Uninteresting. Not motivating. It's currently sitting on my backlog and will be getting another chance sometime later, but what you did here is more like how real estate ads will list "cozy" when the property in question is "small and cramped", or "retro look" when it's obvious it hasn't been renovated in decades.

How can you say a setting is dull and boring if you havnt played the game? That just seems quite ignorant to me because you havnt walked in those lands, you havnt seen the architecture of say Lost izalith or the designs of the crystal caverns.

I would also like to know why you find them dull and boring when you havnt played the game

 

[Vegosiux]

How can you say a setting is dull and boring if you havnt played the game? That just seems quite ignorant to me because you havnt walked in those lands, you havnt seen the architecture of say Lost izalith or the designs of the crystal caverns.

I would also like to know why you find them dull and boring when you havnt played the game

Wouldn't me saying I am going to give it "another" chance imply that I already did give it one...?

 

[Windcaler]

How can you say a setting is dull and boring if you havnt played the game? That just seems quite ignorant to me because you havnt walked in those lands, you havnt seen the architecture of say Lost izalith or the designs of the crystal caverns.

I would also like to know why you find them dull and boring when you havnt played the game

Wouldn't me saying I am going to give it "another" chance imply that I already did give it one...?

Giving it a chance doesnt have the same meaning as I played the game. You could have given it a chance to wow you by looking at screenshots, watching lets plays or walkthroughs, watching a challenge series, watching a friend play it, reading reviews/critiques, etc. There are many ways in which you can give a game a chance to pull you in but to call something dull and boring without having said I played the game makes me question the legitimacy of that opinion

That said, you didnt answer my question.

 

[Zeldias]

The thing about the Souls series is that they are superbly fair. I get infuriated sometimes when I die, but usually the death was something like "Well, that'll teach me to try to check around corners," or "Damn, that guy with me just ran off a cliff hidden by the camera going for that chest. Better make sure I watch my footing." I found Demon's Souls to be WAY better just because the co-op was more easily done, but the games are very beautiful, very atmospheric, the narrative is told in a very intriguing and quiet way, and like I said, they're very very fair.

It doesn't feel fair at first, but I think the Souls approach to difficulty is less "Ramp up slowly, walk before you run," and more "THAT'S RIGHT ************, YOU BETTER WATCH THE FUCK OUT." Then you watch out and it's like "Great job, here's a sword." Or you don't and it's like "WHAT DID I SAY!?" I never found expertise to be what Souls was demanding, but caution and awareness. Most games lean way more towards power fantasy than the Souls series does. In Souls, the feeling is more "The world is fucked up and grueling, but with thoughtfulness and will, you can be great!" Your usual power fantasy gameplay is usually telling you "You're great! Go get them! Uh oh, that one looks tough! Ah, you got it, brotagonist!"

Plus, fuck man, that gothic theme (in terms of architecture and soundtrack). Incredible! Haven't heard such good music since Infinite Undiscovery (I <3 Motoi Sakuraba).