I liked Star Wars:TFA but....characterization

[FirstNameLastName]

I'm glad someone brought up the Max Landis's argument about Rey being a Mary Sue... I don't think she is, and I think he is misapplying the term. She is no different from Luke Skywalker or Harry Potter or any other fantasy/sci-fi protagonist who is somehow simultaneously an everyman normal guy yet also the center of the Universe and capable of loads of amazing things. If you were to put any of these characters into a Mary Sue identifying checklist they would come out with a high score, but they are still not Mary Sues. They are not what that term implies - a Mary Sue is a badly written, indulgent author insertion character produced by amateurs who want to be the center of someone else's story. James Bond is an indulgent, but not in someone else's adventure. Harry Potter is unnaturally gifted and important, but the writing is good enough to acknowledge that he isn't the be-all-end-all, and more importantly he doesn't want to be.

Appeals to definitions don't really work here since the term Mary Sue is somewhat ill defined. What you've just said is simply one of the different definitions that get used, and since so many are using it this way then it seems pretty apparent that this is far from a niche usage.

 

[maninahat]

I'm glad someone brought up the Max Landis's argument about Rey being a Mary Sue... I don't think she is, and I think he is misapplying the term. She is no different from Luke Skywalker or Harry Potter or any other fantasy/sci-fi protagonist who is somehow simultaneously an everyman normal guy yet also the center of the Universe and capable of loads of amazing things. If you were to put any of these characters into a Mary Sue identifying checklist they would come out with a high score, but they are still not Mary Sues. They are not what that term implies - a Mary Sue is a badly written, indulgent author insertion character produced by amateurs who want to be the center of someone else's story. James Bond is an indulgent, but not in someone else's adventure. Harry Potter is unnaturally gifted and important, but the writing is good enough to acknowledge that he isn't the be-all-end-all, and more importantly he doesn't want to be.

Appeals to definitions don't really work here since the term Mary Sue is somewhat ill defined. What you've just said is simply one of the different definitions that get used, and since so many are using it this way then it seems pretty apparent that this is far from a niche usage.

What you say is true, but then the term becomes useless once it has been applied to something like every main character in every story. Max Landis is trying to use it in a disparaging sense here, yet what he is criticizing is the standard for most protagonists...and I don't think he thinks those are all Mary Sues.

 

[minkus_draconus]

http://imgur.com/gallery/7EhqwbF

Sums up the arguments here, settles them better than here, and has a voting system to show just how crazy and fringe some here are.

enjoy it.

One of the sub posts there gives an excellent reason why Ren lost the fight (besides being emotionally messed up and having been shot in the gut with the "FU cannon") IMO.

"He was also low on conditioner."

His dress was really lovely though, very hippy without being too broad.

#Fabulous

When he first took off his helmet I had two thoughts.
1. What is Snape doing here?
2. What lovely locks! (see Pixar movie Brave where the suitors are being introduced)