He just kinda goes around blaming the hero for the bad things that happen. It's never really explained who he is (okay, they kinda did, but it was stupid and you know it) or why he does what he does.
I need an example of a badly written antagonist...
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He just kinda goes around blaming the hero for the bad things that happen. It's never really explained who he is (okay, they kinda did, but it was stupid and you know it) or why he does what he does.
He's also the protagonist.Harry Mason said:Alex Mercer from Prototype.
"What?! Someone gave me awesome superpowers? MUST DESTROY MILLIONS OF INNOCENT HUMAN LIVES!"
*gets in tank and begins crushing old ladies*
Seriously. He sucks.
It also appears that you do not know what happens in the game.
Just imagine Barry Pepper eating an old lady... It might be awesome, but he still doesn't have proper motivation to do so...mazzjammin22 said:
Isn't he evil because he was twisted by the power of Mordor and the rings?Pompey71 said:
OT, I'd say those villains that get the "I want money/world domination/end life cause I'm a *****." For this, see any villain from any Disney channel original movie ever created. Also, I'm kinda blanking, but the villain from Get Smart had the motivation of "Get money, screw obvious consequences." Also, that scientist woman from Dead Space 1. Trying to avoid spoilers, and she probably wouldn't be considered a villain, but she was against you, the protagonist, and her reasons for this was as low brow and poorly written as possible.
Sorry for lack of names, I forget my own name sometimes.
Yeah, I guess. By the way, that photo is perfect for this string of posts. It's sort of like a "Wait...what?" look.Harry Mason said:Just imagine Barry Pepper eating an old lady... It might be awesome, but he still doesn't have proper motivation to do so...mazzjammin22 said:
Most Final Fantasies.
Most Japanese stories period, be they anime, games, or otherwise. Especially the popular stuff that everyone claims is good (Eva, etc.).
Most Japanese stories period, be they anime, games, or otherwise. Especially the popular stuff that everyone claims is good (Eva, etc.).
I played Prototype (sorry, [Prototype]) all the way through multiple times, and I never found a single good reason for him to be acting like such a dick. There's angry anti-hero, and then there's psychotic mass murderer...DarkRyter said:
Basically anyone who is evil for the sake of being evil and is more of a plot device than an actual relatable character.
Yeah... he looks like he's watching someone eat an old lady from far away. "Wait... What? Eeew!"mazzjammin22 said:Yeah, I guess. By the way, that photo is perfect for this string of posts. It's sort of like a "Wait...what?" look.Harry Mason said:Just imagine Barry Pepper eating an old lady... It might be awesome, but he still doesn't have proper motivation to do so...mazzjammin22 said:
Yeah, here is a case where instead of a "good" villain, we have just a programmed dick.
You can have villains like The Joker from Batman the Animated Series and the comics who don't have any real motivations for the crimes they commit, , but are still good villains if they are still smart/human. Hell, having a villain lie about his motivations makes him an excellent villain (Dark Knight Joker). The ideal antagonist must actually present a challenge to the protagonist, whether a simple physical challenge of being difficult to beat, a tactical challenge, or even an ethical challenge (these are the most fun!) But bad villains... basically anyone whose goal is only, unchangingly "kill that guy" with no motivation, who shows little to no thought, and has almost no emotional expression, especially if they seem more like an obstacle than a threat.
Leaders in Civ games are bad antagonists (they usually have no motivations when they attack, and once they are your enemies, its very hard to change them), versus Alpha Centauri where they either see you as supplying their enemies, or having tech they want, or what have you, and are willing to back down.
Gandhi from Civ IV:"We are a peaceful theocracy that places coexistance above all things... wait, you're not someone we trade with! DIE!!!"
Lady Deidre from Alpha Centauri:"We are children of the planet, and stand for coexistance with it. You use technologies that actively damage the environment. Either become more environmentally friendly, or die!"
And both are made by the same guy!
"I'm gonna kill you! Look at how big a walking, quivering phallus I am!"CM156 said:
"I have all this I could sell at exorbitant rates to third-world countries currently embargoed from OPEC, fueling their rainforest-logging, or shark-fin fishing, or what have you. This would make it so I could get rich and buy more things I like AND I could hurt the environment more... or I could just dump it, because I don't care. Call me Captain Wang Mother Nature, and behold my phallusy!"jumb said:
You can have villains like The Joker from Batman the Animated Series and the comics who don't have any real motivations for the crimes they commit, , but are still good villains if they are still smart/human. Hell, having a villain lie about his motivations makes him an excellent villain (Dark Knight Joker). The ideal antagonist must actually present a challenge to the protagonist, whether a simple physical challenge of being difficult to beat, a tactical challenge, or even an ethical challenge (these are the most fun!) But bad villains... basically anyone whose goal is only, unchangingly "kill that guy" with no motivation, who shows little to no thought, and has almost no emotional expression, especially if they seem more like an obstacle than a threat.
Leaders in Civ games are bad antagonists (they usually have no motivations when they attack, and once they are your enemies, its very hard to change them), versus Alpha Centauri where they either see you as supplying their enemies, or having tech they want, or what have you, and are willing to back down.
Gandhi from Civ IV:"We are a peaceful theocracy that places coexistance above all things... wait, you're not someone we trade with! DIE!!!"
Lady Deidre from Alpha Centauri:"We are children of the planet, and stand for coexistance with it. You use technologies that actively damage the environment. Either become more environmentally friendly, or die!"
And both are made by the same guy!
ANTAGONIST!!! God I couldn't think of the word during my Final this morning...
I can't think of any poorly written villains, I only really read quality books, same with games and movies but...
The Deadric Princes from The Elder Scrolls are pretty motivation-less, they can't comprehend good or evil and just do what ever they want on a whim, some of them at least. It's worth looking into.
-EDIT- There's also Perry smith of "In cold blood" infamy, while there was motive to rob the Clutters, there wasn't much of a reason to kill them, which he intended to do even before the robbery.
I can't think of any poorly written villains, I only really read quality books, same with games and movies but...
The Deadric Princes from The Elder Scrolls are pretty motivation-less, they can't comprehend good or evil and just do what ever they want on a whim, some of them at least. It's worth looking into.
-EDIT- There's also Perry smith of "In cold blood" infamy, while there was motive to rob the Clutters, there wasn't much of a reason to kill them, which he intended to do even before the robbery.
Remember that he is the physical embodiment of the blacklight virus that built itself upon the genetic makeup of the real Alex Mercer.Harry Mason said:
Considering his(its) nature as a biological weapon, whose base personality is built on the asshole who released the virus out of petty revenge, his motivation is rather clear.
Any antagonist that is just evil with no objective aside from being as evil as possible. For instance, the cosmic monstrosities from Fable 3. What do they stand to gain by killing everyone? Unknowable evil is creepy and all but it's crappy writing. A good antagonist is someone who it is possible to sympathize with but still must be defeated, kinda like Saren once you get to know his motives. While I'm on ME, I would like to say that the reapers are dangerously close to the evil for no other reason than someone had to be the bad guy trope. However, they seem to have some motive, just sovereign doesn't think we are even capable of understanding.
Who, Autumn and Eden? Eden wanted to "purify" the wasteland by wiping out all semi-mutated life and Autumn wanted to do the same and also wanted to see the Enclave become the power it was prior to the Oil Rig being nuked. They both believed that all mutated life had to be destroyed to secure the future for humanity and both believed they were acting for the greater good, like most Fallout Villains (Master, Richardson and even Caeser). Seriously though, what is it with bad guys in Fallout 1/2 keeping something that can level a city in their base conveniently for the player to blow it up? You guys say Fallout 3 had bad writing why the fuck did the main bad guys have nukes to be detonated by the stealthy characters in the first place? The Master only had 2 guards for his nuke for fuck sake!Pandabearparade said:
If your talking about Tenpenny and Burke, well Tenpenny is an eccentric nut living isolated in a tower who has Burke do his bidding, which seems to be twisted by Burke to suit his evil ends. Burke uses Tenpenny to fuel his goals, which the player isn't meant to find out, part of his mysterious nature I suppose. Could have done much better for Burke.
Back on topic, Frank Horrigan. He was a cruel bastard before, got turned into a mutant and instead of capping him they put him in power-armor that drip-feeds him roids, along with a gatling plasma gun and a comicly huge knife he can pull out of his ass at whim. No real motivation other than being a psychopathic deathmachine. In fact they desribe him as a "genetically engineered cyborg psycho total homicidal maniac".