If mutants became real, which side would you be on?

senordesol

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GamerMage said:
generals3 said:
000Ronald said:
What I have a problem with is the idea that there is NO WAY that people with inherent, inborn differences can live together peacefully.
Who ever said that? I'm sorry but you're distorting my argument. You've taken one specific type of difference and than extent to "all differences", as if i ever said anything about "differences" in general. We're talking about people with special abilities that make them much more powerful than your average human being (and by extent more dangerous). A person with a mental deficiency is also inherently different but did anything imply i'd want to "neutralize" them? No. That's because they aren't a danger to society. (So you wouldn't even TRY to treat them properly? they're still human,dude. If you treat them terribly, they'll eventually go "To Heck with this. If they hate me so much, then I'll give them a reason to fear me." In short, if you treat them like they're people, they'll be more likely to follow you. Sense, dude. Do you have it? )

This isn't about them being "different" (and i want to stress i find it objectionable you tried to make it about "differences"), it's about them being "powerful" and thus dangerous.
Ok, first of all, I'M Austistic (I.E. A mental condition). So, if it isn't a threat, you don't have a problem. What if it's a child? Would you still kill it? How would you explain to the child's mother, why some general jerk shows up on her front lawn and shot her child? Explain THAT to me. Pro-Mutant. The world has enough discrimination and hate as it is. Lord knows we don't need more.
What does it being a child have to do with it? If it can nuke a city on whim -on accident even-; it's a danger to humanity.

It'd be tough to explain to a mother why you had to kill her child.
It'd be even tougher to explain to a million mothers that their children are dead because you knew about a threat and did nothing.
 

generals3

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GamerMage said:
(So you wouldn't even TRY to treat them properly? they're still human,dude. If you treat them terribly, they'll eventually go "To Heck with this. If they hate me so much, then I'll give them a reason to fear me." In short, if you treat them like they're people, they'll be more likely to follow you. Sense, dude. Do you have it? )
That's why i'd be devious about it and wouldn't let them suspect anything until I can strike one huge blow.

And why i wouldn't even try? Because treating people "properly" or, to be more precise, as "humans" has never ensured people don't do bad/crazy shit. And since in the case of mutants bad/crazy shit can easily cost the lives of way too many people I'd rather not wait until it's too late.

So, if it isn't a threat, you don't have a problem. What if it's a child? Would you still kill it? How would you explain to the child's mother, why some general jerk shows up on her front lawn and shot her child? Explain THAT to me. Pro-Mutant. The world has enough discrimination and hate as it is. Lord knows we don't need more.
A child may not be as much of a threat (although i suspect a child with mutant powers is much more likely to kill people accidentally because children are not well known for being capable of controlling themselves) but they will eventually grow to become a threat. Why wait until it's too late?

And no amount of already existing discrimination changes anything about the potential danger of people with super human powers.
 

Something Amyss

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JoJo said:
If treating them like any other person is 'pro-mutant', I guess it is. I haven't read or watched much X-men, so I don't know the setting that well :-/
Within this context, "pro-" anything is generally treating them like anyone else.
 

Evil Smurf

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I'm pro mutant, see X-Men is a giant metaphor for discrimination. I'm not a dickbutt, I don't discriminate.
 

grey_space

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Well, considering my avatar, I'm going with pro mutant.

We all have the capabilities as thinking individuals to be the most despicable of monsters in real life.

Most of us don't.

Some of us do though.

That shouldn't give me the right to kill everyone I see when I'm walking down the street on the off chance that they are a serial killer.

That would make me a serial killer, and would turn me into the monster I was potentially attempting to defend myself against.

People who do bad things should be stopped. People who may possibly do bad things should be left alone until they do. If they do.

I really don't see how this is complicated.

But good thread though.
 

Saucycarpdog

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William Ossiss said:
Saucycarpdog said:
When I say mutants, I mean the ones from x-men. People with extraordinary powers.
So... Basically you're asking who'd be racist? Only it wouldn't be about race. It'd be about species. You know that many people see Xmen as an allegory for racial tolerance, right?
I know that X-men was created to show racial prejudices in a fictitious, superhero fashion. Except that this question is not meant to be racist, but question the how much equality humans are willing to give. Some mutants can roast entire armies and move entire cities. Is that even human? Should we give equal rights to such dangerous individuals?
 

White Lightning

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Depends, do I have mutant powers? If yes that I'm on their side. If not screw em. I mean seriously I'd be pretty jealous and probably hate them because I'm stuck being a chump without awesome powers.
 

Silvanus

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Saucycarpdog said:
I know that X-men was created to show racial prejudices in a fictitious, superhero fashion. Except that this question is not meant to be racist, but question the how much equality humans are willing to give. Some mutants can roast entire armies and move entire cities. Is that even human? Should we give equal rights to such dangerous individuals?
Some humans have those abilities, you know.

TheKasp said:
I would be for 'registration of powers'. They would have all the same rights as anyone else but, like people with dealdy weapons, they need to register their power to proper authorities.
Would you trust the human authorities to refrain from misusing such a database? It would leave mutants tremendously vulnerable.
 

EternallyBored

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Silvanus said:
Saucycarpdog said:
I know that X-men was created to show racial prejudices in a fictitious, superhero fashion. Except that this question is not meant to be racist, but question the how much equality humans are willing to give. Some mutants can roast entire armies and move entire cities. Is that even human? Should we give equal rights to such dangerous individuals?
Some humans have those abilities, you know.
Humans only have those abilities through working with other humans, the President of the U.S. can authorize the nuking of a city, but only through convincing the chain of command to follow that order, and if the President goes crazy he can still be stopped fairly easily through physical force or a bullet to the head. Even spectacularly armed, a single person is still no real match against a large group of other humans, a leader may be able to weild the power and technology of an entire country, but he has to convince enough people to enforce his rulings to do so, and in the end even histories strongest leaders are still as vulnerable as any other human in a purely physical sense.

The higher level mutants in Marvel don't have that restriction, against normal human law enforcement and even the military, there's basically no way to stop them, to a high level mutant, laws are just a suggestion and the rest of society would need to depend entirely on every individual mutant's sense of morality to function properly. The government derives a large part of its power from the ability to use force to enforce the laws it sets down, they also depend on the ability to gather enough support from the majority to not rebel against its edicts.

High level mutants basically destroy both of these tenets, the government loses the option of force, so any high level rogue mutant could easily demolish a major metropolitan area before the proper authorities would even have the chance to react.

In the case of mutants from Marvel, it likely won't matter what the normal humans think because you only need a couple dozen mutants at Magneto's, Jean Grey's, or xavier's level and any government like what we know today will cease to exist. The most likely scenario is that the world would be divided up into feudalistic forms of government with the high power mutants ruling over humanity and using those less powerful than them to enforce their rulings. The only reason that normal government similar to our world even exists in the Marvel universe is because of authorial fiat that demands the world resemble ours as much as possible except with superheroes, aliens, and magic users running around. There's no way in hell our government wouldn't collapse like a house of cards if actual high level Marvel mutants started showing up.

TheKasp said:
I would be for 'registration of powers'. They would have all the same rights as anyone else but, like people with dealdy weapons, they need to register their power to proper authorities.
Would you trust the human authorities to refrain from misusing such a database? It would leave mutants tremendously vulnerable.
And the opposite leaves the unpowered humans tremendously vulnerable, there likely is no clean solution that works perfectly. With mutant registration you are exposing the mutants to government abuse, without it, you are exposing basically everyone else to forms of abuse that the government will no longer be able to stop, or even mitigate. The cops aren't going to be able to effectively track or catch a serial killer that uses his mind control powers to make people kill themselves, even the military isn't going to be able to stop a high power mutant hiding amongst the population that just snaps one day.

You are right, I wouldn't entirely trust the human authorities not to abuse such information, but the opposite case involves me trusting that any mutant with mass mind control or nuclear explosion powers isn't going to decide to abuse the fact that they can pass anonymously amongst the populace. Both sides are going to abuse any trust given to them, unlike in reality, a top class mutant abusing that trust ends up with a city disappearing or the entire leading branch of the government secretly mind controlled to their whim.
 

Dalisclock

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Pro-Registration. Not to mention find a way to deal with the mutants who, among other things I've seen in the films...Kill people, brainwash people, kidnap government officials, declare war against the government(Storm crashing those military Jets could be considered a number of things, all illegal), and try kill all humans. And they need to be held accountable, just like everyone else is.

So, if you have the power to melt a tank with your eyes or brainwash someone with your mind, damn right you need to be kept under supervision. Your body is a deadly weapon and last thing everyone else needs is you to decide to go on a killing spree.
 

senordesol

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GamerMage said:
No, it would be even tougher to explain that despite what the kid can do, he still a child. You would be killing a kid. Because of what he/she MIGHT do. That doesn't sound paranoid to you? I'm not so cynical or paranoid to give up on someone so easily. Pro Mutant. Give them a chance, good sir. Treat them like they're people and not walking weapons. Powers or no, they're still (for the most part) people. With attitudes like this, it's no wonder Magneto hates humans.
Again, what does s/he being a child have to do with anything and how is it paranoid?

A mutant like Scott Summers could kill EVERYONE in his school, his neighborhood, his whole city; just by LOOKING AT THEM. This is a simple fact, not paranoia. He does need any special tools or training. No series of unlikely events have to converge. All he has to do is LOOK at somebody.

Please explain to me how that is not dangerous -DEVASTATING, even- to the human race. Please explain to me how, by every definition of the word, that is NOT a walking weapon.
 

senordesol

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GamerMage said:
senordesol said:
GamerMage said:
No, it would be even tougher to explain that despite what the kid can do, he still a child. You would be killing a kid. Because of what he/she MIGHT do. That doesn't sound paranoid to you? I'm not so cynical or paranoid to give up on someone so easily. Pro Mutant. Give them a chance, good sir. Treat them like they're people and not walking weapons. Powers or no, they're still (for the most part) people. With attitudes like this, it's no wonder Magneto hates humans.
Again, what does s/he being a child have to do with anything and how is it paranoid?

A mutant like Scott Summers could kill EVERYONE in his school, his neighborhood, his whole city; just by LOOKING AT THEM. This is a simple fact, not paranoia. He does need any special tools or training. No series of unlikely events have to converge. All he has to do is LOOK at somebody.

Please explain to me how that is not dangerous -DEVASTATING, even- to the human race. Please explain to me how, by every definition of the word, that is NOT a walking weapon.
Actually, it's established that he uses a special Ruby Quartz Visor to keep his powers in check. It keeps him from killing people just by looking at them. Also, because you're killing a child based on a assumption of what MIGHT happen, and not even considering any other outcomes.
Yes...he gets a specially designed piece of equipment to *STOP* him from killing people. We have to invent whole new technologies just to KEEP these walking nukes in check (assuming we even have the capability to do it at all).

It IS all based on assumption on what they *might* do, yes. I freely admit that, and subsequently dismiss it as totally irrelevant. Neither a SINGLE MAN nor CHILD is capable of slaughtering thousands without special equipment, training, or following --let alone on accident. Yes, every child born could grow up to be the next Hitler, mass murderer or serial killer but there are systems in place to limit the damage they'd be able to cause and they will be no more capable than any single human can be.

What we're talking here are individuals who can kill people just by being around them. Regular humans can't do that...

...actually, now that I think about it, under certain circumstances, YES THEY CAN!

Plague carriers can do that --people who carry virulent deadly diseases can do that.

In such circumstances, man or child, we quarantine them until they're not a threat...and if a breach is likely to occur, man or child, they will be destroyed without compunction. It's unfortunate that they have to die, but for the good of everyone else, they *have* to die!

Just so, if someone is able to kill everyone around them just by being in their mere presence, they *have* to be quarantined at least and destroyed if they can't be contained.