Infinity Ward Not Borrowing Ideas from Treyarch for Modern Warfare 3

[Treblaine]

Why?

After MW2's bullshit storyline, Dedicated Server betrayal, the blatantly exploitative No Russian level and just how god-damn unbalanced MW2's multiplayer was would you not value infinity Ward even lower? Especially with all the key talent leaving (west/Zampella). Or do you? Your omission is poignant.

Sure, COD3 was awful - in every way - but WaW had a good story and Black ops multiplayer they fixed a lot of the long-standing bullshit.

COD4 generally hasn't been good since COD4 and hasn't even been tolerable since World at War but I'd say all things considered Treyarch is now the lesser evil.

Because I liked the game that Infinity Ward produced more than Treyarch's CoD: Black Ops and CoD: World at War. I thought the Multiplayer was fairly balanced in Modern Warfare 2, and that the story was better than I had expected out of a First Person Shooter. I generally had more fun playing through Modern Warfare 2 than I did playing through Black Ops, and also World at War. Although I'm not sure what the "Dedicated Server betrayal" was/is, I have a feeling that it has to do with PC gaming and therefor I feel that I should state that I am a console gamer.

Hmm, the bit in bold? I assume you mean good story "for a generic military FPS" because you seem to be dismissing a lot of REALLY GOOD games stories that are FPS games:
-Half Life 2
-Bioshock 1 & 2
-Portal 1 & 2
-FEAR 1 & 2
-Halo series
-Fallout 3+
-Elder Scrolls: Oblivion, etc
-STALKER series

and COD4 was WAY better, and that's in precisely the same genre from the same developer

I'm in the same boat as monoochrom on the multiplayer unbalanced thing. While it's true that Black ops was quite boring at least it was balanced.

 

[Treblaine]

Sure, COD3 was awful - in every way

What? I found that to be the best of the entire series after CoD1.

Maybe I'm judging it too harshly compared to recent games. I bought a copy recently for £12 ($20, so no pocket change) and was really annoyed at how it played compared to more recent games. It just seemed to do EVERYTHING wrong.

I wouldn't put it on the same level as COD1 nor COD2 but I played those on PC and understandably am forced to play COD3 on 360.

Then again, I played Half Life 2 and Doom 3 on an ORIGINAL Xbox about the same time and quite enjoyed them even though they are older than COD3 and I had in comparison to my PC experience.

Yeah, Treyarch has benefited a LOT building on the shared work of infinity Ward team, IW could do with taking on the innovations that Treyarch made.

 

[Hachura]

I love how while DICE are pumping out fantastic-looking gameplay and trailer footage for BF3, Infinity Ward are still talking about trivial little things like "our game runs at 60fps lols!" and "we're not stealing from Treyarch who stole from us!".

I could give a shit.

 

[xXHaytonLloyd23Xx]

Sure, by all means ignore everything that Treyarch did with Black Ops, we wouldn't want anything new being added, now would we?

Say what you will, I realize that BO was terrible optimized for PC, that it has it's fair share of bad mechanics and what not. BUT they atleast tried adding upon the Idea. I for one love the concept of the Camera Spike, the Decoy and I also like the concept of CoDPoints. THAT was atleast TRYING to do something new. All I hear Bowling saying here is ''Yeah, MW3 is totally going to be MW2 with a few different Guns...and I thought I'd throw in that we listen to the Fans (not really) but decided that once more leaving out dedicated Servers would be the better idea for some reason...mostly because we don't give 2 Shits about the PC Version and therefore wouldn't want to have any extra Work. Buy our Game!''

No thank you Rob, only chance you're getting here for me to buy the Game is if by some strange stroke of luck I have Money to light Cigars with by November...that isn't going to happen. So, in other words: Activision, please just let the Series die, oh, and tell Rob Bowling, Bobby Kotick and WhatshisfaceMarketingGuyorWhatever to STFU, nobody likes any of you.

You sir are a true american hero and an inspiration/role model for dying british orphans country wide

 

[xXHaytonLloyd23Xx]

I solemnly swear to never buy a CoD game that is produced by Treyarch, I will however shell out for the Infinity Ward games. I believe that they are better overall than their counterpart.

what the fuck is wrong with you? honestly can you say that IW games are better? Treyarch COD games (starting with WAW)-Zombies, stories that arnt boring as hell, gore, great multiplayer design. Now Black ops-Story that (although can be pretty confusing) is fresh and interesting (also your guy actually talks instead being a silent twat all the time), new and interesting zombie maps, more gore, COD points, and RCXD's (haters gonna hate). Infinity Ward has none of that. In fact the only 2 characters i gave a damn about, were Soap(from cod 4) and ghost.

 

[xXHaytonLloyd23Xx]

Of course, not everything that Treyarch has done for - or to - the Call of Duty brand has been positive: Black Ops received a great deal of criticism for multiplayer problems on the PC and PS3.

At least Black Ops on PC had dedicated servers.

Sorry, that simple little thing made Black Ops SOOOOO much better than Modern Warfare 2.

In fact I've heard no bitching about the PC version of Black ops, and after playing over 127 hours I haven't seen any significant problems that haven't been around since Cod4 era.

In fact Treyarch as done a lot of good for CoD online:
-got rid of the basically mandatory perk: Stopping power
-integrated game playback feature
-brought back CoD4 favourites (Skorpion, M60)
-no weapon glitches (MW2 had loads of weapon glitches like PERMANENTLY misaligned sights or non-functional suppressors)
-No commando-lunge
-less overpowered killstreaks
-no more killstreak chaining
-more interesting setting of Cold War era than generic modern-combat era

If Infinity Ward refuse to recognise this and go back to Modern Warfare 2's bullshit then I really won't bother.

I bought Black Ops to show solidarity and appreciation for a big publisher realising that Multiplayer on PC deserves Dedicated Servers. But if Infinity Ward decides MW3 doesn't need Dedicated Servers... well fuck that. The game ain't worth more than $20 to me then, I'd buy it a year later on sale... maybe.

This a thousand times over

 

[Treblaine]

Gotta love the CoD hate in this thread already. The people that say the game is the same every year are likely the people that don't play it.

Is that so? 55 hours played in MW2, 28 hours in Black Ops. Is that not enough to judge if you love it or hate it? Or do you have to spend 100+ hours in a game your dislike before you're allowed to say it's a bad game?

Yeah. Well for one you can't even try all the weapons, perks and kill-streaks till you have played for hours and hours and hours. So you can't say if the whole game is crap as maybe all the cools weapons are several hours of gameplay away... always promising more.

COD online is a Skinner box, it teases you but it fails to truly satisfy.

It can soak up a lot of time egging you on to play more yet winning or losing doesn't really matter, trying to get a feeling of accomplishment is just too transient. The game has good core mechanics but there is so little variety. You CRAVE a change, you get excited by a new gun that functions almost indistinguishably from the others but it's artificial excitement.

 

[MiracleOfSound]

what the fuck is wrong with you? honestly can you say that IW games are better? Treyarch COD games

My problem with Treyarch is that they are not very good at coding. The games are buggy and the netcode is atrocious.

I have so many clips where I kill dudes by missing and shooting metres to the left or right of them... it's a disgrace. IW are much better at coding.

 

[xXHaytonLloyd23Xx]

what the fuck is wrong with you? honestly can you say that IW games are better? Treyarch COD games

My problem with Treyarch is that they are not very good at coding. The games are buggy and the netcode is atrocious.

I have so many clips where I kill dudes by missing and shooting metres to the left or right of them... it's a disgrace. IW are much better at coding.

Ok, i do agree that IW does handle coding much much better than treyarch (many a ragequit have happend because of this) But that dosn't make them the superior developer. Treyarch might not be the brightest bulb in the box, but by god are they trying haha

 

[MiracleOfSound]

Great.. does this mean we get to deal with the annoying fucking grind-quests that MW2 had for experience and thus perks that didn't absolutely blow donkey balls? If there's one thing BO got right it was the use of separate currency to buy your perks.

What? Black Ops's perk system is terrible dude - having to go into Demolition and grind on bomb plants, or get a bunch of Nova gas kills to unlock a Pro Perk... it's awful.

 

[MiracleOfSound]

Ok, i do agree that IW does handle coding much much better than treyarch (many a ragequit have happend because of this) But that dosn't make them the superior developer. Treyarch might not be the brightest bulb in the box, but by god are they trying haha

I think they tried hard to balance Blops at the beginning, but then the Map Pack greed took over and we're stuck with shitty hit detection, knives that kill you by hitting the air 5 feet behind you, Ghost campers slowing the game to a crawl and the most broken perk ever - Second Chance.

 

[THEoriginalBRIEN]

Combine Treyarch's ability to make their games significantly different than the last and Infinity Ward's ability to create competent targeting and respawn systems and you'd have one hell of a decent developer.

 

[THEoriginalBRIEN]

Of course, not everything that Treyarch has done for - or to - the Call of Duty brand has been positive: Black Ops received a great deal of criticism for multiplayer problems on the PC and PS3.

At least Black Ops on PC had dedicated servers.

Sorry, that simple little thing made Black Ops SOOOOO much better than Modern Warfare 2.

In fact I've heard no bitching about the PC version of Black ops, and after playing over 127 hours I haven't seen any significant problems that haven't been around since Cod4 era.

In fact Treyarch as done a lot of good for CoD online:
-got rid of the basically mandatory perk: Stopping power
-integrated game playback feature
-brought back CoD4 favourites (Skorpion, M60)
-no weapon glitches (MW2 had loads of weapon glitches like PERMANENTLY misaligned sights or non-functional suppressors)
-No commando-lunge
-less overpowered killstreaks
-no more killstreak chaining
-more interesting setting of Cold War era than generic modern-combat era

If Infinity Ward refuse to recognise this and go back to Modern Warfare 2's bullshit then I really won't bother.

I bought Black Ops to show solidarity and appreciation for a big publisher realising that Multiplayer on PC deserves Dedicated Servers. But if Infinity Ward decides MW3 doesn't need Dedicated Servers... well fuck that. The game ain't worth more than $20 to me then, I'd buy it a year later on sale... maybe.

This a thousand times over

-I play fine without Stopping Power
-Commando lunge is better that having a knife that doesn't recognize a direct hit half the time.
-Nothing about the BO maps make them anything that MW2 isn't. The only things that make it feel even remotely Cold War are the flamethrower and Infrared attachments which are both useless.

Dedicated servers aside, I think Black Ops has just many flaws as it has improvements.

 

[HaloHappy]

So you're basically going ignore anything Treyarch did better than you; like not letting Killstreaks count towards other Killstreaks, Shotguns as primaries etc. because you don't want to learn anything.

You idiots.

Excuse me but, shotguns as a primary? That was a stupid idea! Who in their right mind would want to go in with a shotgun and pistol/rocket/crossbow/balistic knife? The point is to carry a gun for mid-long range and keep a shotgun in your pocket for close quarters work. I'll agree with you on the killstreaks part, but each franchise has their weaknesses, and Treyarch's was making shotguns a primary.

 

[Vakz]

Yeah. Well for one you can't even try all the weapons, perks and kill-streaks till you have played for hours and hours and hours. So you can't say if the whole game is crap as maybe all the cools weapons are several hours of gameplay away... always promising more.

But seriously, if a game stays bad for more than a whole day of in-game time, can really a few more weapons suddenly make the game great? Have you honestly played every single game you disliked for more than 24 hours before deciding that it was indeed bad? How can one justify a game being bad for so many hours, and still trying to call it a good game?

 

[Treblaine]

what the fuck is wrong with you? honestly can you say that IW games are better? Treyarch COD games

My problem with Treyarch is that they are not very good at coding. The games are buggy and the netcode is atrocious.

I have so many clips where I kill dudes by missing and shooting metres to the left or right of them... it's a disgrace. IW are much better at coding.

Although that is a coding "problem" that is something inherent and the solution is even worse.

the main problem is LAG!

Traditionally (mainly PC) lag meant exactly that, you shot them yet they would not be damaged till the lag reaches them. That's not a problem on PC with dedicated servers ensuring low lag, but on console multiplayer where they try to have user-hosted games the lag is too high so they have to HIDE it.

The problem is trying to hide this lag through various tricks can cause glitches IF THE LAG IS TOO HIGH!

I have played Black ops on PC, and always choosing 50ms servers I haven't found these glitches to spite how in every other way the game is poorly coded i.e. inefficient graphics rendering, RAM hog and so on.

The solution is dedicated servers. But will Activision EVER do that for consoles? Not for free, or unless they are really REALLY desperate.

 

[Paragon Fury]

So you're basically going ignore anything Treyarch did better than you; like not letting Killstreaks count towards other Killstreaks, Shotguns as primaries etc. because you don't want to learn anything.

You idiots.

Excuse me but, shotguns as a primary? That was a stupid idea! Who in their right mind would want to go in with a shotgun and pistol/rocket/crossbow/balistic knife? The point is to carry a gun for mid-long range and keep a shotgun in your pocket for close quarters work. I'll agree with you on the killstreaks part, but each franchise has their weaknesses, and Treyarch's was making shotguns a primary.

SPAS-12.

1887s Pre-Second Nerf.

The fact that Shotguns in Black Ops SUCK BALLS, even though they are Primaries.

Shotguns should allowed to be as powerful as they are in MW2, but they should be Primaries, not Secondaries.

 

[Treblaine]

Yeah. Well for one you can't even try all the weapons, perks and kill-streaks till you have played for hours and hours and hours. So you can't say if the whole game is crap as maybe all the cools weapons are several hours of gameplay away... always promising more.

But seriously, if a game stays bad for more than a whole day of in-game time, can really a few more weapons suddenly make the game great? Have you honestly played every single game you disliked for more than 24 hours before deciding that it was indeed bad? How can one justify a game being bad for so many hours, and still trying to call it a good game?

The thing is it always teases more. It draws you in but no pay off.

I have played SOOO many hours of Black ops yet I honestly don't give a crap about the game.

It's not "bad", it's just not "good" either. It is - in a word - unsatisfying.

There are fleeting moments of excitement but it is in a sea of frustration on grinding, every encounter is the same damn way with guns that are so god damn similar. I was so glad when I quit and went back to TF2, a game full of REALLY different guns and enemy types.

 

[HaloHappy]

Thank God for this, I like both games, but each has their flaws, Black Ops more than MW2. In MW2 they need to fix (and have) fix the infinite noob tube, the people running around with tac-knife and only using that, and the Demolition spawn campers. Black Ops has the problem of damage and hit spots, the ever infamous "Magic bullet", and zombies. No matter how much you try to justify it, Left 4 Dead and Dead Rising 2 will always be infinitely better.

On the single player side, at least with Infinty Ward I don't feel like a lone gunman (at least in MW1). In WaW I would have Reznov shouting his head off about sparing no one, yet he stands there and gets shot to the point of Swiss Cheese and not shooting back. Same with Black Ops, and there my teammates were running ahead and ditching me in the middle of fire fights as well.

Either way, I can't wait for MW3 and hope the new Infinity Ward fixes the main issues of MW2.

 

[Vakz]

The thing is it always teases more. It draws you in but no pay off.

I have played SOOO many hours of Black ops yet I honestly don't give a crap about the game.

Heh, you should start playing an MMO. Blizzard would LOVE to have you as a customer.