Is pre ordering is a terrible idea?

[Ragsnstitches]

Ive been thinking about pre ordering. Particularly with the sem-recent mass effect debacle. It all seems to stem from people complaining after pre ordering. I dont want this to descend into an arguement about mass effect so ill summarise my conclusions about pre ordering:

1. Youre getting something based entirely off PR and advertising - two things known to exhaggerate and distort the true quality of an item.

2. You might as well be purchasing a "mystery box" from a stranger on the basis that his last mystery box contained something good.

3. If you then complain that the mystery box contains something terrible, as they tend to do at times, youre entire point is undermined by the fact your PURCHASED the mystery box despite having very limited knowlegde of what was inside it.

4. It seems like an obvious company scheme to say "Let them buy item X before its true quality can be appraised and they realise they might not want it!"

Ive realised now that, other than for those who are very impatiant, pre ordering is a system designed pretty much to screw you over. This is why they offer bonuses if you DO pre order. Because youre taking a huge risk. No other industry would ask you to spend money on a promise of a product you have never seen. Pre ordering actively hurts the industry because it asks that fans feed a company blind to the quality of the product made.

It doesnt apply a strong enough pressure to publishers who dissapoint their fans. Why SHOULD they make the third installment in any series good? At all? Pre order revinue will give them nice earnings no matter what the quality is.

Basically i see no good reason to pre order. What do you think about pre ordering? Do you think as an industry we should scrap it?

Jesus you must absolutely hate kickstarters, considering:

1. The game isn't made, in fact, it's more then likely only just left the pre-production phase. No possible way to gleam any solid info about the finished product from this point.

2. It's promoted by the front man for the studio, ergo the most biased person you will meet within the industry (though likely the most honest in regards to intentions).

3. Their is potential for scams. It has happened with that "Myth" debacle. Fail safes and insightful browsers found this guy out, but it's only a matter of time before someone more dastardly cons a lot of people out of a lot of money:

Spoiler: Like Mr. John Videogames

 

[BiscuitTrouser]

Jesus you must absolutely hate kickstarters, considering:

1. The game isn't made, in fact, it's more then likely only just left the pre-production phase. No possible way to gleam any solid info about the finished product from this point.

2. It's promoted by the front man for the studio, ergo the most biased person you will meet within the industry (though likely the most honest in regards to intentions).

3. Their is potential for scams. It has happened with that "Myth" debacle. Fail safes and insightful browsers found this guy out, but it's only a matter of time before someone more dastardly cons a lot of people out of a lot of money:

Spoiler: Like Mr. John Videogames

I count kickstarter as a different box of chocolates. Kick starter is very open in what you are doing. You are NOT paying for a game. You are funding one. You are investing in a process and a return is promised with the reward system rather than an instant product. You are making an investment not based on how much you will pay for the game (some donate a LOT of money) you are donating because you want to invest in the project so it can become big.

Buying a game is different. You are buying something that is already big and expecting the product in return. An investor is different from a customer. An investor takes risks by default. An investor will pay money to see a project finished rather than to get the end product. I dont want to be treated like a risk taking investor when i buy something. In short i want to get what i pay for.

 

[Lunar Templar]

*shrugs*

i only preorder the very few games i want (which is pretty much EVERY game i buy >.>), but that's only 1-3 a year due to how picky i am about what is worth my dollar

 

[veloper]

Jesus you must absolutely hate kickstarters, considering:

1. The game isn't made, in fact, it's more then likely only just left the pre-production phase. No possible way to gleam any solid info about the finished product from this point.

2. It's promoted by the front man for the studio, ergo the most biased person you will meet within the industry (though likely the most honest in regards to intentions).

3. Their is potential for scams. It has happened with that "Myth" debacle. Fail safes and insightful browsers found this guy out, but it's only a matter of time before someone more dastardly cons a lot of people out of a lot of money:

Spoiler: Like Mr. John Videogames

I count kickstarter as a different box of chocolates. Kick starter is very open in what you are doing. You are NOT paying for a game. You are funding one. You are investing in a process and a return is promised with the reward system rather than an instant product. You are making an investment not based on how much you will pay for the game (some donate a LOT of money) you are donating because you want to invest in the project so it can become big.

Buying a game is different. You are buying something that is already big and expecting the product in return. An investor is different from a customer. An investor takes risks by default. An investor will pay money to see a project finished rather than to get the end product. I dont want to be treated like a risk taking investor when i buy something. In short i want to get what i pay for.

We're not really investing in games with Kickstarter.
What we're doing is paying for the expensive development, opposed to paying for the almost worthless disc as we do normally.
Buying games the traditional way is type of charity or fandom. You get something of little value for your real money, so the developers have a greater chancee to keep their jobs. The game is already been made and paid for, it's their next (unknown)project that hangs in the balance.

In a way, with Kickstarter you have a better idea what your hard earned money is going help to produce, than if you buy a game from a shop. That finished game is already been developed and paid for by the publisher, so now your GIVING money (the copy of the game isn't worth a dollar to produce) back to publisher and you don't really know what project they'll fund with it next.

We Kickstarter people are the nice guys, letting everyone play game X or Y at our expense; coming from that subset of the same useful fools who buy games new. Pirates are the smart ones. Let's not even talk about the ignorant used buyers.

Bottomline: kickstarter is better; boxed games are a thank-you charity, not a real product.

 

[TheSteeleStrap]

That's the risk you take when you buy anything. Maybe wait for a demo before you preorder.

 

[MercurySteam]

Allow me to point out some flaws:

You might as well be purchasing a "mystery box" from a stranger on the basis that his last mystery box contained something good.

Unless you're very stupid, I don't see why you would preorder a game you know nothing about. Preordering exists so you can secure a copy of a game you know you want well in advance. So unless you're very dumb, a mystery box shouldn't have anything to do with it.

If you then complain that the mystery box contains something terrible, as they tend to do at times, youre entire point is undermined by the fact your PURCHASED the mystery box despite having very limited knowlegde of what was inside it.

Again, why the hell would you preorder a game with little to no knowledge about it. The very idea moggles the bind. You can preorder a game up till the day before release so if that's not enough time to learn as much as possible about the game then I don't know what is. Even then, my local games store offers a 7 day return policy for new games so it's never really a gamble for me.

It seems like an obvious company scheme to say "Let them buy item X before its true quality can be appraised and they realise they might not want it!"

Nobody forces you to preorder. It's simply a service provided to people who want to secure a copy early. Nothing more.

Basically i see no good reason to pre order.

If this is the case then you may want to evaluate your knowledge of what preordering is. I have said many times that you only preoder a game you know you want to buy and people that do preorder do so that come launch day, they a guaranteed a copy.

That's all.

 

[Heinrich843]

If the game is an upstart, and only has a publisher's initial investment, I could see people pre-ordering to support the game.

More often than not however, the giant pre-order cash ins are for well established games or series.

I believe pre-ordering only supports the notion that you are a guaranteed customer, and establishes the idea that they don't have to work to appeal to you anymore. With games developers and publishers constantly looking for a new and larger audience, it's difficult to see why people keep pre-ordering. (Other than the free day one DLC and other incentives.)

Is it a terrible idea? That's really up to you, isn't it? If games are becoming better to you, and you like the way the gaming industry is evolving- then yes, by all means support business that benefits both of you.

 

[BiscuitTrouser]

Allow me to point out some flaws:

You might as well be purchasing a "mystery box" from a stranger on the basis that his last mystery box contained something good.

Unless you're very stupid, I don't see why you would preorder a game you know nothing about. Preordering exists so you can secure a copy of a game you know you want well in advance. So unless you're very dumb, a mystery box shouldn't have anything to do with it.

Ill concede the box metaphor was not the strongest. However i pointed out earlier in the thread that unlike every other industry (other than film/books) you cant possible see the entire product before you get it since the surprise factor is a feature. Also it isnt released yet. So lets stick with the box. But say youre allowed a peak. At a bit or two. Then you can buy. I personally would rather have people look in the box before me and go "yeah theres a lot of good stuff in here, go for it" before i buy the box.

 

[DigitalAtlas]

No other industry would ask you to spend money on a promise of a product you have never seen.

>CD's, DVD's, Blu-Ray's, movie tickets

Well there went that argument.

As for saying 'it's suuuuuch a risk,' so is buying a title period. You never know if the reviewer had it right for YOU.

I see no harm in pre-ordering. Anyone who can't just watch footage of a game and read some previews to see if they're interested before putting down FIVE WHOLE DOLLARS is being moronic.

And as I said earlier, I like to secure titles I hold an interest in.

 

[BiscuitTrouser]

No other industry would ask you to spend money on a promise of a product you have never seen.

>CD's, DVD's, Blu-Ray's, movie tickets

Well there went that argument.

As for saying 'it's suuuuuch a risk,' so is buying a title period. You never know if the reviewer had it right for YOU.

I see no harm in pre-ordering. Anyone who can't just watch footage of a game and read some previews to see if they're interested before putting down FIVE WHOLE DOLLARS is being moronic.

And as I said earlier, I like to secure titles I hold an interest in.

Please keep up with the thread, ive already addressed that point like three times. Just read above. In fact ill CP it. All of your examples are wrong because in those examples i can get HUGE consensus on if its good or bad and who it appeals to, not just bias reviews or advertising. Pre ordering doesnt do that.

 

[DigitalAtlas]

No other industry would ask you to spend money on a promise of a product you have never seen.

>CD's, DVD's, Blu-Ray's, movie tickets

Well there went that argument.

As for saying 'it's suuuuuch a risk,' so is buying a title period. You never know if the reviewer had it right for YOU.

I see no harm in pre-ordering. Anyone who can't just watch footage of a game and read some previews to see if they're interested before putting down FIVE WHOLE DOLLARS is being moronic.

And as I said earlier, I like to secure titles I hold an interest in.

Please keep up with the thread, ive already addressed that point like three times. Just read above. In fact ill CP it. All of your examples are wrong because in those examples i can get HUGE consensus on if its good or bad and who it appeals to, not just bias reviews or advertising. Pre ordering doesnt do that.

....So, you've never bought an album to a new band only pretty much hearing a single on the radio only to be extremely disappointed? You've never watched a trailer to a movie, thought it looked great and, again, were extremely disappointed? You can pre-order all of those things.

Again, footage and previews should be more than enough to tell if you'll like a game. I could tell Last Remnant had oodles of slow down from the recorded footage. I didn't pre-order that. I didn't feel lied to. I found it myself.

 

[NightHawk21]

Honestly with the current model of game sales there is no reason not to preorder if you know you're getting that game at launch. You get a copy reserved for you so you don't have to get there at 8am to make sure its not sold out, and you get a little something extra. A first week/month purchase will more often than not cost the same amount and you miss out on that little extra. Basically if you know you're definitely getting the game before its price is likely to drop you get a better deal by preordering.

 

[C2Ultima]

The only reason I pre-order games is so that I can just have Amazon deliver the game for me on the release date. Sure it's a bit extra, but I think it's worth it.

Additionally, I don't buy games without being completely sure about them, much less pre-order.

 

[BiscuitTrouser]

....So, you've never bought an album to a new band only pretty much hearing a single on the radio only to be extremely disappointed? You've never watched a trailer to a movie, thought it looked great and, again, were extremely disappointed? You can pre-order all of those things.

Again, footage and previews should be more than enough to tell if you'll like a game. I could tell Last Remnant had oodles of slow down from the recorded footage. I didn't pre-order that. I didn't feel lied to. I found it myself.

To the first one. Previously i have. I like to think i learn from my mistakes though. Thus the conclusion i reached at the start of this thread. Recently ive stopped doing that. I give everything a listen and i ask around before i spend my money on things. I dont have a lot of money spare so its important i dont end up wasting it.

They should be. But mass effect 3 seemed to dispell THAT particular belief didnt it?

 

[DigitalAtlas]

Additionally, I don't buy games without being completely sure about them, much less pre-order.

I wouldn't say 100% sure, but pretty much same here. I don't see what's so difficult about being "sure" if you want to own something. If it interests you and you have the cash, pick it up.

To the first one. Previously i have. I like to think i learn from my mistakes though. Thus the conclusion i reached at the start of this thread. Recently ive stopped doing that. I give everything a listen and i ask around before i spend my money on things. I dont have a lot of money spare so its important i dont end up wasting it.

They should be. But mass effect 3 seemed to dispell THAT particular belief didnt it?

No, ME3 really didn't and now I have no further intent to debate with you. You're just butt-hurt you pre-ordered the game (probably collector's edition) and didn't like the ending when I can guarantee you enjoyed it right up until then. Why else would you invest so much time in it to even get to the ending?

 

[BiscuitTrouser]

No, ME3 really didn't and now I have no further intent to debate with you. You're just butt-hurt you pre-ordered the game (probably collector's edition) and didn't like the ending when I can guarantee you enjoyed it right up until then. Why else would you invest so much time in it to even get to the ending?

Don't care if I just double posted. Give the user I quote a notification when I edit in his quote if you want me to try real, real hard not to double post.

I dont own mass effect 3...

Im just commenting on the hilariously huge backlash from the community. I felt so sorry for them i decided never to preorder. I dont know the ending to ME3. I didnt invest any time. I didnt enjoy a second of it. I dont. Own. The. Game.

The amount of outrage made me consider that pre ordering can lead to immense but hurtedness as you described.

Im sure you feel a little silly being so presumptuous.

 

[DigitalAtlas]

No, ME3 really didn't and now I have no further intent to debate with you. You're just butt-hurt you pre-ordered the game (probably collector's edition) and didn't like the ending when I can guarantee you enjoyed it right up until then. Why else would you invest so much time in it to even get to the ending?

Don't care if I just double posted. Give the user I quote a notification when I edit in his quote if you want me to try real, real hard not to double post.

I dont own mass effect 3...

Im just commenting on the hilariously huge backlash from the community. I felt so sorry for them i decided never to preorder. I dont know the ending to ME3. I didnt invest any time. I didnt enjoy a second of it. I dont. Own. The. Game.

The amount of outrage made me consider that pre ordering can lead to immense but hurtedness as you described.

Newsflash: That's a risk you take when buying any game, watch any movie, listen to any band, or view any TV show. You may just not like it. You may even invest a lot of time with it and it turns to the crapper. But that's the gamble with media. That's the risk we should each enjoy taking because, with that risk, when you find quality, you remember it forever and cherish it.

As far as pre-ordering goes, people just took that risk. They invested in something they had an interest in to guarantee ownership. It just didn't work out for them and that's a shame.

Also, if you didn't play ME3, you shouldn't use it as an example, you may like the ending and not know it...

Im sure you feel a little silly being so presumptuous.

Nah, I like to assume people have played a game before using it as a defensive point instead of just blindly pointing at it without knowing what's inside the box. Gives me some faith in human intelligence.

As far as my reputation around here speaks, people can tell you I really don't give a s***.

 

[AbsoluteVirtue18]

I only pre-order games I know will be good. Granted, I've only pre-ordered one game (Dissidia 012) but I plan on pre-ordering Lollipop Chainsaw, Resident Evil 6 and Fall of Cybertron, mainly because the months they come out on I need the money for other things, but also because I'm confident that they will be good games.

 

[NightHawk21]

Allow me to point out some flaws:

You might as well be purchasing a "mystery box" from a stranger on the basis that his last mystery box contained something good.

Unless you're very stupid, I don't see why you would preorder a game you know nothing about. Preordering exists so you can secure a copy of a game you know you want well in advance. So unless you're very dumb, a mystery box shouldn't have anything to do with it.

Ill concede the box metaphor was not the strongest. However i pointed out earlier in the thread that unlike every other industry (other than film/books) you cant possible see the entire product before you get it since the surprise factor is a feature. Also it isnt released yet. So lets stick with the box. But say youre allowed a peak. At a bit or two. Then you can buy. I personally would rather have people look in the box before me and go "yeah theres a lot of good stuff in here, go for it" before i buy the box.

I don't know what you're referring to at the beginning with that industry stuff, but lets stick to the box example.

So say this stranger has his box, and he shows it to you're friends, and hell he give you the same peak he did them. You also know roughly what kind of items the rest of the box contains, because this box is BOXv2, a continuation of BOXv1 you purchased a year ago. He says he's going to sell it tomorrow but they may purchase it today and only pick it up tomorrow (all you and your friends have to go off is the little bits he shown you), and if you do this he'll throw in a custom box colour. Now if your friends are very certain they are going to buy the box (whether due to curiosity as to the rest of the contents of the box, or maybe they just really want the stuff they've been shown), it would be in their best interest to preorder since they get the extra box colour.

Now if you don't want to preorder or buy right away for whatever reason, and would rather let your friends buy, try out the product, and tell you what the rest of the items are you are perfectly justified to do that. Hell you might even save a little bit of money. The question really is whether you are confident enough in the product to know you're likely to purchase it anyways, and are willing to pay the money to get the product first, or whether you're still uncertain and will only get the product once you know the whole story, or once the price drops.

Now I really don't like the box metaphor, it feels weak, but preorders are essentially not terrible because:
1) It lets the publisher a rough idea as to the sales.
2) It gives the store a rough idea about how many products to stack.
3) It gives the consumer a little something extra for ^.

 

[Xannidel]

I am a fan of pre ordering because I find it a nice way to contribute to the company that makes games that you enjoy playing regardless of reviewers or opinions from other people. I know it may be easier to wait a day or two after the release of a game and hop down to a store to buy your own copy of the game but some people like ordering a game.