-ism's on tumblr

[1066]

The reason for the medical side of that is that being obese gives so many symptoms that makes it hard to tell the causes apart.
Surgery on fat people is very hard, takes loads of extra time, increases risk of complications, and exponentially increases infection risks among other things.

Not entirely. Yes, there are problems, but often the assumption is automatically made that that is the sole cause of any given ailment.

I'm sorry to say it, but what you're talking here about isn't privilege or whathaveyou; what you're asking for is called Chasing Zebras in the medical community. Interestingly, also a working title for the show House. The term means to go searching for an 'interesting' condition when the symptoms point toward a mundane one.

Yes, that mild head and neck pain could be caused by a rare Polynesian worm that, perhaps, you got on your recent trip despite it being the rarest condition in its native country (and they may even send you home with an O&P test to make you feel better), but they're going to give you some aspirin and tell you to call back in a week if it gets worse.

I say this as a guy who is overweight in a family who is generally overweight and, yes, hearing that you are and that you need to lose weight from a GP time and again is discouraging. Sadly, it's also a common issue. Realistically, though, it's probably right. Anecdotal evidence of a missed diagnosis will happen with any symptom, but it's just that. Unless you can show a statistic showing it to be a common one related to obesity, I don't buy it. I'm sorry.

 

[oreso]

"Patriarchy backfiring on men is not sexism against men"

What people actually mean when they say this is that acts of "sexism" against men don't, outside of some specific scenarios like family courts, fit into a wider systemic framework of discrimination. Our society is still in many ways geared to privilege and value men and traditional notions of masculinity over women.

If you'll forgive the melodrama: being expected to die is not a privilege. What is the draft but an institutional expression of a systemic framework of male disposability?

(Before continuing, please do quickly note that I place no blame here, nor do I discount the other points you raise about attitudes to promiscuity, I only wish to give you my own viewpoint on why the The Clown's quote is hurtful to me).

Being expected to die for others is an expression of being valueless as a human being. It's saying: "While we might care about you, we care far more about what you can do for us"

And this is only one expression of this idea of "women and children first", which is repeated in the life expectancy gap, workplace death gap, homeless gap, educational attainment gap, etc, etc. (I repeat, I place no blame here, societal expectations are not a conspiracy of one gender against another).

And saying "Patriarchy backfiring on men is not sexism against men" is saying the exact thing again. It's saying "Your problems are not legitimate problems, now please place women and children first and stop thinking about yourself".

Sexism is sexism. Many of the issues faced by men are in fact systemic sexism and even institutionalised by policy, from family courts (as you mentioned, thank you), to access to domestic violence services, and I think we should try our best to not belittle those issues.

 

[PromethianSpark]

I think the key point to remember is that these fringe lunatics are not representative of feminism or any other ism for that matter.

 

[JoJo]

Welcome to Tumblr, these groups used to stick to places like Livejournal, but now they exist on this particular website. There are plenty of sane people on Tumblr, even sane feminists and social justice advocates, but there is a dark side to the place.

What you've stumbled on is basically the liberal progressive version of freerepublic.com, stormfront.com, or whatever website extreme libertarians hang out on. It's a dark corner of the internet where nobody is allowed to challenge the members opinions, so they become more and more extreme as they continually circlejerk their own opinions into ovlivion.

Your best bet is just to ignore them, there are plenty of rational people on Tumblr, conflating these small groups with anything wider will just cause you frustration, it's like equating the extremely misogynistic, racist conservatives of places like freerepublic with anyone who expresses conservative opinions in general. It creates a false image and poisons otherwise rational and reasonable people against each other. Chase off enough people with this spiral of destruction, and you end up with places like that, where the extreme opinions start feeding into each other, creating a downward spiral straight to crazy town.

If anything, be glad that most dedicated social justice advocates think that the tumblr social justice warriors are pretty out there too, and don't pay them much attention.

This post right here is pretty much on the money. I've lurked on quite a few sites and blogs which only allow a certain ideology or point of view and without anyone to critique their ideas, they inevitably end up incredibly toxic and dogmatic, often so focused on their particular goals that they'll openly advocate oppression, ignoring of the rule of law or even mass-murder to achieve them. Anyone outside the ideology is barely human, a 'sheep', the 'unthinking masses' or 'low information voters'. Often a certain group of people is blamed for everything bad that happens, whether they be the Jews, the Left or white males. It's the same pattern every time and just really shows why open debate is always a good thing.

 

[PromethianSpark]

I have never once verbally attacked or said anything to make a large person feel uncomfortable for being over weight, but I think I secretly emphasis with fat shaming. I mean people on here talk of skinny people being privileged, and while I do not deny that there is a connection between weight and class particularly in places like America, when you think globally, the ability to become obese is symptomatic of material inequalities that allows some people to eat excessively. I mean, doesn't watching man vs food, seeing a culture dedicated to the excessive consumption of food as if trying to rub it into those who don't have enough, make you completely sick? While the problem is spreading to Britain, there is something about it that seems so uniquely American, as though eating more than I need is an expression of my freedom. 'Yo, Africans! I get to eat this much because am free yo!', where in reality, its more like they don't get to eat that much precisely because we like to over indulge.

Of course I am simplify things. There is after all a system of material inequality that can not be explained by some obese person eating the largest troth of meat you have ever seen in some diner in America. And yes, many obese people are suffering for forms of mental health problems, usually self esteem related, and that food consumption has a lot to do with education and class. That being said however, it can not be denied that there is a culture of excess, and that those who participate in it are actively supporting a system of material inequality.

 

[Single Shot]

I've been on tumblr for a few months now, and I've been seeing a lot of stuff that's been putting me on edge mostly to do with sexism. It puts me on edge mostly because I am not sure whether I'm wrong in thinking what I am. The people on there seem to be treating feminism like a war on men, as if it's them or us, not actually preaching equality, I saw a post that said "Patriarchy backfiring on men is not sexism against men" with thousands of notes and it bothered me that people could be so sexist when fighting for feminism. A small other thing that bothered me is that people are treating fat-shaming as a deadly sin, I might be wrong, but I see fat-shaming on the same level as calling someone ugly, it shouldn't be done because it's mean to hate on someone for any reason.

I might be over-reacting but I was wondering if you the most intelligent of communities had any insight to whether my moral compass is off a little.

Yeah, and now you see why feminism isn't for equality. But this isn't just a problem on tumblr, it's a much more widespread part of the ideology.

There are websites dedicated to the teachings of Valerie Solanas and the SCUM manifesto (which I suggest you look up if you really want to see the ugly face of feminism). Bare in mind she was called "the first outstanding champion of women's rights" and later as "a heroine of the feminist movement" by National Organization for Women (NOW) for that book and her small-scale implementation of it when she attempted to kill 3 men.

In case you don't want to read it the SCUM manifest treats men as "walking abortions" and calls for the extermination of 95-99% of the male gender (all in the interest of peace of course). I have even read feminist discussion boards that first suggested men's skin be used as leather during this process, and then complained that there would be too many men dying to use all the leather. The honest reply to that really summed up feminism for me "We could always build ovens". You know who built ovens to exterminate a good chunk of the populations? I'll be one name comes to mind. We don't call them femi-nazi's for no reason.

Or Mary Daly who's views on men can be summed up in the quote "If life is to survive on this planet, there must be a decontamination of the Earth. I think this will be accompanied by an evolutionary process that will result in a drastic reduction of the population of males.". She was both admired by the feminist community and taught gender studies at Boston collage until 1999 when she retired amid a push to allow male students into her classes - Something she was set against because she wanted to spend all her time convincing the female students they were victims.

and there are dozens of other examples of this thought process repeated throughout feminist theory. To list a few other offensive examples:
Protesting changes to rape laws that would mean women can rape men.
Protesting fathers rights groups that want equality in custody cases, so the decision if based only on the childs best interest instead of the parents genitalia.
Protesting against mens-support services for men who have suffered relationship abuse.
distorting and subverting the fact that most of non-mutual relationship abuse is perpetrated by the woman against her male partner, most abusive relationships are mutually abusive, and women are statistically more likely to continue being abusive in their future relationships. (That's the findings when you ask both genders the same question instead of the feminist-funded ones that ask women if they have been abused, and men if they have abused.)
and still more. These people may not support the view of the average self-proclaimed 'feminist', but they are what feminism is about.

if you used to describe yourself as a feminist, and by proxy provide support to the crazy's who would advocate male submission and genocide, will you continue to do so after seeing this truth? If you believe in true equality why not call yourself an equalist or egalitarian and show you are not one of them. Fight for the fights of the discriminated, not just women.

Feminism as a word is pro-women, equalism is pro-equality.

It's not just tumblr that's the problem, it's the ideologies behind it being amplified by anonymity.

'We are all created differently, and have the right to be treated the same'

tl;dr: These are real belief's you're seeing on tumblr, shown in the light by a mixture of anonymity and perceived social support. Don't write them off as the minority just because those same people wouldn't say the same thing to your face.

 

[Thaluikhain]

If you'll forgive the melodrama: being expected to die is not a privilege. What is the draft but an institutional expression of a systemic framework of male disposability?

(Before continuing, please do quickly note that I place no blame here, nor do I discount the other points you raise about attitudes to promiscuity, I only wish to give you my own viewpoint on why the The Clown's quote is hurtful to me).

Being expected to die for others is an expression of being valueless as a human being. It's saying: "While we might care about you, we care far more about what you can do for us"

Men aren't drafted because it's expected that they'll die and nobody cares.

Men are (or were, in many cases) drafted because it's expected they are capable of fighting, unlike women.

Society, as a rule, does not want even its conscripted soldiers to take casualties.

Men being assumed to be superior to women naturally has severe disadvantages.

 

[PromethianSpark]

Snip

You know, just like all people who lash out against a movement, group, ideology or whatever, you deliberately misrepresent them/it. I don't know if you yourself are choosing to deliberately misrepresent it, but what I do know, is that you obtained your information in either two ways. 1.Somebody directed you to it, which if traced back means there was deliberate misrepresentation somewhere, or 2. You researched it yourself, and made some conscious choice in screening the information you decided was worth paying attention to.

You see, you cant just point to the lunatic fringe of a movement/ideology and claim that it is representative of the whole, which is not just exactly what you are doing, its about the only thing you are doing. Valerie Solanas? Seriously? Get fucking real man. She is a fringe lunatic whom no feminist academic at the time took seriously let alone today. It was male hate cloaked in feminist ideology. It wasn't even ideological hate, but rather just your more run of the mill kind, as the events of her life proved that she was dependant on a man for her psychological stability and killed him when faced with rejection. Hardly the independent woman feminism envisions.


'Protesting changes to rape laws that would mean women can rape men'

Again this is ridiculous, the majority of feminists where actually offended by the old law that implied that women where physically incapable of rape. Just like everyone around these forums, your understanding of feminism is incredibly limited and you are selective of what you choose to learn about it.

Mary Daly?! Again really? You continually point to the extremists. I will tell you from my personal experience as the sole male who attended numerous feminist classes at university, there is no hostile atmosphere in there, if anything they welcome the educating of men on what feminism is really about.

If you took the time to really explore feminism you would realise that they are not about female superiority. In fact they are very interested in the emancipation of the human race as a whole, reaching out and developing deep links with race studies and male studies. I would in fact say that the defining aspect of feminism as a critical perspective today is its underlying claim that addressing the inequality and oppression related to race, gender, sexuality, and body type, is more pertinent than class inequality. In other words, it is a critical alternative to Marxism.

 

[oreso]

If you'll forgive the melodrama: being expected to die is not a privilege. What is the draft but an institutional expression of a systemic framework of male disposability?

(Before continuing, please do quickly note that I place no blame here, nor do I discount the other points you raise about attitudes to promiscuity, I only wish to give you my own viewpoint on why the The Clown's quote is hurtful to me).

Being expected to die for others is an expression of being valueless as a human being. It's saying: "While we might care about you, we care far more about what you can do for us"

Men aren't drafted because it's expected that they'll die and nobody cares.

Men are (or were, in many cases) drafted because it's expected they are capable of fighting, unlike women.

Society, as a rule, does not want even its conscripted soldiers to take casualties.

Men being assumed to be superior to women naturally has severe disadvantages.

Wow...

I'm sorry, but it seems you actually believe that people being forced into danger and death is a privilege.

It just seems like an incredible lack of compassion to frame it in anything like those terms.


... But regardless of how you wish to portray it, it is still sexism, it is still systemic, it still targets men. I hope you at least agree to this.

 

[Single Shot]

Snip

You know, just like all people who lash out against a movement, group, ideology or whatever, you deliberately misrepresent them/it. I don't know if you yourself are choosing to deliberately misrepresent it, but what I do know, is that you obtained your information in either two ways. 1.Somebody directed you to it, which if traced back means there was deliberate misrepresentation somewhere, or 2. You researched it yourself, and made some conscious choice in screening the information you decided was worth paying attention to.

You see, you cant just point to the lunatic fringe of a movement/ideology and claim that it is representative of the whole, which is not just exactly what you are doing, its about the only thing you are doing. Valerie Solanas? Seriously? Get fucking real man. She is a fringe lunatic whom no feminist academic at the time took seriously let alone today. It was male hate cloaked in feminist ideology. It wasn't even ideological hate, but rather just your more run of the mill kind, as the events of her life proved that she was dependant on a man for her psychological stability and killed him when faced with rejection. Hardly the independent woman feminism envisions.


'Protesting changes to rape laws that would mean women can rape men'

Again this is ridiculous, the majority of feminists where actually offended by the old law that implied that women where physically incapable of rape. Just like everyone around these forums, your understanding of feminism is incredibly limited and you are selective of what you choose to learn about it.

Mary Daly?! Again really? You continually point to the extremists. I will tell you from my personal experience as the sole male who attended numerous feminist classes at university, there is no hostile atmosphere in there, if anything they welcome the educating of men on what feminism is really about.

If you took the time to really explore feminism you would realise that they are not about female superiority. In fact they are very interested in the emancipation of the human race as a whole, reaching out and developing deep links with race studies and male studies. I would in fact say that the defining aspect of feminism as a critical perspective today is its underlying claim that addressing the inequality and oppression related to race, gender, sexuality, and body type, is more pertinent than class inequality. In other words, it is a critical alternative to Marxism.

1) Please keep the language respectful so I can take you seriously. If you treat me with respect, I will respect you.

2) so you're calling NOW, a feminist groups with 550,000 members across 50 states fringe lunatic's? okay, If you wnt to call one of the largest feminism organizations 'not-feminist' that's a little strange, but I'll continue.
3) Yes, they were offended by the old laws. but in Canada, America, and Britain when people started to campaign for 'rape by envelopment' feminists protested against them. I can find the video, news reports, and feminist propaganda from those incidents if you would like.
4) Yes, Mary Daly, she literally taught feminist theory for a good 32 years and was a great example of the kind of teaching that was spread under the name of feminism.
5) If you took the time to explore the public face of feminism you'd see the hate and bile it contains. And I suggest you don't try and pull Marxism into this since most 1st and 2nd wave feminists held some form of communist belief.
6) can you now please answer my last point. Why align yourself with the crazy's and give them power when the umbrella name 'equalism' would be a much more appropriate place for those who truly believe in equality?

 

[Thaluikhain]

I'm sorry, but it seems you actually believe that people being forced into danger and death is a privilege.

A result of male privilege. Not the same thing. You will note that there are fights to allow women to serve in the military, and there is constant resistance to this.

Warfare has long been regarded as this wonderful boys only club that girls weren't allowed in. Only nowdays people don't see it as wonderful nearly so much.

... But regardless of how you wish to portray it, it is still sexism, it is still systemic, it still targets men. I hope you at least agree to this.

Yes and no. No in the sense that it is not one distinct thing, separate from the way society deals with gender in general, which seems to be implied.

If you believe in true equality why not call yourself an equalist or egalitarian and show you are not one of them. Fight for the fights of the discriminated, not just women.

Feminism as a word is pro-women, equalism is pro-equality.

Therefore, you are required to be a feminists to be an equalist. There is no reason you cannot care about other issues, just because you are a feminist.

Secondly, what does "equalist" mean? Equal for who? Unless you specify, the term is meaningless, you can't just assume it to be for "everyone".

And yes, before you ask, being a feminist means being in favour of equality between men and women, it doesn't specify which men and women, and there is a real problem with modern feminism and intersectionality.

 

[Single Shot]

If you believe in true equality why not call yourself an equalist or egalitarian and show you are not one of them. Fight for the fights of the discriminated, not just women.

Feminism as a word is pro-women, equalism is pro-equality.

Therefore, you are required to be a feminists to be an equalist. There is no reason you cannot care about other issues, just because you are a feminist.

Secondly, what does "equalist" mean? Equal for who? Unless you specify, the term is meaningless, you can't just assume it to be for "everyone".

And yes, before you ask, being a feminist means being in favour of equality between men and women, it doesn't specify which men and women, and there is a real problem with modern feminism and intersectionality.

No, you don't have to be a feminist to be an Equalist.

Equalism IS rights for all, when you commented who don't you think has rights?

No, modern feminism continues to churn out the same hate and genocidal bile it always has while pretesting against mens rights where men are discriminated against.

 

[Combustion Kevin]

Men aren't drafted because it's expected that they'll die and nobody cares.

Men are (or were, in many cases) drafted because it's expected they are capable of fighting, unlike women.

Society, as a rule, does not want even its conscripted soldiers to take casualties.

Men being assumed to be superior to women naturally has severe disadvantages.

I'm aware that such mentalities are subjective interpretations, whatever way you may swing it, but the fact remains that men were to take the bullet wherever it was to be taken.
In fact, if you spoke up or simply refused, you'd be executed for dessertion.

Yes, men were expected to die for others, on pain of death.

 

[ForumSafari]

Dude it's tumblr, this is basically what it's for. There have always been a certain number of people that are filled with spite but don't have the courage to say anything out loud and there have always been fringe loonies with a persecution complex. This is an excellent example of why a lack of criticism is bad for a theory though.

In a way this is Feminism's problem too, their unwillingness to draw up a formalised to-do list and a formal movement with real accountability has brought them to the stage where they're acting as a host for all sorts of characters that ruin the credibility of the movement and have removed their ability to distance themselves from these people.

 

[BiscuitTrouser]

6) can you now please answer my last point. Why align yourself with the crazy's and give them power when the umbrella name 'equalism' would be a much more appropriate place for those who truly believe in equality?

This is just weird shit people keep saying and it confuses me.

How does stating my opinion, then giving said opinion a label most will understand, giving ANYONE power. I didnt donate any money. or case any votes. How does this power manifest? Does my psionic resonance provide her with a higher state of being thus enabling her to control more minds? I think its this. Yes.

What i tend to do now, because of the existence of people like YOU and the existence of people like the people youre describing is just state my opinion and offer NO label. You can call what i think whatever you want. The important meat of the discussion is my thoughts, not whatever label you want to call them.

I think men and woman should be equal under the law and in the eyes of society.

You can call that equalism. You can call that feminism. You can call that stupidism. Its unimportant as long as you understand the concepts behind my view. I WISH i could use a label to make this process easier. But since people like you and them are making ANY label synonymous with "Demon hell spawn that I hate" i cant use any label or all discussion with the party that hates it is impossible. YOU are part of the group forcing me to do this. So are they. So is anyone with such a weird obsession with what a view is called rather than the view. I resent you all. So very much.

I swear 90% of all feminism discussions are about the definition of what femninism is, wrestling with eachother over different definitions of the same word and constant repetition of "Thats a fringe group". Its so frustratingly INANE and boring. Dont you want to have a real discussion? Stop referecing people who ARNT the person youre talking to. No one gives a single fuck what these other people have to say, unless the person youre talking to specifically tells you otherwise and NAMES a person they agree with. Try talking about what THEY think.

 

[Single Shot]

6) can you now please answer my last point. Why align yourself with the crazy's and give them power when the umbrella name 'equalism' would be a much more appropriate place for those who truly believe in equality?

This is just weird shit people keep saying and it confuses me.

How does stating my opinion, then giving said opinion a label most will understand, giving ANYONE power. I didnt donate any money. or case any votes. How does this power manifest? Does my psionic resonance provide her with a higher state of being thus enabling her to control more minds? I think its this. Yes.

What i tend to do now, because of the existence of people like YOU and the existence of people like the people youre describing is just state my opinion and offer NO label. You can call what i think whatever you want. The important meat of the discussion is my thoughts, not whatever label you want to call them.

I think men and woman should be equal under the law and in the eyes of society.

You can call that equalism. You can call that feminism. You can call that stupidism. Its unimportant as long as you understand the concepts behind my view. I WISH i could use a label to make this process easier. But since people like you and them are making ANY label synonymous with "Demon hell spawn that I hate" i cant use any label or all discussion with the party that hates it is impossible. YOU are part of the group forcing me to do this. So are they. So is anyone with such a weird obsession with what a view is called rather than the view. I resent you all.

But by calling yourself feminism you align yourself to the most vocal aspects of the group. This is simply because the most vocal parts are the most public. So by calling yourself a feminist you add a number to the perceived acceptance of the group, and thus it's most vocal/extreme parts becaue it's most vocal parts are also the most extreme.

An extreme organisation with 100commited members is a fringe, an organization with an extreme voice of the same 100 but a total of 100,000 members (even if said members are quietly mumbling about equality to themselves) is something else entirely.

You have to see that FEMinismis a female-centric view of the equality issue, and that's what breeds the anti-male subculture. It's not the majority of feminists that believe that, but they are the most vocal.

 

[BiscuitTrouser]

But by calling yourself feminism you align yourself to the most vocal aspects of the group. This is simply because the most vocal parts are the most public. So by calling yourself a feminist you add a number to the perceived acceptance of the group, and thus it's most vocal/extreme parts becaue it's most vocal parts are also the most extreme.

An extreme organisation with 100commited members is a fringe, an organization with an extreme voice of the same 100 but a total of 100,000 members (even if said members are quietly mumbling about equality to themselves) is something else entirely.

You have to see that FEMinismis a female-centric view of the equality issue, and that's what breeds the anti-male subculture. It's not the majority of feminists that believe that, but they are the most vocal.

Well to you id call myself an equalist because you use feminism in a way I dont. My language is fluid depending on who im talking to. Personally I think feminism is centered on the fact the patriarchy (Which i define as a set of sociatal values based on defining what a man(tm) should be, a man shouldnt cry, a man shouldnt cook, a man works ect) causes a lot of the problems for both men and women. I think the patriarchy (Which AGAIN is a set of societal values propagated by men telling other men what they should measure up to and by extension telling them to NOT be like women because women are lesser) hurts men as it does women. I see no problem calling the movement to de construct these random unnecessary social standards feminism. Its a little poetic seeing as this set of standards pretty much uses the general rule of "If a man does ANYTHING we usually assign to women it is weak and bad". I think a core part of femenism is that it shouldnt be frowned upon or hated for a man to act in a way traditionally womanly. Thus i dont see any reason to call the fight for my ability to enjoy baking without being seen as "weak" or "Not into MANLY interests" anything else but feminism cus, hey, it fits. It's my fight too to be allowed access to the things men previously have been steered away from because they BELONGED to the "weaker" caste of "women". Similarly it has a duel purpose in spearheading the idea women have as much right as men to take part in and enjoy "manly" activities and roles without judgement.

But hey if you dont see how thats fitting at all im happy to swap to equalism when talking about it with you. The word really accounts for NONE of my opinion. And if peoples think me using a handy word to describe my views means i have anything to do with the same people who might try and use that label to describe an OBVIOUSLY different view thats just stupid and they are within their right to consider me something else entirely.

 

[Lieju]

I always keep hearing from people how places like Tumblr and Reddit are hives of scum and villainy, but if so, why do you go there? Just ignore them. I manage to use Tumblr for finding fandom-related things or cute stuff and never run into this.

 

[Single Shot]

But by calling yourself feminism you align yourself to the most vocal aspects of the group. This is simply because the most vocal parts are the most public. So by calling yourself a feminist you add a number to the perceived acceptance of the group, and thus it's most vocal/extreme parts becaue it's most vocal parts are also the most extreme.

An extreme organisation with 100commited members is a fringe, an organization with an extreme voice of the same 100 but a total of 100,000 members (even if said members are quietly mumbling about equality to themselves) is something else entirely.

You have to see that FEMinismis a female-centric view of the equality issue, and that's what breeds the anti-male subculture. It's not the majority of feminists that believe that, but they are the most vocal.

Well to you id call myself an equalist because you use feminism in a way I dont. My language is fluid depending on who im talking to. Personally I think feminism is centered on the fact the patriarchy (Which i define as a set of sociatal values based on defining what a man(tm) should be, a man shouldnt cry, a man shouldnt cook, a man works ect) causes a lot of the problems for both men and women. I think the patriarchy (Which AGAIN is a set of societal values propagated by men telling other men what they should measure up to and by extension telling them to NOT be like women because women are lesser) hurts men equally as it does women. I see no problem calling the movement to de construct these random unnecessary social standards feminism. Its a little poetic seeing as this set of standards pretty much uses the general rule of "If a man does ANYTHING we usually assign to women it is weak and bad". I think a core part of femenism is that it shouldnt be frowned upon or hated for a man to act in a way traditionally womanly. Thus i dont see any reason to call the fight for my ability to enjoy baking without being seen as "weak" or "Not into MANLY interests" feminism. It's my fight too to be allowed access to the things men previously have been steered away from because they BELONGED to the "weaker" caste of "women". Similarly it has a duel purpose in spearheading the idea women have as much right as men to take part in and enjoy "manly" activities and roles without judgement.

But hey if you dont see how thats fitting at all im happy to swap to equalism when talking about it with you. The word really accounts for NONE of my opinion. And if peoples think me using a handy word to describe my views means i have anything to do with the same people who might try and use that label to describe an OBVIOUSLY different view thats just stupid and they are within their right to consider me something else entirely.

You seem quite open to the ideas I put forwards and willing to understand them. Thank you.

I also see the problems caused by what you chose to term as 'patriarchy' (I'd use a different term for social standards but you agreed to use equalism so I'll make a concession too.), but I also see the problems inherent in the solutions feminism has provided.
Employment quota's create jobs that can never be filled my men because an office is already at it's limit, this also creates social splits in offices between those seen as employed to fill a quota, and those who are actually the est fit for the job.
Child custody is bias towards women because early feminism fought for that change, but men still have the responsibility for financial care because early feminism didn't want that responsibility.
Men can still be abused by their female partners in relationships because feminism got "the size and muscular stature" of the abuser written into the abuse laws. Feminist groups also campaign and argue against help centres for male victims (making themselves the most vocal parts of the feminist community around the issue)

These and other reasons are what I have a problem with, and why I cannot in good conscience call myself a feminist despite the constant reminder that I agree with most of what they say at the very moderate level to some extent.

You seem to believe in true equality though, so I will respect whatever you choose to call yourself as long as you respect my right to call out the more vocal and extreme sections of your claimed movement.

 

[Thaluikhain]

Employment quota's create jobs that can never be filled my men because an office is already at it's limit, this also creates social splits in offices between those seen as employed to fill a quota, and those who are actually the est fit for the job.

Well, yes, but as as opposed to those there because of informal discrimination, who aren't best for the job either. Now, positive discrimination is by no means a permanent or perfect fix, however it may be useful to alleviate the problem until a better solution can be implemented.

Child custody is bias towards women because early feminism fought for that change, but men still have the responsibility for financial care because early feminism didn't want that responsibility.

Men still have that responsibility (as a rule), chiefly because they still earn more money than men. Once that problem is overcome, the problems with child custody should be greatly reduced.