Junior Seau Shot Himself Today

[Forgetitnow344]

http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/junior-seau-dead-suicide-nfl-linebacker/story?id=16263047#.T6GV46trPpg

Damn. I actually live in Oceanside and used to go to the church his family goes to. All of my problems revolve around money, so it always blows my mind when someone who's rich and famous does something like this... Especially when they know how it will hurt their family. His mother is an avid church-goer who was at church when she heard the news. Being such a blatant suicide, he had to know his mother would think his soul was now enduring eternal torment for an unforgivable sin.

What drives people to this? I'll never understand.

If you do understand and you're still in that place, I advise you to read this:

http://www.cracked.com/article_15658_the-ten-minute-suicide-guide.html

 

[bobmus]

What kind of mother would think of her son as suffering in hell for eternity because he ended his own life? That's the most despicable outlook I've ever heard on someone who's decided they don't want to continue living. Sounds like you're projecting your own beliefs onto the mother's view of her son's death, and I don't believe he took his life just to spite his mom.

 

[tippy2k2]

What kind of mother would think of her son as suffering in hell for eternity because he ended his own life? That's the most despicable outlook I've ever heard on someone who's decided they don't want to continue living. Sounds like you're projecting your own beliefs onto the mother's view of her son's death, and I don't believe he took his life just to spite his mom.

Well to be fair, if she is Catholic, the view of the Catholic church states that suicide and murder is the same thing, therefore you go to hell (which I assume is what the OT assumes). Now this is going to be terribly presumptuous of me but if she was in church on a weekday and a Christian, she likely was attending a Catholic mass.

OT: It sucks. I have never understood what drives a person to suicide and probably never will be able to understand it but I really wish suicidal people would REALLY think about it before they go through with it (ESPECIALLY people with kids like Seau).

 

[bobmus]

What kind of mother would think of her son as suffering in hell for eternity because he ended his own life? That's the most despicable outlook I've ever heard on someone who's decided they don't want to continue living. Sounds like you're projecting your own beliefs onto the mother's view of her son's death, and I don't believe he took his life just to spite his mom.

Well to be fair, if she is Catholic, the view of the Catholic church states that suicide and murder is the same thing, therefore you go to hell. Now this is going to be terribly presumptuous of me but if she was in church on a weekday and a Christian, she likely was attending a Catholic mass.

Attending a Catholic church =/= following all Catholic doctrine to be fair
And a mother's outlook on the death of her son is far more likely to involve grief at his passing than conviction that he's going straight to hell, unless she was a die-hard believer
Just seemed like the OP was projecting his own ideas onto the mother to me.

 

[Cakes]

Well to be fair, if she is Catholic, the view of the Catholic church states that suicide and murder is the same thing, therefore you go to hell (which I assume is what the OT assumes).

That isn't even close to what the Church says.

Grave psychological disturbances, anguish, or grave fear of hardship, suffering, or torture can diminish the responsibility of the one committing suicide.

We should not despair of the eternal salvation of persons who have taken their own lives. By ways known to him alone, God can provide the opportunity for salutary repentance. The Church prays for persons who have taken their own lives.

And why is she likely Catholic? Most Christians in the U.S. are Protestant.

OT: It sucks. I have never understood what drives a person to suicide and probably never will be able to understand it but I really wish suicidal people would REALLY think about it before they go through with it (ESPECIALLY people with kids like Seau).

It's called "depression".

 

[Forgetitnow344]

What kind of mother would think of her son as suffering in hell for eternity because he ended his own life? That's the most despicable outlook I've ever heard on someone who's decided they don't want to continue living. Sounds like you're projecting your own beliefs onto the mother's view of her son's death, and I don't believe he took his life just to spite his mom.

Well to be fair, if she is Catholic, the view of the Catholic church states that suicide and murder is the same thing, therefore you go to hell. Now this is going to be terribly presumptuous of me but if she was in church on a weekday and a Christian, she likely was attending a Catholic mass.

Attending a Catholic church =/= following all Catholic doctrine to be fair
And a mother's outlook on the death of her son is far more likely to involve grief at his passing than conviction that he's going straight to hell, unless she was a die-hard believer
Just seemed like the OP was projecting his own ideas onto the mother to me.

Actually I drew all the conclusions that tippy2k2 drew... I'm not religious, but I was raised in a Christian church. I went to New Venture, which is the church where Shawn Mitchell (the Chargers' team chaplain for years and years) preaches and where a lot of the Seaus go to worship.

One of the things I was brought up to believe was that if I killed myself, I'm going to hell, no exceptions. That's likely what Junior's mother believes. I would probably agree that she would change her outlook on suicide after this though.

 

[tippy2k2]

That isn't even close to what the Church says.

Grave psychological disturbances, anguish, or grave fear of hardship, suffering, or torture can diminish the responsibility of the one committing suicide.

We should not despair of the eternal salvation of persons who have taken their own lives. By ways known to him alone, God can provide the opportunity for salutary repentance. The Church prays for persons who have taken their own lives.

And why is she likely Catholic? Most Christians in the U.S. are Protestant.

Everything I've ever read on Catholic views on suicide call it a mortal sin. I'm not Catholic so that could be incorrect but I'm going off of what I've read. Although I am now on Wikedia and see where you got that quote so I'm alright with saying that I could very well be wrong on this topic.

Also, I stated that I'm assuming Catholic based on the fact that she was in church on a weekday. Again, that's my presumption since I've never seen other Christian denominations do it. Again, I could be wrong which I why I called it my presumption.

Attending a Catholic church =/= following all Catholic doctrine to be fair
And a mother's outlook on the death of her son is far more likely to involve grief at his passing than conviction that he's going straight to hell, unless she was a die-hard believer
Just seemed like the OP was projecting his own ideas onto the mother to me.

That is also fair. I was merely stating what I thought the OP was trying to say (EDIT: which the OP has now confirmed above after I posted this). I agree that it would be tough to see the mother think her son was in hell for what he did and I was going off of the (admittedly little) knowledge I had on the Catholic religion (which Cakes has pointed out my own incorrect assumptions).

 

[bobmus]

Actually I drew all the conclusions that tippy2k2 drew... I'm not religious, but I was raised in a Christian church. I went to New Venture, which is the church where Shawn Mitchell (the Chargers' team chaplain for years and years) preaches and where a lot of the Seaus go to worship.

One of the things I was brought up to believe was that if I killed myself, I'm going to hell, no exceptions. That's likely what Junior's mother believes. I would probably agree that she would change her outlook on suicide after this though.

Ah hello OP.
I'd say it's incredibly unlikely that someone in that state would worry about their mother consigning them to hell, as you indicated in your OP, no matter their upbringing. Your post, to me, almost seemed to imply that he was being selfish in killing himself.
My belief is that, as much as it may affect other people, it is ultimately your own life, and you may choose what you do with it.
(All references to American sport are lost on me - British)

 

[Forgetitnow344]

Actually I drew all the conclusions that tippy2k2 drew... I'm not religious, but I was raised in a Christian church. I went to New Venture, which is the church where Shawn Mitchell (the Chargers' team chaplain for years and years) preaches and where a lot of the Seaus go to worship.

One of the things I was brought up to believe was that if I killed myself, I'm going to hell, no exceptions. That's likely what Junior's mother believes. I would probably agree that she would change her outlook on suicide after this though.

Ah hello OP.
I'd say it's incredibly unlikely that someone in that state would worry about their mother consigning them to hell, as you indicated in your OP, no matter their upbringing. Your post, to me, almost seemed to imply that he was being selfish in killing himself.
My belief is that, as much as it may affect other people, it is ultimately your own life, and you may choose what you do with it.
(All references to American sport are lost on me - British)

I actually have always believed suicide is selfish. No matter what problem you have, it isn't going to be defeated by killing yourself. It only hurts the ones who love and care about you. The only person who really benefits is you because you aren't around to deal with it. It's a terrible loss for his family and it shouldn't have happened, but if he chose to kill himself, it is extremely selfish.

 

[bobmus]

I actually have always believed suicide is selfish. No matter what problem you have, it isn't going to be defeated by killing yourself. It only hurts the ones who love and care about you. The only person who really benefits is you because you aren't around to deal with it. It's a terrible loss for his family and it shouldn't have happened, but if he chose to kill himself, it is extremely selfish.

To me it's selfish in the same way that choosing to move away from your family is selfish. Yes, they might be sad not to see you around, but it's ultimately your life, and no-one elses.
This was best summed up by Schopenhauer:

"They tell us that suicide is the greatest act of cowardice... that suicide is wrong; when it is quite obvious that there is nothing in the world to which every man has a more unassailable title than to his own life and person."

Basically he's saying that it's the last thing you can truly claim to have the right to do with as you like. To deny yourself that right would be to say that there is nothing on earth that you have full rights to do with as you like.

You can factor in the damage it might do to other people, but in the end to criticise someone for choosing to do so is, in my view, both disrespectful and cruel. When it gets to the point where someone is determined enough to commit such an act, who are we to judge them for it?

 

[BrionJames]

Damn, he shot himself in the chest. I know there's no sure-fire way to punch your own ticket, except maybe blowing yourself up or jumping off a building head first, but you'd think if it was a suicide, he'd, you know, shoot himself in the head. Sad to see someone give up on life, though.

 

[Vern5]

I have no idea who this person is but, from reading the thread, I can assume that this is a person who had risen to fame and fortune?

If so, then I see no reason why he would not kill himself.

Maybe that was bit blunt, but hey, I'm like that. Look at it like this. Old men who die with regrets never achieved their dreams while they were young. Young men who achieve their dreams while they are still young inevitably kill themselves in one form or another (alcoholism comes to mind).

Think about it: When you had achieved greatness, achieved prominence, what else is there? When you have made your dreams a reality, what point is there in sleeping? That's where the downward spiral begins.

 

[tippy2k2]

Damn, he shot himself in the chest. I know there's no sure-fire way to punch your own ticket, except maybe blowing yourself up or jumping off a building head first, but you'd think if it was a suicide, he'd, you know, shoot himself in the head. Sad to see someone give up on life, though.

Supposedly he's doing what Dave Duerson (former Safety for Chicago Bears) did, though that is just rumor.

Dave Duerson's death with the important bit bolded (from Wikipedia):

Duerson was found dead at his Sunny Isles Beach, Florida[1] home on February 17, 2011. The Miami-Dade County medical examiner reported that Duerson died of a self-inflicted gunshot wound to the chest.[6] He sent a text message to his family saying he wanted his brain to be used for research at the Boston University School of Medicine, which is conducting research into chronic traumatic encephalopathy (CTE) caused by playing pro football.[7] He left behind three sons and a daughter from his marriage to ex-wife Alicia Duerson.[6] On May 2, 2011 researcher neurologists at Boston University confirmed that he suffered from a neurodegenerative disease linked to concussions.[8]

In short: For science to test his brain for football-related injuries.

 

[Revnak_v1legacy]

I actually have always believed suicide is selfish. No matter what problem you have, it isn't going to be defeated by killing yourself. It only hurts the ones who love and care about you. The only person who really benefits is you because you aren't around to deal with it. It's a terrible loss for his family and it shouldn't have happened, but if he chose to kill himself, it is extremely selfish.

To me it's selfish in the same way that choosing to move away from your family is selfish. Yes, they might be sad not to see you around, but it's ultimately your life, and no-one elses.
This was best summed up by Schopenhauer:

"They tell us that suicide is the greatest act of cowardice... that suicide is wrong; when it is quite obvious that there is nothing in the world to which every man has a more unassailable title than to his own life and person."

Basically he's saying that it's the last thing you can truly claim to have the right to do with as you like. To deny yourself that right would be to say that there is nothing on earth that you have full rights to do with as you like.

You can factor in the damage it might do to other people, but in the end to criticise someone for choosing to do so is, in my view, both disrespectful and cruel. When it gets to the point where someone is determined enough to commit such an act, who are we to judge them for it?

The rights of each and every individual should never be the end all of morality. His death unquestionably affected everyone he ever knew and who had ever held him dear. Suicide is among the most selfish things that a person could ever do, it is far worse than moving away from your family, it is abandoning them forever, along with every other responsibility you have ever had. It is certainly cowardly, as it always is when someone chooses to avoid a problem rather than confront it. Just because nobody has the right to keep you from killing yourself doesn't mean you ever should. There are a thousand things that people can and should have the right to do that are anything but right. Hating, lying, betraying, cheating, these are all things that should remain within each person's rights despite how wrong they are. Suicide should be considered in the same way, if not even to a greater degree.

 

[LT Cannibal 68]

What kind of mother would think of her son as suffering in hell for eternity because he ended his own life? That's the most despicable outlook I've ever heard on someone who's decided they don't want to continue living. Sounds like you're projecting your own beliefs onto the mother's view of her son's death, and I don't believe he took his life just to spite his mom.

it's a christian and catholic belief that if someone takes their life they will spend eternity in hell as a punishment. It's not DESPICABLE it's the mother's religion.

 

[GrimTuesday]

What some people don't know about is the extreme issues that many professional football players have after their playing career. All the collisions that they have cause brain damage, sure the helmets help, but there is only so much the padding can do. What happens is the brain damage takes the form of dead spots in the brain, as well as whats called Chronic traumatic encephalopathy which causes memory loss, aggression, confusion and depression. I bet that when they open up his head and examine his brain (because CTE can only be diagnosed postmortem), they will find this to be the case.

Its a shame that he died, its sad to hear about anything like this.

 

[dyre]

That's pretty brutal. RIP

>Someone commits suicide
>Escapist turns it into a religion debate

This place blows sometimes.

 

[bobmus]

The rights of each and every individual should never be the end all of morality. His death unquestionably affected everyone he ever knew and who had ever held him dear. Suicide is among the most selfish things that a person could ever do, it is far worse than moving away from your family, it is abandoning them forever, along with every other responsibility you have ever had. It is certainly cowardly, as it always is when someone chooses to avoid a problem rather than confront it. Just because nobody has the right to keep you from killing yourself doesn't mean you ever should. There are a thousand things that people can and should have the right to do that are anything but right. Hating, lying, betraying, cheating, these are all things that should remain within each person's rights despite how wrong they are. Suicide should be considered in the same way, if not even to a greater degree.

Hey there Revnak, glad someone responded to that comment, it's always interesting to discuss.
It may affect everyone you know, but it doesn't make it a selfish act. It's one that affects you far more substantially than it affects anyone else, so I personally think that inherently makes it an act that is neither unselfish or selfish.
I wouldn't call it an act of cowardice either. There are times when taking your own life can seem like the only solution to your problems, with no other way of tackling them, so you would be taking on your problems head-on in that sense. Also if you're saying sticking a gun to your head doesn't take courage, I disagree massively.

 

[bobmus]

What kind of mother would think of her son as suffering in hell for eternity because he ended his own life? That's the most despicable outlook I've ever heard on someone who's decided they don't want to continue living. Sounds like you're projecting your own beliefs onto the mother's view of her son's death, and I don't believe he took his life just to spite his mom.

it's a christian and catholic belief that if someone takes their life they will spend eternity in hell as a punishment. It's not DESPICABLE it's the mother's religion.

It's a rare belief, not taught by any major denominations, and in my view is a vile way to look upon anyone's death, especially that of your own son.
It being part of religion would not make me consider it any less despicable either - Islam carries laws that say adulterous women should be stoned, and I find that despicable.
Anyway, let's not have a religious debate, and please read the rest of the conversation surrounding my post before you jump right in.

 

[somonels]

She will be glad when she finds out she has lived in a lie her whole life.... um, yeah, too late then.

Hey, I have brain torauma too
It does mess with you.