"Just go watch Porn!" (Probably NFSW, duh)

[9tailedflame]

I mean you're free to get off how you choose, but i just worry sometimes about people who are maybe repressed, and the volleyball game is the best they can do without crossing some perceived moral line. I want those people to be free, repression isn't healthy, and even though there may be people who legitimately enjoy the game for non-repression purposes, the game still screams repression to me.

Maybe it's because i've never understood the appeal behind being 'teased' or anything, but just because i don't understand the appeal doesn't mean i'm going to shame you for what you like. I just want to see more people embracing sexuality and breaking free from repression.

On a side note, not all porn is as terrible and bland and hackneyed as people may make it seem. There really is a good bit of everything out there. It's just a matter of figuring out what you want, and finding it. Turn safesearch off, enable adblock, check your spyware and virus scans frequently, and embark on your journey! There's something out there for everyone!

 

[CaitSeith]

Not blind; just ignorant. Next question!

 

[Something Amyss]

Is that really their fault though? Most of those games seem to only have one body type for men and women each.

If you don't know what a vulva looks like, no number of body models is going to change that.

On the note about Quiet, The "Breathing though her skin" part wasn't the bit that annoyed me, in fact I kinda found it cool because they based it off another character from the series called "The End" who had similar powers and was also an amazing sniper.

Contextually, though, we're still talking about a sacenario where Kojima wanted to throw in fan service but attempted to "shame" critics of his fan service by saying that the real reason was totes legit and we'd all be sorry, yo.

But no...Bikini and Tights ¬_¬

And waving her ass in your face, and frolicking in water that should reasonably drown her. I mean, this stuff may not bother you personally, but it's a legitimate criticism that exists of the "breathes through her skin" crap.

I mean you're free to get off how you choose, but i just worry sometimes about people who are maybe repressed, and the volleyball game is the best they can do without crossing some perceived moral line.

I mean, don't get me wrong, I'm about to respond to MarsAtlas in a way that may partially validate your argument, so I'm not saying you're completely wrong, but have you looked at some of the poster's previous threads? "Repressed" and "healthy" are not value calls I'm really interested in or comfortable with making, but I'm not sure volleyball is the "best" OP can do.

I do find it somewhat puzzling that the question engenders such defensiveness, since it's not in itself a value call.

If that was the case there would be other, far more profitable volleyball videogames being played by the same people who play DOA volleyball.

I think he's more making the point that it's not porn, it's titillation. And that's the draw. Still not the volleyball.

Which might go hand in hand with the above post.

We've all got them people! Hell, I've got nine.

Well yeah, but only after you stole mine. So now you're up 3 and I've got none.

 

[The Rogue Wolf]

Sometimes I like to look at titties but I don't want to fap. That's where games like this come in. I can also have a bit of fun playing volleyball/whatever and it hurts no one.

Maybe a little more honesty like this would solve at least part of the problem. It's the "wink-wink, nudge-nudge" part that's the most insulting.

 

[Dreiko_v1legacy]

DOA is not porn, it's ecchi. Ecchi is basically a Japanese thing that doesn't exist much elsewhere.


It's content aimed at titillating but not arousing the viewer. Porn is to a brothel what ecchi is to a strip-club, basically. They fulfill different, mutually inclusive functions.


Oh and I have to clarify that softcore porn is NOT the same thing, not at all. Softcore porn is basically porn but you don't get to see all the good parts. Ecchi is not at all porn.

 

[Diablo1099_v1legacy]

On the note about Quiet, The "Breathing though her skin" part wasn't the bit that annoyed me, in fact I kinda found it cool because they based it off another character from the series called "The End" who had similar powers and was also an amazing sniper.

Contextually, though, we're still talking about a sacenario where Kojima wanted to throw in fan service but attempted to "shame" critics of his fan service by saying that the real reason was totes legit and we'd all be sorry, yo.

But no...Bikini and Tights ¬_¬

And waving her ass in your face, and frolicking in water that should reasonably drown her. I mean, this stuff may not bother you personally, but it's a legitimate criticism that exists of the "breathes through her skin" crap.

Oh, I know, just if it wasn't for the Bikini, the character would be totes legit, considering the reason why she has that set up.
Point I was making was the outfit and the strip shows was the only real issue there for me, everything else about the character was actually pretty neat and suited the series, which makes me wish they went in another direction with her.

 

[SmallHatLogan]

Well as I stated in a thread about Senran Kagura the other day I am of the mindset of "I'd rather just watch porn". However, I'm not saying "why don't you watch porn?" I'm just saying there's nothing that I personally can get from these games that I couldn't get from porn. Porn that I don't have to pay for, since pretty much everything is available via streaming. Not to mention that thanks to rule 34 you can see these very characters (from DOA) getting their tits out. Or if you want something less explicit but still titillating (I love that word), well that's available too. Really it doesn't matter what your fetish is, you can find it on the internet.

 

[Ogoid]

OP is excited to have discovered a distinction between soft and hardcore porn, I guess? No one really cares if you like titty games, OP. If you view the casual denigration of those titles by a selection of gamers, I'm going to have to ask how or why that is any different from the shit talking ALL games get. Or are we being charitable when people call some games "walking simulators", or "spunkgargleweewee", or talk about a single title being "so bad it retroactively ruined our enjoyment of an entire award winning series". Do you take up in arms in these circumstances too? Or only to defend the titty games? Must we always be lovely and protective towards the titty games in particular, so that some folks don't get sad and assume that laughing at rubbish like DOAX is indicative of a sneer-conspiracy towards long suffering "male demographic"?

Are titty games and softcore anime porn sacrosanct? Or are we allowed to make fun of them, too, like we do everything else depending on our individual tastes?

I don't really think calling a game bad, whichever the level of hyperbole employed, is quite the equivalent of casting aspersions on the moral character of players and developers alike because they happen to enjoy pixel boobs in their videogames; particularly if the people casting said aspersions just so happen to be supposed professional writers.

Mileages, I'm sure, may vary as they're wont to do.

 

[omega 616]

It getting the same organ going, I'm not into digital stuff myself 'cos making a "hot" cartoon character is fucking easy, draw big tits that defy gravity and wobble unnaturally, DONE! It's like getting your boner from pokémon, you just don't do it.

It's also lazy as fuck "we couldn't make a decent story so we just put tits in and you'll love it 'cos it's all guys care about, amiright!?". We all have that "typical internet user" image in our heads, well I have a "typical anime watcher" image in my head and it's some sex starved, socially awkward guy with the body type of a wet noodle, who sleeps with a hentai body pillow and I don't want to associated with that guy!

This explains how it makes me feel ...


You're into what you're into but I think if you only find 2D images attractive, you need psychological help. I don't mean that in an offensive way, it's just you're not going to find anybody to love 'cos nobody will ever look like that ... I even read about a woman who had some ribs removed to look like Jessica rabbit but no matter how many surgeries she has, she will never look like Jessica! Nobody will ever look like any anime character

 

[nomotog_v1legacy]

And I have to wonder...are people really so blind? That maybe its the fact that its not actually porn that makes people like it?

I mean, I'm a red-blooded male with access to the Internet. I've seen porn. But I don't really like it. I feel its incredibly fake, and most of the time people aren't actually enjoying themselves...

That, and it seems to ignore personal preference too; maybe someone doesn't like actual sex that much but just likes attractive women? Or prefers the people involved to look like they're actually having fun and and enjoying themselves?

I mean, it just seems...more than a bit out of line to dismiss something with that line (or variations thereof).

I don't know if it's so much dismissal as just not getting the exact appeal of some of these things. The DOAX series are a good example: I don't think I've ever met anyone who considered the little mini-games and volleyball simulator to be so damn good that it was worthy of a $60 purchase, so what possible other appeal can the game have? Oh that's right: hot busty cartoon women in bikinis.

But even not talking about porn, that makes little sense. I can hop onto Youtube right now and watch 1000 different bikini contests. If anime girls are your thing, I could easily find thousands of videos of busty anime or cartoon girls. And again, all of this is FREE. So what possible motivation does someone have to pay that kind of money for something that is available essentially for free all over the place? Don't get me wrong, if you want to buy the DOAX games then feel free, but I can't say that I understand it.

Oh that is a simple one. The difference between DOAX and watching a bikini contest is a the interactivity. It totally different feeling to watch then join in*. It's the classic difference between games and movies. As to why someone would pay money for it, well quality porn games are not free. (They are basically non existent, but you know it's all relative.)

*This element can brake down in a lot of ways depending on the game and the player. Like one player might play this game thinking how cool is it that I can dress this girl up in what ever bikini I want, another might be thinking oh I love how I look in this bikini. Then a third or forth might be thinking something totally different.

 

[FPLOON]

I feel ya, yo... Either got full-fake or full-realistic and don't half-ass that shit because it just make the fake shit look more fake and the real shit feel deflowered in all the wrong places... Sure, "balance" is key, but "immersion" is more valuable in this situation by far...

Anyway, I prefer the tease of it all than the nudity itself... because one's imagination is strong in this one, you know what I'm saying?

 

[Something Amyss]

It's like getting your boner from pokémon, you just don't do it.

...

...

...I can tell I'm not welcome here!

*huff*

(though in reality, I've stummbled upon Pokémon porn before. Apparently, someone just does do it)

 

[sky pies]

Well for my two cents I have to agree that western porn wore thin on me quite a long time ago. Some people (the above poster) may have something to say about the paradox of calling real people fake, but I for one agree with you entirely - any viewing of western porn is an exercise in observing industry-standard limpness, dryness, duck-honk gag'ness, and tired rudeness. Some niche forms hold buzz yet, and I think that's how it'll stay. I have a satisfying real life and at this stage anything done online is more out of habit (or addiction) than anything else.

As for animated offerings, they can often push my 'niche' buttons purely by virtue of the added depth and more nuanced expressions. I've got no stigma against them. In wider anime though the only booby'y show I ever liked was Golden Boy, beyond that the anime I watch are mature but not perverted. Consider the nurse and her needle in Kuuchuu Buranko, for instance.

 

[Paragon Fury]

Okay, a lot to reply to here so I'll try to get to as much of it as possible in one go.

1: This isn't just about the DoA Xtreme games. Its about DoA/fanservice-y games/anime etc. in general.

Dead or Alive for example is constantly dumped on by people for the T&A, but also by other fighting game fans for being "too simple" and "too slow" compared to say, Street Fighter. Despite the fact that reviewers and gamers frequently agree that the core gameplay of the DoA games is quite good and many people enjoy it precisely because you DON'T need to pound down two Red Bulls to have the reaction time to be able to beat anything above Easy AI and the slower more move/counter move gameplay is nice. And yes, I do really enjoy playing the game for the women too; but I wouldn't keep playing it if the gameplay wasn't enjoyable.

Spoiler

Favorite character in all 6 games.

And yes, the DoAX games were fun because you got to put the girls in a lot of different swimsuits. It was also nice to see them outside constantly attempting to beat the life out of each other.

But constantly being told to just go watch porn or play Street Fighter just because the game I like has T&A despite being a good game gets real old.

It extends to other things like anime. I like lots of anime, but one of my favorites is Witchblade:

Spoiler

Which yeah has a lot of T&A too, but also a story that'll bring grown men to tears at the end. Or my recent favorite, Monster Musume:

Spoiler

Which is ALL about the fanservice, but is also genuinely entertaining and funny and would greatly lessened by not having the fanservice.

But of course, watching porn would just be better than that, right?

2: I've seen plenty of porn, as I've said - red-blooded man, Internet access. But I rarely if ever enjoy the "real" stuff. The women aren't terribly attractive and as I said they don't seem to be enjoying it. And by "enjoying it" I mean having a good time or having fun with the actual act or being sexy. Or to compare to the things I do like, the sexy doesn't happen in relation or context for it to be any fun, like say in Monster Musume or Sekirei where the sexy stuff happens but its around someone they care about and like and they enjoy it.

The real seems fake because its set-up, while the fake seems more real because its less staged and fun.

Perhaps its more because I prefer the...chase, I guess?...to the actual act? The kind of stuff I DO like to look at is more akin to a risque Pin-up than even softcore porn, IE: something like -

Spoiler

There was a slightly more risque image I wanted to use to demonstrate about the extent of where I'd go, but I didn't want Elfgore to have to ban me even though I think I could get away with it.

Its not that I don't find real women attractive - its just much less depressing and frustrating when its 2D women.

3: At least one person here and some at other sites have echo'd the sentiment of "Well, sex fantasies can be fulfilled and the real ones are better than the fake ones" and that it's better preparation for when the real thing actually happens. Not only am I not sure of that, but I AM sure I don't need to worry about it; sexy time isn't happening for me unless I'm the last man standing, and I'll probably have gotten munched on by whatever caused said apocalypse in the first place. Not really an issue for me.

4: Crap. There was going to be a point 4, but then I forgot what I wanted to put here.

 

[Amir Kondori]

A lot of people are super prudish and feel uncomfortable about sex, they feel awkward discussing sex, or they think sex is a dirty and shameful thing. This kind of thinking is especially prevalent in America and older generations or younger generations it doesn't matter, this is just part of the culture.

Eventually we'll get past these ways of thinkings and having sexuality in our media won't be viewed as some sort of evil thing. Until then people like you will have to keep making posts about it. Discussion helps.

 

[Ogoid]

All right, so as to contribute an actual on-topic post here...

In Italy, comics from artists such as Guido Crepax, Milo Manara or Paolo Eleuteri Serpieri are considered bona-fide works of art. Now, mind, I'm not Italian, but this is not something I've read about or been told - I've actually been to an elderly couple's house in Florence (we're talking people in their 70s here) - and comics from the aforementioned authors sat on their living room bookshelf, right next to their Renaissance art books; and if you're wondering about the precise content of said comics, just googling their names should give you a very clear idea.

So really, as far as I'm concerned this whole "why don't you just look at porn" comes from a very specific and very restrictive mindset as to what's "proper" and what "isn't" when it comes to media.

 

[Something Amyss]

The real seems fake because its set-up, while the fake seems more real because its less staged and fun.

The stuff that's scripted almost literally to the pixels is less scripted than porn.

WHAT?

 

[Redd the Sock]

My response to that question these days is: have you actually watched porn? Not fapped to it. Sat down and watched it. Yeah, there's a part that does what it is supposed to do, but it's wrapped around some of the worst production values out there. Porn flourishes on the naughtiness of it, to the point a lot ignores titillation and seduction value. We either jump right into the sex, or run though some half assed script with acting only slightly better than the audio (seriously, if I have hear every moan during the act, why can't I make you what they're saying first) or some sketch like a bad Saturday Night Live sketch (or in other words, a normal SNL sketch).

Going elsewhere, I guess it depends on the game or anime (or movie or comic on occasion). Something like Senran Kagura is a bit titillating, but it's also bright, colorful, and often funnier and more entertaining than just watching 2 people (or more) fuck. Something like Moe Chronicle (a dungeon crawler where you catch monster girls for your party like pokemon) is again, colorful and the girls' designed are creative and unique. It isn't fap material, but something meant to look bright and exotic, rather than plate armor or normal clothes. Sometimes it isn't the titillation, but the circumstance, like the humor in any harem anime with a girl not sexually repressed or shy around others that want her to cover up, or an exaggerated realism in Queen's blade that battle damage can and will expose the naughty bits.

Then there's DOAX3 and similar games, that, can truly be counted in that ecchi / porn area, but it offers something porn doesn't: control. In porn or photo shoots, I'm an observer on a passive ride, while in a game I can look at the parts I want when I want to, instead of enjoying a view one minute, and moving to something I don't the next, on top of choosing the girl and activity. There's so much in movies you just have to accept, which may be why I think we've all seena bit of porn that didn't do it for us, but the idea of a game opens a lot of possibilities.

Honestly, I think the question gets asked by people that are more sex-negative than they want to admit to themselves, and the firm line between titillation and "normal" entertainment must be there and very clear so that they can feel sex-positive without having to face a more sex positive (and less repressed) world. They can shuffle the porn off to the side and ignore it, but let it be high profile and/or with everything else, and they go nuts.

 

[Luminous_Umbra]

The real seems fake because its set-up, while the fake seems more real because its less staged and fun.

The stuff that's scripted almost literally to the pixels is less scripted than porn.

WHAT?

I think it's the idea of how obvious it is. I mean, surely you've seen things that you know are scripted, but it doesn't "hit you in the face" with it, if you get what I'm saying?

Yes, both are scripted, but one is blatantly so.

 

[BloatedGuppy]

So really, as far as I'm concerned this whole "why don't you just look at porn" comes from a very specific and very restrictive mindset as to what's "proper" and what "isn't" when it comes to media.

Honestly, I think the question gets asked by people that are more sex-negative than they want to admit to themselves, and the firm line between titillation and "normal" entertainment must be there and very clear so that they can feel sex-positive without having to face a more sex positive (and less repressed) world.

Yes, when confronted by criticism of either oneself or something one likes, it is very typical and tempting to try and cast aspersions upon the source of the criticism. Sure, they're criticizing you, but they're prudes, so it stands to reason. I'd say it's a relatively new cultural phenomenon...IE jump on the whole "participation award" generation slam wagon and pretend that young people need constant approval or their balls drop off...but in reality it's a pretty human thing to do. "Oh, X said a bad thing about me? Well, I'm amazing, so clearly X is stupid." We are, after all, the protagonists in our own life stories.

Personally, I have what qualifies as an extremely liberal and forgiving attitude towards sex. I'm not terribly keen on some of the less savory aspects, particularly where the porn/escort industry tends to overlap with human trafficking...but the concept that I'd be "sex negative", or "have a very specific or restrictive mindset as to what's proper" is...frankly...hilarious. And yet, in spite of this, I think DOAX is a ridiculous joke. I thought the same thing about Quiet and the (rather hilarious) explanations behind her bikini clad attire. I don't CARE, I'm not going to petition the games out of existence, and if I thought such a thing was actually apt to happen I'd probably argue vehemently for their survival...but I think they're fucking ridiculous. And I think listening to people argue about DOAX3 being EVER SO MILDLY more problematic to purchase (IE, you might have to buy something ONLINE, the horror!) as if they were Rosa Parks refusing to give up her seat on the bus to be so fucking ridiculous that I find it difficult to put into words.

It's a titty game. It's stupid. I don't care if people like it or not, we all like something stupid from time to time, but for gods sake just own it. OP is literally stressing out because people on the internet are disrespecting jiggly anime girls playing volleyball. This, apparently, is beyond reproach. I'm speechless.