Kickstarter Video Project Attracts Misogynist Horde
- Thread starter The Wooster
- Start date
Are you mistaking the word 'bland' for the word 'ridiculous'?SimpleThunda said:
I would argue that the problem isn't that men and women cope with sexualised characters in different ways, but that the characters are sexualised in different ways. As has already been discussed at length in this thread, there is a big difference between a power fantasy and sexualisation. Batman or one of the Spartan soldiers are certainly sexy since they are played by handsome actors, have good bodies etc. but they are also powerful characters who have agency. Their muscles give them strength to fight so they transcend merely being eye-candy. Giant breasts serve no purpose except as possible buoyancy aids and the cause of back problems. In your example you mentioned that the spartan soldiers were fighting valiantly, while the bikini models were playing volleyball. I know you were deliberately using extremely stereotypical examples but that's exactly the point.
men and women find different things sexy. this is often phrased as women are human-being and men are human-Doings. what it means is that women are sexualised through their looks whilst men are sexualised by what they contribute, how much money they earn, what car they drive, what job they have, how well groomed they are ETC. this is why allot of women find men in suits sexy because a suit shows wealth and what he can do for her. its called hypergamy and it came through evolution. men looked for healthy, women with good genes (wide hips ETC ) whilst women looked for protection a resources.Hollyday said:
my point is just because a man finds a feature about a women sexy then that doesn't mean a women will find the same thing sexy on a man.
People who are impaired by drugs or alcohol can't consent in the first place.Trekkie said:
I dunno, I've only had sex when not impaired with people who aren't impaired. I always assumed making sure potential sexual partners actually want to fuck was a basic human decency thing.Trekkie said:
What is with the internet and not understanding consent law? If someone's impaired by alcohol, they cannot (in most jurisdictions) consent to sex. So if someone is impaired by alcohol (or by any drug) and is raped, they in fact have the right to press charges.SimpleThunda said:
But your point hinges on the idea that only men are watching and enjoying these sexualised depictions of women, and only women are watching and enjoying the sexualised depictions of men. We're not talking about porn, we're talking about mainstream media. Everyone of all genders and sexualities are consuming this media. Men (and women) can get something positive out of the character of Batman - yes you can argue that he's sexualised, but that's a very small part of his character. He is fully-rounded. Women in the media often aren't - they're just this sexualised ideal that men want (as you pointed out in your post, just 'being' sexy and not 'doing' anything). I think that that's a pretty harmful message to send to women on a daily basis.Trekkie said:
i can guarantee you that you will be hard fucking pressed to find people who think the same way if it was a man and not a woman. and unless someone has slipped you something which is rape then you have decided to drink that beer or smoke that pot and you should know what it dose to your body and you should take steps to make sure you don't do anything stupid like jump into bed with someone when your drunk. the whole too drunk to give consent thing is bullshit because it reduces people to the level of children who cant and or wont take responsibility for their own actions.Kahunaburger said:
and that's the thing, you don't need to be drunk you just have to say you regret it and point a finger. the system is set up in a way that makes it almost impossible for a man to prove he didn't do anything.
and also what if they are both drunk? what then? is he still a rapist?
I can't think of any jurisdiction where the problem is rape being over-prosecuted.Trekkie said:
really because I cant think of one game where the female chars arent seen as strong and independent and who don't need help from anyone. Samus, alex Vance, Lara croft, Ashley Williams, catwoman, Jennifer Mui, Liara T'soni, Shaundi... seriously i can go on for a really long fucking time but the fact of the matter is this, they are all strong female characters and whenever you say a female char that isn't strong and independent its always peach a char from a game where the PC didn't have his own personality beyond plumber.Hollyday said:
and so we get to the point where we constantly get bombarded with the statement that games are sexist because the women look sexy. yeah well so do the men and dont pretend they dont.
plus what dose the human-doing message do for men besides tell us were nothing but an appliance to be used to extract resources?
...Is there anyone who is currently confused as to why the gaming community is not considered mature or ready to be accepted as a grown and refined cultural phenomenom?
This is why.
Is it really that surprising, then, that gaming culture tends to be reguarded fairly poorly when vermin like these runs about freely and mostly unopposed? No, it isn't. It can change, but evidently, too many prefer to remain apathic for that to happen. And gaming culture will continue to recieve the treatment that it honestly deserves at this time.
Yes, yes, haters gonna hate is practically a physical law, but... No, this is too far. These haters, specifically those aiming to shoot the project down and the ones threatening violence and rape, are utter scum. Utter, utter scum. No excuses.
Not everyone is like that, of course, but there comes a time when repeating a fairly obvious fact over and over again just isn't enough, and it's time to start acting like it, too.
Suppose I'm another bolshevik feminist. But I also suppose I'm fairly proud of that. It certainly beats the alternative.
Disgusting.
This is why.
Is it really that surprising, then, that gaming culture tends to be reguarded fairly poorly when vermin like these runs about freely and mostly unopposed? No, it isn't. It can change, but evidently, too many prefer to remain apathic for that to happen. And gaming culture will continue to recieve the treatment that it honestly deserves at this time.
Yes, yes, haters gonna hate is practically a physical law, but... No, this is too far. These haters, specifically those aiming to shoot the project down and the ones threatening violence and rape, are utter scum. Utter, utter scum. No excuses.
Not everyone is like that, of course, but there comes a time when repeating a fairly obvious fact over and over again just isn't enough, and it's time to start acting like it, too.
Suppose I'm another bolshevik feminist. But I also suppose I'm fairly proud of that. It certainly beats the alternative.
Disgusting.
duke lacrosse. enough said.Kahunaburger said:
a case where the prosecution with covered up evidence that would have accused the three men so that they could get a prosecution.
and if you still don't believe me, this site is full of them:
http://falserapesociety.blogspot.co.uk/
The question of if and how intoxication affects mens rea is complicated. [http://www.aapl.org/newsletter/N241_mens_rea_defenses.htm] The question of how an impairing amount of alcohol affects consent is considerably less so.marche45 said:
I just flat-out don't agree. I think this is the point where neither of us is going to budge, because I can honestly say that I'm not threatened by depictions of sexualised women in the media. I look up to many of them, especially when 'being sexy' is not the only thing they have on their resume. I've never played a game/watched a film featuring a sexy female sidekick/villainess/heroine and thought 'wow, she's prettier than I am: I HATE THAT B****!' The worst I can say is that usually the sexualised depictions of women BORE me, because looking pretty isn't exactly the stuff meaty characters are made from.SimpleThunda said:
I think that the sexualised depictions of men aren't threatening to men because they usually remain fully-rounded characters. This means that men have something to identify with except 'if I looked like him, women would like me'.
But again, this is my opinion seen from a female standpoint, yours is from yours. We may have to agree to very much disagree!
no they didn't but only because of a very very good defence team. how many other guys weren't so lucky? the point is that the prosecution tried to cover-up evidence to convict these guys as rapists when they knew they where not, that is a perversion of justice! that is wrong!Kahunaburger said:
You still aren't any closer to evidence that the US is a jurisdiction where the over-prosecution of rape is a bigger problem than the under-prosecution of rape, BTW.Trekkie said: