Kojima To Unveil "Massive PS3 Exclusive" at TGS 2010
- Thread starter Tom Goldman
- Start date
If it's something absolutely earth shatteringly amazing then I may actually have to fork out for a PS3.
I now expect Zone of the Enders 3. There's been a severe lack of awesome mecha games in my life since the last one. Kojima, make it happen!
For people who are talking about MGS long cutscenes:
Not everyone likes to play videogames just for ludic entertainment. Some people can appreciate videogames as a storytelling form, and that's what Kojima delivers. Also, gameplay becomes that much more fun when the story delives extra motivation for the player. I totally love enormous cutscenes, as much as I love long codec conversations. For me, the more text a game has (be it voiced or not), the better.
Fact is: people just want to get the game, they want someone to shout "Snake do this it's an order", they want him to say "ok" and them play until they beat the game. That's not the purpose of the game, and it never was.
MGS resembles Kojima's adventure games (Snatcher and Policenauts) in terms of dialogues and storytelling content. The only difference is that adventure games feature text instead of voice. Someone who plays an adventure game is looking for a lot of text and dialogue, so they do not find it boring at all because that's exactly what they're looking for. But someone who plays an action game (like MGS) is looking for action, they want dialogues to keep it short.
So no, I don't think MGS looks like a movie at all. Not in its structure anyway. Movies go straight to the point. They only have 2 hours to delives the story. As a game, MGS has as much time as the disc can hold. If games like Phoenix Wright were fully voiced, for example, they would have "cutscenes" as long as MGS does.
The difference is: creating cinematic cutscenes is expensive, so developers mostly use them for short dialogues and/or action scenes. Kojima wanted to take videogame storytelling one step further and he took two enormous risks:
1) executing a a script with so much dialogue, that it matches the volume of text in point and click adventure games and visual novels, but in a fully voiced, cinematic way.
2) Mixing that much storytelling content with action-driven gameplay, rather than point and click gameplay or choice based gameplay, like in visual novels.
So, if you compare MGS to Action games and/or even movies, it looks too boring, too much talking, takes too long etc. If you compare MGS to visual novels, it has too much action. MGS is something in between.
I simply love reading, I love watching movies and I love playing videogames. For me, MGS has at all. It's not boring at all; not even Rosemary codec calls talking about relationship, not even Liquid explaining the conspiracy behind historic events like the Gulf War, not even Paramedic talking about movies from the 60's.
It's simply fascinating. I don't feel like I'm just shooting bad guys and being badass, like most games make me feel: I'm meeting people. I'm learning about cinema, literature, history, science and politics. I'm appreciating human dramas. I'm enjoying art. That's how I feel about Kojima's games.
When I play a MGS game, I'm not looking for a espionage simulator. I'm not a spy and I don't have any interest of becoming one. The gameplay part of it alone only guarantees me a ludic kind of fun. Like playing Mario, or a racing game, or even playing cards with friends. That alone is just something to kill time, something to enjoy for a while. You sneak up on someone, you take him down, you enjoy it. When you stop playing, you forget about it. It's an ephemeral kind of appreciation.
For some, that's the whole point of videogames. For me, it's just one element. Combined with great storytelling, gameplay can become much more than just casual, ludic entertainment. Gameplay and storytelling can complete each other to provide unparalled artistic enjoyment.
Not everyone likes to play videogames just for ludic entertainment. Some people can appreciate videogames as a storytelling form, and that's what Kojima delivers. Also, gameplay becomes that much more fun when the story delives extra motivation for the player. I totally love enormous cutscenes, as much as I love long codec conversations. For me, the more text a game has (be it voiced or not), the better.
Fact is: people just want to get the game, they want someone to shout "Snake do this it's an order", they want him to say "ok" and them play until they beat the game. That's not the purpose of the game, and it never was.
MGS resembles Kojima's adventure games (Snatcher and Policenauts) in terms of dialogues and storytelling content. The only difference is that adventure games feature text instead of voice. Someone who plays an adventure game is looking for a lot of text and dialogue, so they do not find it boring at all because that's exactly what they're looking for. But someone who plays an action game (like MGS) is looking for action, they want dialogues to keep it short.
So no, I don't think MGS looks like a movie at all. Not in its structure anyway. Movies go straight to the point. They only have 2 hours to delives the story. As a game, MGS has as much time as the disc can hold. If games like Phoenix Wright were fully voiced, for example, they would have "cutscenes" as long as MGS does.
The difference is: creating cinematic cutscenes is expensive, so developers mostly use them for short dialogues and/or action scenes. Kojima wanted to take videogame storytelling one step further and he took two enormous risks:
1) executing a a script with so much dialogue, that it matches the volume of text in point and click adventure games and visual novels, but in a fully voiced, cinematic way.
2) Mixing that much storytelling content with action-driven gameplay, rather than point and click gameplay or choice based gameplay, like in visual novels.
So, if you compare MGS to Action games and/or even movies, it looks too boring, too much talking, takes too long etc. If you compare MGS to visual novels, it has too much action. MGS is something in between.
I simply love reading, I love watching movies and I love playing videogames. For me, MGS has at all. It's not boring at all; not even Rosemary codec calls talking about relationship, not even Liquid explaining the conspiracy behind historic events like the Gulf War, not even Paramedic talking about movies from the 60's.
It's simply fascinating. I don't feel like I'm just shooting bad guys and being badass, like most games make me feel: I'm meeting people. I'm learning about cinema, literature, history, science and politics. I'm appreciating human dramas. I'm enjoying art. That's how I feel about Kojima's games.
When I play a MGS game, I'm not looking for a espionage simulator. I'm not a spy and I don't have any interest of becoming one. The gameplay part of it alone only guarantees me a ludic kind of fun. Like playing Mario, or a racing game, or even playing cards with friends. That alone is just something to kill time, something to enjoy for a while. You sneak up on someone, you take him down, you enjoy it. When you stop playing, you forget about it. It's an ephemeral kind of appreciation.
For some, that's the whole point of videogames. For me, it's just one element. Combined with great storytelling, gameplay can become much more than just casual, ludic entertainment. Gameplay and storytelling can complete each other to provide unparalled artistic enjoyment.
I kinda hope it's not another MGS cos i'm a big Fan but after 4 it's seems like they just beating a dead horse, MGS story has ended why would anyone want to make it more confusing with new plot lines.
I'm so tired of hearing about this guy and his star franchise, Metal Gear Solid. It seems like every single time he says "This is the last in the franchise" but that's never the case.
(Yes, I am aware that this reveal could be something other than MGS, I'm just sayin'.)
(Yes, I am aware that this reveal could be something other than MGS, I'm just sayin'.)
Excellent post, and I actually agree with most of it. My big issue with Metal Gear is the fact that it takes so many risks to base the experience around the story, when the story is nonsensical gibberish. The characters have character, but the motivations and overall plot arc are borderline retarded.AndreyC said:
I would love to see a game designed with the same philosophy as the Metal Gear series, but with competent writing. It doesn't have to be a stealth/action game, it could be a hack and slash title like Devil May Cry or God of War, or an FPS title with the cutscenes executed with a 3rd person camera.
I just want a better story if that's what is going to drive your game. Metal Gear doesn't provide that for me.
It does provide an excellent gameplay experience though, I feel like such a bad ass when I'm in control of Snake.
Is it just me or does "Metal Gear Solid: Snake Eater 3D - The Naked Sample" combined with "Metal Gear Solid: Rising" make an awesome set of titles for a couple of porn movies?
In any case, those are bold words. Wonder what he has up his sleeve. Hopefully something new, I like surprises. We know MGS by now.
In any case, those are bold words. Wonder what he has up his sleeve. Hopefully something new, I like surprises. We know MGS by now.
It's a good way of storytelling. For a movie. In a game, I can't possibly say that the storytelling is good when the story and the actual game part are pretty much completely separated. If he wants to make cutscenes so badly, hop in the motion picture business. If you want to make a game, actually make a damned game.AndreyC said:
FloodOne said:
About the actual storyline content, it all comes down to taste. Some people just can't seem to enjoy the kind of storyline Kojima delivers, doesn't matter if it's a game, or a movie, or a book, or a comic book. I know some people that, no matter how good it is, just can't enjoy a movie or anything if it has a Super Hero on it. Watchmen is one of my favorite comic books, and/or movies, but some people judge by its appearence. They don't see what is beyond the superficial presentation. Behind the "heroes and villains" motivation, there's a lot of cultural reference, incredible dialogues, deep mataphors, complex dilemmas etc.
The same goes for MGS plot. It has ninjas. It has cardboard boxes. It has bipedal nuclear equipped tanks. It has nanomachines. It has people talking to dead people. But that's all just the surface. That's just presentation. Pretty much like Tarantino's Kill Bill has a presentation that mixes elements from trash movie genres like japanese ninja movies and wild west movies, it has so much more depth to it than just the looks.
MGS overall presentation seems over the top. It's fusion of western comics, conspiratory movies, japanese anime and every other over-the-top genre you can think about. But, regardless of what setting Kojima puts the game in, the way he develop the themes and metaphors is incredible.
Take in-depth analysis like this one: http://junkerhq.net/MGS2/ You'll see that MGS2, for example, is about more than Ocelot becoming possesed by Liquid Snake and Raiden becoming a Ninja. If you analyse any plot by the THEME Kojima explores in each game (gene for MGS1, meme for MGS2, scene for MGS3, sense for MGS4 and peace/deterence for Peace Walker) you'll see that there's a lot more than meets the eyes. Very few fictional works explore each of those themes better than those games, regardless of the setting.